What is the purpose of this forum existing anymore?

[heavenlyboy34]

There are two ways to the end you bring up, namely the one where we prove this is no longer a Republic by having the system deny us. One is to keep using the system such that someone who is undoubtedly not approved by the media (good luck on that) is rejected outright in such an obvious way that the people are forced to recognize that what the media tells them happened is not the truth (and good luck with that, too.) Another way is to stop using the system such that the system is forced to go on without us, at which point we have proven the same thing and we haven't wasted so much time and billions of dollars worth of resources to do it. Rather, we have built our own lives irrespective of the regulations of our rulers and fought for that life until we are forced to give it up by the machine, which is the battle you want to be fighting, not the "Who's the fairest of them all" battle.

If you take yourself out of the market of productive ideas to live for the beauty pageant, fighting for the life you've built in the beauty pageant, then I'm sorry, but your life is literally a lie. Your purpose going into the beauty pageant was to help people see that the beauty pageant is a lie, but in order to do that, you've had to make your life about the beauty pageant and you can't risk letting your beauty pageant life be taken away for fear you won't make in the actual market of productive ideas.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to PaulConventionWV again.

grrrr. Someone plz +rep my brother here^^

[FindLiberty]

... Does anyone really care what the rest of the world thinks?

Picture from post #62

Hmmm, makes me wonder just who is paying for those $$ HQ floats - different designs seen in both Germany and America?

[FindLiberty]

Sorry, hit reply button 30 posts ago, still reading A new site vision; a new era did not mean to float off-topic. too tired to think right now.

[Natural Citizen]

..but then I'm not advocating becoming Chairman Mao to make China libertarian, am I?...

Man, I'm right there with you about that. I see this mindset gradually and strategically being inserted as the more desirable catalyist. And I don't like it. I kind of just bite my tongue about it and don't say too much, though. I think it is sometimes more practical to remain observant in those situations rather than to contribute to it. Once that becomes the prevalent line of logic, I'll consider other avenues of outreach on a more regular basis, too. Of course, on the flipside I really am beginning to conclude that some just want to stimulate/endorse total chaos. Complete anarchy. Bloodshed even albeit from behind the coercive comfort of a keyboard and far removed from any instance of that which one may tend to endorse. And no good will come from that.

...becoming Chairman Mao to make China libertarian...that's a good way to put it. And we're sure as heck seeing that logic become the driver in all of this. Silver-tongued as it may often be presented, it is what it is.

[osan]

Will they be worth having on the 10 millionth turn of the hamster wheel? How many times do we need to turn the hamster wheel before we recognize that getting off the damn wheel is actually a viable solution?

All well and good, but this has nothing to do with the efforts being made here. I wan't speaking about voting at all, was I? My point was that giving up on freedom was the worst response to the encroaching tyrant. You obviously feel differently. That is your prerogative. Don't like voting? Think it is futile? I agree, but that's not in any measure the entire universe of possible responses.

I would add that you erect a false dichotomy, whether intentionally or otherwise, when you implied that one either does nothing or starts shooting. There is a whole lot that ought to come before that. At times I think we have gone past that point and at others I don't. Part of the human condition, I suppose. Regardless, even if we started shooting yesterday, what would it buy us in terms of proceeding in the aftermath? Nothing. Why? Because the vast and overwhelming wad of humanity has absolutely no idea how to live beyond the parameters of tyranny, regardless of how seemingly benign it may appear. What kind of a world... hell, NATION would we put in the place of what we now have? For want of the most basic understanding of proper human relations we would erect yet another tyranny because people are simply unwilling to let go of the base assumptions that lead to tyranny every single time such that you can set your clocks by it.

"We have to have roads... we have to have schools... we have to have standing military... we have to have...", and on down the nauseating list of failure-based assumptions upon which nearly everyone hangs their justifications for tyranny. "Well, I don't like it that much, but we HAVE to do these things....", "everybody has to pay their fair share." Oh really? Who the hell says?

[PaulConventionWV]

You missed the point.

The point is, if you help people discover that the right to build your life is stolen and we have already given our lives up to the machine, despite the tons of propaganda designed to obscure that, then you can do something about it sooner, and you have more help when you do.

More importantly, you have had a chance before that moment to teach people what they are fighting for. Which is important, because if you don't you wind up watching everyone fighting to get something even worse.

No, I understand your point. My point is this stuff is happening all the time. Our rights are being taken away, and you'll never get to demonstrate that if all you do is talk about it. Many activists do it right by pushing the boundaries and showing how the system has treated them unfairly. Those who choose to participate in the beauty pageant to see who the king should be, regardless of what they may be saying while they're doing it, are missing a vital opportunity to fill a need of the market. If filling that need attracts the government's attention, then all the better because now you have a chance to fight them and demonstrate their unfairness rather than simply talk about it. Not only that, but in the process, you are supposedly still doing something productive for society rather than nothing. In other words, fight them when they come after you. That way, you at least know that those who want what you have to offer will stand with you.

[PaulConventionWV]

All well and good, but this has nothing to do with the efforts being made here. I wan't speaking about voting at all, was I? My point was that giving up on freedom was the worst response to the encroaching tyrant. You obviously feel differently. That is your prerogative. Don't like voting? Think it is futile? I agree, but that's not in any measure the entire universe of possible responses.

Who's giving up on freedom? I'm saying live it, don't just talk about it. Fight them when they come. Don't become them to fight them.

I would add that you erect a false dichotomy, whether intentionally or otherwise, when you implied that one either does nothing or starts shooting. There is a whole lot that ought to come before that. At times I think we have gone past that point and at others I don't. Part of the human condition, I suppose. Regardless, even if we started shooting yesterday, what would it buy us in terms of proceeding in the aftermath? Nothing. Why? Because the vast and overwhelming wad of humanity has absolutely no idea how to live beyond the parameters of tyranny, regardless of how seemingly benign it may appear. What kind of a world... hell, NATION would we put in the place of what we now have? For want of the most basic understanding of proper human relations we would erect yet another tyranny because people are simply unwilling to let go of the base assumptions that lead to tyranny every single time such that you can set your clocks by it.

I'm not aware of implying that at all. What I meant is that, although probably a bad idea in the vast majority of scenarios, shooting is doing more than voting. I'm not one to tell people when they've lost enough to risk it all, but the political game in general is far less meaningful than even one man's act of vengeance against the state for ruining his life when he tried to fill a demand of the market. Of course, shooting is not the only viable option in that scenario, either, but it's something to think about.

[younglibertarian]

I'm glad this forum is still around. I didn't know sane people still existed on the internet.......

[kfarnan]

Liberty is more than one battle. Even if all was accomplished, there would be a continuous war for personal freedom.

[Ronin Truth]

Purging posters, cutting down on pesky liberty? Am I getting close?

[CaptainAmerica]

Im not sure yet, but I don't see myself tied to this sinking ship