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Thread: Trump Made A Mistake By Overlooking Colorado

  1. #1

    Trump Made A Mistake By Overlooking Colorado

    Their weekly podcast is good. Pretty much says what I've been trying to explain to a segment of the RPFs membership.


    Trump Made A Mistake By Overlooking Colorado

    2016 Election 10:56 AM Apr 11, 2016
    He needs delegates anywhere he can find them to reach 1,237.

    By Harry Enten


    You’re hearing a lot about New York, where Donald Trump is reportedly trying to make up for his poor performance in Wisconsin. On Friday, for example, CNN reported:

    The Trump campaign is overhauling its schedule to go all in in the Empire State. Trump abandoned plans to travel west this week for a news conference in California, a rally in Colorado and an appearance at Colorado’s state convention …
    On the surface, this strategy makes sense: New York, which votes April 19, is worth 95 delegates, while Wisconsin, which voted last Tuesday, awarded only 42 pledged delegates and Colorado just 34.1 In reality, however, the Colorado conventions this weekend were really important; Trump’s path to the 1,237 delegates necessary to clinch the Republican nomination is so tenuous that he can’t afford slip-ups anywhere. And he slipped up in Colorado. Now, no matter how well Trump does in New York, he will have fallen further off pace to reach 1,237 delegates, taking into account Colorado and Wisconsin.

    Colorado elects 34 potentially pledged delegates through seven district conventions and a statewide convention. (The state GOP decided not to hold a primary or caucus with a presidential preference vote this year.) But instead of putting together a top-notch convention team, Trump’s campaign was a mess: In one case, Trump delegates weren’t even on the ballot to be voted on by a district convention; in two others, Trump’s campaign didn’t provide his potential supporters with a list of pro-Trump delegates, so they didn’t know who to vote for.

    The end result: Trump won zero delegates from Colorado; Ted Cruz won 34.

    So where does that leave Trump?

    ...
    http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...king-colorado/
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul



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  3. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by CPUd View Post
    Their weekly podcast is good. Pretty much says what I've been trying to explain to a segment of the RPFs membership.
    http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...king-colorado/
    "Donald Trump has this thing in the bag."

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by CPUd View Post
    There's more truth to it than "Trump got cheated", which is blatantly false.
    Nope he got cheated. His hard won delegates are being stripped away after victories in some states. Colorado there is a concentrated effort to shut him out.

    Well I been reading that he is starting to do that in other states to Cruz.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cowlesy View Post
    Americans in general are jedi masters of blaming every other person.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by silverhandorder View Post
    Nope he got cheated. His hard won delegates are being stripped away after victories in some states. Colorado there is a concentrated effort to shut him out.

    Well I been reading that he is starting to do that in other states to Cruz.
    Which states and how many delegates? Be specific.
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by CPUd View Post
    Which states and how many delegates? Be specific.
    Why would I bother? LOL

    You were bragging here all month.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cowlesy View Post
    Americans in general are jedi masters of blaming every other person.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by silverhandorder View Post
    Why would I bother? LOL

    You were bragging here all month.
    I'm not bragging. I do take interest in things like delegate strategies, especially ones that are well executed.
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul

  8. #7
    I would actually be impressed if Trump's campaign could pull something like that off in one of the western states. I'd probably post a lot about it, too. But all I know so far is they sent their delegate info for WA to DC when DC is already done and WA is past deadline.
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul

  9. #8
    Oh. Um I thought you meant something else. Apparently this happened in Massachusetts. So I am assuming he is going to start doing it in all the states that are left to select delegations. And probably other ways to break loyalty to Cruz.

    It's naive to believe that Cruz can out organize him if he already lost once at the voting. That also takes organizations and support. So I think he played his hand. It would also be very easy to flip Cruz loyalists.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cowlesy View Post
    Americans in general are jedi masters of blaming every other person.



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  11. #9
    Not all Cruz-supporting delegates actually support Cruz. Rubio is in the mix as well.
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by CPUd View Post
    Post specifics, or withdraw from this thread. This thread is about discussing whether or not Trump made a tactical error in not organizing for CO.
    Hard to make a tactical error in CO, when they refused to seat delegates supporting him. CO did this same shadow backdoor $#@! to Ron Paul, it's amazing how people aren't up in arms about it. Whether you like Trump or not, the way these things are playing out is a blast from the past.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Fivezeroes View Post
    Hard to make a tactical error in CO, when they refused to seat delegates supporting him. CO did this same shadow backdoor $#@! to Ron Paul, it's amazing how people aren't up in arms about it. Whether you like Trump or not, the way these things are playing out is a blast from the past.
    They never refused to seat delegates supporting him, those 2 guys were not guided through the process by the campaign, and left to fend for themselves, subsequently, they failed to show up to the lower-level caucuses (again, a function the campaign should have overseen), and could not be credentialed at the state convention.
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Fivezeroes View Post
    Hard to make a tactical error in CO, when they refused to seat delegates supporting him. CO did this same shadow backdoor $#@! to Ron Paul, it's amazing how people aren't up in arms about it. Whether you like Trump or not, the way these things are playing out is a blast from the past.
    In the past Ron Paul won delegates in states where he lost the popular vote by wide margins kind of like Ted Cruz has done. That is the analogy to the past. Ron Paul had a ground game. Ted Cruz has a ground game. Donald J. Trump is just now getting a ground game.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    In the past Ron Paul won delegates in states where he lost the popular vote by wide margins kind of like Ted Cruz has done. That is the analogy to the past. Ron Paul had a ground game. Ted Cruz has a ground game. Donald J. Trump is just now getting a ground game.
    Nope. Ron Paul had lights turned off on him, had meeting disbanded, had votes overturned. Not even close. Actually kinda what is happening to Trump.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cowlesy View Post
    Americans in general are jedi masters of blaming every other person.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by silverhandorder View Post
    Nope. Ron Paul had lights turned off on him, had meeting disbanded, had votes overturned. Not even close. Actually kinda what is happening to Trump.
    LOL. So is this what counts for discussion now on RPF? Simply ignore any inconvenient fact and obfuscate? Again, the ultimate result is that Ron won delegates in states that by the popular vote he shouldn't have won $#@!. The Trump campaign itself admits the truth of what is being said in the OP. Trump didn't have a ground game in Colorado. Everything else is anecdotal evidence and hearsay.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    LOL. So is this what counts for discussion now on RPF? Simply ignore any inconvenient fact and obfuscate? Again, the ultimate result is that Ron won delegates in states that by the popular vote he shouldn't have won $#@!. The Trump campaign itself admits the truth of what is being said in the OP. Trump didn't have a ground game in Colorado. Everything else is anecdotal evidence and hearsay.

    Are you saying Ron Paul didn't have any delegates unseated, his delegates weren't locked out as well? Cause if you are, you have a short short memory of 2012.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    LOL. So is this what counts for discussion now on RPF? Simply ignore any inconvenient fact and obfuscate? Again, the ultimate result is that Ron won delegates in states that by the popular vote he shouldn't have won $#@!. The Trump campaign itself admits the truth of what is being said in the OP. Trump didn't have a ground game in Colorado. Everything else is anecdotal evidence and hearsay.
    I am not too bothered by Colorado and I didn't like Ron's strategy. It kinda made sense but not too much. I saw it as a way to continue to argue with republican rank and file. As far as stealing the election from republicans I didn't think it would happen because if that to happen people would just vote for another republican party and this one would become like LP.

    As far as Colorado I am listening to Stefan talk about it now and it looks really bad. Like 24 people unanimously voting on rules that make it very hard for Trump to win Colorado. Kinda makes sense why he would skip it. Also how this was brought in after Ron Paul and Santorum did will in Colorado. So I guess it is easy who you are by the friend you keep. And how the people who wronged RP in the past are not aligned with Cruz temporarily makes it more clear.

    (mod edit)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cowlesy View Post
    Americans in general are jedi masters of blaming every other person.



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  20. #17
    Did Trump have any delegates going into the Convention?

    If he did, then that's where the cries of "stolen!" seem justified since there wasn't a vote at the Convention.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by CPUd View Post
    This is the 2016 presidential election forum. We discuss presidential candidates and elections in here.
    I wish you would discuss how you plan to deal with the establishment that is standing behind Cruz, but no, Trump must be stopped at all costs and I guess we'll just bend over and take it in 2020 like we have the last 3 elections.

    Some of us are actually quite tired of seeing the establishment win every time, and we're exceptionally weary of you opening 5 new threads every day quoting some establishment buffoon on why Trump sucks and is an idiot.
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    This is getting silly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It started silly.
    T.S. Eliot's The Hollow Men

    "One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors." - Plato

    We Are Running Out of Time - Mini Me

    Quote Originally Posted by Philhelm
    I part ways with "libertarianism" when it transitions from ideology grounded in logic into self-defeating autism for the sake of ideological purity.

  22. #19
    This whole thing is funny. Colorado was one of those states that we ID as favorable for Rand because of their rules.

    And now, because of those rules not working out for a certain authoritarian, it's the rules' fault.
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    This whole thing is funny. Colorado was one of those states that we ID as favorable for Rand because of their rules.

    And now, because of those rules not working out for a certain authoritarian, it's the rules' fault.
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to CaptUSA again.

    Exactly! And now a brokered convention is "evil incarnate" when for two election cycles our only hope was a brokered convention.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Fivezeroes View Post
    Are you saying Ron Paul didn't have any delegates unseated, his delegates weren't locked out as well? Cause if you are, you have a short short memory of 2012.
    What do you mean by "as well"? Are you trying to say that something unfair has happened to Trump that's similar to the tactics used against Ron Paul?

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by nobody's_hero View Post
    I wish you would discuss how you plan to deal with the establishment that is standing behind Cruz, but no, Trump must be stopped at all costs and I guess we'll just bend over and take it in 2020 like we have the last 3 elections.

    Some of us are actually quite tired of seeing the establishment win every time, and we're exceptionally weary of you opening 5 new threads every day quoting some establishment buffoon on why Trump sucks and is an idiot.
    There is no monolithic entity called "the establishment" and large factions of "the establishment" are not standing behind Cruz and many are standing behind Trump. That is unless people like Chris Christie has magically become no longer part of "the establishment" simply by virtue of throwing his weight (no pun intended) behind Trump. And how many threads is it okay to have spreading the misinformation that Trump lost Colorado because it was "stolen" from him when the truth is he didn't even show up to the game? And Ron Paul has already made it clear that Trump sucks but Trump is no idiot. He's a very smart dishonest used car salesman. In a twisted way I admire him for being able to fool so many people. As for dealing with "the establishment", the GOP is pretty much $#@!ed regardless of what it does. Nominate Trump? They damn well will lose the election to Hillary Clinton and anyone but the most ardent Trump supporters knows this. A Trump candidacy also pretty much guarantees that third parties will get around 10% or more of the vote. The Libertarian Party could well get over the magic 5% number. I see some of the main people pushing Trump are hoping for that. If the GOP doesn't nominate Trump then Trump becomes the third party candidate and the Libertarian Party doesn't get $#@!. I understand the "logic" but I won't idly be a player in that.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Fivezeroes View Post
    Are you saying Ron Paul didn't have any delegates unseated, his delegates weren't locked out as well? Cause if you are, you have a short short memory of 2012.
    Straw man argument. I'm saying Ron Paul's people actually showed up, played the game, and won delegates in states where he lost the popular vote. Trump didn't. Is that because the establishment liked Ron Paul better? If you believe that then you really are a lost cause. What it does mean is that Ron Paul actually had a ground game. Trump does not. Think of it from a football standpoint. You have a great quarterback but no running game. If that's the case ultimately you will lose. Sure there will be some bad calls by the refs and some cheating by the other team. That happens in football. But if you show up without decent running backs and strong offensive and defensive lines, that's your fault. That's what happened to Trump. Pointing to this bad call or that unfair tactic by the other team is just window dressing to the fact that you showed up without a running game.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by silverhandorder View Post
    I am not too bothered by Colorado and I didn't like Ron's strategy. It kinda made sense but not too much. I saw it as a way to continue to argue with republican rank and file. As far as stealing the election from republicans I didn't think it would happen because if that to happen people would just vote for another republican party and this one would become like LP.
    Like it or not it was about all we had at the time. Get as many delegates in the state convention and go for a brokered convention.

    As far as Colorado I am listening to Stefan talk about it now and it looks really bad. Like 24 people unanimously voting on rules that make it very hard for Trump to win Colorado. Kinda makes sense why he would skip it. Also how this was brought in after Ron Paul and Santorum did will in Colorado. So I guess it is easy who you are by the friend you keep. And how the people who wronged RP in the past are not aligned with Cruz temporarily makes it more clear.
    Many of the people who wronged Ron Paul in the past lost their power in the convention process. In Kentucky a lot of the party leaders that "stole" delegates from Donald Trump actually support Rand Paul. I heard a pro Trump talk show host from Kentucky bitching and moaning about this just this past weekend.

    (mod edit)
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.



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  29. #25
    It's amazing how even Matt Drudge is completely blinded by Trump. To promote the idea that Cruz cheated because he's organizing to get delegates, which is what a campaign is supposed to do, is just mind boggling to me.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by SilentBull View Post
    It's amazing how even Matt Drudge is completely blinded by Trump. To promote the idea that Cruz cheated because he's organizing to get delegates, which is what a campaign is supposed to do, is just mind boggling to me.
    That part isn't that amazing. Drudge feeds on sensationalism and controversy. Trump is like a gift from Heaven for him.

  31. #27


    There is a lot of misinformation about what happened in Colorado and anti trump trolls are further obfuscating the issue. Here is Stefan Molyneux breaking it down comprehensively about what happened.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cowlesy View Post
    Americans in general are jedi masters of blaming every other person.

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by silverhandorder View Post


    There is a lot of misinformation about what happened in Colorado and anti trump trolls are further obfuscating the issue. Here is Stefan Molyneux breaking it down comprehensively about what happened.
    His opening statement was so factually inaccurate that I can't imagine there was anything worth listening to in the rest. Could you save me the time and reiterate any valid points you think he made?
    Last edited by erowe1; 04-12-2016 at 08:05 AM.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by erowe1 View Post
    His opening state was so factually inaccurate that I can't imagine there was anything worth listening to in the rest. Could you save me the time and reiterate any valid points you think he made?
    Re listening the opening. How far in were you?

    1 minute in he states no voting took place to award delegates and compares the process to banana republic. Did you stop here? No facts were said yet.

    0:52 to 2:00 Talks about an article and Trump hiring an aid to figure out what republicans want. Still no inaccuracies. Whats your definition of opening statement?

    If you stopped listening in the first minute because cognitive dissonance is too painful well that is your problem.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cowlesy View Post
    Americans in general are jedi masters of blaming every other person.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by silverhandorder View Post
    1 minute in he states no voting took place to award delegates and compares the process to banana republic. Did you stop here? No facts were said yet.
    Yes. I heard that part. That is a claim about facts, and is blatantly false. If he believes that, he must be completely clueless about what happened.

    What does he think the precinct caucuses on March 1 were? Does he even know they happened?

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