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Thread: My take on Trump after Ron Paul 2012.

  1. #1

    Post My take on Trump after Ron Paul 2012.

    Hello,


    I was with Ron Paul since 2008 and 2012. I loved him and lost friendships because of him. He was great but lacked what Trump has.

    In our world, you cannot succeed without it unless you have the establishment machine behind you. When I first heard Trump was running I didn't pay attention remembering Trump antics when Ron Paul was running. I couldn't bother with any republicans. Rand Paul doesn't have what I identified as needed after 2008 and 2012.

    So when in September 2015 I first heard and saw Trump talking to the media, punching back. I couldn't help think if only Ron Paul had that mojo, that saviness in talking. This high energy. Trump doesn't talk to the political junkie that practice intellectual onanism. He talks to absolutely everyone.
    Ron Paul would always go off in a tangent, he would get boxed by reporters. It was always painful to watch.

    Trump uncovers the corruption in the system and forces everyone to look at it, just like Sanders does. Trump doesn't know about delegate rules but those rules are what powers corruption!!! Remember how Ron Paul got boxed in 2012?

    I don't even care about Trump policies except that he is a non-interventionist and anti illegal immigration. So I'm surprised Ron Paul supporters don't like him that much.

    Just my 2 cents after 4 years.



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  3. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    Hello,


    I was with Ron Paul since 2008 and 2012. I loved him and lost friendships because of him. He was great but lacked what Trump has.

    In our world, you cannot succeed without it unless you have the establishment machine behind you. When I first heard Trump was running I didn't pay attention remembering Trump antics when Ron Paul was running. I couldn't bother with any republicans. Rand Paul doesn't have what I identified as needed after 2008 and 2012.

    So when in September 2015 I first heard and saw Trump talking to the media, punching back. I couldn't help think if only Ron Paul had that mojo, that saviness in talking. This high energy. Trump doesn't talk to the political junkie that practice intellectual onanism. He talks to absolutely everyone.
    Ron Paul would always go off in a tangent, he would get boxed by reporters. It was always painful to watch.

    Trump uncovers the corruption in the system and forces everyone to look at it, just like Sanders does. Trump doesn't know about delegate rules but those rules are what powers corruption!!! Remember how Ron Paul got boxed in 2012?

    I don't even care about Trump policies except that he is a non-interventionist and anti illegal immigration. So I'm surprised Ron Paul supporters don't like him that much.

    Just my 2 cents after 4 years.
    That is a pretty spot on observation. However this forum is not a good indication of "Ron Paul supporters" as a whole. There just happens to be a small loud contingent of Trump hater spammers here. Some may or may not be Paul supporters at all and some I suspect are actually being paid.
    * See my visitor message area for caveats related to my posting history here.
    * Also, I have effectively retired from all social media including posting here and are basically opting out of anything to do with national politics or this country on federal or state level and rather focusing locally. I may stop by from time to time to discuss philosophy on a general level related to Libertarian schools of thought and application in the real world.

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    Hello,


    I was with Ron Paul since 2008 and 2012. I loved him and lost friendships because of him. He was great but lacked what Trump has.

    In our world, you cannot succeed without it unless you have the establishment machine behind you. When I first heard Trump was running I didn't pay attention remembering Trump antics when Ron Paul was running. I couldn't bother with any republicans. Rand Paul doesn't have what I identified as needed after 2008 and 2012.

    So when in September 2015 I first heard and saw Trump talking to the media, punching back. I couldn't help think if only Ron Paul had that mojo, that saviness in talking. This high energy. Trump doesn't talk to the political junkie that practice intellectual onanism. He talks to absolutely everyone.
    Ron Paul would always go off in a tangent, he would get boxed by reporters. It was always painful to watch.

    Trump uncovers the corruption in the system and forces everyone to look at it, just like Sanders does. Trump doesn't know about delegate rules but those rules are what powers corruption!!! Remember how Ron Paul got boxed in 2012?

    I don't even care about Trump policies except that he is a non-interventionist and anti illegal immigration. So I'm surprised Ron Paul supporters don't like him that much.

    Just my 2 cents after 4 years.
    I am so $#@!ing tired of hearing this lie you trump supporters tell us. It has been proved Trump supported both the Iraq wars and the Libyan wars from the beginning. That is NOT non interventionist.
    Last edited by klamath; 04-11-2016 at 11:45 AM.
    War; everything in the world wrong, evil and immoral combined into one and multiplied by millions.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by kahless View Post
    That is a pretty spot on observation. However this forum is not a good indication of "Ron Paul supporters" as a whole. There just happens to be a small loud contingent of Trump hater spammers here. Some may or may not be Paul supporters at all and some I suspect are actually being paid.
    Hmmm...... my POV is quite the opposite.

    "There just happens to be a small loud contingent of Trump lover spammers here. Some may or may not be Paul supporters at all and some I suspect are actually being paid."

    And I seldom engage in the Trump dialog.
    Last edited by Ender; 04-11-2016 at 03:28 PM.
    There is no spoon.

  6. #5
    //
    double post
    Last edited by Jamesiv1; 04-11-2016 at 11:44 AM.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Hmmm...... my POV is quite the opposite.

    "There just happens to be a small loud contingent of Trump lover spammers here. Some may or may not be Paul supporters at all and some I suspect are actually being paid."
    And I seldom engage in the Trump dialog.
    I would say we have both.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    Hello,


    I was with Ron Paul since 2008 and 2012. I loved him and lost friendships because of him. He was great but lacked what Trump has.

    In our world, you cannot succeed without it unless you have the establishment machine behind you. When I first heard Trump was running I didn't pay attention remembering Trump antics when Ron Paul was running. I couldn't bother with any republicans. Rand Paul doesn't have what I identified as needed after 2008 and 2012.

    So when in September 2015 I first heard and saw Trump talking to the media, punching back. I couldn't help think if only Ron Paul had that mojo, that saviness in talking. This high energy. Trump doesn't talk to the political junkie that practice intellectual onanism. He talks to absolutely everyone.
    Ron Paul would always go off in a tangent, he would get boxed by reporters. It was always painful to watch.

    Trump uncovers the corruption in the system and forces everyone to look at it, just like Sanders does. Trump doesn't know about delegate rules but those rules are what powers corruption!!! Remember how Ron Paul got boxed in 2012?

    I don't even care about Trump policies except that he is a non-interventionist and anti illegal immigration. So I'm surprised Ron Paul supporters don't like him that much.
    Just my 2 cents after 4 years.
    Lol, perhaps you should check out what Ron Paul himself has been saying about selecting Trump.
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  9. #8
    Staff - Admin
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    I don't even care about Trump policies except ...
    We do care; and they are things that have been evaluated here:
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...mp-%28POTUS%29

    There has been no argument shown how Trump supports our principles or Mission in any significant manner. Additional analysis shows he is not worthy of promotion as a back-up or strategic candidate. We understand that others will disagree, which is fine, but the site has set a policy that limits the promotion of candidates that do not receive a favorable evaluation, as shown here:
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...ial-Candidates

    Obviously this doesn't mean that all site members agree in lockstep, which is again fine, but as a site everyone has to follow the guidelines. This thread is being closed as it is overly promoting Trump. You are welcome to contribute to the previous listed evaluation thread and provide pro's and con's as seen fit. Thank you for your understand and cooperation.
    This site has a specific purpose defined in our Mission Statement.

    Members must read and follow our Community Guidelines.

    I strive to respond to all queries; please excuse late and out-of-sequence responses.



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  11. #9
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    We are reopening this for now as there can be value in the discussion, and the OP does not have a history of problems.

    Please limit to analysis and thoughtful discussion of @Mordan: post.

    Do not use this thread as a spring board to promote Trump.

    Thanks.
    This site has a specific purpose defined in our Mission Statement.

    Members must read and follow our Community Guidelines.

    I strive to respond to all queries; please excuse late and out-of-sequence responses.

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Bryan View Post
    We are reopening this for now as there can be value in the discussion, and the OP does not have a history of problems.

    Please limit to analysis and thought discussion of @Mordan: post.

    Do not use this thread as a spring board to promote Trump.

    Thanks.
    So, does this mean that you are opening it for people to bash the TS for what he posted, but no one who agrees with him can join in and post why they agree with his take? I probably am misunderstanding you, so please set me straight.
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  13. #11
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    I fixed a typo in my post, that should make it clear.

    Please limit to analysis and thoughtful discussion


    -- no need to bash the OP, that's against the guidelines anyways.
    This site has a specific purpose defined in our Mission Statement.

    Members must read and follow our Community Guidelines.

    I strive to respond to all queries; please excuse late and out-of-sequence responses.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    Hello,


    I was with Ron Paul since 2008 and 2012. I loved him and lost friendships because of him. He was great but lacked what Trump has.

    In our world, you cannot succeed without it unless you have the establishment machine behind you. When I first heard Trump was running I didn't pay attention remembering Trump antics when Ron Paul was running. I couldn't bother with any republicans. Rand Paul doesn't have what I identified as needed after 2008 and 2012.

    So when in September 2015 I first heard and saw Trump talking to the media, punching back. I couldn't help think if only Ron Paul had that mojo, that saviness in talking. This high energy. Trump doesn't talk to the political junkie that practice intellectual onanism. He talks to absolutely everyone.
    Ron Paul would always go off in a tangent, he would get boxed by reporters. It was always painful to watch.

    Trump uncovers the corruption in the system and forces everyone to look at it, just like Sanders does. Trump doesn't know about delegate rules but those rules are what powers corruption!!! Remember how Ron Paul got boxed in 2012?

    I don't even care about Trump policies except that he is a non-interventionist and anti illegal immigration. So I'm surprised Ron Paul supporters don't like him that much.

    Just my 2 cents after 4 years.
    lol.. you made a huge mistake not supporting Rand. I can't believe how many people got hoodwinked into not supporting Ron Paul's own son, who Ron Paul himself fully supported..

    You are making the argument that, "In our world, you cannot succeed without it unless you have the establishment machine behind you." .... Well... WTF did you think Rand was trying to do?? If Ron Paul's supporters hadn't all abandoned Rand, we wouldn't be sitting here deciding whether or not we should support some authoritarian-lite just because he might be anti-establishment.. we would have a true freedom fighter in our corner, someone with a much better foreign policy than Trump.
    Last edited by dannno; 04-11-2016 at 02:27 PM.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  15. #13
    First off, thx for reopening my thread. I was baffled. If I was a new account, I would have understood but this is a 2008 account!

    Many here might not like it, but fact is, Trump is liked by many. And when I keep reading the media insulting Trump supporters saying they are uneducated. I feel bad. I felt bad when replies here just jumped on conclusions.

    What I said about not caring about policies might have been misunderstood. I do care about policies but I have become a single issue voter. And I want the people that made Ron Paul suffer LOSE. I see Trump as Karma to the GOP establishment. However bad some Trump ideas are, he has some good points and he has qualities.

    When you see Romney pulling all the stops to prevent Trump from being nominated I can't stop but wanting Trump even more. Romney is the establishment hack who boxed Ron Paul. Therefore Trump must be doing something worth it. It is not rational. It is intuitive.
    Ron Paul is a purist and will never vote for Trump of course.

    This thread is not about promoting Trump for the sake of it. I'm a former RP supporter and wanted to have some insights about what others think. I was rooting for Rand Paul a bit but he became too establishment and left early. Its strange how Trump supporters quickly receive blame or insults everywhere they go. I remember being called a PaulBot on Hannity forums and was banned quickly.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    lol.. you made a huge mistake not supporting Rand. I can't believe how many people got hoodwinked into not supporting Ron Paul's own son, who Ron Paul himself fully supported..
    I think you shouldn't put the blame on former Ron Paul supporters. It's not a dynasty. After the 2008 and 2012 I am wise enough to understand "Who has a Chance" and "Who has a snowball chance in Hell". Even Trump will probably be defeated by the Establishment.

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by klamath View Post
    I am so $#@!ing tired of hearing this lie you trump supporters tell us. It has been proved Trump supported both the Iraq wars and the Libyan wars from the beginning. That is NOT non interventionist.
    you know. here i found the videos that made me think of Ron Paul (foreign policy wise) and cemented my support. I think Trump is very non-interventionist compared to other GOPers. And I find it sad that Rand Paul doesn't have that image in my mind. He isn't like his father. Rand would toe the establishment line several times. I forgot exactly when but i didn't like what I heard. While when I heard Trump in those videos. It stuck and I agreed mostly.

    Trump talks to the jewish coalition
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQYO...&nohtml5=False

    Trump Guardian Interview on Foreign Policy.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=re7BA2Ybjsg

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    I think you shouldn't put the blame on former Ron Paul supporters. It's not a dynasty. After the 2008 and 2012 I am wise enough to understand "Who has a Chance" and "Who has a snowball chance in Hell". Even Trump will probably be defeated by the Establishment.
    So you thought Ron Paul had a chance, but Rand Paul didn't?

    I think all else equal, Rand had a much better chance than his father, after what his father had done - as much as I'd really like to see Ron Paul as President, Rand had the potential to appeal to more conservative voters and more independent voters as well as the media. On the left they probably would have been similar since Ron Paul had a much more brazen foreign policy that appealed to them.

    Rand didn't do well because most of the Ron Paul supporters abandoned him, so he didn't have a leg to stand on, and then on top of that we had at least one and maybe even two candidates who had been prepped for years and were put on the ticket, imo, for the sole purpose of keeping Rand Paul from getting the nomination (Cruz and Trump).
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    you know. here i found the videos that made me think of Ron Paul (foreign policy wise) and cemented my support. I think Trump is very non-interventionist compared to other GOPers. And I find it sad that Rand Paul doesn't have that image in my mind. He isn't like his father. Rand would toe the establishment line several times. I forgot exactly when but i didn't like what I heard. While when I heard Trump in those videos. It stuck and I agreed mostly.

    Trump talks to the jewish coalition
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQYO...&nohtml5=False

    Trump Guardian Interview on Foreign Policy.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=re7BA2Ybjsg
    Ya see this is exactly what I'm talking about. Rand tried to appeal to the establishment and the media, while also attempting to retain his father's support so he could win. You dropped your support for Rand due to his strategy, not his beliefs. You confused the two. Rand thought his father's supporters were smart enough to know the difference, but unfortunately that didn't work out too well. Rand has an infinitely better foreign policy than Donald Trump, and here you are saying how great Donald Trump's foreign policy is.. It's just absolutely nuts.

    Trump, on the other hand, used a different tactic. He used his popularity as a tv star to discredit and tear apart the media and the establishment, even though we don't even know if he is actually anti-establishment - in the mean time Rand was trying to get along with the media and the establishment, which were dying out and Trump came in with some death blows and mucked up Rand's strategy.

    The problem is Rand actually believes in freedom, and we have no idea what Donald Trump believes in.

    And you still can't see that you got completely fooled by the establishment.
    Last edited by dannno; 04-11-2016 at 03:37 PM.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    So you thought Ron Paul had a chance, but Rand Paul didn't?

    I think all else equal, Rand had a much better chance than his father, after what his father had done - as much as I'd really like to see Ron Paul as President, Rand had the potential to appeal to more conservative voters and more independent voters as well as the media. On the left they probably would have been similar since Ron Paul had a much more brazen foreign policy that appealed to them.

    Rand didn't do well because most of the Ron Paul supporters abandoned him, so he didn't have a leg to stand on, and then on top of that we had at least one and maybe even two candidates who had been prepped for years and were put on the ticket, imo, for the sole purpose of keeping Rand Paul from getting the nomination (Cruz and Trump).
    i was younger and yea I hoped Ron Paul could upset the powers that be.

    See this New York Times article as to why Trump is running. Remove the tin foil. Trump never run to stop Rand. The article is quite good. It gives details on the relationship between Trump and Romney.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/13/us...-campaign.html

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Ya see this is exactly what I'm talking about. Rand tried to appeal to the establishment and the media, while also attempting to retain his father's support so he could win. You dropped your support for Rand due to his strategy, not his beliefs. You confused the two. Rand thought his father's supporters were smart enough to know the difference, but unfortunately that didn't work out too well. Rand has an infinitely better foreign policy than Donald Trump, and here you are saying how great Donald Trump's foreign policy is.. It's just absolutely nuts.

    Trump, on the other hand, used a different tactic. He used his popularity as a tv star to descredit and tear apart the media and the establishment, even though we don't even know if he is actually anti-establishment - in the mean time Rand was trying to get along with the media and the establishment, which were dying out and Trump came in with some death blows and mucked up Rand's strategy.

    The problem is Rand actually believes in freedom, and we have no idea what Donald Trump believes in.

    And you still can't see that you got completely fooled by the establishment.
    You're waaaay over-thinking it.

    Donald Trump has the best words. And that's all you need to know.

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Ya see this is exactly what I'm talking about. Rand tried to appeal to the establishment and the media, while also attempting to retain his father's support so he could win. You dropped your support for Rand due to his strategy, not his beliefs. You confused the two. Rand thought his father's supporters were smart enough to know the difference, but unfortunately that didn't work out too well. Rand has an infinitely better foreign policy than Donald Trump, and here you are saying how great Donald Trump's foreign policy is.. It's just absolutely nuts.

    Trump, on the other hand, used a different tactic. He used his popularity as a tv star to descredit and tear apart the media and the establishment, even though we don't even know if he is actually anti-establishment - in the mean time Rand was trying to get along with the media and the establishment, which were dying out and Trump came in with some death blows and mucked up Rand's strategy.

    The problem is Rand actually believes in freedom, and we have no idea what Donald Trump believes in.

    And you still can't see that you got completely fooled by the establishment.
    Rand accepted Bitcoin as donations. That's all I remember about him that stuck. Trump? He wants to deport illegal immigrants. Hello!! We have a winner.!!! That's the single one reason why Trump succeeded. Trump said it in a way that stuck in the minds of voters. Trump won Florida. He didn't spend a dime and Romney and his friends spent millions in attack ads. There you have Trump's anti establishment credentials.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    i was younger and yea I hoped Ron Paul could upset the powers that be.

    See this New York Times article as to why Trump is running. Remove the tin foil. Trump never run to stop Rand. The article is quite good. It gives details on the relationship between Trump and Romney.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/13/us...-campaign.html
    First of all, I said "we had at least one and maybe even two candidates to had been prepped for years and were put on the ticket, imo, for the sole purpose of keeping Rand Paul from getting the nomination (Cruz and Trump).

    The "one" was Cruz and the "maybe even two" is Trump.

    Have you ever seen "House of Cards" ?

    You have no idea if what is in that article is valid, or a script for a play that was written just for you. Neither do I, but at least I'm admitting that.

    Just so you know, I'm in the Stefan Molyneux thread right now defending Stefan for his pro-Trump videos. I don't know what is behind the Trump phenomenon, and I'm not going to pretend to know until the more facts come out. At the moment, I cannot tell you that Trump is pro or anti-establishment - there are good arguments on both sides and neither are definitive.

    Before you go full-retard for Trump just consider what else might be going on. There are valid reasons to support him, but it could all just be showmanship.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    i was younger and yea I hoped Ron Paul could upset the powers that be.

    See this New York Times article as to why Trump is running. Remove the tin foil. Trump never run to stop Rand. The article is quite good. It gives details on the relationship between Trump and Romney.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/13/us...-campaign.html
    This article is quite good and it explains the relationship of the Pauls and Trump.


    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Trump: Huntsman and Paul are 'joke candidates'

    The mogul said if the right GOP nominee doesn't emerge, he'll jump in as an independent

    http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/455513.../#.Tt0BvFtNquO

    If “the wrong candidate is nominated to run” and “it’s a candidate that’s not going to win and not very good,’’ Trump said he would “certainly think about running as an independent.’’ Despite dalliances with a possible presidential bid in the past, Trump said he has never seriously considered it until this year

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Ya see this is exactly what I'm talking about. Rand tried to appeal to the establishment and the media, while also attempting to retain his father's support so he could win. You dropped your support for Rand due to his strategy, not his beliefs. You confused the two. Rand thought his father's supporters were smart enough to know the difference, but unfortunately that didn't work out too well. Rand has an infinitely better foreign policy than Donald Trump, and here you are saying how great Donald Trump's foreign policy is.. It's just absolutely nuts.

    Trump, on the other hand, used a different tactic. He used his popularity as a tv star to descredit and tear apart the media and the establishment, even though we don't even know if he is actually anti-establishment - in the mean time Rand was trying to get along with the media and the establishment, which were dying out and Trump came in with some death blows and mucked up Rand's strategy.

    The problem is Rand actually believes in freedom, and we have no idea what Donald Trump believes in.

    And you still can't see that you got completely fooled by the establishment.
    AMEN.

    That's exactly how I see it. Rand tried to play the game a bit smarter and was dumped by the RP supporters- most of who complained that Ron just hadn't played the game right- Boo. Hoo.
    There is no spoon.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post

    Before you go full-retard for Trump just consider what else might be going on. There are valid reasons to support him, but it could all just be showmanship.
    I'm not full retard on Trump and never will. It is intuitive. When NeoCons and Democrats and the media attack someone like they attacked Ron Paul. That guy must be doing something right! I agree with you on Cruz though. He stole Rand Paul voters on his lane.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    Rand accepted Bitcoin as donations. That's all I remember about him that stuck.
    lol.. whose fault is that???

    How about the fact that when he was 17, he stepped in for his father and debated his congressional opponent and won? How about the fact that his father endorses Rand as a liberty candidate?? Do you even care about liberty? Peaceful foreign policy?? If so, then Rand is your candidate, not Trump..


    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    Trump? He wants to deport illegal immigrants. Hello!! We have a winner.!!! That's the single one reason why Trump succeeded. Trump said it in a way that stuck in the minds of voters. Trump won Florida. He didn't spend a dime and Romney and his friends spent millions in attack ads. There you have Trump's anti establishment credentials.
    And when most people think of deporting illegal immigrants, they think of the Holocaust, Japanese internment and worse - massive violence, race wars, etc.. For good reason. The round-up of all these illegal immigrants will infringe on the rights of white people - they will infringe on the rights of legal immigrants - they will infringe on the rights of illegal immigrants.

    I understand the anti-immigrant sentiment - immigration has been a government program for decades. They bring them in, they give them welfare - double the amount of illegal immigrants on welfare as citizens. They get all sorts of free things they don't pay for and then they send the money they do make out of the country. Then they vote for socialist politicians who will give them more money!! But individually they are also families and actual people.

    I'm totally 100% ok with removing all the government programs that fund and promote illegal immigration. I'm ok with putting a moratorium on immigration, I'm ok with removing illegal immigrants who have committed violent crimes.

    But to round them all up and send them all back just sounds completely insane to most people.
    Last edited by dannno; 04-11-2016 at 03:32 PM.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post

    But to round them all up and send them all back just sounds completely insane to most people.
    Art of the Deal.

    Thx to this outrageous statement we are talking about fixing illegal immigration. Otherwise nothing. Look what Rubio did. Voters gave him PAY BACK!

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    First off, thx for reopening my thread. I was baffled. If I was a new account, I would have understood but this is a 2008 account!

    Many here might not like it, but fact is, Trump is liked by many. And when I keep reading the media insulting Trump supporters saying they are uneducated. I feel bad. I felt bad when replies here just jumped on conclusions.

    What I said about not caring about policies might have been misunderstood. I do care about policies but I have become a single issue voter. And I want the people that made Ron Paul suffer LOSE. I see Trump as Karma to the GOP establishment. However bad some Trump ideas are, he has some good points and he has qualities.

    When you see Romney pulling all the stops to prevent Trump from being nominated I can't stop but wanting Trump even more. Romney is the establishment hack who boxed Ron Paul. Therefore Trump must be doing something worth it. It is not rational. It is intuitive.
    Ron Paul is a purist and will never vote for Trump of course.

    This thread is not about promoting Trump for the sake of it. I'm a former RP supporter and wanted to have some insights about what others think. I was rooting for Rand Paul a bit but he became too establishment and left early. Its strange how Trump supporters quickly receive blame or insults everywhere they go. I remember being called a PaulBot on Hannity forums and was banned quickly.
    Trump spends a lot of time telling people how much he is liked, how many people show up to his rallies, how many twitter followers he has, how rich he is, etc. Dig into those and you will find they are all gross exaggerations. The truth is, as a presidential candidate, he is only going after 1 demographic:
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...eeny-tiny-base

    Nowhere near enough to win a general election, and probably not enough to win a primary nomination. The reason he does well with the uneducated is because even in the $#@!ty public education system, most people get exposed to enough history and political science to recognize Trump is following a model that has been attempted in the past to some limited success.

    Trump also attracts the socially disconnected. You can see this in the Trump supporters online- a lot of them are 100% negative in their postings, and tend to lash out because they feel like they are under constant attack.
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...ial-identities

    Of all the reasons why the promotion of Trump's candidacy on a liberty board (as noted by Bryan) is not a good thing for liberty, most alarming is the idea of building up a massive police state to aggressively hunt down illegal immigrants, deport them, then let them rapidly come back in.
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...heir-turn-quot
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    I'm not full retard on Trump and never will. It is intuitive. When NeoCons and Democrats and the media attack someone like they attacked Ron Paul. That guy must be doing something right! I agree with you on Cruz though. He stole Rand Paul voters on his lane.
    But Donald was parroting the neocon talking points in 2011 attacking Ron Paul, and then he supported Mitt Romney.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    Hello,


    I was with Ron Paul since 2008 and 2012. I loved him and lost friendships because of him. He was great but lacked what Trump has.

    In our world, you cannot succeed without it unless you have the establishment machine behind you. When I first heard Trump was running I didn't pay attention remembering Trump antics when Ron Paul was running. I couldn't bother with any republicans. Rand Paul doesn't have what I identified as needed after 2008 and 2012.

    So when in September 2015 I first heard and saw Trump talking to the media, punching back. I couldn't help think if only Ron Paul had that mojo, that saviness in talking. This high energy. Trump doesn't talk to the political junkie that practice intellectual onanism. He talks to absolutely everyone.
    Ron Paul would always go off in a tangent, he would get boxed by reporters. It was always painful to watch.

    Trump uncovers the corruption in the system and forces everyone to look at it, just like Sanders does. Trump doesn't know about delegate rules but those rules are what powers corruption!!! Remember how Ron Paul got boxed in 2012?

    I don't even care about Trump policies except that he is a non-interventionist and anti illegal immigration. So I'm surprised Ron Paul supporters don't like him that much.

    Just my 2 cents after 4 years.
    Hello. Sorry that you've been fooled into believing that Donald Trump is a non-interventionist. I was fooled too. Here's the truth.

    1) Donald Trump lied when he claimed to have been against the Iraq war from the beginning. The truth is that Trump called for the invasion of Iraq in 2002 and even in 2000 (before 9/11).


    http://www.breitbart.com/big-governm...-wmds-in-iraq/

    2) Donald Trump called for U.S. troops to be sent into Libya to overthrow Khaddafi. That makes him more of an interventionist than even Obama.



    3) Donald Trump called Hillary Clinton "The best secretary of state" even after Benghazi.



    In short, Donald Trump is a snake oil salesman. He's not even against illegal immigration. He wants to deport all of the illegals then bring the "good ones" back "rapidly" through a "big beautiful door" in the wall that he's going to build and Mexico is going to pay for. He hired illegal immigrants to work for him. His ties are made in China. He's a big phony. Some of us see through him. Others refuse to see. Still others are fine with him being a phony because all they want is a GOP candidate that sucks so bad that the libertarian candidate might get 5% of the popular vote in the general election.

    http://therightscoop.com/trump-all-i...-back-legally/
    Last edited by jmdrake; 04-11-2016 at 03:45 PM.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    lol.. whose fault is that???

    How about the fact that when he was 17, he stepped in for his father and debated his congressional opponent and won? How about the fact that his father endorses Rand as a liberty candidate?? Do you even care about liberty? Peaceful foreign policy?? If so, then Rand is your candidate, not Trump..




    And when most people think of deporting illegal immigrants, they think of the Holocaust, Japanese internment and worse - massive violence, race wars, etc.. For good reason. The round-up of all these illegal immigrants will infringe on the rights of white people - they will infringe on the rights of legal immigrants - they will infringe on the rights of illegal immigrants.

    I understand the anti-immigrant sentiment - immigration has been a government program for decades. They bring them in, they give them welfare - double the amount of illegal immigrants on welfare as citizens. They get all sorts of free things they don't pay for and then they send the money they do make out of the country. Then they vote for socialist politicians who will give them more money!! But individually they are also families and actual people.

    I'm totally 100% ok with removing all the government programs that fund and promote illegal immigration. I'm ok with putting a moratorium on immigration, I'm ok with removing illegal immigrants who have committed violent crimes.

    But to round them all up and send them all back just sounds completely insane to most people.
    Preach it, Bro!
    There is no spoon.

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