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Thread: The libertarian case for Kasich

  1. #1

    The libertarian case for Kasich

    One week ago, Rand Paul officially suspended his presidential campaign.

    While the move was perhaps inevitable after disappointing Iowa results, his absence did leave an unanswered question: Where will disaffected libertarians and independents go?

    Answers abounded almost immediately. Ted Cruz? Donald Trump? Even Bernie Sanders?

    The circular speculating belies an important point – the Paul campaign may have struggled, but as Reason’s Nick Gillespie recently pointed out, the electorate’s slow, steady move toward independence and libertarian sympathies continues.

    For years, I have considered myself very much a part of this “libertarian moment.”

    As a teenager, I found my political home in a rag-tag collection of activists motivated by the quixotic campaign of a doctor from Texas.

    As a college student, I thrived in libertarian student organizations and small-government activism.

    Today, I work every day helping lead an independent organization that’s dedicated to cutting government spending.

    It’s even thanks to “the movement” that I met my husband, who served as Dr. Paul’s fundraising director in 2008.

    In many ways, there’s little about the 2016 election that can make someone like me happy.

    On the Republican side, there are near-universal calls to bust budget caps; candidates itching for “carpet bombing” the Islamic State; and a populist frontrunner who casually discusses killing terrorists’ families, supports eminent domain and economic protectionism, and brags about bringing back “waterboarding and much worse.”

    And the Democrats? A hawkish establishment favorite or an open socialist.

    Hardly inspiring.

    Especially in light of these options, it’s time to take a second look at Tuesday night’s second-place finisher, Governor John Kasich.

    Coming off of his unexpected surge in the Granite State, Kasich will likely be getting a lot more attention in coming days.

    Libertarians and independents might find a lot to like.

    Kasich, who campaigned across New Hampshire with a portable debt clock, often talks of the fact that he was a “key player” in passing the Balanced Budget Act of 1997. Drilling down into details, though, shows that his dedication to fiscal responsibility today is far more substantive than most of his rivals can claim.

    Business Insider called his leadership of Ohio the best among governors seeking the Presidency, based on Ohio’s high ranking in its Economic Evaluation of States. Under his tenure, the jobless rate in the state has gone from above the national average to 5 percent below, while a record number of businesses have been created.

    Federal fiscal policy also shows a clear distinction.

    In July, Defense One called him “the fiscal-defense hawk you don’t remember,” highlighting his effective fight as Budget Chair against buying more B-2 bombers and his push for overall Pentagon reforms.

    In August of this year, Governor Kasich caught heat from the neoconservative wing of his party for saying the Pentagon sequester “doesn’t matter” – because he wants to fight for savings even if he opposes the across-the-board cuts.

    In a field dominated by endless calls to hike Pentagon spending to the moon and back, Kasich often demurs, preferring to highlight his record fighting for reform at the nation’s largest bureaucracy, and saying he’ll spend more “if necessary.”

    To be clear – a prominent Republican whose last name is not Paul, Amash, or Massie, who wants to limit Pentagon spending is all but revolutionary in 2016.

    There’s a reason Jeb Bush plans to undertake a “scorched-Earth” campaign against Kasich in South Carolina, saying he “has consistently supported gutting the military.”

    Sharing common neoconservative enemies, of course, does not mean libertarians will be comfortable with Kasich’s foreign policy. He’s called for increasing the size of the Navy and is open to boots on the ground to fight ISIS. He’s meandered into discussions of “punching Putin on the nose” in recent debates.

    We may not be happy with what FiveThirtyEight recently characterized as a 71 percent hawkish platform, but stacked against the 100 percent dyed-in-the-wool neoconservatism of some his rivals, uncomfortable comments are perhaps less troubling.

    For libertarians, this election will not offer perfect options. Few elections do.

    Libertarians and independents can appreciate Kasich’s kind comments on gay marriage or his calls for sanity on immigration policy. We can get excited about his support for criminal justice reform and his all-too-rare nuanced position on NSA spying.

    But those same voters will rightly find themselves turned off by his stubborn opposition to marijuana legalization – and of course the very bad judgement call he and a half-dozen other GOP governors made on Medicaid expansion.

    Governor Kasich is unquestionably not a libertarian – why is he nevertheless worthy of support from independents and libertarians?

    The answer comes down to one factor: Results.

    Governor Kasich has many positions that ruffle libertarian feathers – but almost every one is shared in more extreme terms by the rest of the field. On the issues where he is libertarian-friendly, he often stands alone in stark contrast to his rivals and based on a history of tangible accomplishments.

    At the end of the day, results do matter, and if you’re a libertarian or independent voter who plans to vote in this bleakest of elections, your one bright spot may be a hopeful governor from Ohio.



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  3. #2
    Kasich is definitely one of the less bad candidates in the field.

    However, he's not a liberty conservative, libertarian or anything we could get behind in my opinion.
    "I am a bird"

  4. #3
    As an added bonus, ksuck will bring more tanks to the party to Conduct warrant "service " with.
    And dont forget the disenfranchisement of ohio LIBERTARIAN party and voters!!!

    Yeah
    Im gonna pass on this Tyrant Bankster leech

    But thanks
    FLIP THOSE FLAGS, THE NATION IS IN DISTRESS!


    why I should worship the state (who apparently is the only party that can possess guns without question).
    The state's only purpose is to kill and control. Why do you worship it? - Sola_Fide

    Baptiste said.
    At which point will Americans realize that creating an unaccountable institution that is able to pass its liability on to tax-payers is immoral and attracts sociopaths?

  5. #4
    People who think Kasich is less bad probably also thought that Paul Ryan would be an improvement over Boehner.

  6. #5
    I reject the OP argument.
    "This here's Miss Bonnie Parker. I'm Clyde Barrow. We rob banks."

  7. #6
    There is no libertarian case for Kasich.

  8. #7
    No. Kasich can get bent.

  9. #8
    I am going to approach this presidential election the same way as I approached the Superbowel. I kinda, sorta wanted Carolina to win just because I kinda, sorta was annoyed with some Denver fans. When I found out that Denver won, I shrugged and took another sip of coffee.
    Which buffoon gets selected matters almost that much at this point.
    With the same sort of passion that I chose my preferred Superbowel team, I am kinda, sorta rooting for Bernie. He is such a moron that the Fabian agenda will be put on hold as long as he is the face of it. The Democrats will be hissing through their teeth, "shutUP!" instead of pushing an agenda, and the Republicans will be shut down because Bernie. Anything that he signs into law will look absolutely ridiculous. As it should. The end result is that anyone stupid enough to vote for Bernie will get disillusioned with politics, pick up the crack pipe again and never get involved again.
    "This here's Miss Bonnie Parker. I'm Clyde Barrow. We rob banks."



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Isaac Bickerstaff View Post
    I reject the OP argument.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gold Standard View Post
    There is no libertarian case for Kasich.
    Quote Originally Posted by jkob View Post
    No. Kasich can get bent.
    I agree but the alternatives are uh... Just as bad or worse ?

    Not saying anyone should vote for him though. They shouldn't.
    "I am a bird"

  12. #10
    Kasich is the most pathetic candidate running. He may not be the worst. But there is no issue that I know of that he is good on. At best he's meh on some things.
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It's a balance between appeasing his supporters, appeasing the deep state and reaching his own goals.
    ~Resident Badgiraffe




  13. #11
    The libertarian case for Hitler.

    This makes about as much sense.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    Kasich is the most pathetic candidate running. He may not be the worst. But there is no issue that I know of that he is good on. At best he's meh on some things.
    Well lol, when you look at the prospects of current 'frontrunners' then 'meh' would be an improvement or am I wrong ?

    I can't stand Kasich, I don't know a thing about him but he was the most obnoxious in the debates. He couldn't understand nobody cared about his stories yet he kept on telling them.
    "I am a bird"

  15. #13
    Get $#@!ed, Kasich.

  16. #14
    Pass.

  17. #15
    He's just more of the same 'ol crap. No thanks.
    ================
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    The Property Basis of Rights

  18. #16
    Kasich screwed the Libertarian Party in Ohio....so nope, he cannot be a libertarian.

    I got this email a few days ago

    Why Republican John Kasich is Unfit to be President

    ALEXANDRIA, VA — "Why compete for votes when you can use your gubernatorial powers to change or bend the law to quash your opponents?" That seems to be the attitude of Ohio Republican governor and presidential hopeful John Kasich.

    Voters today strongly disapprove of the performance of both Democrats and Republicans in office and want more choices on the ballot. But Kasich denied them a choice when he helped to knock his competitor, Libertarian for Governor Charlie Earl, off the ballot in 2014.

    Earl's campaign had collected enough signatures to be on the ballot. But Republican Secretary of State Jon Husted challenged his signatures. Courts eventually ruled to disqualify Earl along with Libertarian Steven Linnabary for attorney general on a technicality that had been only selectively enforced in the past.

    Terry Casey, who worked for Kasich's 2010 gubernatorial campaign and whom Kasich later appointed to a $70,000-a-year job chairing the state personnel review board, hired the firm Zeiger, Tigges & Little to do the legal work needed to challenge the signatures.

    "Ohio Republican Gov. John Kasich is unfit to be president," said Nicholas Sarwark, Chair of the Libertarian National Committee. "Not only does he play dirty, he's a big-spender who fights efforts by his own legislature to control costs."

    As reported by the Cato Institute, spending increased in Ohio by 18 percent under Kasich's leadership, largely due to his support for expanding Medicaid in defiance of the Ohio House of Representatives. They had inserted a provision in the state budget forbidding the Kasich administration from expansion without their approval. Kasich stripped the provision from the budget and then proceeded to expand the program without their approval.

    "We urge all Americans to vote Libertarian and strip big-government politicians like Kasich of their ability to rig elections, circumvent the law, and drive up government spending," said Sarwark.

    "Kasich claims that Big Government schemes will mediate poverty, when in fact, Big Government is the primary cause of poverty throughout the world,” said Sarwark.

    Kasich has said, “When you die and get to the meeting with St. Peter, he’s probably not going to ask you much about what you did about keeping government small. But he’s going to ask what you did for the poor. You better have a good answer.”

    “Libertarians have the answer,” said Sarwark. “Vote against politicians like Kasich who raise taxes, raise government spending, rig elections, and kowtow to medical insurance companies that leave families impoverished."

    In 2015, Kasich hastily signed Senate Bill 193, a law that revoked Ohio ballot access for any party other than that of the Republicans or Democrats. The Libertarian Party of Ohio is suing to overturn the law.

    Bob Bridges, Chair of the Ohio LP, remains determined to give Ohio voters a Libertarian choice.

    “We will be on the ballot again. We aren't going away,” he said.



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  20. #17
    Kasich was the author of the 1996 "Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity Act". The name sounds good on the surface but in reality over reached into family life, child support and was a direct attack on poor fathers. Due to the likes of John Kasich when you marry you are essentially marrying government. It was modeled after Tommy Thompson's welfare reform in Wisconsin which his consultants pulled directly from Soviet law as a model.

    I will never forgive John Kasich and every piece of $#@! politician that has injected themselves into marriage and families which ultimately should be a private matter between people and God.
    * See my visitor message area for caveats related to my posting history here.
    * Also, I have effectively retired from all social media including posting here and are basically opting out of anything to do with national politics or this country on federal or state level and rather focusing locally. I may stop by from time to time to discuss philosophy on a general level related to Libertarian schools of thought and application in the real world.

  21. #18
    Really, REALLY stupid premise. I can actually have an easier time looking for a reason for someone to hold their nose and vote for Cruz or Trump than I can for Kasich. The guy has far more in common with Bush than he does with liberty or conservatism.

  22. #19

  23. #20
    Kasich can't stop talking; that's what I took from the debates. He could not bring a sentence to an end and shut up...he drove me crazy...he looks and sounds like a liberal Democrat..what makes him a Republican?

  24. #21
    No case and no chance at potus for Kasich. NH was a one off for him. Small state he practically lived in for months. That formula is not repeatable from here on out.

    IMO Cruz is probably where the support ends up.

  25. #22
    Kasich is libertarian compared to someone like Trump, but that's about it. He's certainly bad on a large number of issues.

  26. #23
    There's a better libertarian case for Sanders than for Kasich. Several of them, actually, but the #1 is that we may as well bring the inevitable reset sooner than later so come on down and spend your heart out Bernie.

  27. #24
    If I had to vote in the republican primary today it would probably be for him. If for no other reason than he at least seems mild mannered and moderate.

    I don't think it's likely I'll vote in any primary this year though.



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  29. #25
    Isn't Kasich the guy who took federal funding and shoved a portion of Ohio into that worst healthcare program (Medicaid) while using the funds to present a lie - the surplus he claims. In reality Ohio will be in huge debts a few years down the road once Kasich is long gone. How on earth can those points be linked to a libertarian ????????

  30. #26
    ssssssssshhhh John Kasich says we can't talk about cellphone backdoors:





    He also has the same ridiculous foreign policy as Sanders saying to "put the boots of our sunni arab allies on the ground" to get rid of isis. You know like Saudi Arabia, Qatar, the UAE, Turkey -- the very countries that actually created isis.
    Last edited by charrob; 02-11-2016 at 08:14 PM.

  31. #27
    Is Kasich going to be the new Huntsman?

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Rudeman View Post
    Is Kasich going to be the new Huntsman?
    Yep, he has no support at all in South Carolina.

  33. #29
    The libertarian case for Kasich
    Because hey, Bob Barr!

  34. #30
    - In 1994, Kasich was one of the Republican leaders to support a last-minute deal with President Bill Clinton to pass the Federal Assault Weapons Ban. After a series of meetings with Clinton's Chief of Staff, Leon Panetta, who was also a long-time friend of Kasich, the assault weapons ban was passed when 42 Republicans crossed party lines and voted with the Democrats to ban assault weapons. Kasich's support of the assault-weapons ban angered the National Rifle Association, which gave Kasich an "F" rating.

    - Kasich served on the board of directors for several corporations, including Invacare Corporation and Chicago-based Norvax Inc. In 2001, Kasich joined Lehman Brothers' investment banking division as a managing director. He remained at Lehman Brothers until its bankruptcy and collapse in 2008.

    - Former chief of staff Curt Steiner: He's [Kasich] always had his own views. He's a biological Democrat... his parents were Democrats.

    - Governor John Kasich’s enactment of the Obamacare Medicaid expansion: The vote was a victory for Governor Kasich, who has spent the past eight months peddling leftist talking points — http://mediatrackers.org/ohio/2013/1...eveland-clinic and outright falsehoods — in favor of taking billions per year in new Obamacare spending to turn Medicaid into a broader entitlement program. President Obama cited Ohio Governor John Kasich’s embrace of the Obamacare Medicaid expansion as proof the law works during two separate November 14 speeches, flailing to defend his signature legislative achievement while it hikes insurance costs nationwide and causes millions to lose their policies.

    - John Kasich (R-OH) is taking flak from conservatives for his plan to expand Medicaid in his state. Not only have his actions been foolish and irresponsible, but he also violated the principle of representative government and even broke the law in order to implement it. http://www.freedomworks.org/blog/npl...on-in-medicaid

    - John Kasich refused to support a “right-to-work” ballot measure, which would ban mandatory union membership and dues, and nitpicking on lesser-known policies and statements, such as recent declarations he has made about his belief in climate change. http://www.dispatch.com/content/stor...th-kasich.html

    - John Kasich supports JobsOhio. Matt Mayer, former president of the Buckeye Institute, a conservative policy-research group, said, “The mentality behind JobsOhio is very much a blue, social model of government where the government can pick winners and losers.” JobsOhio officials have identified specific economic sectors on which to focus their efforts of business attraction and retention, and Mayer and others cite those decisions made by the nonprofit firm as the opposite of the free-market principles conservatives cherish. Kasich’s proposed tax increase on oil and gas wells to fund a statewide income-tax cut was criticized as a “spread-the-wealth” system. http://www.dispatch.com/content/stor...th-kasich.html

    - John Kasich Voted YES on more prosecution and sentencing for juvenile crime. (Jun 1999)

    - John Kasich Voted NO on maintaining right of Habeas Corpus in death penalty appeals. (Mar 1996) The Founders of our nation believed habeas corpus was so essential to preserving liberty, justice, and democracy that they enshrined it in the very first article of the United States Constitution.

    - John Kasich supports more prisons, more enforcement, effective death penalty. (Sep 1994)

    - John Kasich - More after-school programs with federal plus local funding. (May 1999)

    - John Kasich - Focus on terrorism. (Mar 1999)

    - John Kasich voted YES on $15.2 billion for foreign operations. (Nov 1999)

    - John Kasich voted NO on withdrawing from the WTO. (Jun 2000)

    - John Kasich 2004: If Kerry OR Bush wins, America will be fine. (May 2006)

    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...-On-The-Record



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