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Thread: Does Rand need to change for the next go around (2020) or was this just not his time?

  1. #1

    Does Rand need to change for the next go around (2020) or was this just not his time?

    What do you think? Does Rand need to change for the next go around (2020) or was this just not his time?

    Were the circumstances of ISIS and Bernie Sanders plus Trump and Cruz too much, or did Rand make the wrong moves in trying to appeal more mainstream? Or did he not go mainstream enough?

    As to timing, I remember one of the great things that made me love Ron Paul was his predictions speech that started out "Mr. Speaker, our government interventions in the affairs of...leads to many unintended consequences..." And many of the things he predicted were coming true exactly in 2012. The speech video doesn't resonate as much for 2016.

    Maybe we just have to hope for the right circumstances to be there in 2020? Does Rand have to come out with some devastating predictions?



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  3. #2
    There are a few things he could improve upon. This time around though you had bernie running, trump and cruz. Then when Rand had his first awesome debate, the Paris attacks. I think that hurt him a bit even though he has the best foreign policy out of all the candidates by far. If two terrorist attacks happened in 2012 Ron would of sunk as well. The media just pumped fear into people over and over again.

    Rand was the right man at the wrong time.
    "They that can give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
    -Benjamin Franklin

  4. #3
    Most people vote based on emotion. Rand didn't illicit much, if any.
    ================
    Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.

    Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America

    The Property Basis of Rights

  5. #4
    IMHO, he need to shed the isolationist label. We should be better in showing to the neocons that to be interventionist is to be the bidding of other countries. That Iraq war was 15 year ago and that we went in under UN resolution. And to the Christians that bombing 500k cvivillian to enoforce no fly zone back in Sadam time is wrong. That preemptive war does not match Christ's teaching of 'Blessed are the peacmakers'. To the financially conservative that one trillion dollars is insane amount of money. Wait till we have to pay the interest of that when interest rate is 5% or 10%. And to all Americans that our sons and daughters fight for *this* country. And that knowingly sending our kids to fight without properly taking care of them is not supporting our troops. You hear about the vets suicide rate and the terrible va system. Rand should repeat that speech over and over again that he would never ever underestimate the human cost of war.

  6. #5
    There are a variety of reasons.... But while libertarians are blaming Rand for being too this or that, neoconservatives are busy citing ISIS and feeling vindicated right now.

    If this foriegn policy keeps up the current trajectory, attacks are probably going to become more frequent not less. How is the liberty movement going to make a strong case in response?

  7. #6
    Rand was by far the most presidential of all of them. His gravitas made his wit and playfulness that much more exciting.
    He came on strong at the beginning, and then everyone else went full stupid to counter, but he still had the reputation in the moldy crowd of being petulant and smug.

    Morons will moron, I guess. Everything I thought I knew about politics has been blown to hell since 95% of the population has become medicated, poisoned, polluted or otherwise brain damaged.

    We really do need to talk to people as if they are fourth graders. That's my take away.

  8. #7
    I think its a combination of multiple things to be honest. the biggest reasons being the mainstream media. without that you wouldnt have the trump cruz and bernie hillary popularity constantly showing.

    You wouldnt have ISIS as the boogeyman it shouldnt be in the first place.

    You wouldnt have a lot of potential voters swayed so easily into voting for the douche or the turd.

    it really is the media that controls the narrative.

    For 2020? i think its going to depend on whats going to happen across the world. Russia Iran Syria and Iraq are actually working together to defeat ISIS in the region and theyre winning. Even though the US media takes credit for some of it.

    This is also hurting Saudi Arabia in the process which will hurt us too i believe. So economically we will be even weaker than we are now.

    Then of course our domestic policies will drain us even further since the next president most likely will not be for free markets.

    And finally the base of the liberty movement could expand in the next couple of years if we are active enough for it and the factors i just listed above could help with that too.

    So by 2020 the environment could be much more favorable for a liberty candidate. But again it wont be easy. and you still have to deal with the media which will still have lots of control unless a powerful competitor is made in the world of TV.

    Id suggest what others have said and be much much more active in spreading the word and getting libertarian candidates in control of local and state offices and congress positions. This would create some headaches for the establishment and create a lot bigger support for a liberty president.

  9. #8
    He was blacked out, there was the Trump effect.

    A few different dynamics at work.

    Over the next 4 years he will continue to cement his positions and will have an even stronger record on which to run.
    "An idea whose time has come cannot be stopped by any army or any government" - Ron Paul.

    "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you arent allowed to criticize."



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  11. #9

  12. #10
    If he runs again he will be Rand, same as he is today.
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul

  13. #11
    I would be stunned if Rand runs in 2020. I think people are pretty optimistic about him running again this soon.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    I would be stunned if Rand runs in 2020. I think people are pretty optimistic about him running again this soon.
    You'll never see the death of hope from true Rand supporters.

    #Kentucky #StillRanding


  15. #13
    2020 isn't happening barring some pretty extraordinary circumstances
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  16. #14
    I would be surprised if he runs again. But if he does the strategy shouldn't be to run as the "college kids" candidate or to run an online-only campaign, although I understand the money just wasn't there to run a more traditional campaign. I was hoping for TV ads in Iowa that showed Rand standing up to those that were robbing social security and ads that showed Rand standing up to the DNC on abortion.

  17. #15
    Again, I think he would do better as KY governor for a spell before running for President again.

    He doesn't seem to want it enough. Which is great and noble, but will get you killed in the electorate.
    In New Zealand:
    The Coastguard is a Charity
    Air Traffic Control is a private company run on user fees
    The DMV is a private non-profit
    Rescue helicopters and ambulances are operated by charities and are plastered with corporate logos
    The agriculture industry has zero subsidies
    5% of the national vote, gets you 5 seats in Parliament
    A tax return has 4 fields
    Business licenses aren't a thing
    Prostitution is legal
    We have a constitutional right to refuse any type of medical care

  18. #16
    He probably should not run in 2020.



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  20. #17
    IMO, he's not running again. He will do his second term in the Senate and retire from politics, as he believes in term limits.

  21. #18
    There was a ton wrong with his messaging. Denying such is denying reality.

    Republicans now hate the government and feel like their gun rights are threatened, but he never effectively made the appeal to channel those feelings into caring about government snooping.

    He based a significant portion of his campaign around being a "Detroit Republican", going so far as to try to sell openly leftist views on racism on the GOP debate stage.

    "Cut military" are two words you just don't say together. This is a language rather than ideological problem, and a very severe one.

    He needs to respond to personal attacks with personal attacks. The "isolationist" attack should not be given legitimacy by responding to it with facts. Calling out propoganda tactics for what they are exudes strength and authority which sadly is what the GOP electorate responds to. They don't want to think too hard.
    Last edited by Anti-Neocon; 02-07-2016 at 11:58 AM.
    The enemy of my enemy may be worse than my enemy.

    I do not suffer from Trump Rearrangement Syndrome. Sorry if that triggers you.

  22. #19
    "2020 isn't happening barring some pretty extraordinary circumstances 2020"

    On that we can agree. Anything else is both wishful thinking and the denial of the reality that Rand is not enamored of politics to do what it takes to President and that's all there is to it.

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by July View Post
    If this foriegn policy keeps up the current trajectory, attacks are probably going to become more frequent not less. How is the liberty movement going to make a strong case in response?
    Secure the border, stop involving ourselves in the corrupt politics of the Middle East, and respond with overwhelming force against anyone who dares to attack the United States. Pretty simple message, and very popular. Foreign policy is not a weakness of the Liberty Movement unless a candidate allows it to be.

  24. #21
    The problem is the candidate. Rand should stick to the Senate from here on out, he's obviously not the right guy to run for President. Not enough killer instinct to compete successfully at that level.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Most people vote based on emotion. Rand didn't illicit much, if any.
    Agreed.

    I liked Rand's message, but poor delivery and personality.

    He always sounded so monotone at the debates, and uninspiring. No emotion, no raising of his voice, or even yelling. Just overall bland.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by thoughtomator View Post
    The problem is the candidate. Rand should stick to the Senate from here on out, he's obviously not the right guy to run for President. Not enough killer instinct to compete successfully at that level.
    Yeah, we need to run someone from the liberty movement who can go on national TV and say with a straight face he wants to make the sand glow, shoot down Russian planes and send more people to Gitmo so we can enhanced interrogate them.
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by CPUd View Post
    Yeah, we need to run someone from the liberty movement who can go on national TV and say with a straight face he wants to make the sand glow, shoot down Russian planes and send more people to Gitmo so we can enhanced interrogate them.
    Well, that's the best way to win. It's what the people crave. It's got electrolytes.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by RonPaulMall View Post
    Secure the border, stop involving ourselves in the corrupt politics of the Middle East, and respond with overwhelming force against anyone who dares to attack the United States. Pretty simple message, and very popular. Foreign policy is not a weakness of the Liberty Movement unless a candidate allows it to be.
    Pretty much what Ron said in 2008 and 2012!

  30. #26
    I don't think Rand should run again at least not in 2020, too much ambition this this time around. Focus on becoming on being a senator who votes with his heart not what you think might play in a general election, build a record and maybe the time will come again to run.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by jkob View Post
    I don't think Rand should run again at least not in 2020, too much ambition this this time around. Focus on becoming on being a senator who votes with his heart not what you think might play in a general election, build a record and maybe the time will come again to run.
    I agree. Rand is not that great of a Presidential candidate. He needs to cook his jets for a while.

  32. #28
    He appealed to blacks and college kids, who ended up not voting him :\

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Most people vote based on emotion. Rand didn't illicit much, if any.
    If only there was someone who spoke of liberty from a place of passion, who ran for President,

    I bet then we would win
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  34. #30
    Rand won't run against Trump again, because by then, America will be great.

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