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Oh please don't start attacking Carson again. Carson isn't going to win, but he is a useful ally. We need him and his supporters on our side.
"And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat
"It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire
Technically it goes back to Issac and Ishmael, but what Carson has said here isn't crazy, it's actually backed up by history if you study the history of Islam. The early converts to Mohammed's party would identify themselves as Ismaelites, and the basic tenants of Islam argue that their very existence as a people is predicated on the union of Abraham and Hagar. The Eastern Orthodox saint John of Damascus noted all of this in "On Heresy" when he first encountered the early adherents of Islam and took note of their viewpoints.
Granted, this all isn't to say that recent history doesn't apply as well, and Carson said as much in the interview. The only thing I see wrong here is that Carson mixed up his biblical figures, not that he referenced biblical history. And Justin Raimondo, as usual, is being a douche. Par for the course for him.
Didn't know that Ben Carson was a Seventh Day Adventist. They are nuts.
Hello Pot!Originally Posted by Sola_Fide
Muh Atheism!
//
Last edited by specsaregood; 05-22-2016 at 10:15 PM.
Well, they follow a "prophet" who said people lived on Jupiter. To me, that's nuts.
You see, that's the neat thing about our country, people are free to worship in the way that they choose.
================
Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.
Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America
The Property Basis of Rights
Who's saying anything different? Not me.
Excuse me, Muh Agnosticism. Anyhow, people who value the truth shouldn't shrink from exercising that other part of the 1st Amendment that everybody sees as tantamount to holy writ.
Carson didn't really say anything incorrect so I don't really get the point of this nonsense article.
Mohammed may have formally started things, but it can ultimately be traced back to Ishmael.
As for Adventists, not they aren't nut. Sure the founder said odd things, pretty much true of any religious figurehead. But the general population of the religion is composed of normal people.
That's the problem with "religious figureheads". I just stick with God's Word.
ditto
I wonder if the evangelicals supporting him know this.
I certainly agree with that.
I haven't heard anyone talk about it. But evangelicals are so full of mush nowadays they probably don't care. Evangelicalism is not a Biblical Christian movement anymore.
Actually, I haven't heard anything Carson say that I didn't agree with. He's a pretty laid back, peaceful kind of guy. I wouldn't even begin to attack him at this point. Rather, take Christie out, take Jebbie out. Start working on the middle tier, and when they are gone we'll be back in the top 5.
I didn't see anything crazy about what Carson said. The objections raised by both Raimondo and HH are missing the point. Sure, Islam itself doesn't go back to Esau. But it didn't just appear out of nowhere without any backgrounds leading into it from the Arabs it initially was made up of, many of which came from the areas populated by the Edomites, descended from Esau. As HU said, he probably did mean Isaac and Ishmael, but even referring to Jacob and Esau instead is not inaccurate, according to history as recorded in the Bible.
Raimondo's correction at the top only digs him in further. I doubt that Carson's claim has anything to do with any schismatic Adventist group, nor that it has much if anything to do with being pro-war. It's also not specifically dispensationalist. And dispensationalists are post-millennialists, like Raimondo says, but premillennialist, like Adventists.
And how is that any crazier than people who believe their savior was born from a virgin who got impregnated by spirit?
Because God's word says it is true.
Your God's words is true but other people's God's words is false. And your proof is just because.... actually no real proof....
God's word is its own proof. There's no higher authorization than God Himself speaking His truth in His word.
Yeah I know. All the other religions say the exact same thing. Hello Pot!
No, the entire issue that Christians have with Seventh Day Adventists is that they depart from the Scriptures at several key turns.
In other words: God's Word is true and men's words are lies.
Yea, sure the Seventh Day Adventists are this, the Catholics are this, the Protestants are this, and the Lutherans and the Mormons and on and on you go. But your interpretation is correct because God chose you and not the others. Hi Pot, how are you doing?
No. I don't believe that at all. Truth isn't predicated on if one thinks they are "chosen". Truth is predicated on God's Word, and one's fidelity to that.
Nut seems like a very strong word.
Benny comes across as a devoted Christian Zionist, his recent visit to Israel was a great example of religious leadership in the dumbo age of Pastor Hagee and CUFI.
MAGA Allies: 'Bully Israel with undeclared nukes steals land'
Dangerous conspiracy theories on Right claim MAGA fake frontgroup
Poll: Should US apologize for financing radicalization of Afghan children in 80s?
Obama-Clinton Years: A Violent Chapter in World History
Trump: If (Neocon) Adelson Backs Rubio "He'll Have Total Control" Over Him
Delta variant, death of 9 Chinese engineers in terror attack led to airport chaos & quick Kabul fall?
Are you guys talking about the guy who thinks that getting raped in jail turns people into homosexuals? The part that scares me is the guy is probably smart than I am, yet he absolutely believes that sexuality is fluid, that it is changeable.
He was right about that.
It could possibly be argued that the Edomites also became converts to Islam in Palestine, but from a biblical perspective, the Edomites were more instrumental during the New Testament than they were with regard to the rise of Islam several centuries later, and the Edomites are not specifically named as the forerunners to Mohammed's "new revelation", whereas Ishmael does hold an extremely prominent part throughout the Koran.
I think you may have mixed up your wording at the end regarding Dispensationalism being Post-Millennial, which is obviously not the case, and I think you intended to say that it was not Post-Millennial, but Pre-Millennial. Just for everybody else's information, Adventists are generally Historic Pre-Millennial in that they don't hold to the Dispensationalist interpretation supported by Darby, though they share the same view as all Pre-Millennialists in that they believe that Christ will come again prior to the Millennium.
I honestly didn't bother reading all of Raimondo's stupid screed, but if he is suggesting that linking OT figures like Esau or Ishmael to Islam is unique to Adventists, he's far more ignorant of Christianity than I thought. Barring a bunch of progressive mainline churches who dabble in Universalism, every church has a similar view regarding Islam being an enemy of the Christian faith, though I think some strains of Dispensationalism, while rightly identifying Islam as the Eastern Antichrist, over-emphasize both its significance as well as that of the secular nation-state of Israel. I actually believe that the fulfillment of the Eschaton will require the complete eradication of Islam and the conversion of all elect Arabs, Persians, Turks, et cetera to Christianity, but I'm not keen on the idea of waging an all out war with all of Islam, more I'd argue that our foreign policy should be geared towards preserving governments that tolerate Eastern Christian Churches and encouraging governments there that allow said churches to grow and expand.
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