Isn't demanding that Rand's supporters second choice isn't Trump a little maniacal?

[LibertyEagle]

I agree with your positions regarding immigration. We need a new amendment, like Rand has been saying since 2011. But those whose second choice is Trump, well it boggles the mind. How can ones first choice be liberty and their second be authoritarianism? Its bi-polar.

What is bipolar are those who keep bitching incessantly about who we MIGHT vote if Rand isn't on the ballot, instead of doing something constructive to help Rand so that he not only is on the ballot, but wins the nomination.

I have explained this over and over again and I am sick of doing it. I don't give a rat's ass if anyone on here agrees with me. It's my vote and I will place it as I see fit. I have not decided for sure who I will vote for if Rand doesn't make it. I said that the way things stand now, it would be Trump. And then the lynch mob lost their $#@!.

Ok, one more time.

If Rand doesn't make it, all the other candidates, in my opinion, are total CRAP. I suppose if Carson stayed high, that I might would vote for him, if Rand got knocked out. But, at one point he was anti-gun, so... Cruz has said that if people don't stand with Israel, then he doesn't stand with him. To me, that means he puts Israel before his own country. That is beyond sickening to me. Plus, I think he's establishment too; just putting on a big 'ol act.

So, Rand is the only good one.

What if he drops out? If the scenario is that it's either Bush or Trump, I said I would vote for Trump. I know they both suck. But, with Bush, I already know what he would do. Trump would probably do the same, but at least it's a little bit unknown. Again, I think everyone sucks but Rand.

Now, some of you might not vote at all, if Rand drops out. That may be what I do too, if that happens. Just don't know yet. It depends a lot what happens from here on out. Or, some of you may think you are protesting by voting for the Libertarian candidate. Well, those have been far less from perfect too. It would be easy to ask their supporters... HOW COULD YOU, IF YOU SUPPORT LIBERTY? Not to mention the fact that the establishment doesn't care one iota about your little protest vote. But, I digress. The point is, the options are not good if Rand doesn't make it. So, how about stopping all this infighting crap and try to do something constructive to help Rand?

[carlton]

I guess I just don't see how the other GOP candidates are suppose to be better than Trump, Trump is right on some issues and operates outside the establishment Republican orthodoxy so he's so much worse because why? We don't have a real democracy with real choices, we've been fascist country for over a century. Trump doesn't scare me because I don't take him seriously, he's a showman and plays an audience but I don't think he is stupid or else he wouldn't be as successful as he is. I dunno, I see him as more reachable as far the wants of the common man than I do Hillary Clinton or Jeb Bush, those are the odds on favorites to win. Trump would destroy the party system as it is so just to shake it up even maybe.

I want Ron Paul to be president, I'd settle for Rand, there ain't much beyond that. If Rand drops out where are we supposed to go? Gary Johnson? Jesse Ventura? Bernie Sanders? I'd probably just stay home but I got retiring John McCain and marijuana legalization on the agenda too.

I think that any supposed Liberty enthusiast who would vote for an authoritarian quasi fascist just to shake up the political system does him/herself and the Liberty movement a great disservice.

[BGfree]

So, how about stopping all this infighting crap and try to do something constructive to help Rand?

I can't see any good way for the grassroots to help Rand unless he decides to help himself by dumping his entire campaign staff and hiring another.

[GunnyFreedom]

I haven't seen you ask that, tulsa, or I would have given it a shot. I don't spend much time over here.

If you really cared about Rand then you would spend a lot less time on these forums altogether.

But, the way to ask me to spend time to do something for you is not by trying to mimic Gunny's horse's ass behavior.

Someone who tells lies, bears false witness and slings accusations around in an effort to stop criticism of and promote a liberal progressive, that's jackassery. Kind of like what we are seeing from TyrannyBuzzard.

I responded to Gunny with far less than the same venom with which he came at me. There is no excuse whatsoever for what has come out of his mouth. None.

You are a liar TyrannyBuzzard. You attacked me with all kinds of sick lies and accusations because I had the audacity to defend Rand Paul against the Trumpaloompas. You started this, and your narcissism keeps deflecting. Don't you remember your posts attacking me that the moderators deleted because they were so sick and depraved? Or are you just pretending that you didn't attack me because it soothes your ego and justifies your wickedness?

You are a liar, and you are doing everything in your power to discredit those who oppose Donald Trump...on Ron Paul Forums. You should be ashamed of yourself but narcissistic personality disorder does not allow humility.

[CPUd]

I can't see any good way for the grassroots to help Rand unless he decides to help himself by dumping his entire campaign staff and hiring another.

Rand grassroots does not impose such conditions on its support.

[GunnyFreedom]

So, how about stopping all this infighting crap and try to do something constructive to help Rand?

Lol wow. If you can't see how much of a flaming hypocrite you are you've seriously got problems.

[LibertyEagle]

Lol wow. If you can't see how much of a flaming hypocrite you are you've seriously got problems.

I guess that means that you don't want to turn this around and do something constructive for Rand. Good to know.

If you really cared about Rand then you would spend a lot less time on these forums altogether.

Like you, eh?

Someone who tells lies, bears false witness and slings accusations around in an effort to stop criticism of and promote a liberal progressive, that's jackassery. Kind of like what we are seeing from TyrannyBuzzard.

You are a liar TyrannyBuzzard. You attacked me with all kinds of sick lies and accusations because I had the audacity to defend Rand Paul against the Trumpaloompas. You started this, and your narcissism keeps deflecting. Don't you remember your posts attacking me that the moderators deleted because they were so sick and depraved? Or are you just pretending that you didn't attack me because it soothes your ego and justifies your wickedness?

You are a liar, and you are doing everything in your power to discredit those who oppose Donald Trump...on Ron Paul Forums. You should be ashamed of yourself but narcissistic personality disorder does not allow humility.

Nope, I never attempted to discredit anyone for posting facts about Donald Trump. I have said a few too. What I have taken an issue with is your disgusting attacks against a few long-time members who, while saying they are planning to vote for Rand if he is on the ticket, had the audacity to mention that they might vote for Trump, if he isn't. THAT is when you went ape$#@! and THAT is what I took issue with. To claim anything else is not being honest and that is exactly what you are doing.

And Gunny, I said nothing that wasn't true.

NOTE: I remember when Ron was running and some called us all kinds of names, including Paultards. I recall us not liking it; it was offensive. Never in my life did I think that the same behavior would be coming from these forums. I was wrong.

[nikcers]

Yeah right, newbie.

I may be new to this website, but at least I am not stupid enough to vote for someone that Ron/Rand label as an authoritarian RINO who is the opposite of a libertarian and has zero chance winning the election due to his mass deportation policy. I don't care how much you hate Mexicans, you are not going to convince me to not vote and campaign for Rand Paul.

[GunnyFreedom]

And Gunny, I said nothing that wasn't true.

Do you think that's going to work when you stand before the Judgement Seat of Christ?

[LibertyEagle]

I may be new to this website, but at least I am not stupid enough to vote for someone that Ron/Rand label as an authoritarian RINO who is the opposite of a libertarian and has zero chance winning the election due to his mass deportation policy. I don't care how much you hate Mexicans, you are not going to convince me to not vote and campaign for Rand Paul.

I'm not trying to. You should campaign and vote for Rand.

[LibertyEagle]

Do you think that's going to work when you stand before the Judgement Seat of Christ?

ABSOLUTELY.

But, I think you should be more concerned about your own self.

[nikcers]

I'm not trying to. You should campaign and vote for Rand.

This is why I am not talking about second choice, Rand is running a long term delegate campaign. Just mentioning second choice means that you are not on team Rand.

[LibertyEagle]

This is why I am not talking about second choice, Rand is running a long term delegate campaign. Just mentioning second choice means that you are not on team Rand.

No it doesn't. It really doesn't. If the lynch mob would stop attacking, no more would be said about it.

[nikcers]

No it doesn't. It really doesn't. If the lynch mob would stop attacking, no more would be said about it.

No the paid shill keeps posting about it.

[erowe1]

Many RPF posters have mentioned that Trump is their second choice. After that, they were criticized or attacked by people like acptulsa, Anti Federalist, gunny, and others. Is that a smart strategy?

I don't see how it has anything to do with strategy.

And who is demanding that Trump not be anyone's second choice, like the thread title says?

Criticizing you for being a moron, as proven by the fact that you would support Trump for president under any circumstances, is entirely different and something Trump supporters well deserve.

Also, why is it that everyone here who says that Trump is only their second choice, while Rand is their first, spends all their time here praising Trump at Rand's expense? If you're going to talk about Trump here, it should be to bash him. It sure looks like he's your first choice. The only Trump supporter here who actually admits he's a Trump supporter is David Sadler. I respect his honesty about it more than I respect posers like the OP who think they can come here and woo Rand supporters over to support Trump by pretending to be one of us.

[LibertyEagle]

No the paid shill keeps posting about it.

Who is that?

[klamath]

I don't see how it has anything to do with strategy.

And who is demanding that Trump not be anyone's second choice, like the thread title says?

Criticizing you for being a moron, as proven by the fact that you would support Trump for president under any circumstances, is entirely different and something Trump supporters well deserve.

Also, why is it that everyone here who says that Trump is only their second choice, while Rand is their first, spends all their time here praising Trump at Rand's expense? If you're going to talk about Trump here, it should be to bash him. It sure looks like he's your first choice. The only Trump supporter here who actually admits he's a Trump supporter is David Sadler. I respect his honesty about it more than I respect posers like the OP who think they can come here and woo Rand supporters over to support Trump by pretending to be one of us.

The false narrative that they are getting attacked for mentioning Trump is their second choice is getting old. It is the posting of positive articles and the strong defense of him, the concern Troll posts and veiled criticism of Rand that irritates Rand supporters.

[erowe1]

Who is that?

The jury is out on you. But obviously -jj and kahless are.

[LibertyEagle]

The jury is out on you. But obviously -jj and kahless are.

lol. The jury is already in on you and it ain't good. Your support of open borders and your attempt at attaching it to Ron and Rand, puts you in the enemy category.

Quite the little lynch mob some of you have going here. Is that a libertarian thing?

[LibertyEagle]

The false narrative that they are getting attacked for mentioning Trump is their second choice is getting old. It is the posting of positive articles and the strong defense of him, the concern Troll posts and veiled criticism of Rand that irritates Rand supporters.

What positive articles have I posted about Trump? What veiled criticism have I made of Rand?

[GunnyFreedom]

ABSOLUTELY.

But, I think you should be more concerned about your own self.

Like the Word says, “God will send them strong delusion so that they would believe the lie, that they might be condemned who had no love of truth but took pleasure in unrighteousness.” Good luck with that, and for the record you can't claim that nobody warned you.

[Dianne]

I can definitely tell there is a full moon tonight. Guys, stop fighting !!!! We should all be in the same fox hole right now.

[T.hill]

Anyone who is considering supporting Trump only does so only because they like it when he insults people and guarantees the restoration of American greatness through vague rambling generalities. These people believe he will restore "greatness" to America unconditionally and no matter what he does or says, no matter the evidence that is offered to prove he only says things to entertain himself or for his own benefit -- they will ignore it. Whatever Trump supporters believed before they began worshiping the Donald, if anything, I can guarantee those once highly valued beliefs now only exist as an afterthought to the greatness of their leader.

Really, the only people who support Donald Trump are angry idiots and people who believe an economic collapse is inevitable and want it to happen sooner rather than later.

[kahless]

It used to be if someone came here or an existing member questioned policy the brain trust would go into technical detail and political theory why one should support Ron's policy or Ron as a candidate. In that respect this forum has totally failed Rand.

A good example of this is when I raised the issue of Rand proposing to increase H-1B immigration as the reason I may not definitively support him and are leaning towards Trump or possibly another candidate and that I just have not made a decision.

Did anyone try to clarify Rand's positions and why I should continue to support Rand. Nope. Not once did someone try to convince me why Rand was a better choice overall or did anyone go into details of his H-1B or immigration policy and why I should support it. No, in fact several people here said the Paul's are ultimately for complete open borders as long as entitlements are closed.

However most of what I got back was hate spewed back by a couple of forum members.

I even repeated this in this thread and again it went unchallenged. This time I was even more specific and asked if Rand's economic zones mean unlimited H-1B immigration to those zones. No one challenged this assumption. Rand has real problems with his campaign when supporters here do not know really where he stands on policy and are unable to logically defend his positions.

I do not support open borders ever, increasing H-1B immigration or unlimited H-1B immigration to "economic zones". If these are in fact Rand's policies or any candidate for that matter then I will likely not be supporting them.

You want to judge me on that go ahead. The question I get asked then is why am I still here, well because I am or was undecided and wanted answers.

[nikcers]

The question I get asked then is why am I still here, well because I am or was undecided and wanted answers.

Rand Paul is the closest candidate it to Ron Paul, so if you are still undecided then we are not going to convince you of anything. You probably can't decide whether to vote for tyranny and a wall around the country or less government and protection of the bill of rights. If you can't decide between apples and oranges then you are a few cards short of a full deck.

[erowe1]

I do not support open borders ever, increasing H-1B immigration or unlimited H-1B immigration to "economic zones". If these are in fact Rand's policies or any candidate for that matter then I will likely not be supporting them.

Bye.

[LibertyEagle]

Bye.

Good thing that Rand IS NOT for open borders. So sorry, erowe, for you. NOT.

Kahless, if it's something that Rand has introduced legislation on, the best thing to do would be to call his Senate office and ask for the legislative director, or aide in charge of that area.

If it's something he proposed as a plank in his campaign, call his campaign.

I think this will get you better answers than you have here.

[Dianne]

It used to be if someone came here or an existing member questioned policy the brain trust would go into technical detail and political theory why one should support Ron's policy or Ron as a candidate. In that respect this forum has totally failed Rand.

A good example of this is when I raised the issue of Rand proposing to increase H-1B immigration as the reason I may not definitively support him and are leaning towards Trump or possibly another candidate and that I just have not made a decision.

Did anyone try to clarify Rand's positions and why I should continue to support Rand. Nope. Not once did someone try to convince me why Rand was a better choice overall or did anyone go into details of his H-1B or immigration policy and why I should support it. No, in fact several people here said the Paul's are ultimately for complete open borders as long as entitlements are closed.

However most of what I got back was hate spewed back by a couple of forum members.

I even repeated this in this thread and again it went unchallenged. This time I was even more specific and asked if Rand's economic zones mean unlimited H-1B immigration to those zones. No one challenged this assumption. Rand has real problems with his campaign when supporters here do not know really where he stands on policy and are unable to logically defend his positions.

I do not support open borders ever, increasing H-1B immigration or unlimited H-1B immigration to "economic zones". If these are in fact Rand's policies or any candidate for that matter then I will likely not be supporting them.

You want to judge me on that go ahead. The question I get asked then is why am I still here, well because I am or was undecided and wanted answers.

Well I agree with you, other than the voting for Trump part. Although my theory and Rand's, is that once the entitlements are shut down, those here illegally will self deport. After all, who the hell can live in this country with no income and pay for groceries? The cost of living is far less in Mexico, or wherever they are from.

I do trust Rand that this is his intent.... shut down entitlements.

[CaptainAmerica]

[klamath]

It used to be if someone came here or an existing member questioned policy the brain trust would go into technical detail and political theory why one should support Ron's policy or Ron as a candidate. In that respect this forum has totally failed Rand.

A good example of this is when I raised the issue of Rand proposing to increase H-1B immigration as the reason I may not definitively support him and are leaning towards Trump or possibly another candidate and that I just have not made a decision.

Did anyone try to clarify Rand's positions and why I should continue to support Rand. Nope. Not once did someone try to convince me why Rand was a better choice overall or did anyone go into details of his H-1B or immigration policy and why I should support it. No, in fact several people here said the Paul's are ultimately for complete open borders as long as entitlements are closed.

However most of what I got back was hate spewed back by a couple of forum members.

I even repeated this in this thread and again it went unchallenged. This time I was even more specific and asked if Rand's economic zones mean unlimited H-1B immigration to those zones. No one challenged this assumption. Rand has real problems with his campaign when supporters here do not know really where he stands on policy and are unable to logically defend his positions.

I do not support open borders ever, increasing H-1B immigration or unlimited H-1B immigration to "economic zones". If these are in fact Rand's policies or any candidate for that matter then I will likely not be supporting them.

You want to judge me on that go ahead. The question I get asked then is why am I still here, well because I am or was undecided and wanted answers.

First off Immigrating isn't my big interest so I don't follow real close what Rand has said. I suspect his stand IS beyond what you want on this issue. Thank you for doing the respectful thing and leaving if you no longer can post in support of Rand.