"Most of the sheeple get the shepherds that most of the sheeple deserve."
Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.Originally Posted by hells_unicorn
That is literally the stupidest $#@! I've read in years. God didn't write that trash, no way. Essentially if you believe that, then you are a slave to your government in perpetuity no matter what they do. Kill kids GREAT!, Beat your brother to death, Outstanding.... He must have been a sinner....
Seriously, anyone that believes that left their brain on the floor long ago. No point conversing about it.
It explicitly states there is no bad Government, so what in the world are you fighting against if God established it for you to submit to. It says right there the "authorities that exist have been established by God." Why are you trying to change God's work, if you believe that is word of God.
Last edited by RonPaulIsGreat; 08-18-2015 at 08:00 AM.
I tend to prefer the Geneva Bible's interpretation, but there is nothing stupid about having a government that punishes people who do wrong. If you think that there should be no punishment or strain on one's conscience over murdering another human being (conveniently you stopped before verse 9, typical dishonest paganism is dishonest), I think you might want to think about who actually "left their brain on the floor long ago". In fact, you leaving out verse 9 is the only way that you could have come up with the moronic idea that because magistrates should be obeyed on the prohibition against murder that the government somehow excuses murder whenever it happens. Stupid, stupid, stupid.
Note to everyone: There is a reason why I cited ALL OF ROMANS 13 and not just the first 6 verses, and it is precisely because idiocy like this is the result of somebody who blindly snips verses out of a chapter. Similarly, there is a reason why I also cited other chapters in my previous post, and it is because people seem to not understand that Romans 13 is not the only part of scripture dealing with the subject of government, and that viewing even the entire chapter of Romans 13 as being the chapter that destroys the rest of scripture leads to similarly idiotic misinterpretations.
Okay, you got me, I must have missed the good governing authorities throughout history.I tend to prefer the Geneva Bible's interpretation, but there is nothing stupid about having a government that punishes people who do wrong. If you think that there should be no punishment or strain on one's conscience over murdering another human being (conveniently you stopped before verse 9, typical dishonest paganism is dishonest), I think you might want to think about who actually "left their brain on the floor long ago". In fact, you leaving out verse 9 is the only way that you could have come up with the moronic idea that because magistrates should be obeyed on the prohibition against murder that the government somehow excuses murder whenever it happens. Stupid, stupid, stupid.
Note to everyone: There is a reason why I cited ALL OF ROMANS 13 and not just the first 6 verses, and it is precisely because idiocy like this is the result of somebody who blindly snips verses out of a chapter. Similarly, there is a reason why I also cited other chapters in my previous post, and it is because people seem to not understand that Romans 13 is not the only part of scripture dealing with the subject of government, and that viewing even the entire chapter of Romans 13 as being the chapter that destroys the rest of scripture leads to similarly idiotic misinterpretations.
A few years back I went to church. I learned there from a sunday school teacher, telling little kids up at the podium that we fought the war of independence so we wouldn't be Muslim or Hindu. True story. The churches I'm aware of say, "blessed are those who support Israel (cuz its biblical I am told)" while wrapping themselves up in American militarism against them others who want to take our jobs and install an Islamic Caliphate.
You missed a heck of a lot more than that. Acts 12:21-23 cites that Herod (the tyrannical ruler of Judea) was smote and killed by God for being insubordinate and ruling for his own ends rather than for God's. Leave us not forget what happened to Pharaoh and his entire nation in Exodus chapters 7-11 for his tyranny. There are multiple examples in the Old and New Testament of governing officials being held to account for corruption.
Romans 13 should be viewed in the context of God as the Sovereign of all Authority, and in keeping with this, insubordinate rulers are not exempt from being punished for breaking the law. This is why I tend to prefer the Geneva Study Bible when the subject of magistrates is under consideration, because it ties Romans 13 in with other verses and heads off the sort of Erastian errors that view the government as being above the law. Granted, I think that people blow some of the minor flaws in the King James Version way out of proportion, but there is something to the whole idea of using a study bible and catechisms for study, whereas the KJV tends to work better for official worship and public reading.
Hells_Unicorn isn't a very good teacher.
There's a good explanation of Romans 13 in the commentaries I found:
Paul was once in the position of persecution, so he understood full well that the higher powers ought to be held accountable.This is not to be understood, as if magistrates were above the laws, and had a lawless power to do as they will without opposition; for they are under the law, and liable to the penalty of it, in case of disobedience, as others; and when they make their own will a law, or exercise a lawless tyrannical power, in defiance of the laws of God, and of the land, to the endangering of the lives, liberties, and properties of subjects, they may be resisted, as Saul was by the people of Israel, when he would have took away the life of Jonathan for the breach of an arbitrary law of his own, and that too without the knowledge of it, 1 Samuel 14:45; but the apostle is speaking of resisting magistrates in the right discharge of their office, and in the exercise of legal power and authority:
It must be understood that from the Christian perspective Jesus was the King of the Earth. His "kingdom" as Paul was preaching was coming along "any day now". So it was necessary to suppress any arbitrary rebellious attitudes simply because "Jesus is the real authority, so I don't have to listen to you."
Now, Jesus did further restrict what you could really do to "resist" unjust authority in the general sense, but that's a different topic than what Paul was addressing.
When a trumpet sounds in a city, do not the people tremble?
When disaster comes to a city, has not the Lord caused it? Amos 3:6
Your not really one to talk in this topic as you've professed to not believe in the concept of ordained teachers, yet you seem fit to copy and paste commentaries from actual educated sources that essentially echo exactly what I just said. You might try dropping the ego and simply stating your view on the matter, you'll come off as less of a kook, just saying.
Does the USSA even DESERVE a POTUS? <Rhetorical question>
Well I do. I have been critical of him in other posts. I've said "he wasn't ready", "he's too immature", he should have waited for the next election cycle. Then it hit me this morning. This may be the last election cycle. The time is now to help Rand get elected !!
I did state my view on the matter. You're not a very good teacher.Your not really one to talk in this topic as you've professed to not believe in the concept of ordained teachers, yet you seem fit to copy and paste commentaries from actual educated sources that essentially echo exactly what I just said. You might try dropping the ego and simply stating your view on the matter, you'll come off as less of a kook, just saying.
You aren't a good teacher because you don't get to the point and simplify so that others can easily grasp the concept with minimal effort.
Besides, RonPaulIsGreat is already well aware of my kooky status, he doesn't need you sounding the alarm bells. And in general I don't make too much effort avoiding the crazy label as there's no telling what crazy things I will end up doing in the future for the Lord, so useless to try to pretend to know what kind of person He's ultimately portraying me as. I'm not interested in how the mob perceives me. The perceptions of the mob are ultimately a reflection of the mob.
When a trumpet sounds in a city, do not the people tremble?
When disaster comes to a city, has not the Lord caused it? Amos 3:6
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