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Thread: Toxic mine water accidentally released by EPA in Colorado river flows south

  1. #1

    Toxic mine water accidentally released by EPA in Colorado river flows south



    ...

    The huge amount of water nearly flooded Cement Creek as it flowed into the Animus River, after breaking free from a shoddy dam at the Gold King Mine. EPA officials said that a blockage of loose soil and little more was holding in the bright orange wastewater at Gold King, a former gold mine, when water broke loose. An EPA official estimated that 200 gallons of wastewater per minute was still flowing out of the mine as of Friday afternoon.

    The EPA was working at the property as part of a plan to remediate the superfund site and stop a longtime flow of acidic, heavy metal-laden wastewater from the nearby Red and Bonita mine, all near the abandoned Gladstone mining town. The work would have installed a bulkhead, or massive plug, at the end of the inactive mining tunnel.

    The EPA’s initial tests of the wastewater and sediment in Animus found substances known to be harmful to be human health, including lead, arsenic, cadmium, copper, calcium and other heavy metals “at varying levels,” though at concentrations enough for officials to warn people away from the river. The PH of the water near the mouth of the mine was found to be 4.5, roughly that of beer. Lake water typically ranges from 6.5 to 8.5 on the PH scale.

    EPA officials later told reporters that the impact on human and environmental health was not immediately clear, because toxicologists are still analyzing data from water samples.

    “First off, I’d like to just say I’m sorry for what’s happened,” David Ostrander, the EPA’s head of emergency management told a standing-room-only crowd in Durango, Colorado Friday afternoon. “This is a huge tragedy, and it’s hard being on the other side of this, in terms of being the one who caused this incident.”

    “We usually respond to emergencies, we don’t cause them,” said Ostrander.

    The wastewater is the vestige of gold rush mining of more than 100 years ago. Though the mine still has an owner it appears to have been all but abandoned.

    ...
    http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2...o-animas-river
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    This intellectually stimulating conversation is the reason I keep coming here.



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  3. #2
    Maybe it will dissolve all those plastic bags.

  4. #3
    Quality journalism.

    The EPA’s initial tests of the wastewater and sediment in Animus found substances known to be harmful to be human health, including lead, arsenic, cadmium, copper, calcium and other heavy metals “at varying levels,”
    Arsenic isn't even a metal and calcium isn't heavy. How can calcium even be considered pollution ? Harmful to human health !? I thought people needed enough calcium for their bones..
    "I am a bird"

  5. #4
    Reminds me of this:

    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  6. #5

  7. #6
    A hefty fine needs to be imposed on the fuggers that did this!

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    A hefty fine needs to be imposed on the fuggers that did this!
    There is no foul when the regulators do it. Just ask them.

    It was an unfortunate mistake and policy will be reviewed.

    But when an individual makes an unfortunate mistake........

  9. #8
    This is the closest thing to justice that has ever happened to a federal agency employee that willfully caused a disaster.

    Hayman Fire

    Had that been a "civilian" that set the fire, don't expect a sentence like this.

    In the floods of '93, a man was convicted to life in prison for pulling a few sandbags off the top of a levee across from Quincy, IL and causing the levee to fail.
    Last edited by sparebulb; 08-08-2015 at 04:04 PM.



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  11. #9
    ...Define "accidentally"...
    The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding one’s self in the ranks of the insane.” — Marcus Aurelius

    They’re not buying it. CNN, you dumb bastards!” — President Trump 2020

    Consilio et Animis de Oppresso Liber

  12. #10
    EPA= extremely pathetic agency
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it."
    James Madison

    "It does not take a majority to prevail ... but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." - Samuel Adams



    Μολὼν λάβε
    Dum Spiro, Pugno
    Tu ne cede malis sed contra audentior ito

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    A hefty fine needs to be imposed on the fuggers that did this!
    Lol.

    EPA won’t face fines for polluting rivers with orange muck

    DENVER — Unlike BP, which was fined $5.5 billion for the 2010 Deepwater Horizon disaster, the EPA will pay nothing in fines for unleashing the Animas River spill.

    “Sovereign immunity. The government doesn’t fine itself,” said Thomas L. Sansonetti, former assistant attorney general for the Justice Department’s division of environment and natural resources.

    New Mexico Gov. Susana Martinez and other lawmakers have called on the EPA to hold itself to the same standards as it would a private company in the aftermath of Wednesday’s accident, in which an EPA-led crew uncorked a 3 million-gallon spill of orange wastewater from the abandoned Gold King Mine near Silverton, Colorado.

    However, “The EPA does not fine itself the way that you would fine an outside company like BP,” said Mr. Sansonetti, who served from 2001 to 2005 under President George W. Bush.

    What the EPA can be expected to cover is the cost of the cleanup and compensation for the damage caused, funding that would have to be appropriated by Congress, meaning that the taxpayers will foot the bill.

    “That’s going to have to be appropriated because that sort of thing is not included in the EPA’s budget,” said Mr. Sansonetti, now a Denver attorney.

    As for compensation, he said, “It’s similar to the BP situation because you’ve got rafting companies that couldn’t raft, you’ve got kayakers that couldn’t kayak, you’ve got ranchers that didn’t want spoiled water being drunk by their cows.”
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...s-orange-muck/

  14. #12
    Sovereign immunity. The government doesn’t fine itself,”
    Qualified immunity.........

    Notice any similarities?



    When government functionaries are permitted to hide from the people they lord over this is what happens.......

  15. #13
    "Everything government touches turns to crap." -- Ringo Starr

  16. #14
    It's okay folks...they will slap each others hands for punishment. All is well. <s>
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  17. #15
    This river runs down into the Colorado river through the Grand Canyon.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Weston White View Post
    ...Define "accidentally"...
    Yup.

    This is interesting. Someone either leaked it (no pun intended) or predicted it.

    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book



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  20. #17
    Navajos say EPA should clean its spill rather than trying to swindle Indians

    The EPA is trying to cheat Navajo Indians by getting them to sign away their rights to future claims from the agency’s Gold King Mine disaster, tribal officials charged Wednesday, adding more to the administration’s public relations problems over the spill that threatens critical Southwest waterways.

    Environmental Protection Agency officials were going door to door asking Navajos, some of whom don’t speak English as their primary language, to sign a form that offers to pay damages incurred so far from the spill, but waiving the right to come back and ask for more if their costs escalate or if they discover bigger problems, Navajo President Russell Begaye told The Washington Times.

    “It is underhanded. They’re just trying to protect their pocketbook,” Mr. Begaye said in a telephone interview.

    Mr. Begaye has promised a lawsuit on behalf of the Navajo Nation and said he suspects the EPA is trying to buy off as many Navajo as possible now to head off a bigger settlement later.

    The spill has dumped millions of gallons of polluted wastewater into the Animas River, which feeds the San Juan River and eventually the Colorado River, which provide water for grazing and crops in much of the Four Corners area, the quadripoint of Arizona, Colorado, New Mexico and Utah. The Navajo Nation covers much of that territory.

    The EPA did not have an immediate comment on Mr. Begaye’s charges Wednesday.

    ...

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...em-mine-spill/
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    This intellectually stimulating conversation is the reason I keep coming here.

  21. #18
    looks like urine.

    not a problem.

    give it a few days.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by tod evans View Post
    Qualified immunity.........

    Notice any similarities?



    When government functionaries are permitted to hide from the people they lord over this is what happens.......
    Its not illegal when the government does it.
    Out of every one hundred men they send us, ten should not even be here. Eighty will do nothing but serve as targets for the enemy. Nine are real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, upon them depends our success in battle. But one, ah the one, he is a real warrior, and he will bring the others back from battle alive.

    Duty is the most sublime word in the English language. Do your duty in all things. You can not do more than your duty. You should never wish to do less than your duty.

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Pericles View Post
    Its not illegal when the government does it.
    I give no creedence to legal or illegal any more, haven't for decades.

    Right and wrong I feel pretty strongly about though, and it's wrong for tax-ticks to hide.

    If they were doing right they wouldn't have to hide.......

  24. #21
    interesting...

    Did The EPA Intentionally Poison Animas River To Secure SuperFund Money?
    A week before The EPA disastrously leaked millions of gallons of toxic waste into The Animas River in Colorado, this letter to the editor was published in The Silverton Standard & The Miner local newspaper, authored by a retired geologist detailing verbatim, how EPA would foul the Animas River on purpose in order to secure superfund money...
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-0...uperfund-money

    nah! they would never do that!

  25. #22
    I can toss another couple logs on the fire.

    Decades ago, EPA forced manufacturers to stop using a solvent called TCE and substitute a solvent called TCA. Unfortunately, TCA is not as stable as TCE and required the addition of a stabilizer called dioxane (not to be confused with the toxic contaminant dioxin found in Agent Orange). Now, dioxane is being discovered in groundwater. Usually it is found in conjunction with TCE because it was used in the same factories. Unfortunately, the methods that have been used to treat TCE contamination do not remove dioxane from the water. So all these years people have been pumping groundwater, removing the TCE, but unknowingly not removing the dioxane, and then either serving it as drinking water or reinjecting it into the ground, spreading the dioxane contamination. Thanks EPA.

    EPA caused a similar problem when it mandated the use of MBTE in gasoline. Of course leaks and spills happened and so now many plumes of gasoline contamination in groundwater are also contaminated with MBTE. And MBTE contamination cannot be treated by the same methods as gasoline contamination, making cleanup much more complicated and expensive. Thanks EPA.

    I'l add more as I think of them.
    The proper concern of society is the preservation of individual freedom; the proper concern of the individual is the harmony of society.

    "Who would be free, themselves must strike the blow." - Byron

    "Who overcomes by force, hath overcome but half his foe." - Milton

  26. #23
    Environment Plaguing Agency

    What do you expect from something specifically created to prevent corporations from being sued for destroying the habitat and poisoning the water?
    Last edited by acptulsa; 08-13-2015 at 09:12 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You only want the freedoms that will undermine the nation and lead to the destruction of liberty.

  27. #24
    Does anyone know what they were actually doing at the abandoned mine? Why were they fiddling around there in the first place? The hell they unleashed is like something movies are made out of.
    A savage barbaric tribal society where thugs parade the streets and illegally assault and murder innocent civilians, yeah that is the alternative to having police. Oh wait, that is the police

    We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.
    - Edward R. Murrow

    ...I think we have moral obligations to disobey unjust laws, because non-cooperation with evil is as much as a moral obligation as cooperation with good. - MLK Jr.

    How to trigger a liberal: "I didn't get vaccinated."



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior_of_Freedom View Post
    Does anyone know what they were actually doing at the abandoned mine? Why were they fiddling around there in the first place? The hell they unleashed is like something movies are made out of.
    They found a potential problem which had remained a potential problem for some odd one hundred twenty years, and turned it into a real problem. Just so it could throw some money around.

    It's what Washington does.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You only want the freedoms that will undermine the nation and lead to the destruction of liberty.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    They found a potential problem which had remained a potential problem for some odd one hundred twenty years, and turned it into a real problem. Just so it could throw some money around.

    It's what Washington does.
    interesting, so it was possible if they left it alone it would have burst and leaked anyway? I don't understand why they didn't block off any potential route right into the river first, idiots.
    A savage barbaric tribal society where thugs parade the streets and illegally assault and murder innocent civilians, yeah that is the alternative to having police. Oh wait, that is the police

    We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.
    - Edward R. Murrow

    ...I think we have moral obligations to disobey unjust laws, because non-cooperation with evil is as much as a moral obligation as cooperation with good. - MLK Jr.

    How to trigger a liberal: "I didn't get vaccinated."

  31. #27
    'You're going to kill people'. EPA blasted for polluting water in 4 states, 'threatening country with a blackout'
    http://www.wendymcelroy.com/news.php?extend.6621

    Horner said the EPA's clumsy handling of the Gold King Mine contamination means it should never be permitted to enforce sweeping new regulations on citizens and businesses.

    "It comes amid their biggest demand for authority over the private sector, wrapped in this veil of saintliness and goodness and perfection and competence," he said. "This reminds us the agency clearly does not possess it."


    Because of the EPA's pursuit of lower carbon emission standards and new rules on water and ozone, Horner said the agency can't keep its eyes on the job it's supposed to be doing.

    As a result, he says Congress ought to take an aggressive stand against the EPA overreach.

    "You know what Congress ought to say? 'This is a big red flag. You are not accountable. That is clear. And you want to redesign the electricity system. What happens when you take that out of the hands of the people that delivered a miracle, the modern electricity system, and give it to an unaccountable bureaucracy that has no expertise in this?'"


    Horner added, "This is an agency running around, pretending to control the weather with rules they acknowledge will have no impact on the weather. But it's a good excuse to do something they've always wanted to do."

    Among the carbon, water and ozone rules, Horner finds the recent power-plant emissions rule the most troubling.

    "You're threatening the country with a blackout," he said. "There are terrific, tremendous, immediate human health and environment consequences, life and death consequences from that.

    "[The rule] was driven, expressly according to the president, to finally make renewable energy profitable. That's not a legitimate purpose of government. And to bankrupt companies he didn't like. You need to hit the brakes on that immediately because you're going to kill people. This agenda is killing people in Europe right now, which may be one of the reasons the president stopped telling us to look to Europe to see how it's going to turn out."

    Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2015/08/youre-goi...42m3xlkqdC4.99
    Based on the idea of natural rights, government secures those rights to the individual by strictly negative intervention, making justice costless and easy of access; and beyond that it does not go. The State, on the other hand, both in its genesis and by its primary intention, is purely anti-social. It is not based on the idea of natural rights, but on the idea that the individual has no rights except those that the State may provisionally grant him. It has always made justice costly and difficult of access, and has invariably held itself above justice and common morality whenever it could advantage itself by so doing.
    --Albert J. Nock

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior_of_Freedom View Post
    interesting, so it was possible if they left it alone it would have burst and leaked anyway? I don't understand why they didn't block off any potential route right into the river first, idiots.
    Yes, it seems the obvious thing to do would have been to build a containment before doing anything else at that site.

  33. #29
    h/t Daniel McAdams @ LRC: https://www.lewrockwell.com/lrc-blog...e-environment/
    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel McAdams
    How’s the EPA doing protecting us from environmental catastrophes? Looks like they are too busy creating them. Who would protect the environment in a libertarian society? Ron Paul explains in today’s Liberty Report.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul Liberty Report
    The recent EPA massive toxic spill into the Animas River in Colorado highlights the Agency's total incompetence...and maybe worse. Should we still trust the government to protect us?
    The EPA: Protecting the Environment?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTkhIp04v24
    The Bastiat Collection · FREE PDF · FREE EPUB · PAPER
    Frédéric Bastiat (1801-1850)

    • "When law and morality are in contradiction to each other, the citizen finds himself in the cruel alternative of either losing his moral sense, or of losing his respect for the law."
      -- The Law (p. 54)
    • "Government is that great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
      -- Government (p. 99)
    • "[W]ar is always begun in the interest of the few, and at the expense of the many."
      -- Economic Sophisms - Second Series (p. 312)
    • "There are two principles that can never be reconciled - Liberty and Constraint."
      -- Harmonies of Political Economy - Book One (p. 447)

    · tu ne cede malis sed contra audentior ito ·

  34. #30
    Mine’s owner says he tried to keep out EPA but was threatened with fines
    DENVER — The owner of the Colorado’s Gold King Mine says he tried to stop the Environmental Protection Agency from gaining access to his property, but that he relented after the agency threatened to pound him with ruinous fines if he refused.

    Mine owner Todd Hennis said that he had little choice four years ago but to allow in an EPA-led crew, which triggered the Aug. 5 blowout that sent 3 million gallons of toxic orange wastewater down the Animas River.

    “When you are a small guy and you’re having a $35,000 a day fine accrue against you, you have to run up the white flag,” Mr. Hennis told CBS4 in Denver.

    Mr. Hennis said he opposed having the EPA investigate leakage from the inactive mine near Silverton, Colorado, because he had tangled with the agency in previous years over its work at another mine he owns in Leadville, Colorado.

    “I said, ‘No, I don’t want you on my land out of fear that you will create additional pollution like you did in Leadville,’” Mr. Hennis told Colorado Watchdog.org. “They said, ‘If you don’t give us access within four days, we will fine you $35,000 a day.’”

    The EPA has admitted that its agents accidentally unleashed the acidic flood, which has since contaminated the San Juan River in New Mexico and seeped into Lake Powell in Utah, albeit in very low concentrations.

    The Interior Department and the EPA’s Office of Inspector General are investigating the circumstances leading up to the accident, while at least two House committees are also expected to hold hearings on the spill.

    ...
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...as-threatened/
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    This intellectually stimulating conversation is the reason I keep coming here.

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