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Thread: How Far Will Trump Go?

  1. #1

    How Far Will Trump Go?


    How Far Will Trump Go?

    By Patrick J. Buchanan • July 28, 2015

    The American political class has failed the country, and should be fired. That is the clearest message from the summer surge of Bernie Sanders and the remarkable rise of Donald Trump.

    Sanders’s candidacy can trace it roots back to the 19th-century populist party of Mary Elizabeth Lease who declaimed: “Wall Street owns the country. It is no longer a government of the people, by the people, and for the people, but a government of Wall Street, by Wall Street, and for Wall Street. The great common people of this country are slaves, and monopoly is the master.”

    “Raise less corn and more hell!” Mary admonished the farmers of Kansas.

    William Jennings Bryan captured the Democratic nomination in 1896 by denouncing the gold standard beloved of the hard money men of his day: “You shall not press down upon the brow of labor this crown of thorns, you shall not crucify mankind upon a cross of gold.”

    Sanders is in that tradition, if not in that league as an orator. His followers, largely white, $50,000-a-year folks with college degrees, call to mind more the followers of George McGovern than Jennings Bryan.

    Yet the stagnation of workers’ wages as the billionaire boys club admits new members, and the hemorrhaging of U.S. jobs under trade deals done for the Davos-Doha crowd, has created a blazing issue of economic inequality that propels the Sanders campaign.

    Between his issues and Trump’s there is overlap. Both denounce the trade deals that de-industrialized America and shipped millions of jobs off to Mexico, Asia and China. But Trump has connected to an even more powerful current.

    That is the issue of uncontrolled and illegal immigration, the sense America’s borders are undefended, that untold millions of lawbreakers are in our country, and more are coming. While most come to work, they are taking American jobs and consuming tax dollars, and too many come to rob, rape, murder and make a living selling drugs.

    Moreover, the politicians who have talked about this for decades are a pack of phonies who have done little to secure the border.

    Trump boasts that he will get the job done, as he gets done all other jobs he has undertaken. And his poll ratings are one measure of how far out of touch the Republican establishment is with the Republican heartland.
    ...
    But can Trump win?

    If his poll numbers hold, Trump will be there six months from now when the Sweet 16 is cut to the Final Four, and he will likely be in the finals. For if Trump is running at 18 or 20 percent nationally then, among Republicans, it is hard to see how two rivals beat him.

    For Trump not to be in the hunt as the New Hampshire primary opens, his campaign will have to implode, as Gary Hart’s did in 1987, and Bill Clinton’s almost did in 1992.

    Thus, in the next six months, Trump will have to commit some truly egregious blunder that costs him his present following. Or the dirt divers of the media and “oppo research” arms of the other campaigns will have to come up with some high-yield IEDs.

    Presidential primaries are minefields for the incautious, and Trump is not a cautious man. And it is difficult to see how, in a two-man race against the favorite of the Republican establishment, he could win enough primaries, caucuses and delegates to capture 50 percent of the convention votes.
    ...
    More: http://www.theamericanconservative.c...uld-trump-win/
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.



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  3. #2
    I'll be surprised if his skeletons haven't chased him away before Iowa.

  4. #3
    The Buchananites think Trump is carrying their mantle now.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by fr33 View Post
    I'll be surprised if his skeletons haven't chased him away before Iowa.
    Just look at his brainwash effect around here. This guy could kill and eat a newborn baby on live television and his supporters would shout "hell yeah!"

  6. #5
    My SWAG, probably until it's not really any fun anymore, and he just gets tired of throwing his money away.

  7. #6
    Trump will fly as close to the sun as he can.

  8. #7
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    Trump can win the nomination, but the field needs to dissolve quickly. Jeb possesses the deep coffers to play the long game and win. Any alternative to Bush needs to unite the clans fast or it's probably going to Bush and his PACs that carry the day.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by GunnyFreedom View Post
    Just look at his brainwash effect around here. This guy could kill and eat a newborn baby on live television and his supporters would shout "hell yeah!"
    I'd say, that's just a bit harsh.

    Do you have some here, in particular, in mind?



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Sola_Fide View Post
    The Buchananites think Trump is carrying their mantle now.
    I doubt anyone who would call themselves a "Buchananite" is fooled by Trump. Now, the low information GOP crowd might fall for it...but even most of them just support anyone giving a big middle finger to the RINO establishment.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  12. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    I doubt anyone who would call themselves a "Buchananite" is fooled by Trump. Now, the low information GOP crowd might fall for it...but even most of them just support anyone giving a big middle finger to the RINO establishment.
    Trump is far from a Buchanite, but we'll take what we can get in these dark times.

  13. #11
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    BTW the closest to a Buchanite in Congress is probably Walter Jones.
    Last edited by AuH20; 07-29-2015 at 11:39 AM.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Sola_Fide View Post
    The Buchananites think Trump is carrying their mantle now.
    Lots of people are suckered in by Trump it seems, notably Rand haters who think Rand is not pure enough. I would have supported Buchanan if I was a voter back in his era, and I can't stand Trump.
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It's a balance between appeasing his supporters, appeasing the deep state and reaching his own goals.
    ~Resident Badgiraffe




  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by GunnyFreedom View Post
    Just look at his brainwash effect around here. This guy could kill and eat a newborn baby on live television and his supporters would shout "hell yeah!"
    Yes but he's renounced those views. I never actually heard him say he renounced them, but I trust him.

    ^This is what people actually think.

    And didn't Trump get upset that Buchanan beat him for the reform party nomination or something?
    Support Justin Amash for Congress
    Michigan Congressional District 3

  16. #14
    I have said this many times before and I will say it again. Americans vote based on emotion. They aren't going to read a book, a treatise on libertarianism or the NAP, or try to understand that anarcho-capitalists really aren't the anarchists they've seen and heard about who set buildings on fire.

    Trump plays to that and he does it well. What he's saying doesn't require a lot of detail and he's talking about things people are majorly pissed off about. Most Republican voters prefer a candidate who doesn't come off like a wimp and Trump certainly doesn't do that. These are the reasons I believe he is appealing to so many right now. Americans are fed up and they can wrap their brains around Trump's solutions.
    ================
    Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.

    Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America

    The Property Basis of Rights

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    I have said this many times before and I will say it again. Americans vote based on emotion. They aren't going to read a book, a treatise on libertarianism or the NAP, or try to understand that anarcho-capitalists really aren't the anarchists they've seen and heard about who set buildings on fire.

    Trump plays to that and he does it well. What he's saying doesn't require a lot of detail and he's talking about things people are majorly pissed off about. Most Republican voters prefer a candidate who doesn't come off like a wimp and Trump certainly doesn't do that. These are the reasons I believe he is appealing to so many right now. Americans are fed up and they can wrap their brains around Trump's solutions.
    Here is a good visual representation of what Liberty Eagle is talking about, and it fits the average American voter, GOP or otherwise, to a tee.

    Last edited by hells_unicorn; 07-30-2015 at 10:38 PM.

  18. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    I have said this many times before and I will say it again. Americans vote based on emotion. They aren't going to read a book, a treatise on libertarianism or the NAP, or try to understand that anarcho-capitalists really aren't the anarchists they've seen and heard about who set buildings on fire.

    Trump plays to that and he does it well. What he's saying doesn't require a lot of detail and he's talking about things people are majorly pissed off about. Most Republican voters prefer a candidate who doesn't come off like a wimp and Trump certainly doesn't do that. These are the reasons I believe he is appealing to so many right now. Americans are fed up and they can wrap their brains around Trump's solutions.
    People generally aren't deep thinkers, but they do not want this.That's for sure.

    Last edited by AuH20; 07-29-2015 at 12:40 PM.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    People generally aren't deep thinkers, but they do not want this.That's for sure.

    Indeed, who would want to live in a city or town that looks like this?

  21. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by hells_unicorn View Post
    Indeed, who would want to live in a city or town that looks like this?
    A tattoo artist?

  22. #19
    Buchanan's run might have made the Trump candidacy possible.

  23. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by jj- View Post
    Buchanan's run might have made the Trump candidacy possible.
    Some people say Buchanan is an agent of Rome, but I always liked the guy. Bold. uncompromising. Super intelligent.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    People generally aren't deep thinkers, but they do not want this.That's for sure.
    It doesn't require deep thinking to not want that. Agreed.
    ================
    Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.

    Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America

    The Property Basis of Rights

  25. #22
    Buchanan interview


  26. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by jj- View Post
    Buchanan interview

    I agree with Pat. Trump can run away with this if they don't stop him quickly. Look at the rest of the field. Who really gets the blood flowing in the most relatable manner? There is no one other than Trump. However, if they can slow him down and lengthen this out, he will falter. Like Pat said, the establishment almost always wins the prolonged wars of attrition.
    Last edited by AuH20; 07-30-2015 at 05:44 PM.

  27. #24
    lol if this all boils down to trump vs bernie

    'We endorse the idea of voluntarism; self-responsibility: Family, friends, and churches to solve problems, rather than saying that some monolithic government is going to make you take care of yourself and be a better person. It's a preposterous notion: It never worked, it never will. The government can't make you a better person; it can't make you follow good habits.' - Ron Paul 1988

    Awareness is the Root of Liberation Revolution is Action upon Revelation

    'Resistance and Disobedience in Economic Activity is the Most Moral Human Action Possible' - SEK3

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    ...the familiar ritual of institutional self-absolution...
    ...for protecting them, by mock trial, from punishment...




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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    People generally aren't deep thinkers, but they do not want this.That's for sure.

    ...the focus on which demonstrates an astounding lack of perspective.

    The odds of being harmed by a criminal (be it terrorist, gangster, or other) are trivial, the odds of being harmed by the government's policies are 100% - every year.

    ...not to mention that a large fraction of the crime problem is exclusively attributable to the government's drug policy.

    Likewise with the magnitude of the harm; crime costs society a couple hundred billion per year; government costs society $6.5 trillion per year (excluding indirect costs).

    To prioritize crime prevention over reducing the size of government is idiotic.

    ...yet "conservatives" keep falling into this trap over and over again, Trump being the latest example.

    A couple people get shot by an illegal alien and everybody goes ape$#@!.

    "Who cares if he supports socialized medicine, this is an EMERGENCY (!), we've got bigger fish to fry!"

    ...yea, like reducing the murder rate from 4.7 per 100,000 to 4.1 per 100,000.

    ....Boy that'll fix everything, won't it?

    Last edited by r3volution 3.0; 07-30-2015 at 06:20 PM.

  30. #26
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    Trump may have taken a page from failed Ron's strategy in 2012. Load up in the early states and run away from the pack. By the time the establishment realizes it, you're halfway down the road.

    Last edited by AuH20; 07-30-2015 at 08:34 PM.

  31. #27
    Trump will crumble under inspection because he's so inconsistent. He doesn't have well-developed policies, he has complaints. Not enough to sustain a campaign over time.

  32. #28
    Folks -- Florida went to Mitt. JEB thinks he has an edge there in 2o16.
    Pat Buchanan name~drops William Jennings Bryan, the Prairie Populist.
    We need solid finishes in Iowa, N.H & S.C to even contemplate FL now.

    "William Jennings Bryan captured the Democratic nomination in 1896 by
    denouncing the gold standard beloved of the hard money men of his day:
    “You shall not press down upon the brow of labor this crown of thorns,
    you shall not crucify mankind upon a cross of gold.” "[how*far*will*Trump*go]

  33. #29
    there will be a final four-Rand , Trump, Jeb or Kasich, and one of the others who will surprise.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by jj- View Post
    Buchanan's run might have made the Trump candidacy possible.
    I wouldn't say that at all. Buchanan and Trump have little in common except for the voting block they tap in to. There has always been a big part of the electorate that was open to these ideas. But it all comes down to timing. Buchanan is actually a great politician. If 1992 Buchanan were running today, he'd probably be polling above 50% right now. Trump is benefiting from the angriest electorate in modern history and an America that is far closer to the breaking point than it was back in '92. Trump on the other hand, is kind of a bozo. Not even most Trump supporters believe he'd make a good President, he's still drawing strong support just because there is no other viable alternative. Trump's success is an indictment of the current GOP field.

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