Same sex marriage is a sign of the end of times. Or not.

[moostraks]

I am not judging. It's not my job. My job as put forth in a Biblical description is to love and forgive others their sin as I have been forgiven. One can lead by example or one can lead by force. Force has not been a successful program.

You could try digging around in James to ascertain what my answer is. Did you bother with answering my previous questions?

You received a response. Check into James and immerse yourself in the writings. Yet, that was not good enough. It was more than you gave me to my earlier questions which you are still ignoring. You gain nothing by acting as if you may make assumptions on my beliefs when I choose not to waste time on pointless, endless arguments with you.

I was busy grading a huge stack of papers when I received a cricket response for not hanging out online continuously, then somehow this is how you have proved some point while ignoring my answer? You should refrain from making assumptions as with me you never are accurate. Read James. And if you think you can command a response as though you deserve special treatment while ignoring the previous discussion you engaged in, think again.

One should concern themself with their own sin and not that of their neighbor.

Proverbs 6:16 There are six things which the Lord hates,
Yes, seven which are an abomination to Him:
17 Haughty eyes, a lying tongue,
And hands that shed innocent blood,
18 A heart that devises wicked plans,
Feet that run rapidly to evil,
19 A false witness who utters lies,
And one who spreads strife among brothers.

Calvin:
http://www.spurgeon.org/~phil/calvin...l#fortysev.htm

Luther:

http://www.iclnet.org/pub/resources/...eb/cat-08.html

So it is more convenient for you stir the pot than to be responsible for the nonsense you stated previously to promote fear?

Maybe you should take a moment to reread what I had posted within the thread to ascertain that I shouldn't have to repeat my answer to his fishing expedition so he may crucify people according to their personal opinions when they are supposed to be merciful in order to obtain mercy themselves. Then you could mosey on over and immerse yourself in James and it shouldn't take to long to see where I am coming from here.

Sola owned nothing wrt to me. it just further proved his shallow nature when it comes to fleeing from a discussion to try and create hysteria elsewhere.

Hmmm, is this still a liberty forum? One should not use the government as their own personal agent to enforce their religious beliefs at the barrel of a gun and not expect it to potentially be turned upon themselves when they see their numbers dwindle within their religious ranks.

Fear is the beginning of knowledge, for the individual. An individual who is granted mercy and as such should be merciful towards others.

Matthew 18:23 “For this reason the kingdom of heaven may be compared to a king who wished to settle accounts with his slaves. 24 When he had begun to settle them, one who owed him ten thousand talents was brought to him. 25 But since he did not have the means to repay, his lord commanded him to be sold, along with his wife and children and all that he had, and repayment to be made. 26 So the slave fell to the ground and prostrated himself before him, saying, ‘Have patience with me and I will repay you everything.’ 27 And the lord of that slave felt compassion and released him and forgave him the debt. 28 But that slave went out and found one of his fellow slaves who owed him a hundred denarii; and he seized him and began to choke him, saying, ‘Pay back what you owe.’ 29 So his fellow slave fell to the ground and began to plead with him, saying, ‘Have patience with me and I will repay you.’ 30 But he was unwilling and went and threw him in prison until he should pay back what was owed. 31 So when his fellow slaves saw what had happened, they were deeply grieved and came and reported to their lord all that had happened. 32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

First, one should be more concerned with one's own shortcomings rather than nosing around what they believe their neighbors might be doing wrong. Second, one should leave it up to the Creator to deal with the situation as He sees fit rather than taking it upon themselves to impose judgement if one feels tempted to believe another is transgressing. Lead by example, allowing Love to do that which force will never achieve.

You cant type a 2 or 3 letter word to me right now? What post did you answer it in?

Have you put any real thought into how busy one would be if they concerned themselves with every sin or possible sin of their neighbor? I have eight children that keep me busy and no time to concern myself with what others are doing in their own bedrooms.

Take Care with Your Liberty

1Corinthians 8:1Now concerning things sacrificed to idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge makes arrogant, but love edifies. 2If anyone supposes that he knows anything, he has not yet known as he ought to know; 3but if anyone loves God, he is known by Him.
4Therefore concerning the eating of things sacrificed to idols, we know that there is no such thing as an idol in the world, and that there is no God but one. 5For even if there are so-called gods whether in heaven or on earth, as indeed there are many gods and many lords, 6yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.

7However not all men have this knowledge; but some, being accustomed to the idol until now, eat food as if it were sacrificed to an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled. 8But food will not commend us to God; we are neither the worse if we do not eat, nor the better if we do eat. 9But take care that this liberty of yours does not somehow become a stumbling block to the weak. 10For if someone sees you, who have knowledge, dining in an idol’s temple, will not his conscience, if he is weak, be strengthened to eat things sacrificed to idols? 11For through your knowledge he who is weak is ruined, the brother for whose sake Christ died. 12And so, by sinning against the brethren and wounding their conscience when it is weak, you sin against Christ. 13Therefore, if food causes my brother to stumble, I will never eat meat again, so that I will not cause my brother to stumble.

^^^ this is further explanation for my position. I concern myself with my own shortcomings that may present themselves a stumbling block to others, and in that I fail more often than succeed at complying with what my conscience pricks me to be concerned over. I am not so perfect as to demand I hear His Voice so well that I should sit in judgement, condemning anyone, based on an opinion of my own on an activity or relationship (with the Creator) to whom I am not a party to, as to do such, according to my Faith and the Spirit that resides in me, makes me lack mercy for those walking a path different than my own.

I don't drink either. I could choose to formulate an argument over the sin of intoxication, if I chose to do such. People argue both sides of the fence on that issue using Scripture. Should I be ashamed that I am not condemning drunkards? I find people who obsess over alcohol annoying but I see no need in creating a policy statement which shuts people out of heaven and claim moral superiority as I don't drink.

When I was less experienced in spiritual matters I was much more opinionated about others sin but paid little attention to what effect that had to myself and those I was so concerned about sinning differently than I. If you are hashing out a church to associate with likeminded people than it is important they share the similar goals but imposing religious beliefs through force will be detrimental to all parties involved.

Now, you may not agree with me, but that is my answer.

[Sola_Fide]

Have you put any real thought into how busy one would be if they concerned themselves with every sin or possible sin of their neighbor? I have eight children that keep me busy and no time to concern myself with what others are doing in their own bedrooms.

Take Care with Your Liberty

1Corinthians 8:1Now concerning things sacrificed to idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge makes arrogant, but love edifies. 2If anyone supposes that he knows anything, he has not yet known as he ought to know; 3but if anyone loves God, he is known by Him.
4Therefore concerning the eating of things sacrificed to idols, we know that there is no such thing as an idol in the world, and that there is no God but one. 5For even if there are so-called gods whether in heaven or on earth, as indeed there are many gods and many lords, 6yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.

7However not all men have this knowledge; but some, being accustomed to the idol until now, eat food as if it were sacrificed to an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled. 8But food will not commend us to God; we are neither the worse if we do not eat, nor the better if we do eat. 9But take care that this liberty of yours does not somehow become a stumbling block to the weak. 10For if someone sees you, who have knowledge, dining in an idol’s temple, will not his conscience, if he is weak, be strengthened to eat things sacrificed to idols? 11For through your knowledge he who is weak is ruined, the brother for whose sake Christ died. 12And so, by sinning against the brethren and wounding their conscience when it is weak, you sin against Christ. 13Therefore, if food causes my brother to stumble, I will never eat meat again, so that I will not cause my brother to stumble.

^^^ this is further explanation for my position. I concern myself with my own shortcomings that may present themselves a stumbling block to others, and in that I fail more often than succeed at complying with what my conscience pricks me to be concerned over. I am not so perfect as to demand I hear His Voice so well that I should sit in judgement, condemning anyone, based on an opinion of my own on an activity or relationship (with the Creator) to whom I am not a party to, as to do such, according to my Faith and the Spirit that resides in me, makes me lack mercy for those walking a path different than my own.

I don't drink either. I could choose to formulate an argument over the sin of intoxication, if I chose to do such. People argue both sides of the fence on that issue using Scripture. Should I be ashamed that I am not condemning drunkards? I find people who obsess over alcohol annoying but I see no need in creating a policy statement which shuts people out of heaven and claim moral superiority as I don't drink.

When I was less experienced in spiritual matters I was much more opinionated about others sin but paid little attention to what effect that had to myself and those I was so concerned about sinning differently than I. If you are hashing out a church to associate with likeminded people than it is important they share the similar goals but imposing religious beliefs through force will be detrimental to all parties involved.

Now, you may not agree with me, but that is my answer.

So you think homosexuality is a question of Christian liberty?

[moostraks]

The comment you responded to was posted in this forum, it is a logical conclusion that both you and said individual were complaining about the level of activity on this thread. Let's start with that one. And yes, I am very much casting you in the light of making imaginative claims, it's a hallmark of modern thought and I feel very confident in saying so.

Again the world exists beyond the forum. Once presented with that response, the logical conclusion should be that the person making said comments is responding to the greater environment beyond said forum. Maybe you fancy that others are supposedly making imaginative claims because you are guilty of such from the numerous times you attempt to create fantastical statements which you refute all while purporting to blame another poster for the utterances you have dreamed up?

[moostraks]

Moostraks has a history of never answering questions, changing the subject, and then attacking you personally. She can't carry on a normal conversation like you and I could do.

BS. I answer your questions extensively and repeatedly and you forget the answer and demand I answer again. If normal conversation is being a rude, forgetful broken record who drops conversations midstream, then yeah, I don't carry on your version of so called normal conversation. Lol!

[moostraks]

So you think homosexuality is a question of Christian liberty?

I believe what I wrote. What is so difficult for you to comprehend? Whats your angle with turning it into Christian liberty rather than what I went to the effort to explain?

[Sola_Fide]

Moostraks,

Is it your position that a person can be a homosexual and be a Christian?

[moostraks]

Moostraks,

Is it your position that a person can be a homosexual and be a Christian?

I have answered your question already. You will find the answer you seek for this in my previous response. You are continuing to derail my thread with this side discussion which I have asked you to please take up elsewhere. And, you still are avoiding a previous discussion which you rudely abandoned in favor of derailing my thread.

I have been excessively tolerate despite the behavior you have continued to display in my thread. Please at least have respect enough for others who share your faith title, and show some sense of decorum.

[hells_unicorn]

Again the world exists beyond the forum. Once presented with that response, the logical conclusion should be that the person making said comments is responding to the greater environment beyond said forum.

So you and said individual decided to carry on a conversation about the entire world beyond this forum, while not only in this forum, but this particular thread concerning the subject of homosexuality not only as being sin but also a sign of judgment day according to the OP, and when questioned on this you state that you are not talking about anything pertaining to this thread or the people active in it? This makes zero sense.

Maybe you fancy that others are supposedly making imaginative claims because you are guilty of such from the numerous times you attempt to create fantastical statements which you refute all while purporting to blame another poster for the utterances you have dreamed up?

You and the other individual were talking about this issue in this thread. At the very least, your statement included the people in this thread along with the world beyond it. By extension, you are implying that either myself or one of the others in this conversation don't care about government abuse of power, which is demonstrably false. If this was not your intent, your words were extremely unclear initially and your response to me was fairly condescending.

[Terry1]

So you and said individual decided to carry on a conversation about the entire world beyond this forum, while not only in this forum, but this particular thread concerning the subject of homosexuality not only as being sin but also a sign of judgment day according to the OP, and when questioned on this you state that you are not talking about anything pertaining to this thread or the people active in it? This makes zero sense.



You and the other individual were talking about this issue in this thread. At the very least, your statement included the people in this thread along with the world beyond it. By extension, you are implying that either myself or one of the others in this conversation don't care about government abuse of power, which is demonstrably false. If this was not your intent, your words were extremely unclear initially and your response to me was fairly condescending.

We've been discussing the OP as to whether this was a biblical sign and how that's going to affect the Churches of Christ of all denominations and moos continually lowered the bar in this discussion by implying this was about personal bigotry. After repeated efforts to get her back on topic in her own thread, she continued to lower the bar even further by then claiming others were "derailing her thread", when in fact moos herself is responsible for that.

This is her MO--we should all simply abandon this thread and stop feeding the abscess.

[moostraks]

So you and said individual decided to carry on a conversation about the entire world beyond this forum, while not only in this forum, but this particular thread concerning the subject of homosexuality not only as being sin but also a sign of judgment day according to the OP, and when questioned on this you state that you are not talking about anything pertaining to this thread or the people active in it? This makes zero sense.



You and the other individual were talking about this issue in this thread. At the very least, your statement included the people in this thread along with the world beyond it. By extension, you are implying that either myself or one of the others in this conversation don't care about government abuse of power, which is demonstrably false. If this was not your intent, your words were extremely unclear initially and your response to me was fairly condescending.

No, you are taking one post and attempting to silence discussion by setting erroneous framework much like SF and his specific yes-no answer. If you feel yourself representative of the insult it isn't because anything was directed at you but that you continue to want to drag this out to mean such is your own problem.

If the response seems condescending, maybe you should rethink how you speak to others as most of the post was a reworded negation of your reply to me.

[moostraks]

We've been discussing the OP as to whether this was a biblical sign and how that's going to affect the Churches of Christ of all denominations and moos continually lowered the bar in this discussion by implying this was about personal bigotry. After repeated efforts to get her back on topic in her own thread, she continued to lower the bar even further by then claiming others were "derailing her thread", when in fact moos herself is responsible for that.

This is her MO--we should all simply abandon this thread and stop feeding the abscess.

No, instead of dealing with the initial OP intent of the end times sign, that was ignored to derail for a witch hunt on who supports gay marriage yes or no. As the OP, I may request that off topic discussion go to another thread. I even went to an extent to answer the off topic request to return discussion to the OP but because my answer was not properly framed as yes or no, I have had the thread continuously derailed by several antagonistic individuals who think Love means acting like a belligerent bully. It is a shame that a few individuals make being miserable seem the norm. The hysterics and certainty of immediate doom is self serving, but when I attempted to discuss that I was buried in several off topic statements against gay marriage itself. Making a new thread is not that hard, but some people would rather behave as forum bullies.

[Eagles' Wings]

Excellent Louise -you've got this 'Peace Through Religion' (FAITH) pegged, and you shared it. Thank you.

I don't know if this is all about the end times.
What I DO know is fear and false pride got us to this point:
A lot of fear by non-believers and Christians of weak faith. A lot of false pride by non-believers and Christians of weak faith.

We know what battles fear and false pride -MOAR Truth. What Louise said. Be ready and act!

I've been thinking about your post for a couple
of days, bunklo, and it seems there is a misunderstanding.

IN no way, shape, or form am I advocating for the kind peace Bryan would desire on this forum.

The passage of Roe v Wade caused unspeakable human suffering for Americans. I believe the decision by the Supreme Court to legalize homosexual marriage will increase human suffering, for both the believer in Christ and the un-believer.

God has clearly said that homosexuality is sin. Those engaged in this sin need to hear that it is sin, and then to hear that the only way to repentance and forgiveness is through Jesus Christ.

[moostraks]

Homosexuality is firmly a religious, rather than a moral prohibition. It is akin to the laws of not desecrating the Sabbath or eating non-kosher food. Someone who eats a cheeseburger at McDonald’s, mixing milk and meat, is not immoral. They are contravening a Biblical commandment.

What I sense in my friends who see the Court’s decision as an unconscionable travesty is a misunderstanding of this distinction between moral law versus religious law. Prohibition against homosexuality is a religious law, much in the same way lighting a match on the Sabbath is a violation of the divine will.

While I may insist on societal adherence with moral laws as part of a broader social compact that binds us together, I cannot reasonably expect to impose my religious beliefs upon others, and certainly not in America, a nation built on religious freedom.

I realize that gay marriage is in a somewhat different category, involving as it does the question of social institutions upon which the world has long relied upon for stability. But what is better? To encourage gay men and women to be in enduring relationships based on fidelity and faithfulness or eternal singlehood bereft of commitment...

For those who might call themselves “culture warriors” and want to fight for traditional marriage, I call on you to look inward and begin your fight on a new front: combatting the ridiculously high fifty percent divorce rate. Fight to keep families whole. Fight to prevent the dislocation of children and the pain of seeing parents fight in court. Fight to end the shameful epidemic of heterosexual marital decline that impacts half of new marriages today. That is where the battle ahead lies, and it is one that impacts us all.

For all those who are predicting that the legalization of gay marriage is the end of Western civilization and the traditional family, let’s face facts. Divorce and the easy culture of recreational sex, which makes a mockery of intimacy and commitment, poses a far greater threat to the future of the family than gay marriage. One affects about 5-7% of the population while the other affects far higher numbers.

It’s not gay marriage but heterosexual divorce that threatens a real end-of-days scenario for the American family.

Read more at http://observer.com/2015/07/gay-marr...#ixzz3evasjPXn

[moostraks]

How time flies. It was only a week ago that the Supreme Court ruled that same-sex couples must be afforded the same legal status as everybody else when it comes to marriage. The states had not shown any compelling interest in making the distinction that would justify it. Finding the idea "icky" was apparently not an adequate reason to discriminate. It was a big deal, and there was a lot of news coverage of the decision and how it affects real people.

Several Republican presidential candidates denounced it in the strongest terms. So in addition to repealing Obamacare (and replacing it with the still top-secret Republican alternative we've been hearing about for six years without ever seeing it), they are now pounding the desk demanding a constitutional amendment on marriage. The decision was the end of the world. For about 48 hours.

So here we are a week later. The sun still rises on schedule. We have not been beset by unusual earthquakes, floods or pestilence. Same-sex couples are now getting married in all 50 states and the planets have not careened out of alignment. They did have to add a "leap second" to some official clock to adjust for the earth being a little slow in its orbit, but that had been planned for years. It wasn't related to the Supreme Court decision. The nation has given the issue a collective shrug and moved on...

http://www.parkrecord.com/opinion/ci...-off-end-world

[Sola_Fide]

Read more at http://observer.com/2015/07/gay-marr...#ixzz3evasjPXn

http://www.parkrecord.com/opinion/ci...-off-end-world

Well, we can put you in the judicial tyranny camp.

[moostraks]

Well, we can put you in the judicial tyranny camp.

Yeah, that's right. Not like I have stated it would be better if all parties advocated that the government get out of marriage completely. Lies about my beliefs/opinions all you got nowadays?

[Sola_Fide]

Yeah, that's right. Not like I have stated it would be better if all parties advocated that the government get out of marriage completely. Lies about my beliefs/opinions all you got nowadays?

Why would you encourage two homosexuals to deepen their relationship with each other? Are you a Christian?

[acptulsa]

Well, we can put you in the judicial tyranny camp.

That comment is rude, unjust and incorrect.

Government created the situation where marriage created certain financial benefits such as access to family medical plans. Now, maybe you are ready, willing and able to let them suffer, since you are incurably obsessed with this one particular sin for whatever reason. And maybe I am disgusted that the cure effected is far worse than merely getting government out of the business of mandating benefits, and saying who is and who isn't married, and ripping up families, and supporting the Divorce Industry. But here we are.

And I'll say these two things once, and let you ask me to repeat them until doomsday: Gay marriage can never cause the harm that the insanely high divorce rate is causing. And these divorces have actual victims. People who divorce after having children let their lawyers impoverish them, and the discord damages the children they have had. These people suffer far, far more than you do when your delicate sensibilities are offended.

Complaining about gays being allowed to engage in this awful source of blood money for the divorce lawyers is ridiculous. Firstly, these people that you view as enemies are merely taking on punishment for what you perceive as their sins by putting themselves at the mercy of the Divorce Industry. And they can never do as much harm to the institution of marriage as the sky-high divorce rate and the forfeiture of the rights of parents to parent to the Divorce Industry's child custody racket.

Whether you approve of these sources or not, or whether you think God shouldn't have allowed the sun to rise this morning or not, the points made in those posts are valid. Complaining about this when the real purpose of marriage--to provide children with a real family and parents of both sexes, which they need--marriage is not providing, is tantamount of stopping to try to clean a stain off the living room carpet on the way to the phone to call the fire department in to douse the flames upstairs.

Perspective, Sola. Show us some. Coveting one's neighbor's wife is breaking a Commandment. Sodomy is not. You may be in tune with St. Paul's priorities, but Moses proved you aren't in tune with God's. Participating in this distraction enables the government to help make the children more miserable even as you actively try to make gays more miserable. How does that square with what Jesus said about what we do to these, the least of our bretheren?

Feel free to ignore these hard questions as usual if they are a threat to your state of denial.

[moostraks]

Why would you encourage two homosexuals to deepen their relationship with each other? Are you a Christian?

Why would I entertain another array of loaded questions from someone who lacks the integrity to not misrepresent my position?

You have already wasted plenty of forum space declaring I am not Christian a number of times. I more than gladly acknowledge that my faith like that which you profess.

I don't know if you noticed but I had nothing to do with the vote and the consequences for the gay community for choosing to embrace this method will soon enough be evident in its misery it imposes upon them. It was a horrible choice considering the two options available. If you weren't so busy deflecting from the previous discussion you would have noticed I said this previously.

[acptulsa]

Ignoring those who are already victimized, and victimizing more people, so that Christians can prove their faith by having someone to comfort is the devil's job description.

The devil's job description.

The devil's job description.

And sounding a warning may seem all loving and magnanimous, but if you force someone to repent at the barrel of a gun, I'm pretty sure it does not save them, and it condemns you, in God's eyes.

[Sola_Fide]

Why would I entertain another array of loaded questions from someone who lacks the integrity to not misrepresent my position?

You have already wasted plenty of forum space declaring I am not Christian a number of times. I more than gladly acknowledge that my faith like that which you profess.

I don't know if you noticed but I had nothing to do with the vote and the consequences for the gay community for choosing to embrace this method will soon enough be evident in its misery it imposes upon them. It was a horrible choice considering the two options available. If you weren't so busy deflecting from the previous discussion you would have noticed I said this previously.

Ok, so you don't agree with the Supreme Court ruling. I agree with you there.

But on a personal level, why would you encourage two homosexuals in their sin? Is it Biblical to do that?

[acptulsa]

Ok, so you don't agree with the Supreme Court ruling. I agree with you there.

But on a personal level, why would you encourage two homosexuals in their sin? Is it Biblical to do that?

You do not agree with her there. She believes homosexuals are bringing misery upon themselves by putting themselves at the mercy of the Divorce Industry, and she deplores that because what offends her Christianity is what makes God's children miserable.

You, on the other hand, seem perfectly fine with making them miserable because you seem to think that adversity will not strengthen their resolve, but rather it will wear down their resistance to your interpretation of what God wants from them.

[moostraks]

Ok, so you don't agree with the Supreme Court ruling. I agree with you there.

But on a personal level, why would you encourage two homosexuals in their sin? Is it Biblical to do that?

Ignoring those who are already victimized, and victimizing more people, so that Christians can prove their faith by having someone to comfort is the devil's job description.

The devil's job description.

The devil's job description.

And sounding a warning may seem all loving and magnanimous, but if you force someone to repent at the barrel of a gun, I'm pretty sure it does not save them, and it condemns you, in God's eyes.

^^^THIS!!!

Why would I entertain another array of loaded questions from someone who lacks the integrity to not misrepresent my position?


I don't know if you noticed but I had nothing to do with the vote and the consequences for the gay community for choosing to embrace this method will soon enough be evident in its misery it imposes upon them. It was a horrible choice considering the two options available. If you weren't so busy deflecting from the previous discussion you would have noticed I said this previously.

Stop misrepresenting my position. Again, if you could grasp the level to which this issue is irrelevant to my existence, well, that would be cool.

Why should I not expend my energy to the sin of intoxication as opposed to gay marriage? That has been more directly harmful to me in the past than homosexuality and it also has its Biblical support if I were to want to grind an ax.

[Sola_Fide]

^^^THIS!!!



Stop misrepresenting my position. Again, if you could grasp the level to which this issue is irrelevant to my existence, well, that would be cool.

Why should I not expend my energy to the sin of intoxication as opposed to gay marriage? That has been more directly harmful to me in the past than homosexuality and it also has its Biblical support if I were to want to grind an ax.

Great, I agree with you on that.

But take the politics, divorce, and government out of the equation for a second.

Is homosexuality wrong? Should a person encourage homosexuals to be in relationships with each other?

[acptulsa]

Great, I agree with you on that.

But take the politics, divorce, and government out of the equation for a second.

Why?

This thread is about government sanctioned, licensed marriage. It's about real things that affect real children of God. Why should we all help you hijack it?

You blather on about encouraging homosexuality. It does not to be encouraged. It has happened regularly since the beginning of time. Discouraging it does not stop it and encouraging it does not cause those who are disgusted by the thought of it to do it.

This is about government causing misery among God's children with their divorce lawyers, and their concerted efforts to destroy the family. And preservation of the family unit was, when I was young, the very reason no one wanted to entertain the notion of gay marriage, but wanted to resist it. But I have given you an opening to talk about it, and you will not do it. You want to distract form that important topic to talk about whether 'political liberty' (whatever that is) is an idol or not.

If you want people to reconsider their actions and consider your concerns with their actions, you do that by attracting them with your superior example. You don't do it by purposely making them miserable and telling them you're harassing them out of love and in the name of kindness.

[acptulsa]

Great, I agree with you on that.

But take the politics, divorce, and government out of the equation for a second.

Why?

This thread is about government sanctioned, licensed marriage. It's about real things that affect real children of God. Why should we all help you hijack it?

You blather on about encouraging homosexuality. It does not to be encouraged. It has happened regularly since the beginning of time. Discouraging it does not stop it and encouraging it does not cause those who are disgusted by the thought of it to do it.

This is about government causing misery among God's children with their divorce lawyers, and their concerted efforts to destroy the family. And preservation of the family unit was, when I was young, the very reason no one wanted to entertain the notion of gay marriage, but wanted to resist it. But I have given you an opening to talk about it, and you will not do it. You want to distract form that important topic to talk about whether 'political liberty' (whatever that is) is an idol or not.

If you want people to reconsider their actions and consider your concerns with their actions, you do that by attracting them with your superior example. You don't do it by purposely making them miserable and telling them you're harassing them out of love and in the name of kindness.

[moostraks]

Great, I agree with you on that.

But take the politics, divorce, and government out of the equation for a second.

Is homosexuality wrong? Should a person encourage homosexuals to be in relationships with each other?

I have as much an opinion on it as I have on intoxication, as in I am a teetotaler. I have, in the distant past, heard arguments for total abstinence and recreational drinking, much as I have in the past heard arguments on homosexuality, both sides of the argument, in the distant past. I thought it was relevant to my faith to have an opinion. Then I thought about it for awhile and realized it was not relevant to me to do so as it just made me a judgemental ass.

You see, I don't drink because I dislike the taste of alcohol. So, go me? Um, no. I am just lucky not to have to deal with that issue and it is fairly irrelevant to my existence. That others, Christian and non-Christians alike, choose to justify their choice to drink alcohol when others wish to make it an issue of faith, well, I just find it a bit absurd and think that prohibition was evidence of the ineffectual use of government wrt the issue. Alcohol has an effect on society, yet, very few Christians make this an Armaggedon issue of dire importance, anymore that is, and so I feel Christians should see the current issue, with full confidence that His Will shall be done and we should Love others with the same mercy and acceptance we believe ourselves to be given.

[Eagles' Wings]

Alcohol has an effect on society, yet, very few Christians make this an Armaggedon issue of dire importance, anymore that is, and so I feel Christians should see the current issue, with full confidence that His Will shall be done and we should Love others with the same mercy and acceptance we believe ourselves to be given.

Moos, Christ is not loving and merciful to those who live in un-repentant sin. Check out King David, if you think otherwise. In your quest for peace and love, you seem blind to the Law. Without the Law, there is no Gospel. You are a smart woman. I hope you look into the distinction of Law and Gospel. Christians must have a greater resolve to keep God's commandments, as we recognize our utter dependence on the Lord for doing so.

[moostraks]

Moos, Christ is not loving and merciful to those who live in un-repentant sin. Check out King David, if you think otherwise. In your quest for peace and love, you seem blind to the Law. Without the Law, there is no Gospel. You are a smart woman. I hope you look into the distinction of Law and Gospel. Christians must have a greater resolve to keep God's commandments, as we recognize our utter dependence on the Lord for doing so.

Right. And only He has the strength to help anyone once they are convinced of their particular sins by the Spirit. It isn't a matter of being blind to the Law as finding it an irrelevant issue to my particular path in life. Were I to find myself craving alcohol, then I would likely revisit that specific issue as it would be relevant to my spiritual path, and I would move forward, prayerfully, with trust in His guidance.

[Biblefundyfun]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFB1fdIMafQ

Peace people, yes peace, little white turtle doves of religious peace to you all . Oh and unquenchable gaiety