Rand's WSJ Op-Ed: Blow Up the Tax Code and Start Over

[LibertyExtremist]

I would prefer blow up the tax code and then stop there. Hey, I can dream right?

[fisharmor]

Where can I find out more about this plan? Is there any more?
Does anyone else realize that a "simple" 14.5% here is anything but simple?

The first video posted by Barrex specifically mentions eliminating employee-paid FICA taxes. That's not in the text.
Can I assume that the 14.5% will be the only deduction on my paycheck?
Does it follow then that he's proposing we also eliminate medicare/medicaid payroll deductions, and roll that into the one rate?

If the first $50k is not taxed, does that mean I get a GIGANTIC refund in April now, since I have a mortgage and give charitably?
In order not to tax the first $50k they're either
1) going to not withhold for the first part of the year, meaning that after I hit $50k I will start having withholdings, which I am totally not cool with, or
2) they're going to have to charge 14.5% all year, and if I have (for example) a $60k salary they'll have to withhold $8700. But 14.5% of the taxable revenue is only $1450, so they'll have to refund me a whopping $7250, which they've drawn interest on all year instead of me doing it.

Except.... this is not qualified.

deductions except for a mortgage

Mortgage.... what? Mortgage payments, or mortgage interest?
If it's mortgage payment, I mean, holy $#@!, I could make $90k in one year, I could totally live off of $50k, and then I'd be putting $40k per year into mortgage payments!
If it's just interest, then that's a whole lot of complication and reporting and accountancy job program built into the system.
In either case, that gigantic refund is getting even bigger!!!

More to the point, how is mortgage anything actually pro-growth? He sounds like he's against creating unnecessary accountancy jobs, but what do YOU call it if you're encouraging people never to pay off their mortgages? I call that a lot of accountancy job creation and not a whole lot of increase of standard of living for the rest of us.

And how about medical deductions? Rand, you wanna clarify that please? There are a lot of people out there who recognize that a large chunk of the problem with our medical system is exactly that true costs are obscured and therefore spiral out of control, and it's all because employers are offering tax-free medical programs as incentives to work for them.
You wanna maybe point out that all that goes away the minute you stop allowing us to deduct medical expenses? I think that's kind of important! You can either phrase it in libertarian terms (that in the long run costs go down and quality of care goes up).... OR, you can allow your enemies to phrase the argument, and it's going to go exactly like this: "RAND WANTS TO TAKE AWAY YOUR EMPLOYER-SUBSIDIZED MEDICAL CARE!!!!"

[jllundqu]

Rand should also propose removing all withholding requirements and make the tax bill due the day before election day.

I've always supported this idea! Man, people would be a LOT more attentive to government pigs if they were forced to pay the bill themselves...

[RabbitMan]

Watch 2 videos:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ

Ugh, not a huge fan of what Rand proposed in the second video. Why didn't he just stop with the first populist one?

[Sam I am]

I like the idea of simplifying the tax code, but What I really don't want to see is for the government revenue to go down while the government spending stays the same. Cutting $2 billion from the amount we spend is going to be a hard sell, especially considering that the main objective of the single most powerful lobbyist group is to keep medicare and social security around.

[helmuth_hubener]

Rand should also propose removing all withholding requirements and make the tax bill due the day before election day.

How about the day after?

[CaptUSA]

Libertarian thought process defined:

OMG SECOND ONE IS AWESOME


RAND 2016 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ugh, not a huge fan of what Rand proposed in the second video. Why didn't he just stop with the first populist one?

[Occam's Banana]

Ugh, not a huge fan of what Rand proposed in the second video.

So ... you're saying you want Rand to make you cry, say goodbye, tell a lie and hurt you ... ?

[fisharmor]

Libertarian thought process defined:

I dunno, I like how libertarians generally click through and become at least familiarized with what the actual argument is.
Personally, I think the second video epitomizes libertarian society. A statist system would not - could not - produce a video of such caliber, and bestow on it such lasting utility.

[PierzStyx]

Well, this is better than the current model. 14.5% would eliminate loopholes. It has a lot to mollify liberals as well. The rich almost never pay the full 35%. Mitt Romney only paid about 13% during the last Presidential Circus. This would make him, and others like him, pay a higher amount, period. Plus, and this is a HUGE thing, the first $50,000 would be tax free, which would mean most people in the country wouldn't pay any taxes. For conservatives, the cut in corporate taxes, payroll taxes, capital gains taxes, death taxes, income taxes, etc. is a huge boon for personal and economic prosperity. So, yes. Much better than the current model.

That said, the only fair tax is his father's proposed flat taxes of 0-0-0.

[jtap]

Funny to hear the "point five" that was obviously recorded in different settings and spliced in and doesn't fit at all. I hate seeing (hearing) such amateurish video editing and production. For me it distracts a bit and makes me wonder what level of people he has working for him. The message is great though it leaves many questions.

[jllundqu]

So ... you're saying you want Rand to make you cry, say goodbye, tell a lie and hurt you ... ?

I'm soooo confused.... the second video is a $#@!ty 80s music cover video.... Did I miss something?

[Sola_Fide]

I would prefer blow up the tax code and then stop there. Hey, I can dream right?

Me too.

[Barrex]

I'm soooo confused.... the second video is a $#@!ty 80s music cover video.... Did I miss something?

You need to watch carefully. Rand is there.


Also:

"blow it up", "put a stake through it"... very aggressive for someone who is advocating non-aggression.

[r3volution 3.0]

I've been waiting for Rand to go hardcore fiscal conservative for months (since he's been focusing instead on other issues recently), because this is where he really distinguishes himself from the others in a way that most resonates with the primary voters (and because it's the issue I personally think is most important). And Rand did not disappoint!

[garyallen59]

Beck and company were drooling over Rand's tax plan today. Pat the one who usually hates on Rand said it made him want to leave the radio show and work to get Rand elected like Kibbe. Pretty good stuff.

[RichardAlpert]

this is a very nice move by the campaign! well-played

[francisco]

Rand should also propose removing all withholding requirements and make the tax bill due the day before election day.

Ooooooh I Like this idea! +rep

Oops, out of rep--I already gave rep for posting the op-ed in the first place!

Can someone please cover?

BTW, there was a positive news article about Rand's tax plan in the WSJ. Hopefully this gets a lot of traction.

[puppetmaster]

I approve. Never perfect but so much better. Imagine millions of people with a bunch more take home pay...that is a huge benefit to the economy.

[Michael Landon]

Ooooooh I Like this idea! +rep

Oops, out of rep--I already gave rep for posting the op-ed in the first place!

Can someone please cover?

Done.

- ML

[Sola_Fide]

Rand should also propose removing all withholding requirements and make the tax bill due the day before election day.

If that ever happened there would be revolt in this country. The elites would never let it happen.

[WD-NY]

Beck and company were drooling over Rand's tax plan today. Pat the one who usually hates on Rand said it made him want to leave the radio show and work to get Rand elected like Kibbe. Pretty good stuff.

YouTubes or it didn't happen!

[Jamesiv1]

How to be like Rand Paul:

1. Kick ass
2. Take names later

[eleganz]

Glenn says Rand has the best platform on the IRS out of every single candidate.

[georgiaboy]

I want to see someone actually blow up 70,000 pages of tax code.

C'mon, youtubers!

A box of copy paper is 5k sheets (10 reams @ 500 sheets/ream), so 14 boxes for 70k pages. Easy-peasy.

[Jackie Moon]

[harikaried]

Does it follow then that he's proposing we also eliminate medicare/medicaid payroll deductions, and roll that into the one rate?

The text says it eliminates the payroll tax, so that's the 6.2% for social security and 1.45% for Medicare (for the employee). This is one of the main differentiators of this plan compared to other flat tax proposals. Eliminating the payroll tax and the first $50k income exemption are what benefits the median US household, which has an income around $50k. This means that median household pays $0 taxes based on income with this plan compared to roughly $6200 (12% of income) currently. This is a 100% savings on income taxes.

Here's various savings based on some income amounts:

$25k income: 8% taxes now, 0% taxes with Rand = 100% saving
$50k income: 12% taxes now, 0% taxes with Rand = 100% saving
$75k income: 16% taxes now, 5% taxes with Rand = 69% saving
$100k income: 18% taxes now, 7% taxes with Rand = 59% saving
$125k income: 20% taxes now, 9% taxes with Rand = 56% saving
$150k income: 21% taxes now, 10% taxes with Rand = 54% saving
$175k income: 22% taxes now, 10% taxes with Rand = 53% saving
$200k income: 23% taxes now, 11% taxes with Rand = 52% saving

In order not to tax the first $50k they're either
1) going to not withhold for the first part of the year, meaning that after I hit $50k I will start having withholdings, which I am totally not cool with, or
2) they're going to have to charge 14.5% all year, and if I have (for example) a $60k salary they'll have to withhold $8700. But 14.5% of the taxable revenue is only $1450, so they'll have to refund me a whopping $7250, which they've drawn interest on all year instead of me doing it.

There won't be much change in how much is withheld each paycheck in that employers already handle exemptions/deductions based on the allowances people file on their W-4. I.e., there will not be a jump in take home pay because each paycheck's withholding already factors in the "first $50k tax free."

[FreedomProsperityPeace]

I've been waiting for Rand to go hardcore fiscal conservative for months (since he's been focusing instead on other issues recently), because this is where he really distinguishes himself from the others in a way that most resonates with the primary voters (and because it's the issue I personally think is most important). And Rand did not disappoint!

Exactly. This is what I've wanted, as well. It seems to be working...lots of excitement and positivity already from the announcement. He should keep it up!

[Brian4Liberty]

Zero income tax would be preferable, but Rand's plan is the best one proposed at the moment.

All deductions except for a mortgage and charities would be eliminated. The first $50,000 of income for a family of four would not be taxed. For low-income working families, the plan would retain the earned-income tax credit.

Mortgage? Banking interests already have an exemption? This is why flat and simple always devolves into what we have today. More and more exceptions for powerful special interests.

And over at the New York Times, they are already screaming that they need more deductions:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/19/up...-its-name.html

[r3volution 3.0]

Mortgage? Banking interests already have an exemption?

It's not for the bankers, it's for the mortgagees (who vote, you know). That deduction is extremely popular.