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Thread: Ted Cruz poopstorm on FR (TPP)

  1. #1

    Ted Cruz poopstorm on FR (TPP)

    Cruz just lost me!


    2 posted on 6/11/2015, 9:26:36 PM by Mollypitcher1 (I have not yet begun to fight....John Paul Jones)
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    He is doing the RINO rounds.

    I'm betting he won't go near Mark Levin right now.

    Levin would give him Hell over giving more power to Obama.

    7 posted on 6/11/2015, 9:31:05 PM by P-Marlowe (Saying that ISIL is not Islamic is like saying Obama is not an Idiot.)
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    Cruz is busy going DC bush.... No other way to hope to win the nomination.


    11 posted on 6/11/2015, 9:33:37 PM by Paladin2 (Ive given up on aphostrophys and spell chek on my current device...)

    I’ve been a Cruz guy, have Cruz sticker on my car, on my shoppe window, on my wife’s car, and mention my enthusiasm for him on my FR profile page. But this is big and this is upsetting. Jeff Sessions is the worst public speaker in the Senate but he is sincere on this and Cruz appears too flippant. Cruz should look hard before he leaps again on this issue.

    When Cruz votes for this abolish-the-borders bill, he loses me.


    20 posted on 6/11/2015, 9:39:08 PM by Arthur McGowan
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    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/ne...ts?q=1&;page=1



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  3. #2
    LOL! This is Ted's "oops" moment.

  4. #3
    Cruz and Walker's decision to support Obamatrade can only be because their donors support it.

    I haven't been following this, but I hope Paul is against it. Would be a fantastic opening.

  5. #4
    Ted posted on Facebook about it, the comments are not happy.

    https://www.facebook.com/tedcruzpage...type=2&theater
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It's a balance between appeasing his supporters, appeasing the deep state and reaching his own goals.
    ~Resident Badgiraffe




  6. #5
    There may be valid reasons to oppose this trade deal from a libertarian perspective, but the large amount of protectionist rhetoric that I'm hearing from libertarians and even many conservatives is concerning. Should libertarians oppose free trade among the states as well? There may be valid libertarian reasons to oppose this deal such as the loss of U.S sovereignty, but one of those reasons shouldn't be "concern over job losses" in the United States. Ted Cruz is more libertarian on this issue than those who oppose free trade agreements for protectionist reasons.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Brett85 View Post
    There may be valid reasons to oppose this trade deal from a libertarian perspective, but the large amount of protectionist rhetoric that I'm hearing from libertarians and even many conservatives is concerning. Should libertarians oppose free trade among the states as well? There may be valid libertarian reasons to oppose this deal such as the loss of U.S sovereignty, but one of those reasons shouldn't be "concern over job losses" in the United States. Ted Cruz is more libertarian on this issue than those who oppose free trade agreements for protectionist reasons.
    It's not about free trade. Other free trade deals aren't purely about free trade but this one is even worse. This so called 'trade deal' is much more. This deal turns the ability of states to enact laws as they wish. This deal also makes the taxpayers of said states liable for damages to international businesses for a loss of revenue that they perceive from those laws. At least that's what I got from reading the available media.

    So why wouldn't conservatives be against this as well ? Liberals and progressives even.
    "I am a bird"

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by luctor-et-emergo View Post
    It's not about free trade. Other free trade deals aren't purely about free trade but this one is even worse. This so called 'trade deal' is much more. This deal turns the ability of states to enact laws as they wish. This deal also makes the taxpayers of said states liable for damages to international businesses for a loss of revenue that they perceive from those laws. At least that's what I got from reading the available media.

    So why wouldn't conservatives be against this as well ? Liberals and progressives even.
    As I said, if that's true than that is concerning, and that seems to be a valid reason to be opposed to the TPP. I never said I was for it, but just that I don't like all of the comments I've read that oppose the TPP on protectionist grounds. If you read the comments on Cruz's Facebook page that William Tell posted, you will see some of those comments.

  9. #8
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    If Rand was stronger on ilegal immigration and the corporate malfeasance which accompanies it, he would be running away with this. It wouldn't even be close. The rest of the field is so meh.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Brett85 View Post
    As I said, if that's true than that is concerning, and that seems to be a valid reason to be opposed to the TPP. I never said I was for it, but just that I don't like all of the comments I've read that oppose the TPP on protectionist grounds. If you read the comments on Cruz's Facebook page that William Tell posted, you will see some of those comments.
    Maybe @William Tell is using tactics and language that those people can understand...
    "When a portion of wealth is transferred from the person who owns it—without his consent and without compensation, and whether by force or by fraud—to anyone who does not own it, then I say that property is violated; that an act of plunder is committed." - Bastiat : The Law

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  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by ClydeCoulter View Post
    Maybe @William Tell is using tactics and language that those people can understand...
    I just linked Ted Cruz official page. I haven't posted on it.

    If I did though, I would try to use tactics and language they understand.
    Last edited by William Tell; 06-12-2015 at 09:18 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It's a balance between appeasing his supporters, appeasing the deep state and reaching his own goals.
    ~Resident Badgiraffe




  13. #11
    From another thread. This was mentioned by Rep. Earl Blumenauer on C-Span today:

    Quote Originally Posted by tsai3904 View Post
    This is in the TPA bill:
    Section 908: Sets out U.S. policy identifying the importance of the bilateral U.S.-Israel trade relationship. This section states that among the principal U.S. trade negotiating objectives for trade agreements with foreign countries are to discourage actions to boycott, divest from, or sanction Israel. The section requires the President to report annually to Congress on politically motivated acts of boycott against, divestment from, and sanctions against Israel.
    Yippee! Free Trade!

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  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Brett85 View Post
    There may be valid reasons to oppose this trade deal from a libertarian perspective, but the large amount of protectionist rhetoric that I'm hearing from libertarians and even many conservatives is concerning. Should libertarians oppose free trade among the states as well? There may be valid libertarian reasons to oppose this deal such as the loss of U.S sovereignty, but one of those reasons shouldn't be "concern over job losses" in the United States. Ted Cruz is more libertarian on this issue than those who oppose free trade agreements for protectionist reasons.
    I don't think U.S. sovereignty is a libertarian concern.

  15. #13
    If the TPP brings about a net reduction in government interventions in the economy (in all likelihood it will end some and implement others, so these have to be weighed), then I'd be for it.

    Since we don't know for sure what the final details will be, I'm in favor of cautiously proceeding with the negotiations, and then judging the final deal on its merit (Congress will get to vote, contrary to some of the rhetoric going around).

    So, I disagree with Rand's opposition to TPA, but it's a point on which reasonable libertarians can disagree, and it is definitely working for Rand politically.
    Last edited by r3volution 3.0; 06-12-2015 at 04:35 PM.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    If the TPP brings about a net reduction in government interventions in the economy (in all likelihood it will end some and implement others, so these have to be weighed), then I'd be for it.

    Since we don't know for sure what the final details will be, I'm in favor of cautiously proceeding with the negotiations, and then judging the final deal on its merit.

    So, I disagree with Rand's opposition to TPA, but it's a point on which reasonable libertarians can disagree, and it is definitely working for Rand politically.
    Why? if TPA passes, Obama gets to negotiate. And then Congress only gets an up or down vote, and I believe without the normal required 2 3rds majority needed for actual admitted treaties. There is no cautious way to proceed. Congress should tell Obama to go stuff himself, and then come back with antreaty to vote on if he wants.

    You are essentially proposing they pass it to see what's in it, because once they give TPA authority its a done deal, just a matter of time.
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It's a balance between appeasing his supporters, appeasing the deep state and reaching his own goals.
    ~Resident Badgiraffe




  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Brett85 View Post
    As I said, if that's true than that is concerning, and that seems to be a valid reason to be opposed to the TPP. I never said I was for it, but just that I don't like all of the comments I've read that oppose the TPP on protectionist grounds. If you read the comments on Cruz's Facebook page that William Tell posted, you will see some of those comments.
    Did you see Massie's speech on the TPP? He said that American meat producers will not be allowed to put "Made in the USA" on their own products to differentiate them from meat products that come from other countries, which will go UN-labelled as such.
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  18. #16
    I'm loving it, seeing Cruz and his lemming-like followers caught in a poopstorm. Cognitive dissonance is a wonderful thing to behold!
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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    Why? if TPA passes, Obama gets to negotiate. And then Congress only gets an up or down vote, and I believe without the normal required 2 3rds majority needed for actual admitted treaties. There is no cautious way to proceed. Congress should tell Obama to go stuff himself, and then come back with a legit treaty to vote on if he wants.
    I don't see the problem with a simple majority vote sans amendments.

    You are essentially proposing they pass it to see what's in it, because once they give TPA authority its a done deal, just a matter of time.
    As you just said yourself, if/when TPA passes, TPP still has to receive a majority vote in both houses. So I don't know what you mean.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    You are essentially proposing they pass it to see what's in it, because once they give TPA authority its a done deal, just a matter of time.
    It's actually the exact opposite. TPA contains language forcing President Obama to publicly release the text of the deal two months before the deal is voted on. Without the TPA passing, President Obama would've had the authority to keep the deal a secret permanently and never allow Congress to see it before it was voted on.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    Why? if TPA passes, Obama gets to negotiate. And then Congress only gets an up or down vote, and I believe without the normal required 2 3rds majority needed for actual admitted treaties. There is no cautious way to proceed. Congress should tell Obama to go stuff himself, and then come back with antreaty to vote on if he wants.

    You are essentially proposing they pass it to see what's in it, because once they give TPA authority its a done deal, just a matter of time.
    "Fool me once, we won't get fooled again."

    How many times have we been through this? "We'll just pass this one little thing (cloture or some procedural vote) and then we'll really fight it tomorrow." Next thing you know, it's passed, and Boehner, McConnell and friends are saying "well, we tried to stop it", while Obama, Reid and Pelosi laugh.
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  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    If Rand was stronger on ilegal immigration and the corporate malfeasance which accompanies it, he would be running away with this. It wouldn't even be close. The rest of the field is so meh.
    Yep you're right. Trying to please the Silicon Valley big donor crowd on immigration has not helped Rand.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by William R View Post
    Yep you're right. Trying to please the Silicon Valley big donor crowd on immigration has not helped Rand.
    Maybe Rand just believes in liberty on the immigration issue.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Brett85 View Post
    Maybe Rand just believes in liberty on the immigration issue.
    Immigration and liberty?? Who are you kidding??

  26. #23
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  29. #25
    Lol, the mod there is attacking you as a Ron Paul supporter.
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It's a balance between appeasing his supporters, appeasing the deep state and reaching his own goals.
    ~Resident Badgiraffe




  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    Lol, the mod there is attacking you as a Ron Paul supporter.
    He's right. He is also an $#@!. Yep, Neil Stevens is the absolute worst.

    Almost every "Tech at Night" post he publishes (which no one reads) he includes a jab at Snowden for being a traitor.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    He's right. He is also an $#@!. Yep, Neil Stevens is the absolute worst.

    Almost every "Tech at Night" post he publishes (which no one reads) he includes a jab at Snowden for being a traitor.
    Yeah. I guess he doesn't have the power to ban you.
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It's a balance between appeasing his supporters, appeasing the deep state and reaching his own goals.
    ~Resident Badgiraffe




  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    Lol, the mod there is attacking you as a Ron Paul supporter.
    With Cruz's remarks and his supporters retaliation I don't see why that a bad thing. If one things for sure, Ron Paul was consistent and most would agree with him if it wasn't for that rascally media that everyone gets their infotainment from. But the more and more that the paid apologists point to the "Ron Paul" guy, with the backdrop of wishy washy politicians and an unhappy base makes the ideas that they attack more attractive. The only reason I looked into Ron Paul more was because everyone else was attacking him, especially his own party. It's like the establishment knew he'd start a brush fire. And they were right. Rand is just the continuation of Rons campaign with better camouflage. They know this as well. And they're right.
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  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    If Rand was stronger on ilegal immigration and the corporate malfeasance which accompanies it, he would be running away with this. It wouldn't even be close. The rest of the field is so meh.
    Or we could advocate the government follow Romans 13:4 and only criminalize things that are sinful
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  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by William R View Post
    Immigration and liberty?? Who are you kidding??
    Immigration is very much a part of liberty. You wouldn't be here if your ancestors hadn't been allowed to immigrate to this country centuries ago.

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