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Thread: Judge Andrew Napolitano: Mass Surveillance Will Continue Even Without PATRIOT Act Section 215

  1. #1

    Judge Andrew Napolitano: Mass Surveillance Will Continue Even Without PATRIOT Act Section 215

    Video at link...

    Judge Andrew Napolitano: Mass Surveillance Will Continue Even Without PATRIOT Act Section 215

    Privacy advocates looking forward to an end of the Unites States government’s mass surveillance program due to the looming sunset of PATRIOT Act section 215 may do well to shelve their Champagne bottles. Judge Andrew Napolitano, in a Fox News interview on Wednesday, presented his grim assessment that the US National Security Agency (NSA) snooping would continue even absent the section 215 authority.

    Napolitano, a Ron Paul Institute Advisory Board member, says in the interview that the US government is lying to the American people with the claim that the mass surveillance would be suspended upon the expiration of the PATRIOT Act provision used to justify the mass surveillance program. Instead, Napolitano explains the snooping will continue reliant on two other legal justifications. Napolitano states:

    There are two other provisions in the law that the NSA relies on which will cause it to continue to spy on Americans even if section 215 of the PATRIOT Act does expire. One of those is a section of the FISA law called section 702, and one of them is a still-existing executive order signed by President George W. Bush in the fall or 2001, which has not been tinkered with, interfered with, or rescinded.

    Watch here Napolitano’s full explanation as well as a passionate concluding commentary by show host Shepard Smith:


    Meanwhile, the potential of section 215 of the PATRIOT Act expiring is being used to push through the US Congress the USA FREEDOM Act that will give the mass surveillance program a new legal framework just as the old legal framework provided in the PATRIOT Act is coming under greater judicial scrutiny.

    The “reform” USA FREEDOM Act (act two of PATRIOT Act sponsor Rep. Jim Sensenbrenner (R-WI)) has passed in the House and is available for consideration in the Senate. But, the failure of the new bill to end or even significantly restrict the mass spying program has become increasingly evident. If Congress does not send to President Barack Obama the USA FREEDOM Act in its current form or a simple extension of set to expire PATRIOT Act provisions soon, expect an effort to quickly push through Congress a “new and improved” USA FREEDOM Act.

    There will be much bluster about an “improved” USA FREEDOM ACT — a pig with lipstick — striking the right balance to protect both liberty and security. But, as with the PATRIOT Act 14 years ago, national security state special interests will control the tinkering behind the scenes, and the American people will learn what was wrought only after the bill passes.

    Copyright © 2015 by RonPaul Institute. Permission to reprint in whole or in part is gladly granted, provided full credit and a live link are given.
    Please donate to the Ron Paul Institute
    http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archives...t-section-215/



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  3. #2
    I came here to post this very link. Great minds, great minds....

    (cant +rep you right now so i'll ask for an assist)

  4. #3
    Anybody surprised?

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by morfeeis View Post
    I came here to post this very link. Great minds, great minds....

    (cant +rep you right now so i'll ask for an assist)
    Glad to cover it for you.
    I have an autographed copy of Revolution: A Manifesto for sale. Mint condition, inquire within. (I don't sign in often, so please allow plenty of time for a response)

  6. #5
    Can we move to other means besides political then? I mean we are all sitting here admitting it wont be changed in this way, so what the $#@! are we doing?
    "One thing my years in Washington taught me is that most politicians are followers, not leaders. Therefore we should not waste time and resources trying to educate politicians. Politicians will not support individual liberty and limited government unless and until they are forced to do so by the people," says Ron Paul."

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by ZENemy View Post
    Can we move to other means besides political then? I mean we are all sitting here admitting it wont be changed in this way, so what the $#@! are we doing?
    carrying the false hope that at some point, the people with the power will get their fill and relax. we all know how this ends, we just hope it can be turned around at some point and even if that point isn't within our lifetime then all the better. The powerful will capture more power and one day the people not just us, but all people will have had enough and on that day true change will happen.

    Change only happens when the risk from that change is less painful than the current situation...

  8. #7
    This is what I already believed; they held that they could do this lawfully and secretly before they came up with the PATRIOT Act rationalization, so they will simply revert to that stance if Section 215 expires.

  9. #8
    We all knew this. The average american will not. They need a powerful figure like Napolitano to be told what to think. This is the completely corrupt US Govt we are talking about here: their Secrets have Secrets. Soon enough, all surveillance will be a Secret.
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.



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  11. #9
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    The Patriot Act didn't authorize what the NSA has been doing anyway, so why should they care if the Patriot Act were repealed? They do what they want to do without fear of prosecution.
    Citizen of Arizona
    @cleaner4d4

    I am a libertarian. I am advocating everyone enjoy maximum freedom on both personal and economic issues as long as they do not bring violence unto others.

  12. #10
    It's the idea of it. If the law is repealed then it shows that Americans want mass surveillance to end. If section 215 ends and.then Americans find out mass surveillance is still occurring then we can target the next part of the problem. Once we can get the ball rolling on stop this stuff then it.becomes easier to finally kill all of it.
    I am more and more convinced that man is a dangerous creature and that power, whether vested in many or a few, is ever grasping, and like the grave, cries, 'Give, give.'

    Abigail Adams

  13. #11
    Of course it will. We live in a nation of cowards and slaves.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by ZENemy View Post
    , so what the $#@! are we doing?
    Can't speak for everyone,, but I'm waiting for the inevitable.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  15. #13
    Of course it will. Do you really think the US government follows the law or tells us everything they do?

  16. #14
    I thought they claimed they had to already begin shutting down the program starting 7 days ago?

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Can't speak for everyone,, but I'm waiting for the inevitable.
    .... battering ram through the door?


    XNN
    "They sell us the president the same way they sell us our clothes and our cars. They sell us every thing from youth to religion the same time they sell us our wars. I want to know who the men in the shadows are. I want to hear somebody asking them why. They can be counted on to tell us who our enemies are but theyre never the ones to fight or to die." - Jackson Browne Lives In The Balance

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by ZENemy View Post
    Can we move to other means besides political then? I mean we are all sitting here admitting it wont be changed in this way, so what the $#@! are we doing?
    Just because it's destined to not work doesn't mean you don't try. Had Bonhoeffer spoken out on day 1 it would not have changed history, it would have changed him. We fight, and we fight to win; but we do not fight because we are guaranteed victory, we fight because fighting is the right thing to do. Maybe we win, probably we lose, but win or lose we make a big enough stink that they cannot shove us down the memory hole. Future generations may see that we went down, but they will know that we did not go down without a fight.

    We will probably lose, but we might just win, if we lose and I did nothing then I will hate the face that looks back at me in the mirror, and if we win and I did nothing I will be utterly ashamed at the man that I failed to be.

    By doing...something...I will win even if we lose. The indomitable spirit of man will, inevitably stand up and stand out even if he stands alone.

    I would rather live only a short time fighting tooth and nail for right and good, than to live a thousand years paying obeisance to evil.

    I will fight, not because fighting will ensure victory, I will fight because fighting is the right thing to do.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by ZENemy View Post
    Can we move to other means besides political then? I mean we are all sitting here admitting it wont be changed in this way, so what the $#@! are we doing?
    Encryption.

    lots of magazines come with dvds these days.
    thumb drives. Get the distributors to pre-instal a privacy toolkit on them.
    chain software - give 10 thumb drives or dvds to friends and strangers or just leave them in public places with a README saying make 10 copies and do the same.
    hold privacy workshops
    flyers brief breakdown of the problem and tiny urls to where to get the tools
    contact every journalist that has done an article on the issue, tell them its not shutting down and ask then to do a followup with pointers to encryption tools.

    basically put effort into piggybacking distribution networks to get the knowledge and tools out to the general public.

    -t

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by XNavyNuke View Post
    .... battering ram through the door?


    XNN
    That is one distinct possibility.

    I expect nothing but violence from Government.

    And eagerly await their inevitable end.

    Isaiah 27:1
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom



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