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Thread: Top federal court rules against NSA's phone records program

  1. #1

    Top federal court rules against NSA's phone records program

    documents at source
    http://thehill.com/policy/technology...st-nsa-program
    Top federal court rules against NSA's phone records program

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    By Julian Hattem - 05/07/15 09:25 AM EDT
    A federal court has decided that the National Security Agency’s (NSA) bulk, warrantless collection of millions of Americans’ phone records is illegal.
    The sweeping decision from the Second Circuit Court of Appeals on Thursday represents a major court victory for opponents of the NSA, and comes just as Congress begins a fight over whether to renew the underlying law used to justify the program.



    That program “exceeds the scope of what Congress has authorized,”


    Judge Gerard Lynch wrote on behalf of the three-judge panel.

    The law “cannot be interpreted in a way that defies [sic defines? - presence] any meaningful limit,” he added.

    Additionally, the government’s rationale behind the program represents “a monumental shift in our approach to combating terrorism,” which was not grounded in a clear explanation of the law.
    The Second Circuit’s decision provides the most significant legal blow to the NSA operations to date, and comes more than a year after a lower court called the program “almost-Orwellian” and likely unconstitutional. The appeals court did not examine the constitutionality of the surveillance program in its ruling on Thursday.
    The Second Circuit is just one of the three appeals courts examining challenges to the NSA’s phone records program, which may ultimately land at the Supreme Court.
    Section 215 of the Patriot Act authorizes the government to collect “any tangible things” that the government proves are “relevant to” an investigation into suspected terrorists.
    With the blessing of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court — the secretive federal court overseeing government intelligence operations — the government has interpreted that mandate to allow it to collect massive amounts of records containing “metadata” about people’s phone calls, including the numbers involved in the call and when it occurred.
    While seemingly benign, metadata can reveal “civil, political, or religious affiliations,” Lynch wrote, as well as personal behavior and “intimate relationships.”
    But that reading, the court ruled, is far beyond what Congress ever intended.
    “If the government is correct, it could use § 215 to collect and store in bulk any other existing metadata available anywhere in the private sector, including metadata associated with financial records, medical records, and electronic communications (including e‐mail and social media information) relating to all Americans,” Lynch wrote.
    “Such expansive development of government repositories of formerly private records would be an unprecedented contraction of the privacy expectations of all Americans.”
    Congress last reviewed the law in 2011, but even then many lawmakers were not aware of the details of the NSA’s bulk collection practices.
    Because most of the details were kept classified, “Congress cannot reasonably be said to have ratified a program of which many members of Congress – and all members of the public – were not aware,” Lynch wrote.
    That all changed two years ago, however, following revelations from Edward Snowden that detailed the expansive nature of the NSA’s surveillance.
    In the wake of those leaks, lawmakers including Rep, Jim Sensenbrenner (R-Wis.) — the original author of the Patriot Act — have made clear they never meant to authorize the NSA’s bulk phone collection program.
    They have attempted to rein in the agency by pushing legislation that would end its current collection practices and force it to request from private companies only a narrow set of phone records involved in a case. The debate is simmering in Congress, ahead of Section 215’s scheduled expiration at the end of the month.
    That debate may be more important than ever now, since the full details of the NSA phone program have been made public.
    If Congress chooses to reauthorize the existing law without change — as Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) and others want to do — it would likely be seen as a blessing to the current NSA program, the appeals court indicated.
    “If Congress chooses to authorize such a far‐reaching and unprecedented program, it has every opportunity to do so, and to do so unambiguously,” Lynch wrote. “Until such time as it does so, however, we decline to deviate from widely accepted interpretations of well‐established legal standards.”
    This story was updated at 10:25 a.m.

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  3. #2
    I'm confused.

    Didn't AF just post an article about how the judges ruled cops can get your phone records without a warrant now?

    If that's true why does it matter if the NSA can't?

    So an expendable bureaucracy can't "because we live under the constitution" but the boys in blue who are the front line supposedly for enforcing the constitution can do it whenever they want?

    Am I missing something?
    When a trumpet sounds in a city, do not the people tremble?
    When disaster comes to a city, has not the Lord caused it? Amos 3:6

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by wizardwatson View Post
    I'm confused.

    Didn't AF just post an article about how the judges ruled cops can get your phone records without a warrant now?

    If that's true why does it matter if the NSA can't?

    So an expendable bureaucracy can't "because we live under the constitution" but the boys in blue who are the front line supposedly for enforcing the constitution can do it whenever they want?

    Am I missing something?
    NSA won't need to collect anymore because they can get it directly from the carriers now.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by freejack View Post
    NSA won't need to collect anymore because they can get it directly from the carriers now.
    Basically, that.

    Don't try to tell me for one second that these clowns in gowns do not collude together.

    The one court knew this decision was coming, so they sidelined it in just the way you mentioned.

    NSA won't have to do the "collecting" anymore, that will be done by the "private" corporations running the network.

  6. #5

    Federal court rules that NSA surveillance program revealed by Edward Snowden is illegal - but

    Federal court rules that NSA surveillance program revealed by Edward Snowden is illegal - but doesn't shut it down

    By Francesca Chambers

    A federal appeals court said today that a National Security Agency program that collects bulk data from millions of Americans' phone calls was not authorized by the Patriot Act and is therefore illegal.

    The American Civil Liberties Union lawsuit contends that the NSA's mass surveillance program, revealed by Edward Snowden in 2013, violates the ban on warrantless searches under the Fourth Amendment of the U.S. Constitution.

    Judges on the 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals did not make a ruling on that front and did not issue an injunction against the program despite ruling it a violation of the law, preferring to let a congressional battle over its future play out first.

    Continued...
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  7. #6

    Court of Appeals Rules NSA Domestic Surveillance Program Illegal

    Washington, D.C. May 7, 2015. The Second Circuit Court of Appeals ruled today that the National Security Agency’s (NSA) telephone metadata collection program, which gathers up millions of phone records on an ongoing daily basis, is illegal.

    NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden first revealed documents confirming the illegal program’s existence in June of 2013.

    The government argued that it was authorized by the Patriot Act to secretly collect such data. Judge Gerard E. Lynch, writing for a three-judge panel, said the program “exceeds the scope of what Congress has authorized.” Lynch continued that the Patriot Act “cannot bear the weight the government asks us to assign to it, and that it does not authorize the telephone metadata program.”

    “Whether you supported or opposed Edward Snowden’s disclosure of this massive privacy violation committed by the NSA, the courts ruling today demonstrates the importance of whistleblowing,” stated Stephen M. Kohn, executive director of the National Whistleblower Center.

    “The First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution gives the American people the right to know about government misconduct. When our government is systemically violating the rights of its citizens, it often takes the courage of a whistleblower to alert the public to threats to our Liberty,” said Kohn.

    Full Article.
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  8. #7
    I think this is bad news.


    I'm concerned that Congress might now think that they don't have to change/fix/repeal the patriot act.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    I think this is bad news.


    I'm concerned that Congress might now think that they don't have to change/fix/repeal the patriot act.

    Can you shed some light on this? Can you share the opinion of your progressive colleagues on the "Patriot" Act? It seems like progressives were the ones against these government intrusions, especially in the 1960s-1970s. I know that libraries don't like this Act, but what about others in your progressive circles? Is this something that liberty people and progressives have in common, but maybe for different reasons?
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
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  11. #9
    Sure would be nice if there was some consistency. This story kind of conflicts with one that AF JUST POSTED YESTERDAY.

    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...hout-a-warrant

    I think there is more personal opinion (or bribery) in the U.S. court system's rulings than there are rulings based upon the Bill of Rights or even preceding rulings. One day they don't think phone use is protected. The next day another court says it is protected. They can listen to your conversations but they can't keep track of the number of conversations you have. Then it's, 'no, we can't listen to your conversations but we are allowed to see how often you use your phone.'

    What good is a court's ruling if it is changing every 5 minutes?
    Last edited by nobody's_hero; 05-08-2015 at 07:33 AM.
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    This is getting silly.
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    It started silly.
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  12. #10
    From article
    A federal court has decided that the National Security Agency’s (NSA) bulk, warrantless collection of millions of Americans’ phone records is illegal.
    How many perps were arrested and charged?
    Quote Originally Posted by BuddyRey View Post
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