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Thread: [Video] Judge Napolitano debates former NSA director Michael Hayden at CPAC 2015

  1. #1

    [Video] Judge Napolitano debates former NSA director Michael Hayden at CPAC 2015

    Last edited by jct74; 02-27-2015 at 03:21 PM.



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  3. #2
    It's pretty incredible. This discussion would not exist at all at CPAC 8-10 years ago, let alone with a largely pro-privacy crowd.
    Support Justin Amash for Congress
    Michigan Congressional District 3

  4. #3
    I've been looking to see if MOXNEWS had the tubes but I can't find any channel where he is currently uploading videos. Does anyone know his current channel or did he finally give up?

  5. #4
    Just a clip...


    Former NSA chief tries to claim he’s an “unrelenting libertarian”—CPAC’s reaction is priceless



    Former NSA chief Michael Hayden took to the stage at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) earlier today to debate Fox News personality Judge Andrew Napolitano over the government’s collection of metadata.
    “The judge is an unrelenting libertarian,” Hayden declared after Napolitano’s opening statement. “So am I.”
    The crowd immediately booed and several attendees shouted: “No you’re not!”
    Read more at http://rare.us/story/former-nsa-chie...x67VIf8l0zI.99

  6. #5

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    It's pretty incredible. This discussion would not exist at all at CPAC 8-10 years ago, let alone with a largely pro-privacy crowd.
    That's in part because 10 years ago Bush was still president. It's funny that it took a democrat in the whitehouse to all of a sudden make republicans skeptical again of government abuse of power.

    Please read: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...re-ambivalent/
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Suzanimal View Post
    Just a clip...

    Former NSA chief tries to claim he’s an “unrelenting libertarian”—CPAC’s reaction is priceless



    Read more at http://rare.us/story/former-nsa-chie...x67VIf8l0zI.99
    The Judge (and the Crowd)
    http://www.lewrockwell.com/lrc-blog/...and-the-crowd/

    Take down ex-Stasi chief.
    ‘No You’re Not!’ Former NSA Chief Heckled for Calling Himself a ‘Libertarian’ at CPAC
    http://www.mediaite.com/tv/no-youre-...arian-at-cpac/

    Hayden was at the conference for a debate with Fox News senior judicial analyst and staunch libertarian Judge Andrew Napolitano, moderated by FBN’s Lou Dobbs. After Napolitano implored the audience to be “outraged” by the National Security Agency’s widespread surveillance programs, first unearthed in 2012 by whistleblowers like Edward Snowden, Hayden stood up and said, “If NSA were even capable of doing what the judge has just outlined for you, we wouldn’t be having a debate here today. There would be nothing to argue about.”

    He continued: “Let’s talk about reality. Let’s talk about facts. The judge is an unrelenting libertarian.” That line drew large applause from an audience likely composed of many of the judge’s (and Sen. Rand Paul‘s) devoted fans. That fact would explain what happened next.

    “So am I,” Hayden claimed as the crowd booed. Several people shouted “No, you’re not!”

    “I’m an unrelenting libertarian,” Hayden insisted, “who’s also responsible for four decades of his life for another important part of [the Constitution], the part that says ‘provide for the common defense.’”

    Let this scribe settle the debate and definitively state for Hayden: No, you are not.
    Now the progs in the red jerseys are going to try to bastardize "libertarian" just like the progs in the blue jerseys bastardized "liberal."
    Based on the idea of natural rights, government secures those rights to the individual by strictly negative intervention, making justice costless and easy of access; and beyond that it does not go. The State, on the other hand, both in its genesis and by its primary intention, is purely anti-social. It is not based on the idea of natural rights, but on the idea that the individual has no rights except those that the State may provisionally grant him. It has always made justice costly and difficult of access, and has invariably held itself above justice and common morality whenever it could advantage itself by so doing.
    --Albert J. Nock

  9. #8
    here's the full video from the official CPAC channel



    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7D5IdDmLEo



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  11. #9
    General Hayden is a war criminal and should be, if Leavenworth is to remain open, at the very bottom of that penitentiary.
    “The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.” --George Orwell

    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    In terms of a full spectrum candidate, Rand is leaps and bounds above Trump. I'm not disputing that.
    Who else in public life has called for a pre-emptive strike on North Korea?--Donald Trump

  12. #10
    Judge calls him out on Ukraine. Awesome

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrooge McDuck View Post
    Judge calls him out on Ukraine. Awesome
    That was good. But I was a bit disappointed overall. Hayden got away with straight up lying. I wish this had been a larger panel discussion that included at least one whisteblower from the NSA or from a tech company. We've got hard evidence to prove that the NSA does more than just collect metadata. Even back in 2007 there was proof that the NSA was datamining content.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/homefront/view/
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  14. #12
    the Judge was way too graceful here.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    the Judge was way too graceful here.
    the judge should have stood over Hayden and said...''you like violence you motherfucker?''...here.....'slap'..!...''now whaddya gonna do pussy man?''...''hit me with your purse ya coward piece of $#@!''...

  16. #14
    The problem with these "discussions" is that we believe the other side to be criminals and tyrants. You can't have polite discussions with tyrants. We believe these people are evil, not "patriots". And they know this.

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    the Judge was way too graceful here.
    Quote Originally Posted by JK/SEA View Post
    the judge should have stood over Hayden and said...''you like violence you motherfucker?''...here.....'slap'..!...''now whaddya gonna do pussy man?''...''hit me with your purse ya coward piece of $#@!''...
    Quote Originally Posted by Sola_Fide View Post
    The problem with these "discussions" is that we believe the other side to be criminals and tyrants. You can't have polite discussions with tyrants. We believe these people are evil, not "patriots". And they know this.
    They should get Alex Jones next time.

    Seriously though, the problem wasn't that the judge was "too nice." The problem is that the judge let Hayden get away with lying and at the same time basically calling the judge a mistaken and the judges sources liars. Hayden was able to hide behind his credentials and say in effect "I know what we did and you don't nah nah boo boo." Our side needed at least one whistleblower to say "When I was at the NSA we actually listened to phone calls." Or the judge could have specifically brought up the PRISM documents that Snowden released. For Hayden to try to explain that away.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  18. #16
    I meant "gracious" not "graceful".... apologies.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst



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  20. #17
    The General is no Patriot. He is a Liar and a Traitor who if the People ever manage to restore the Constitution deserves a drumhead court-martial and the appropriate punishment for his Treason.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    I meant "gracious" not "graceful".... apologies.
    I read it as "gracious." My "this must be what you meant" translator was working fine. That said, the judge could have been just as gracious, but still nailed Hayden on the facts. The judge kept coming back to the theoretical "But where does it allow for that in the constitution" argument as opposed to "Can you explain the leaked PRISM document that says that you were scarfing up content or the ATT whistleblower from back in 2007 that showed that you were listening to phone calls back then or project Echelon where you allowed other countries to spy on Americans and they did the same in reverse? Oh, and I have all of the documentation. Lou, can you put this on the screen?"
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  22. #19
    Wow.... interesting debate. The Judge should not have let him stick to the "but but it's only metadata" meme. The whole world knows that the NSA is capable of and it sure as hell is more than just metadata.
    There are only two things we should fight for. One is the defense of our homes and the other is the Bill of Rights. War for any other reason is simply a racket.
    -Major General Smedley Butler, USMC,
    Two-Time Congressional Medal of Honor Winner
    Author of, War is a Racket!

    It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours.
    - Diogenes of Sinope

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by jllundqu View Post
    Wow.... interesting debate. The Judge should not have let him stick to the "but but it's only metadata" meme. The whole world knows that the NSA is capable of and it sure as hell is more than just metadata.
    Thank you! I was starting to think I was the only one that picked up on that. The judge started out with some pretty strong accusations, Hayden came back with "That's just not true" and Hayden's argument was allowed to go unchallenged. I do give the judge credit for calling Hayden out on the "56 terrorist threats were stopped" claim when it was only 3 and those 3 couldn't be articulated.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.



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