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Thread: The Slander of 'Blowback'

  1. #61
    Maybe you should actually read the Chalmers Johnson book.


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  3. #62
    To be fair, the case that the the author specifically mentions is one worth taking issue with. The Charlie Hebdo attacks weren't "blowback" in the way that Ron Paul likes to define it. It was murder by primitive savages who were offended over a drawing. Was it offensive? Sure, but that isn't reason to murder innocents. Ron shouldn't allow pieces like the one mentioned in the article be published under his name if he's serious about expanding the liberty movement beyond its niche audience. It does nothing to advance our cause and only hurts us amongst those who might be inclined to help us should Rand conquer the rest of the GOP field.

  4. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    If it were all simply about retaliation, then there wouldn't be a religious component.
    This just simply isn't true. Maybe (pretty much certainly) there is a religious driver behind the activities of radical Muslims, however this statement is a total non sequitur. The American revolutionaries were largely acting out of retaliation against the British, and there was an enormous religious component to the American Revolution.

  5. #64
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  7. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by NOVALibertarian View Post
    To be fair, the case that the the author specifically mentions is one worth taking issue with. The Charlie Hebdo attacks weren't "blowback" in the way that Ron Paul likes to define it. It was murder by primitive savages who were offended over a drawing. Was it offensive? Sure, but that isn't reason to murder innocents. Ron shouldn't allow pieces like the one mentioned in the article be published under his name if he's serious about expanding the liberty movement beyond its niche audience. It does nothing to advance our cause and only hurts us amongst those who might be inclined to help us should Rand conquer the rest of the GOP field.

    Actually there is evidence it was probably a false flag, but either way it would have had little to do with Hebdo's content, that was just an identifiable target. It was actually admitted by the killers that it had to do with France helping with the invasion of muslim countries.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
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  8. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by A Son of Liberty View Post
    The fail here is so catastrophically strong that it sent a ripple of stupid through the internet and gave me a nose bleed.

    This right here is why we are good and $#@!ed... because people like this are of the majority opinion in this "country". Ain't no election gonna un$#@! it, either.
    Its hard to undo the problem while you're perpetuating the problem. Which is why I don't agree with TaftFan.

    If you make a genuine attempt to fix the problem, and there are still people who want to kill you, sure, then you do what you have to do to DEFEND the US from attack, but even still without targeting innocents. But we haven't done anything close to that. We haven't (as a government) even offered to apologize, let alone pay restitution of any kind. Really, the US should send everyone who voted for the Iraq War to the Muslim world as a peace offering. Then, only then, could we really say we've done everything we can.

    I don't deny that there are a few people who would engage in terror attacks against the west no matter what, but the VAST majority of this nonsense is foreign policy related, and would probably change with our foreign policy.
    This post represents only the opinions of Christian Liberty and not the rest of the forum. Use discretion when reading

  9. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFanatic View Post
    Its hard to undo the problem while you're perpetuating the problem. Which is why I don't agree with TaftFan.

    If you make a genuine attempt to fix the problem, and there are still people who want to kill you, sure, then you do what you have to do to DEFEND the US from attack, but even still without targeting innocents. But we haven't done anything close to that. We haven't (as a government) even offered to apologize, let alone pay restitution of any kind. Really, the US should send everyone who voted for the Iraq War to the Muslim world as a peace offering. Then, only then, could we really say we've done everything we can.

    I don't deny that there are a few people who would engage in terror attacks against the west no matter what, but the VAST majority of this nonsense is foreign policy related, and would probably change with our foreign policy.
    It's not like it's a new concept. Been around since about 380AD. These idiots in power have no excuse for not understanding it. Least of all anybody claiming to be a Christian. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just_war_theory

  10. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    I don't think you read what I posted.

    Blowback causes many to radicalize. I completely acknowledge that. But it isn't the cause of violent, radical Islam itself. If it were all simply about retaliation, then there wouldn't be a religious component.

    Blowback from interventionism didn't create Sharia law. Radical, violent Islamic terrorism predated the United States.
    This is so full of fail it's not even funny. Mosaic law created Sharia law and the law of Moses was in many respects more brutal than the law of Mohammed. That said, if you're talking about Charlie Hebdo, the killer was a Muslim before he became radicalized. He didn't become radicalized, as per the official story, until he saw the Abu Ghraib photos. And the Mohammed as a gay porn star cartoons of Charlie Hebdo are similar to the gay pyramid photos of Abu Ghraib. So if the analogy in the OP as accurate it would say "Uncle of kid A rapes mother of kid B and then kid A says kid B's mother is a whore."
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  11. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    Is ^that all you learned from Michael Scheuer? Did you miss this?

    http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/arch...-are-blowback/
    Michael Scheuer: Hollande, like Cameron, like Obama, like Bush, wants to keep a lid on the fact that we're at war with these people and they're responding to what we do and not who we are.

    Edit: And it seems you lack the intelligence to understand what Scheuer is saying. If war is your only answer then you have to be willing to kill pretty much everybody. That doesn't mean that war is the answer though or that even if you are willing to pull out all stops wantonly kill that you will win. The Soviet Union was willing to kill as many people as needed to win in Afghanistan. They still lost.

    Edit 2: Guess what's at the front page of Scheuer's website non-intervention.com? The Paris attacks are blowback!

    http://non-intervention.com/1475/on-...ill-only-grow/
    On Paris: The cost of Western leaders’ deceit and interventionism will only grow
    By MIKE | Published: JANUARY 12, 2015
    “We are gathered here tonight because we believe in an independent destiny for America. … An independent destiny for America means … that our soldiers will not have to fight everybody in the world who prefers some other system of life to ours.” Colonel Charles A. Lindbergh, 23 May 1941

    Media commentary on the well-planned, professionally executed, and completely successful mujahedin operation in Paris is really quite quaint. Listened to closely, the ponderously somber pundits will have you thinking that it is September, 2001, rather than January, 2015. The canned, 15-year old comments and questions flow freely: “Horrific attack kills 12 innocents”; “the attackers have nothing to do with Islam”; “how are the young men radicalized?”; “an attack on freedom”; “Muslims must condemn the attacks”; “we are not at war with Islam”; “why this senseless violence?”; and, of course, the maddeningly absurd and irrelevant “we will bring them to justice”.

    Fortunately, just before this tripe put listeners to sleep, the prize jackass of the week trotted on stage in the person of Canada’s prime minister, Stephen Harper.
    “The fact of the matter is this, ladies and gentlemen,” Mr. Harper told a small audience, “The international jihadist movement has declared war.” Here, then, is one of the main reasons why the West has gotten its collective behind so regularly kicked, humiliated, and defeated since 2001. An important NATO leader, Mr. Harper seems not to know — even though the fine Canadian army along with all NATO militaries were defeated in Afghanistan — that the jihadists declared war on the United States and its vassals in August, 1996. Harper’s ignorance is important because it reminds all Westerners how hard it will be to survive the war the Islamists are waging against them when their leaders are just beginning to think there might be a war at hand fifteen years after the enemy began to fight it in earnest.

    The inane gabfest over the Paris attacks will end in a few days and nothing much will change — at least for the Islamists. Western leaders will continuing to thunder about the rule of law, the peacefulness of Islam, the protection of freedom of the press, but will scurry to avoid doing anything that will destroy the enemy in numbers that have any strategic impact whatsoever. They will savor and gloat over the fact that it only took 90,000 French police and military personnel to kill three Islamist shooters. They held an impromptu summit of senior officials to condemn terrorism and have set another, both will promise “unity and future action.” And they will publicly beg the Arab tyrants to do the dirty work they are too embarrassed or cowardly to let their own military and intelligence services do. And, of course, the public purse will be robbed by the whores who masquerade as social science professors. The will descend on Western capitals armed with quack answers about how to solve “the Islamic radicalization of youth,” and legislators will give them gobs of tax dollars just so they appear to be doing something. The sum of all of this will be what it has been since 2001: motion without movement.

    The substantive post-Paris changes from Western leaders will come when they inevitably enhance the war they are already waging against their own people and their peoples’ civil liberties, rather than by ordering the hugely expensive Western militaries to annihilate the Islamists, their civilian supporters and funders, and whatever infrastructure they possess. Because it is so utterly unfashionable to kill in the necessary numbers those who are killing you, perpetual adolescents like Obama, Harper, Cameron, Hollande, Merkel, and their colleagues will increase surveillance of their own civilians, their communications, and their bank accounts; make international air travel more intrusive and arduous; and work overtime to silence and/or penalize those citizens who speak the simple, irrefutable fact that an increasing part of Islam is at war with the West, and that that war is motivated not by Western lifestyles but by what Western governments do in the Muslim world — be it invading Muslim countries, coddling Israel, or championing those who blaspheme the Prophet.

    In many ways, the Islamists are the Western leaders’ best friends in that they give them credible reasons to progressively eliminate civil liberties and continue building the authoritarian states many of them seem to desire. Obama, in particular, is likely to take advantage of the Paris attacks to further savage the 1st and 4th Amendments of the Constitution. And it will not be long before Obama and his pro-tyranny sidekicks in both parties undertake a renewed campaign to gut the 2nd Amendment, probably claiming that the national government needs to control all arms so that domestic Islamists — or those who come in across the open southern border — cannot assemble an arsenal to use in attacks.

    [NB: For two reasons, I think that seldom in American history has it been more important for every American to be armed, and armed with as deadly a weapon (or weapons) as possible. First, as the Paris attack shows, the cowardly refusal of the French and all other NATO regimes to militarily eradicate the Islamists abroad wherever they can be found means more and more attacks in NATO countries. The attacks will occur not because of George W. Bush's nonsensical argument that if we do not kill them overseas we will have to fight them at home -- those who attack at home will have been residents most or all of their lives -- but because Washington and its NATO partners have deliberately lost wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. Young Muslims believe Allah has given Islam victory in both places, and, as Osama bin Laden predicted, they are following the strong horse. American citizens need weapons to provide the protection against domestic Islamists for themselves, their families, and their neighborhoods that the national government deems unimportant. Second, if Obama sends his Islam-loving multicultural thugs to unconstitutionally do an inventory of privately held weapons or even to take the guns of law-abiding Americans they merit a heartily discouraging welcome from well-armed Americans.]

    There really is not much more to say about the Paris attacks except that Western leaders and their acolytes in the media and churches will keep lying to their public about the Islamist issue. When you hear those lies and the asinine comments and questions mentioned in the first paragraph, there are five simple facts to keep in mind as a defense against the lethal deceit that dominates the current public debate.

    –1.) An increasing portion of the Islamic world is waging war against the West; most of the Islamists who are fighting are adherents of the Salafi sect of Sunni Islam, which is a small but growing, martially inclined, and admired sect that has declared a defensive jihad against the U.S.-led West. On the basis of these facts, it is suicidal madness to pretend that the West is not engaged in a religious war.

    –2.) The reformation that the West is urging on the Muslim world is already underway, but it is not a reformation that will be to Western liking. The message delivered by Osama bin Laden and his successors that the most basic relationship in Islam is between the individual Muslim and Allah without an intermediary is obviously gaining ground across the Muslim world. Part of this success is due to the example of bin Laden and the victorious mujahedin, but most of it is due to the recognition by Muslims that the religious scholars who work for Arab governments are on the take, and that they will deliver religious decisions in whatever form their tyrant-employer desires so as not to lose the wealth, position, and status and they have won by selling out their faith. In this aspect, the current Islamic Reformation mirrors in content and violence the Protestant Reformation that occurred in the West.

    –3.) Most of those mujahedin who attack inside Western countries will be residents of those countries. Responsibility for facilitating this phenomena lies strictly with Western governments that for forty years have championed the immigration of foreigners who never intend to assimilate, and who in some cases mean to harm the nation to which they have immigrated. This intent to harm clearly increases with each generation that is born in the country of immigration. This sort of society-killing multiculturalism has been worsened and made unmanageable by the open borders specialized in by the U.S. and the European Community governments.

    –4.) The worldwide Islamist insurgency that the West confronts is not susceptible to defeat by a combination of law enforcement methods, Special Forces, and intelligence operations, or by a coalition of Western nations and Arab tyrannies. The first three tools might have been decisive in the late 1990s, but President Clinton refused to use them and let the Islamist problem strengthen and mature. It is now much, much too late to successfully employ these methods as war winners because the enemy is simply too numerous, well-armed, and geographically dispersed; using them today, as I have said before, is like trying to destroy the Wehrmacht one man at a time. The last-mentioned coalition is, on its face, a huge and cynical joke. The West is looking for others to do their war fighting, and the Arab tyrants will not risk internal revolution by seriously injuring the mujahedin, who are fueled by money, volunteers, and prayers from the tyrannies. Indeed, the Saudis and their Gulf partners are experts in the exact opposite of the kind of coalition being called for by the West. In the case of Iraq, the West has on three occasions provided blond, blue-eyed slave soldiers to protect the tyrants by fighting and dying there, while the tyrants have kicked in a few bucks and continued their debauchery while joining the mujahedin in laughing at the fools in Washington, London, Berlin, and Paris.

    –5.) The bipartisan, interventionist foreign policy of the United States is today, as it was when bin Laden declared war on America in 1996, the main motivator — along with the West’s relentless military fecklessness — of the Islamist insurgency. Washington’s steady support for Arab tyrannies and the re-installation of one in Egypt; its unnecessary, corrupt, and dead Americans-causing relationship with Israel; and its willingness to invade Muslim countries at the drop of a hat make Washington — next to Allah — the only indispensable ally of the mujahedin. This reality all but ensures the inevitable demise of Western liberties. Western leaders are too cowardly to kill the Islamists and their supporters in the extraordinary numbers that now will be necessary to achieve victory, and yet they will continue to intervene militarily and culturally in the Muslim world and so motivate ever greater number of mujahedin to join the fight. Given this combination, Western leaders, in the name of defense, will crackdown on the liberties of their own citizens while the Islamist grow ever stronger.

    When reviewing the five facts above, and knowing that each of them is fully substantiated in public, not secret sources, one can only conclude that Western leaders are pursuing their own political agendas, following the dictates of ruinous theories like multiculturalism, diversity, and uncontrolled borders and immigration, and hold in contempt the clear national interests of the nations they were chosen to govern. “Which is more blameworthy,” George Washington asked a correspondent in 1790, “those who see and steadily pursue their interest, or those who cannot see, or seeing will not act wisely?” The West today, sadly, is dangerously afflicted with both men and women in governing positions who – unless they are stupid — can easily see their nation’s interests but “will not act wisely.”
    Last edited by jmdrake; 01-23-2015 at 01:50 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  12. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by NOVALibertarian View Post
    To be fair, the case that the the author specifically mentions is one worth taking issue with. The Charlie Hebdo attacks weren't "blowback" in the way that Ron Paul likes to define it. It was murder by primitive savages who were offended over a drawing. Was it offensive? Sure, but that isn't reason to murder innocents. Ron shouldn't allow pieces like the one mentioned in the article be published under his name if he's serious about expanding the liberty movement beyond its niche audience. It does nothing to advance our cause and only hurts us amongst those who might be inclined to help us should Rand conquer the rest of the GOP field.
    It hurts only to the extent it is the wrong or insufficient response to the pro-war/pro-intervention mindset. Raising the issue of blowback is important and does indeed advance the liberty cause, but it is inadequate to confront the war mentality. That mindset is an emotional or attitudinal one, not a logical argument, that must be answered with a counter attitude. The interventionists believe "we are under threat" by parties who are organically motivated to violence because of animal hatred, independent of the overt policy of the US or Western governments. Our counter should be, no, we're being lied to again, this incident is another false flag operation.

    The truth is, the prime motivators for the violence are the COVERT activities of those powers, which are performed to artificially generate attacks that look like they are hate-inspired, but are in fact designed to create or sustain that meme, so as to justify the overt policy of endless intervention. The Hebdo attacks were NEITHER the result of simple "blowback," or "murder by savages," they were well organized provocateur campaigns by sleeper intelligence assets, whose job was to shift French policy and opinion (which was leaning more towards Palestine) back in line with that of the US and Israel.

    According to the Daily Mail, the attackers had RPGs, a restricted and pricey military weapon common Muslim laborers would not be able to get without military connections (not independent ones). They were already on watchlists (or should we say asset reserve lists?), yet we are supposed to believe they were independently sophisticated enough to armor up for the attack without being noticed. While simultaneously being dumb enough to leave their ID behind? Or that the Hayat woman could slip past a whole SWAT team, AND get on a plane out of France, despite also being on the watch list?

    More likely, the entire point behind creating the mayhem, and leaving the IDs, is to foster the "they're a threat, they are Muslims, they hate us" framework needed to keep justifying Mid east intervention, and domestic hyper-surveillence. The Hebdo attackers had connections to Anwar al-Awlaki, whom both Lt. Col. Anthony Shaffer and Fox News revealed was likely a US asset since at least 2001. Hayat was likewise connected to the shoe bomber, who was also a known CIA asset.

    And on it goes. Rand would get somewhere on foreign policy if he exposed these covert machinations, instead of relying solely on blowback rhetoric, which when used by itself is plainly incapable of rebutting the pro-war emotions fomented by the false flag attacks.
    -----Peace & Freedom, John Clifton-----
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  13. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by NOVALibertarian View Post
    To be fair, the case that the the author specifically mentions is one worth taking issue with. The Charlie Hebdo attacks weren't "blowback" in the way that Ron Paul likes to define it. It was murder by primitive savages who were offended over a drawing. Was it offensive? Sure, but that isn't reason to murder innocents. Ron shouldn't allow pieces like the one mentioned in the article be published under his name if he's serious about expanding the liberty movement beyond its niche audience. It does nothing to advance our cause and only hurts us amongst those who might be inclined to help us should Rand conquer the rest of the GOP field.
    And so you're just going to ignore statements by one of the Charlie Hebdo shooters that he was radicalized by the Abu Ghraib photos?
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  14. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    When all else fails, make baseless accusations against the CIA.
    None of my accusations regarding the CIA are baseless.
    They are documented,, and known historical fact,,, and are only limited by the knowledge that has survived deliberate destruction in an attempt to obfuscate.

    The full evil is not known only because of the CIAs destruction of evidence, and a complicit government that allows their continued existence,, rather than prosecution.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

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  16. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    And so you're just going to ignore statements by one of the Charlie Hebdo shooters that he was radicalized by the Abu Ghraib photos?
    Has Ron, Rand, or ANYBODY outside of RPF used this? The only reason I know about this, is I researched it as soon as the event happened and posted it here on RPF. Have you seen that key piece mentioned anywhere outside of RPF?

  17. #74
    Yes, The singular/most prominent reason to shoot someone is because they made a comic strip of you.
    Last edited by NorthCarolinaLiberty; 01-25-2015 at 05:20 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Influenza View Post
    which one of yall fuckers wrote the "ron paul" racist news letters
    Quote Originally Posted by Dforkus View Post
    Zippy's posts are a great contribution.




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  18. #75
    Yes, I'm the singular/most prominent reason to shoot someone is because they made a comic strip of you.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Influenza View Post
    which one of yall fuckers wrote the "ron paul" racist news letters
    Quote Originally Posted by Dforkus View Post
    Zippy's posts are a great contribution.




    Disrupt, Deny, Deflate. Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3): http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...eptive-members

  19. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    When all else fails, make baseless accusations against the CIA.
    Actually THIS is the definition of blowback - the OP believes that the CIA is only responsible for what the mainstream media says they are responsible for, so when we have a violent attack he sees it as a random act of violence because he is ignorant to admitted and un-admitted CIA activities that there is document evidence for and not. The sad part is that Ron Paul rants about this stuff ALL THE TIME..
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
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    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  20. #77
    Ten points for Troll Thread of the Week.

    Radical Islam existed prior to the US and Europe involving themselves in Middle Eastern affairs. Cites no history of this prior violence. Ignoring historical facts dating European involvement to late 19th century. No of this matters, because history began on 9/11/2001. 'Merica.

    Also, if we are talking about violent religious radicalism. The State of Israel was created by white Europeans to build a homeland for the Jewish population because 2000 years ago an old book says they deserve to live there. So all sides are $#@!ing stupid.

    Can I please stop paying for it with my money, my time, my safety and the lives of my family and friends?

    Or no? Because Muslims must be destroyed so the Christian Right can then spread its good will towards men?
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  21. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    the OP believes that the CIA is only responsible for what the mainstream media says they are responsible for
    What? What possible reason would the MSM or CIA have for misleading the public about covert activity?
    Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised if half the Muslims in the Mideast were on the CIA payroll.
    All modern revolutions have ended in a reinforcement of the power of the State.
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  22. #79
    Anti-Muslim jingoists must not rise within the liberty movement. There are so many desperate to sell their souls for political power within the Republican Party and would happily support the lies and the bombing campaigns to do so. These are the forces that must be fought most vigorously, as they jeopardize the future of our movement more than any of our enemies.

  23. #80
    According to those who advocate for military action against ISIS, we need to play Whack-a-Mole with ISIS because they are evil barbarians who chop peoples' heads off for no good reason.

    If you are one of those advocates, then riddle me this:

    If it is our righteous and bounden duty to extirpate the evil of ISIS, then why aren't you advocating for the same with respect to Saudi Arabia?

    From another thread: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...=1#post5763182
    Quote Originally Posted by Lucille View Post
    Western Politicians and Media Rush To Issue Tributes To King That Led The World In Beheadings, Whipped Bloggers For Criticism & Banned Women From Driving
    http://www.strike-the-root.com/weste...ngs-whipped-bl

    After all, the Saudis under King Abdullah have beheaded more people than ISIS, treated women drivers and atheists as terrorists, and flogged people who speak out. (Indeed, the Saudi government and ISIS are virtually indistinguishable).

    And given that unconditional Western support for Saudi Arabia is one of the main causes for terrorism, Western hypocrisy is very costly, indeed.
    The Bastiat Collection · FREE PDF · FREE EPUB · PAPER
    Frédéric Bastiat (1801-1850)

    • "When law and morality are in contradiction to each other, the citizen finds himself in the cruel alternative of either losing his moral sense, or of losing his respect for the law."
      -- The Law (p. 54)
    • "Government is that great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
      -- Government (p. 99)
    • "[W]ar is always begun in the interest of the few, and at the expense of the many."
      -- Economic Sophisms - Second Series (p. 312)
    • "There are two principles that can never be reconciled - Liberty and Constraint."
      -- Harmonies of Political Economy - Book One (p. 447)

    · tu ne cede malis sed contra audentior ito ·



  24. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  25. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by NOVALibertarian View Post
    To be fair, the case that the the author specifically mentions is one worth taking issue with. The Charlie Hebdo attacks weren't "blowback" in the way that Ron Paul likes to define it. It was murder by primitive savages who were offended over a drawing. Was it offensive? Sure, but that isn't reason to murder innocents. Ron shouldn't allow pieces like the one mentioned in the article be published under his name if he's serious about expanding the liberty movement beyond its niche audience. It does nothing to advance our cause and only hurts us amongst those who might be inclined to help us should Rand conquer the rest of the GOP field.
    Blowback is never a valid reason to murder innocents.

  26. #82
    Poor Taftfan. Uses a name of a classical 20th century conservative and has no clue about the ideas and history of any of those people.

    http://original.antiwar.com/justin/2...ring-ron-paul/

    The wisdom of Swordy:

    On bringing the troops home
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    They are coming home, all the naysayers said they would never leave Syria and then they said they were going to stay in Iraq forever.

    It won't take very long to get them home but it won't be overnight either but Iraq says they can't stay and they are coming home just like Trump said.

    On fighting corruption:
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Trump had to donate the "right way" and hang out with the "right people" in order to do business in NYC and Hollyweird and in order to investigate and expose them.
    Fascism Defined

  27. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by green73 View Post
    Taftfan siding with NRO over Ron Paul. Is anybody surprised?
    We have to start throwing Dad under the bus now, haven't you heard?

  28. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by cajuncocoa View Post
    We have to start throwing Dad under the bus now, haven't you heard?
    Of course.

    We simply can't do the good cop/bad cop strategy. It might work...
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  29. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Of course.

    We simply can't do the good cop/bad cop strategy. It might work...
    We'd better get to changing the name of this place before Rand makes his big announcement. Wouldn't want to embarrass anyone.

  30. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    When all else fails, make baseless accusations against the CIA.
    Thought of your comment here when I saw this thread:
    Editor of major newspaper says he planted stories for CIA

    Becoming the first credentialed, well-known media insider to step forward and state publicly that he was secretly a "propagandist," an editor of a major German daily has said that he personally planted stories for the CIA...Ulfkotte says he is better positioned to come forward than many journalists because he does not have children who could be threatened.
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...tories-for-CIA

    Now why should folks NOT trust the CIA?
    We will be known forever by the tracks we leave. - Dakota


    Go Forward With Courage

    When you are in doubt, be still, and wait;
    when doubt no longer exists for you, then go forward with courage.
    So long as mists envelop you, be still;
    be still until the sunlight pours through and dispels the mists
    -- as it surely will.
    Then act with courage.

    Ponca Chief White Eagle

  31. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Islam was radicalized by direct efforts of the CIA and other agencies. Radicalized Islam did not exist prior to our involvement.
    It simply did not exist,, until it was created.
    When all else fails, make baseless accusations against the CIA.
    What is baseless about that particular accusation?

    The CIA did in fact incite and encourage the radicalization of Iranian clerics as a critical part their efforts to undermine and overthrow the secular Mossadeq regime.

    I don't know if I'd go so far as to say that they created radical Islam, but at the very least, they sure as hell exploited, fostered, empowered and grew it.

    And now we are paying the price ...
    The Bastiat Collection · FREE PDF · FREE EPUB · PAPER
    Frédéric Bastiat (1801-1850)

    • "When law and morality are in contradiction to each other, the citizen finds himself in the cruel alternative of either losing his moral sense, or of losing his respect for the law."
      -- The Law (p. 54)
    • "Government is that great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
      -- Government (p. 99)
    • "[W]ar is always begun in the interest of the few, and at the expense of the many."
      -- Economic Sophisms - Second Series (p. 312)
    • "There are two principles that can never be reconciled - Liberty and Constraint."
      -- Harmonies of Political Economy - Book One (p. 447)

    · tu ne cede malis sed contra audentior ito ·

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