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Thread: Isn't the Federal Reserve already audited?

  1. #1

    Question Isn't the Federal Reserve already audited?

    An e-mail from Campaign for Liberty today...



    Dear Matt --

    It’s one of the objections we most encounter when talking about Audit the Fed.

    The Fed’s already audited.”

    Even the Fed itself claims it’s “subject to several levels of audit and review.”

    So does that settle it? Open and shut case?

    *Spoiler alert*

    NO!

    Last week, Dr. Paul emailed you with an Audit the Fed update and a link to several resources to help you spread the word and recruit more support for this historic effort.

    One of those resources is an updated “Audit the Fed F.A.Q.” based on one that was created while I worked as Legislative Director in Dr. Paul’s congressional office.

    And it directly tackles this “Fed’s already audited” talking point.

    So to borrow from Paul Harvey, what’s the rest of the story?

    Here’s what our F.A.Q. has to say:

    2.) Isn’t the Fed already audited?
    Not fully. The Fed’s financial statements are audited annually, but the Fed’s monetary policy operations are exempt from audit. Congress’ investigative arm, the Government Accountability Office (GAO), is currently prohibited by law from examining discount window and open market operations; agreements with foreign governments and central banks; and Federal Open Market Committee (FOMC) directives. It is precisely this information that should be made public.

    The American people must know how and why Fed officials expand the money supply and set interest rates. It is not enough for the Fed to simply provide its updated balance sheet after crucial decisions and transactions already have occurred. Audit the Fed allows the GAO to audit the Fed’s monetary policy operations and directs the GAO to report the audit results to Congress within a year of the bill’s passage.
    And one more:

    4.) Hasn’t the Fed already published details of its emergency bank lending?
    Yes, but only partially. The Fed was required by the Dodd-Frank Act to disclose data from its emergency credit lending facilities created during the financial crisis. Most of the data on its other activities, such as open market operations and discount window lending, have only been published as a result of lawsuits – not because of Congressional action. Dodd-Frank requires this information to be disclosed going forward, but with a two-year time lag and with the GAO restricted to auditing only the procedural components of any programs. Audit the Fed grants the GAO and Congress access without special exemptions and ensures that ALL of the Fed’s lending actions will be subject to oversight.
    C4L has even heard that Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid’s staff has told callers that the Fed’s already audited, and that’s why the senator hasn’t brought up Audit the Fed for a vote.

    But it’s clear Senator Reid doesn’t really have any excuse to not hold a Senate vote on a full Fed audit.

    (And, if Senator Reid really does believe the Fed is already fully audited, it is odd he didn’t say that when asked about Audit the Fed in a campaign debate in 2010. Instead, candidate Reid said he supported Audit the Fed legislation, the very legislation his staff is now saying is unnecessary!)

    You can help shatter myths about the Fed.

    Click here to get our Audit the Fed F.A.Q., along with other resources including a half-page flier and a fact sheet.

    And be sure to call your senators at 202-224-3121 today and urge them to push for a roll call vote on S. 209 or its House-passed counterpart, H.R. 24, during Congress’ upcoming Lame Duck session.

    Thank you so much for helping Campaign for Liberty shine a spotlight on the Federal Reserve!

    In Liberty,

    Norm Singleton
    Vice President of Policy

    P.S. Can you chip in $5 or $10 to help C4L mobilize Americans on Audit the Fed and other core liberty issues?

    If so, click here to donate today!


    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst



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  3. #2
    Out of curiosity, how much money does the Fed have lent out through their Discount Window?

    http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/DISCBORR

    Discount Window Borrowings of Depository Institutions from the Federal Reserve

    2014-09: 0.300 Billions of Dollars (+ see more)
    Monthly, Not Seasonally Adjusted, DISCBORR, Updated: 2014-10-02 3:56 PM CDT
    $300 million currently.

  4. #3
    Who cares? EBOLA is far too important to be concerned with these trivial matter. (sarcasm off)
    “The easiest way to gain control of a population is to carry out acts of terror. [The public] will clamor for such laws if their personal security is threatened”.
    - Josef Stalin

  5. #4
    Chester Copperpot
    Member

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Out of curiosity, how much money does the Fed have lent out through their Discount Window?

    http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/DISCBORR





    $300 million currently.
    More than they have backed up with gold.

  6. #5
    Collinz, I doubt anyone who hangs around RPFs is ignorant of how FED audits work or RP's End Teh FED endeavours.
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RP Support me on Patreon here Ephesians 6:12

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Mitrosky View Post
    More than they have backed up with gold.

    The Fed doesn't own any gold so yes, that would be true. US gold is owned by the US Treasury and money isn't backed by gold anymore.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    The Fed doesn't own any gold so yes, that would be true. US gold is owned by the US Treasury and money isn't backed by gold anymore.
    What is the money backed by? What exactly gives the dollar value?

    (nice post collins, i bit)
    Last edited by devil21; 10-20-2014 at 01:46 AM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book

  9. #8
    Everything- the entire US economy. It is backed by what you can exchange it for. You don't have to take it to the bank and trade it for some piece of metal. Its value is what people are willing to give it. If you agree to pay a certain amount for something, you have agreed to the value of the dollar for that transaction. If you agree to a certain wage at work, you are agreeing to the value of the dollars you are given in exchange for your labor.
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 10-19-2014 at 11:23 PM.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Everything. It is backed by what you can exchange it for. You don't have to take it to the bank and trade it for some piece of metal. Its value is what people are willing to give it. If you agree to pay a certain amount for something, you have agreed to the value of the dollar for that transaction. If you agree to a certain wage at work, you are agreeing to the value of the dollars you are given in exchange for your labor.
    This^^ Value is subjective. Austrian Econ FTW.
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RP Support me on Patreon here Ephesians 6:12

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Everything- the entire US economy. It is backed by what you can exchange it for. You don't have to take it to the bank and trade it for some piece of metal. Its value is what people are willing to give it. If you agree to pay a certain amount for something, you have agreed to the value of the dollar for that transaction. If you agree to a certain wage at work, you are agreeing to the value of the dollars you are given in exchange for your labor.
    That's a long winded way to say that people's labor and energy backs the dollar, right? When the labor stops so does the value of the currency. Sound about right?
    Last edited by devil21; 10-20-2014 at 01:14 AM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book

  13. #11
    Basically- yes. Money is a medium of exchange. Its value is determined by the people who use it. Some think money should be a store of value. Why? Money can be exchanged for things you think might store value for you but nothing is guaranteed to store value. Not even gold. At one point in history, aluminum was more valuable than gold. Values are relative and change over time. Money itself does not have to serve that purpose.
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 10-20-2014 at 01:21 AM.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Basically- yes. Money is a medium of exchange. Its value is determined by the people who use it.
    Is gold money?

    I think it's the people that create it with their labor, instead of those that codify the ability to create representations of it, that control the value of it. Most just don't understand this simple principle that was the standard prior to the Federal Reserve Act of 1913. The Fed Act gave a private corporation the power, unconstitutionally, to control the representations of American's labor. Don't you agree Zippy?
    Last edited by devil21; 10-20-2014 at 01:26 AM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book

  15. #13
    Is gold money?
    Do you get paid in gold? Do you buy things with gold? If yes, then for you, gold is money. I don't use gold for money. You can trade money for gold if you like gold.

  16. #14
    Cool. I like gold.

    What are your thoughts on the second part of my post about labor and the dollar?
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book

  17. #15
    How does the Fed:
    control the representations of American's labor

  18. #16
    You tell me. Every dollar bill I have says "Federal Reserve Note" on the top of it. That is the 'money' and the Fed is a private bank. Yes or no question.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book



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  20. #17
    It is a hybred. It is not truely a private bank nor is it government run by Congress or the President. The president nominates members of the board and Congress has to approve of them but they don't get to tell the Fed what to do. The Fed has shares like a private bank but the shares cannot be bought or sold and have no voting rights- the share holders have no voice in what the Fed does. (Member banks must buy the shares equal to ten percent of their total assets to join the Federal Reserve system and have access to their services- more of a membership fee really than normal stock shares).

    How do the words "Federal Reserve Note" impact labor which I thought was your question?
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 10-20-2014 at 01:41 AM.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    It is a hybred. It is not truely a private bank nor is it government run by Congress or the President.
    So it's the financial equivalent of purgatory? That's kinda scary to hear regarding those that control the fiat currency.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory

    It's hybrid btw. Or is it 'bred'?
    Last edited by devil21; 10-20-2014 at 01:43 AM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Is gold money?

    I think it's the people that create it with their labor, instead of those that codify the ability to create representations of it, that control the value of it. Most just don't understand this simple principle that was the standard prior to the Federal Reserve Act of 1913. The Fed Act gave a private corporation the power, unconstitutionally, to control the representations of American's labor. Don't you agree Zippy?
    Gold can be a money and like all monies it's direct use-value would come from it's exchange-value; that is the degree to which it is accepted as a means of transaction for more valued consumer goods. Value is subjective, it comes from the valuator not the thing being valuated. Money by it's nature as a social construct is a means to an end not really an end in itself and understand means only have value according to whatever end they help attain.

    Anyway, the more relevant point is that gold does not have intrinsic value.

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    So it's the financial equivalent of purgatory? That's kinda scary to hear regarding those that control the fiat currency.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory

    It's hybrid btw. Or is it 'bred'?
    Thanks for the spelling correction. How would you like to see a monetary system structured? Who should be in charge- Congress or Bankers? This tries to keep both of them out of control.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Out of curiosity, how much money does the Fed have lent out through their Discount Window?

    http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/DISCBORR



    $300 million currently.
    Nice misdirection. You are good. Very good. You left out the entire quote though.

    Not fully. The Fed’s financial statements are audited annually, but the Fed’s monetary policy operations are exempt from audit. Congress’ investigative arm, the Government Accountability Office (GAO), is currently prohibited by law from examining discount window and open market operations; agreements with foreign governments and central banks; and Federal Open Market Committee (FOMC) directives. It is precisely this information that should be made public.


    How much has been lent to foreign banks? How about 1/2 trillion?

    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by T.hill View Post
    Gold can be a money and like all monies it's direct use-value would come from it's exchange-value; that is the degree to which it is accepted as a means of transaction for more valued consumer goods. Value is subjective, it comes from the valuator not the thing being valuated. Money by it's nature as a social construct is a means to an end not really an end in itself and understand means only have value according to whatever end they help attain.

    Anyway, the more relevant point is that gold does not have intrinsic value.
    +rep Glad to see you get it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RP Support me on Patreon here Ephesians 6:12

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Constitutional Paulicy View Post
    Who cares? EBOLA is far too important to be concerned with these trivial matter. (sarcasm off)
    +rep

    Quote Originally Posted by heavenlyboy34 View Post
    Collinz, I doubt anyone who hangs around RPFs is ignorant of how FED audits work or RP's End Teh FED endeavours.
    Ummmm....your point? Seriously. I know folks around here are reflexively "anti Collinz" and sometimes it's warranted but other times it's just plain silly. Ron Paul sent that email out because he wanted it read and distributed. This is more important than the latest "cop kills dog" or "pro/anti Ferguson riot" or "my religion is better than your religion" or "love/hate 9/11 truther" thread. Yes, all old timers know that there is this thing called the federal reserve that we are supposed to be against. But does everyone understand how to argue that point to the rest of America? Zippy, for all his trolling ways, actually added something worthwhile to the discussion.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Thanks for the spelling correction. How would you like to see a monetary system structured? Who should be in charge- Congress or Bankers? This tries to keep both of them out of control.
    Nice false choice fallacy.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.



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  29. #25

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Thanks for the spelling correction. How would you like to see a monetary system structured? Who should be in charge- Congress or Bankers? This tries to keep both of them out of control.
    Money should represent MASS of tangible commodities held in full reserve. Neither the congress or bankers should be "in charge". Anyone could issue, the freemarket would handle value, and the courts would handle fraud.

    'We endorse the idea of voluntarism; self-responsibility: Family, friends, and churches to solve problems, rather than saying that some monolithic government is going to make you take care of yourself and be a better person. It's a preposterous notion: It never worked, it never will. The government can't make you a better person; it can't make you follow good habits.' - Ron Paul 1988

    Awareness is the Root of Liberation Revolution is Action upon Revelation

    'Resistance and Disobedience in Economic Activity is the Most Moral Human Action Possible' - SEK3

    Flectere si nequeo superos, Acheronta movebo.

    ...the familiar ritual of institutional self-absolution...
    ...for protecting them, by mock trial, from punishment...


  31. #27
    "It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."
    -- Henry Ford

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    The Fed doesn't own any gold so yes, that would be true. US gold is owned by the US Treasury and money isn't backed by gold anymore.
    So why is Ft. Knox empty and the basement of the New York Fed full?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Thanks for the spelling correction. How would you like to see a monetary system structured? Who should be in charge- Congress or Bankers? This tries to keep both of them out of control.
    Ah, yes. The myth that the huge banks that own all the shares in the Fed have no say in what it does.

    Keep shilling it. If you keep repeating a lie long enough some will indeed think it true. Of course, it takes a bit longer if the lie makes not one lick of sense...
    Last edited by acptulsa; 10-20-2014 at 08:51 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    What is the money backed by? What exactly gives the dollar value?

    (nice post collins, i bit)
    In the case of the FRNs, debt backs the currency. The dead give away clue is in the name, Federal Reserve NOTE. As debts are repaid the money supply shrinks. Hence the major deflation worry and Fed mega-fear.

    Evil genius, no?
    Last edited by Ronin Truth; 10-20-2014 at 09:06 AM.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    So why is Ft. Knox empty and the basement of the New York Fed full?



    Ah, yes. The myth that the huge banks that own all the shares in the Fed have no say in what it does.

    Keep shilling it. If you keep repeating a lie long enough some will indeed think it true. Of course, it takes a bit longer if the lie makes not one lick of sense...
    Link to proof of no gold in Fort Knox? Yes, you are right that the Fed does store gold in their vaults-for not just the US Treasury but some foreign governments as well- but they don't own any of it.

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