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Thread: NY court hears arguments that chimps have rights

  1. #1

    Default NY court hears arguments that chimps have rights

    ALBANY, N.Y. (AP) A state appeals court will decide in coming weeks whether chimpanzees are entitled to "legal personhood" in a case that could lead to expanded rights for animals such as gorillas, elephants and dolphins, according to the lawyer advocating for a 26-year-old chimp named Tommy.

    Attorney Steven Wise argued before a five-member mid-level appeals court Wednesday on behalf of Tommy, who lives alone in a cage in upstate Fulton County. A trial-level judge has refused a request by Wise and his Nonhuman Rights Project to have Tommy released to join other chimps at a Florida sanctuary that mimics their natural habitat.

    Wise argues that animals with human qualities, such as chimps, deserve basic rights, including freedom from imprisonment. He's also seeking the release of three other chimps in New York and said he plans similar cases in other states. If he succeeds, he said he will seek personhood for other species with human qualities, which he defines as self-determination and autonomy.

    One of the judges said the state has laws to protect animals from mistreatment and suggested they might be a more appropriate avenue to ensure Tommy's welfare.

    But Wise said the case is not about well-being, but unlawful imprisonment.

    "What about the detention makes it unlawful?" asked Presiding Justice Karen Peters.

    "Keeping a legal person in solitary confinement in a cage is unlawful," Wise replied.

    The key question is whether a chimp is a person.

    Richard Cupp, a professor at Pepperdine Law School who writes and speaks extensively about the legal and moral status of animals, said by phone Wednesday that granting legal personhood and rights to animals could unintentionally dilute the concept of human rights.

    "We could see over time some of our most vulnerable humans losing out in a rights struggle if they're in direct competition with some particularly intelligent non-human animals," Cupp said. "We could have the personhood paradigm weakened by extending it to animals."

    Cupp, and several of the judges, noted that rights come with responsibilities. "Human beings are the only species where most of us are capable of the responsibilities that go with rights," Cupp said.

    Tommy's owner, Patrick Lavery of Gloversville, didn't appear in court or submit documents. Reached later by phone, he said Tommy, a former entertainment chimp who was placed with him several years ago, is cared for under strict state and federal license rules. "I think it's totally ridiculous to give an animal human rights."

    Lavery said Tommy lives in a seven-room enclosure with lots of toys and other "enrichment."

    "We've dedicated our lives to taking care of these chimps who have no place to go," Lavery said. "We would place him in the right sanctuary if we had the opportunity to. But he has special needs, he can't go just anywhere. He's never been associated with other chimps. He could get hurt if he went in the wrong atmosphere."
    http://news.yahoo.com/ny-court-hear-...142643283.html



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  3. #2

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    This is the obvious conclusion of following Darwinism to it's retarded end.

    P.S, we are screwed.
    Freedom index

    ~Resident Badgiraffe





  4. #3

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    3,2,1 Legalize marriage between different species! you know that crap is coming
    Freedom index

    ~Resident Badgiraffe





  5. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    3,2,1 Legalize marriage between different species! you know that crap is coming
    Dolphins are hot.

  6. #5

  7. #6

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    This is how it starts.




    ETA: like minds?
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  8. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    Dolphins are hot.
    Finner!
    Freedom index

    ~Resident Badgiraffe





  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    This is the obvious conclusion of following Darwinism to it's retarded end.
    the end is certainly retarded.

    All modern revolutions have ended in a reinforcement of the power of the State.
    -Albert Camus

  10. #9

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    Wait... so unborn children don't have rights, but chimps do? How sick is this country?

    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    3,2,1 Legalize marriage between different species! you know that crap is coming
    Why should that be illegal? Do animals actually have rights that should be protected by law?

  11. #10

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    Ebola only kills primates.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
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    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  12. #11

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    "We could see over time some of our most vulnerable humans losing out in a rights struggle if they're in direct competition with some particularly intelligent non-human animals," Cupp said. "We could have the personhood paradigm weakened by extending it to animals."
    Only in Amerika is personhood a "paradigm".
    All modern revolutions have ended in a reinforcement of the power of the State.
    -Albert Camus

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    Finner!

  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by otherone View Post
    the end is certainly retarded.

    No, where did this come from:
    Freedom index

    ~Resident Badgiraffe





  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by otherone View Post
    Only in Amerika is personhood a "paradigm".
    #firstworldproblems

  16. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Suzanimal View Post
    #firstworldproblems
    The HUBRIS of the state to decide what a person is. What a effing farce.
    All modern revolutions have ended in a reinforcement of the power of the State.
    -Albert Camus

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    No, where did this come from:
    A milliner?
    All modern revolutions have ended in a reinforcement of the power of the State.
    -Albert Camus

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by otherone View Post
    A milliner?
    Freedom index

    ~Resident Badgiraffe





  19. #18

  20. #19

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    Truly, the stupidity of humans is limitless. Especially in teh "First World".
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RPEphesians 6:12 (KJV)//I sell stuff here go buy nao!

  21. #20

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    Either NY will recognize more chimp rights than human rights, or none at all.

  22. #21

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    Well. I don't know. I think I'd rather see a chimp have personhood than anincorporated figment of some asshat venturist's reckless imagination born from a wink, smile and the stroke of a pen.

  23. #22

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    Of course, many may disagree with that but deep down, you know that I'm right.

  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Natural Citizen View Post
    Of course, many may disagree with that but deep down, you know that I'm right.
    You have a good point.
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RPEphesians 6:12 (KJV)//I sell stuff here go buy nao!

  25. #24

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    ive never wanted to kiss a chip, so heres a vid of a good title change.

  26. #25

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    Texas will be next...
    "Logic is an enemy and truth is a menace." ~ Rod Serling
    "Cops today are nothing but an armed tax collector" ~ Frank Serpico
    "To be normal, to drink Coca-Cola and eat Kentucky Fried Chicken is to be in a conspiracy against yourself."
    "People that don't want to make waves sit in stagnant waters."

  27. #26

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    Update:

    Chimpanzees have no human rights: N.Y. court

    ALBANY, N.Y. (Reuters) - In the first case of its kind, a New York appeals court rejected on Thursday an animal rights advocate's bid to extend "legal personhood" to chimpanzees, saying the primates are incapable of bearing the responsibilities that come with having legal rights.

    A five-judge panel of the Albany court said attorney Steven Wise had shown that Tommy, a 26-year-old chimp who lives alone in a shed in upstate New York, was an autonomous creature, but that it was not possible for him to understand the social contract that binds humans together.

    "Needless to say, unlike human beings, chimpanzees cannot bear any legal duties, submit to societal responsibilities or be held legally accountable for their actions," Presiding Justice Karen Peters wrote.

    Wise said that he would ask the Court of Appeals, New York state's top court, to hear the case.

    "This is just the first appellate decision in a long-term strategic campaign" to win rights for chimps and other intelligent animals, he said.

    Wise, representing The Nonhuman Rights Project, which he helped found in 2007, was seeking a ruling that Tommy had been unlawfully imprisoned by his owner, Patrick Lavery. Wise argued that the chimp should be released to a sanctuary in Florida.

    According to Wise and other experts, it is the first case anywhere in the world in which an appeals court has been asked to extend human rights to animals.

    Lavery said that he agreed with the judges, adding that Tammy received state-of-the-art care and was on a waiting list to be taken in by a sanctuary.

    "It will be my decision where he goes and not someone else's," he said.

    Peters wrote for the court that while chimps could not be granted legal rights, Wise could lobby the state legislature to create new protections for chimps and other intelligent animals.

    The decision, which upheld a 2013 ruling by a state judge, came after Wise on Tuesday urged a separate court in Rochester to order the release of a deaf chimp named Kiko from a cement cage at his owner's home in Niagara Falls.

    Wise has also filed a third case on behalf of two chimps that live at a state university on Long Island.

    The case is Nonhuman Rights Project v. Lavery, New York State Supreme Court, Appellate Division, Third Department, No. 518336.

    http://news.yahoo.com/chimps-no-huma...171924268.html

  28. #27

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    "Needless to say, unlike human beings, chimpanzees cannot bear any legal duties, submit to societal responsibilities or be held legally accountable for their actions," Presiding Justice Karen Peters wrote.

    They don't know how good they have it. Leave the chimps alone. Why would they want to be accountable to us? Maybe mundanes should apply to have the same rights as chimpanzee's.

  29. #28

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    "Needless to say, unlike human beings, chimpanzees cannot bear any legal duties, submit to societal responsibilities or be held legally accountable for their actions," Presiding Justice Karen Peters wrote.

    On second thought the aforementioned description sounds a lot like Law Enforcement Officers.

    "Needless to say, unlike human beings, Police Officers cannot bear any legal duties, submit to societal responsibilities or be held legally accountable for their actions,"
    Last edited by Schifference; 12-12-2014 at 08:12 PM.

  30. #29

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    Update:

    Chimpanzees have no human rights: N.Y. court


    Thank goodness sanity prevails, for now...
    Freedom index

    ~Resident Badgiraffe





  31. #30

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    Chimp discrimination!!!!! It's the new civil rights battle of our time. Don't be on the wrong side of history.

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