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Thread: Cost to renunciate citizenship just went up to: $2350 (From $450)

  1. #1

    Cost to renunciate citizenship just went up to: $2350 (From $450)

    The US embassies will now be charging $2350 for the "service" of renouncing your US citizenship.

    quote, "Since that time, demand for the service has increased dramatically, consuming far more consular officer time and resources, as reflected in the 2012 Overseas Time Survey and increased workload data. Because the Department believes there is no public benefit or other reason for setting this fee below cost, the Department is increasing this fee to reflect the full cost of providing the service. Therefore the increased fee reflects both the increased cost of the provision of service as well as the determination to now charge the full cost."


    https://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2014/08/28/2014-20516/schedule-of-fees-for-consular-services-department-of-state-and-overseas-embassies-and



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  3. #2
    the Department is increasing this fee to reflect the full cost of providing the service.
    Maybe taxpayers should subsidize the costs of the program?

  4. #3
    Because the Department believes there is no public benefit or other reason for setting this fee below cost, the Department is increasing this fee to reflect the full cost of providing the service.
    Well since there is no private benefit or other reason for charging someone for this service at all, the fee should be zero.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
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  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Maybe taxpayers should subsidize the costs of the program?
    Why don't they just make a checkbox in the database that says they are no longer a US citizen?
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  6. #5
    Obviously there is more to it than that- and all data is not kept in a single base.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Maybe taxpayers should subsidize the costs of the program?
    No other country charges close to this amount, or any amount, for this "service".

    It is the larger question... At what point does the USA simply stop allowing people to renounce or simply raises the price so high that people can't?

    So, to renounce:

    1. File the paperwork with the fee of $2350
    2. Fill out "Exit Tax" paperwork for the IRS
    2a. If networth is over $2M, pay an exit tax
    3. Hand in your passport
    3a. If it is discovered that your renunciation was not complete, truthful, etc. The US will nullify your renunciation (think: Herpes)


    If the US govt claimed it costs them $10K for the "service". Do we accept that $10K is a fair amount to hand in a passport and no longer be a US citizen?

    Its a gang... Blood in, Blood out motherfucker. Pay up.
    Last edited by daviddee; 08-29-2014 at 02:25 PM.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Maybe taxpayers should subsidize the costs of the program?
    Oh please. So when the protection racket in the neighborhood finally drives me out, I should have to pay a fee or they come to my new neighborhood and beat me up? The US government is already the most money-grubbing thug enterprise in the world when it comes to the way we treat our citizens abroad.
    The proper concern of society is the preservation of individual freedom; the proper concern of the individual is the harmony of society.

    "Who would be free, themselves must strike the blow." - Byron

    "Who overcomes by force, hath overcome but half his foe." - Milton

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by daviddee View Post
    No other country charges close to this amount, or any amount, for this "service".

    It is the larger question... At what point does the USA simply stop allowing people to renounce or simply raises the price so high that people can't?

    So, to renounce:

    1. File the paperwork with the fee of $2350
    2. Fill out "Exit Tax" paperwork for the IRS
    2a. If networth is over $2M, pay an exit tax
    3. Hand in your passport
    3a. If it is discovered that your renunciation was not complete, truthful, etc. The US will nullify your renunciation (think: Herpes)


    If the US govt claimed it costs them $10K for the "service". Do we accept that $10K is a fair amount to hand in a passport and no longer be a US citizen?

    Its a gang... Blood in, Blood out motherfucker. Pay up.
    First country I checked- Britain- charges 823 Pounds which is about $1400. https://www.gov.uk/renounce-british-...sh-nationality



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Acala View Post
    Oh please. So when the protection racket in the neighborhood finally drives me out, I should have to pay a fee or they come to my new neighborhood and beat me up? The US government is already the most money-grubbing thug enterprise in the world when it comes to the way we treat our citizens abroad.
    What other government services do you think should be free/ taxpayer subsidized?

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    First country I checked- Britain- charges 823 Pounds which is about $1400. https://www.gov.uk/renounce-british-...sh-nationality
    Actual cost to renounce in UK is:

    Cost

    You’ll need to include the correct fee with your application.

    It costs 144 to give up:

    British citizenship
    British overseas citizenship
    British overseas territories citizenship
    British protected person status
    British subject status

    The fee is the same if you’re applying to renounce more than one of these at the same time.

    There’s no fee to give up British national (overseas) status.
    Last edited by daviddee; 08-29-2014 at 02:42 PM.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by daviddee View Post
    As I stated: No other country charges close to this amount, or any amount, for this "service".

    800 pounds is: $1320. $1320 is close to $2350?
    Isn't $1369 "any amount"? Yes- I do consider it somewhat close. It certainly isn't free. And three times larger than the old US fee.

    My conversion source for 823 pounds: https://www.google.com/webhp?sourcei...unds%20dollars
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 08-29-2014 at 02:38 PM.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Isn't $1320 "any amount"? Yes- I do consider it somewhat close. It certainly isn't free. And nearly three times the old US fee.
    I should have fact checked you before responding.

    Here is the correct cost for renouncing:

    https://www.gov.uk/renounce-british-nationality/apply

    144 Pounds.

    144 pounds = $238

    Your cost was to APPLY for citizenship after renouncing: Resume your British nationality


    Cost

    You’ll need to include the correct fee with your application.

    It costs 144 to give up:

    British citizenship
    British overseas citizenship
    British overseas territories citizenship
    British protected person status
    British subject status

    The fee is the same if you’re applying to renounce more than one of these at the same time.

    There’s no fee to give up British national (overseas) status.
    Last edited by daviddee; 08-29-2014 at 02:41 PM.

  15. #13
    Thank you for the correction.

    Should users of government services pay the costs of those services?
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 08-29-2014 at 02:48 PM.

  16. #14
    The mighty Titanic is sinking and you're going down with it!
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Influenza View Post
    which one of yall fuckers wrote the "ron paul" racist news letters
    Quote Originally Posted by Dforkus View Post
    Zippy's posts are a great contribution.




    Disrupt, Deny, Deflate. Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3): http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...eptive-members

  17. #15
    renouncing citizenship seems to me to be something you would mail in a letter stating your intent to ditch your citizenship, not something you apply for, like canceling a cellphone contract, lol. I guess you have to pay the fee for severing the "social contract" everyone speaks of.
    A savage barbaric tribal society where thugs parade the streets and illegally assault and murder innocent civilians, yeah that is the alternative to having police. Oh wait, that is the police

    We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.
    - Edward R. Murrow

    ...I think we have moral obligations to disobey unjust laws, because non-cooperation with evil is as much as a moral obligation as cooperation with good. - MLK Jr.

    How to trigger a liberal: "I didn't get vaccinated."

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Thank you for the correction.

    Should users of government services pay the costs of those services?
    No, of course not.

    FEMA campers should expect a bill.

    People who have their dogs and loved ones shot, should expect a bill.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by NorthCarolinaLiberty View Post
    The mighty Titanic is sinking and you're going down with it!
    Whether you $#@!ing like it or not.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Should users of government services pay the costs of those services?
    "Government services." LOL.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Influenza View Post
    which one of yall fuckers wrote the "ron paul" racist news letters
    Quote Originally Posted by Dforkus View Post
    Zippy's posts are a great contribution.




    Disrupt, Deny, Deflate. Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3): http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...eptive-members

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    What other government services do you think should be free/ taxpayer subsidized?
    Secession should be free.

    The whole idea that the US government will follow you around the world taking your wealth is bizarre to begin with and you should not have to pay them to make them stop. They should stop out of shame alone.
    The proper concern of society is the preservation of individual freedom; the proper concern of the individual is the harmony of society.

    "Who would be free, themselves must strike the blow." - Byron

    "Who overcomes by force, hath overcome but half his foe." - Milton

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Thank you for the correction.

    Should users of government services pay the costs of those services?
    If someone is punching you in the face, is it fair that you pay them a fee to stop?
    The proper concern of society is the preservation of individual freedom; the proper concern of the individual is the harmony of society.

    "Who would be free, themselves must strike the blow." - Byron

    "Who overcomes by force, hath overcome but half his foe." - Milton

  24. #21
    Not sure if this is true, but the story at one point was that when China executed a dissident, it sent the bill for the ammunition used to the family. I guess they should not have expected to get that service for free either.
    The proper concern of society is the preservation of individual freedom; the proper concern of the individual is the harmony of society.

    "Who would be free, themselves must strike the blow." - Byron

    "Who overcomes by force, hath overcome but half his foe." - Milton

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior_of_Freedom View Post
    renouncing citizenship seems to me to be something you would mail in a letter stating your intent to ditch your citizenship, not something you apply for, like canceling a cellphone contract, lol. I guess you have to pay the fee for severing the "social contract" everyone speaks of.
    Actually you need to be outside of the US and personally appear at a US consulate or embassy to apply for renouncing your citizenship. The information you give has to be verified which takes time and costs to be researched. It isn't just "I don't want to do this anymore- cross my name off the list" by mail or email thing.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    No, of course not.

    FEMA campers should expect a bill.

    People who have their dogs and loved ones shot, should expect a bill.
    Some places like National Parks or states are starting to charge people for costs of search and rescue if they think you were "negligent" in your actions.

  27. #24
    Zip, have you ever stated your reason for being on this board? I would really like to know.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Influenza View Post
    which one of yall fuckers wrote the "ron paul" racist news letters
    Quote Originally Posted by Dforkus View Post
    Zippy's posts are a great contribution.




    Disrupt, Deny, Deflate. Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3): http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...eptive-members



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Actually you need to be outside of the US and personally appear at a US consulate or embassy to apply for renouncing your citizenship. The information you give has to be verified which takes time and costs to be researched. It isn't just "I don't want to do this anymore- cross my name off the list" by mail or email thing.
    Why not? Here's my ID. This was my SSN. Cancel subscription. DONE. It should cost less than $25.

    'We endorse the idea of voluntarism; self-responsibility: Family, friends, and churches to solve problems, rather than saying that some monolithic government is going to make you take care of yourself and be a better person. It's a preposterous notion: It never worked, it never will. The government can't make you a better person; it can't make you follow good habits.' - Ron Paul 1988

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    ...the familiar ritual of institutional self-absolution...
    ...for protecting them, by mock trial, from punishment...


  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by NorthCarolinaLiberty View Post
    Zip, have you ever stated your reason for being on this board? I would really like to know.
    Paying for services is counter to Libertarianism? Paying the real costs helps get proper allocation of resources. If something is subsidized or under priced it will be over- utilized (actually this is an economic, not political view).

    Have you stated your reasons? Do you ask all people that question?
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 08-29-2014 at 03:31 PM.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Paying for services is counter to Libertarianism?

    Have you stated your reasons? Do you ask all people that question?

    I'm on here to read the news, talk with like-minded people, and have a couple of a laughs.

    No, I don't ask everyone that question, but I'm asking you. Why are you on this forum?
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Influenza View Post
    which one of yall fuckers wrote the "ron paul" racist news letters
    Quote Originally Posted by Dforkus View Post
    Zippy's posts are a great contribution.




    Disrupt, Deny, Deflate. Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3): http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...eptive-members

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Paying for services is counter to Libertarianism? Paying the real costs helps get proper allocation of resources. If something is subsidized or under priced it will be over- utilized.

    Have you stated your reasons? Do you ask all people that question?
    Answering questions with questions. I am not very active on this board, but I have been lurking for a while. It is rather easy to spot the trolls.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by NorthCarolinaLiberty View Post
    I'm on here to read the news, talk with like-minded people, and have a couple of a laughs.

    No, I don't ask everyone that question, but I'm asking you. Why are you on this forum?
    To be a paid government shill and take names, numbers and addresses. Congratulations on making the list!

    (Yes, that is a joke!).

    I take it you think I don't belong. Because I don't always agree with everything? A world where everybody agrees is a very boring one. It also stagnates and never changes. Nobody has to think. I don't trust somebody who agrees with everything.
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 08-29-2014 at 03:24 PM.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Paying for services is counter to Libertarianism? Paying the real costs helps get proper allocation of resources. If something is subsidized or under priced it will be over- utilized.

    Have you stated your reasons? Do you ask all people that question?
    Social contracts, the state, taxes etc etc are counter to libertarianism.

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