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Thread: Christie calls for 'forceful' defense of Israel, says Obama not 'decisive'

  1. #1

    Christie calls for 'forceful' defense of Israel, says Obama not 'decisive'

    Christie who had been reeling from Bridgegate scandal is trying to come back in the race for neocons' money bundlers? He should have stuck to dance off strategy.





    Christie calls for 'forceful' defense of Israel, says Obama not 'decisive'
    Published July 13, 2014
    July 12, 2014: New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie talks with the media at the National Governors Association convention in Nashville, Tenn. (AP Photo/Mark Humphrey)

    Partly blaming unrest in the Middle East on President Barack Obama, New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie said Saturday that Obama has not spoken firmly and forcefully on Israel's behalf and that the country no longer trusts it has the full support of the United States because of him.
    "Israel is not sure that they have America's full support like they used to," Christie said. "And that's a real failure of this presidency, in my view.."
    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014...-not-decisive/




    Not a fan of Obama but does Christie know what Obama has to put up with in criticisms/pressures from both sides on his "walk the rope" balancing act on Israel policy?
    Could it be that the nobel peace prize winner is doing something right on this issue if he is being attacked so harshly from both sides?
    Following are just few views, albeit extreme from the two ends of the spectrum, with underlying beliefs that Obama is not sufficiently pro-Israel / is too pro-Israel.



    Some pro-Israel critics of Obama:

    Ben Shapiro: Obama White House is ‘borderline a Jew-hating administration’
    July 11, 2014 by Tom Tillison
    Truth Revolt editor Ben Shapiro held nothing back in offering a tough assessment of the Obama administration‘s response to the terrorist group Hamas attacking Israel, saying it’s a borderline “Jew-hating administration.”
    http://www.bizpacreview.com/2014/07/...tration-130914


    Publisher of the ‘Atlanta Jewish Times’ suggests Mossad should assassinate Obama
    Adam Horowitz on January 20, 2012
    John Cook reports at Gawker:
    Andrew Adler, the owner and publisher of the Atlanta Jewish Times, a weekly newspaper serving Atlanta’s Jewish community, devoted his January 13, 2012 column to the thorny problem of the U.S. and Israel’s diverging views on the threat posed by Iran. Basically Israel has three options, he wrote: Strike Hezbollah and Hamas, strike Iran, or “order a hit” on Barack Obama. Either way, problem solved!
    Here’s how Adler laid out “option three” in his list of scenarios facing Israeli president Benjamin Netanyahu (the column, which was forwarded to us by a tipster, isn’t online, but you can read a copy here):
    Three, give the go-ahead for U.S.-based Mossad agents to take out a president deemed unfriendly to Israel in order for the current vice president to take his place, and forcefully dictate that the United States’ policy includes its helping the Jewish state obliterate its enemies.

    Yes, you read “three” correctly. Order a hit on a president in order to preserve Israel’s existence. Think about it. If I have thought of this Tom Clancy-type scenario, don’t you think that this almost unfathomable idea has been discussed in Israel’s most inner circles?
    Another way of putting “three” in perspective goes something like this: How far would you go to save a nation comprised of seven million lives…Jews, Christians and Arabs alike?
    You have got to believe, like I do, that all options are on the table.




    Some "anti-Israel" critics of Obama:




    The following is from the website of the Anti-Defamation League. ADL, which monitors and combats anti-Semitism worldwide, is one of the 32 agencies and programs funded by The Birmingham Jewish Federation Annual Campaign.

    http://archive.adl.org/anti_semitism...tion-2012.html


    Some conservative critics of Obama:

    James Woods on Obama: He’s the ‘gift from hell’

    The Washington Times Thursday, September 12, 2013





    The latest came this week, in response to a report from British press that revealed the National Security Agency commonly provides Israel with intelligence data — without first stripping out private and personal information on American citizens. The Guardian in London reported the item, the latest in its coverage of document leaks from Edward Snowden.
    Mr. Woods unleashed his views of the matter — and of Mr. Obama's role in allowing the practice to occur — on Twitter.
    He wrote: "Report: Data on Americans shared with Israel ... Obama: the gift from hell that keeps on giving."
    This is hardly the first unfavorable rating Mr. Woods has posted on his Twitter account about Mr. Obama. In July, the actor ranted over Mr. Obama's insertion of his personal opinion into the George Zimmerman-Trayvon Martin trial, characterizing it as fueling racial tensions and wondering why the president would speak his mind about the death of the 17-year-old Trayvon but not worry so much about American's soldiers and wounded warriors.
    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/sep/12/james-woods-obama-hes-gift-hell/




    Related

    Caution Graphic Video: USTF funded strike kills 4 Palestinian children on Gaza beach in 2nd tap


    Obama: 'Israel Has The Right To Defend Itself'

    Bachmann: If We Don’t Completely Support Israel, God Will Curse Us



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  3. #2
    So,,

    The next election depends on the support for the state of Israel.

    I do not believe that is a topic that is open for debate.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  4. #3
    American politics being driven by Israel.

    Seriously?







    Watch this game go down.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  5. #4
    Obama is pretty much being a pesky dumbass to Israel.

    "Show restraint" "Try not to hurt too many civilians"

    All while Hamas is firing thousands of rockets into Israel, using human shields, and violating a ceasefire that Israel observed.

    Meanwhile, Harry Reid won't allow a vote on Rand Paul's bill to cut aid to the Palestinian Authority (unity government which includes Hamas).

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    All while Hamas is firing thousands of rockets into Israel, using human shields, and violating a ceasefire that Israel observed.
    Pfizer Macht Frei!

    Openly Straight Man, Danke, Awarded Top Rated Influencer. Community Standards Enforcer.


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    The Federalist Papers, No. 15:

    Except as to the rule of appointment, the United States have an indefinite discretion to make requisitions for men and money; but they have no authority to raise either by regulations extending to the individual citizens of America.

  7. #6
    As someone of chinese descent... what make jews so special? Mao ze dungs government killed 60 million chinese... dont see me boo hooing about it.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by alucard13mm View Post
    As someone of chinese descent... what make jews so special? Mao ze dungs government killed 60 million chinese... dont see me boo hooing about it.
    MARKETING
    FLIP THOSE FLAGS, THE NATION IS IN DISTRESS!


    why I should worship the state (who apparently is the only party that can possess guns without question).
    The state's only purpose is to kill and control. Why do you worship it? - Sola_Fide

    Baptiste said.
    At which point will Americans realize that creating an unaccountable institution that is able to pass its liability on to tax-payers is immoral and attracts sociopaths?

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by jkr View Post
    MARKETING
    True,,
    to a large extent.

    But watch this become the defining theme of the next election,, watch whatever/whoever that is out there fall over themselves trying to see who loves Israel more.
    The defining theme of elections,, from now on. (if it hasn't been going on already)
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    Obama is pretty much being a pesky dumbass to Israel.

    "Show restraint" "Try not to hurt too many civilians"

    All while Hamas is firing thousands of rockets into Israel, using human shields, and violating a ceasefire that Israel observed.

    Meanwhile, Harry Reid won't allow a vote on Rand Paul's bill to cut aid to the Palestinian Authority (unity government which includes Hamas).
    Palestine......

    Oh, you mean that piece of land where the former residents of Israel were shoved and is not allowed to be a country? The place that had democratic elections which did not please the holy masters of the US and Israel, so they would not allow the government to take place?

    The place where the people are held as prisoners while the US spreads democracy?
    There is no spoon.

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    Obama is pretty much being a pesky dumbass to Israel.

    "Show restraint" "Try not to hurt too many civilians"

    All while Hamas is firing thousands of rockets into Israel, using human shields, and violating a ceasefire that Israel observed.
    Curious, do you agree or disagree with this view about him?

    Ben Shapiro: Obama White House is ‘borderline a Jew-hating administration’
    July 11, 2014 by Tom Tillison


    Quote Originally Posted by TaftFan View Post
    Meanwhile, Harry Reid won't allow a vote on Rand Paul's bill to cut aid to the Palestinian Authority (unity government which includes Hamas).
    Reid is a well known tool of controversial zionist group AIPAC, his stance is not surprising at all and is in line with wishes of his puppet mastas.

    AIPAC Opposes Bill to Cut U.S. Aid to Palestinians
    May 1, 2014 2:27 pm
    The nation’s leading pro-Israel lobbying group will not support new legislation that would cut off U.S. aid to the Palestinians, according to multiple sources tracking the debate.

  13. #11
    US Senate is also making its voice heard:

    U.S. Senate unanimously approves resolution giving full support of Israel on Gaza


    The resolution had 78 bipartisan co-sponsors and was introduced by Sens. Robert Menendez (D-N.J.), Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.), Charles Schumer (D-N.Y.) and Kelly Ayotte (R-N.H.) The House passed a similar res. July 11.

    By Chemi Shalev | Jul. 20, 2014
    WASHINGTON - The U.S. Senate unanimously approved a non-binding resolution in support of Israel’s right to defend itself against rocket fire from the Gaza Strip.
    The resolution, which had 78 bipartisan sponsors, passed late Thursday by unanimous consent, a week after it was introduced by Sens. Robert Menendez (D-N.J.), Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.), Charles Schumer (D-N.Y.) and Kelly Ayotte (R-N.H.).
    A similar resolution, introduced by Reps. Steve Israel (D-N.Y.) and Tom Cole (R-Okla.) and with over 140 cosponsors, passed unanimously in the U.S. House of Representatives on July 11.
    The American Israel Public Affairs Committee, which backed both resolutions, praised the Senate for its passage.

    http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/1.606183





    Related

    LewRockwell.com: U.S. Senators Are Nearly All Stooges for Israel

    Info about Obama's secret meet with AIPAC BoDs leaked on youtube ( 6:00 mark)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apSkh...tailpage#t=350

    Israel can tap U.S. arms stockpile if needed
    U.S. stores munitions in classified location in Israel to which army can request access - if Obama approves.
    Jul. 16, 2014
    If the Israeli army needs more missiles or artillery ammunition in the present conflict with Hamas, it can ask Washington for permission to use munitions from an emergency U.S. stockpile located at a classified site in Israel.
    .. the Israel Defense Forces did just that during the Second Lebanon War in 2006 – and was granted permission


    Massacre in Gaza: At least 60 killed in Shuja’iyeh, over 60,000 in UN shelters

    July 20, 2014


    Israeli forces heavily shelled the eastern Gaza City neighborhood of Shuja’iyeh last night killing 63 Palestinians, including at least 17 children,and causing thousands to seek shelter in United Nations facilities. This latest attack brings the total number of Palestinians killed since Operation Protective Edge began on July 8, 2014 to more than 350. Over 63,173 are now living in UNRWA shelters across Gaza, nearly 10,000 more than the number of Palestinians made refugees after Operation Cast Lead in 2008-09. According to Haaretz reporter Anshel Pfeffer an IDF officer described last night’s onslaught on Shuja’iyeh as Israel “taking off the gloves.”

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1bm2GPoFfg

    CNN removes journo after she called Israelis cheering missile strike in Gaza as “Scum."

    Israel-Gaza conflict: Israeli military ‘using flechette rounds in Gaza Strip’


    The tiny arrow-like ammunition, fired in their thousands in a tank shell, have been described as carrying ‘a particularly high danger of harming innocent civilians’http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...p-9617480.html

  14. #12
    I was over at Breitbart today reading the piece about the two from Texas that got killed after volunteering to help Israel in this fight. The allegiance to Israel is astounding there.
    "The Patriarch"

  15. #13
    Hamas is using human shields in this conflict and forbidding it's civilians to flee. Clustering as many women and children as they can around bombing targets in order to raise their body count and curry sympathy from the west. What these people are doing is indefensible, and the people who are falling for their propaganda are nothing more than enablers.

    Israel of course, does the opposite, and actually warns civilians beforehand, telling them to flee before the area is bombed. Which side do you think has the moral high ground here?

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by DevilsAdvocate View Post
    Hamas is using human shields in this conflict and forbidding it's civilians to flee. Clustering as many women and children as they can around bombing targets in order to raise their body count and curry sympathy from the west. What these people are doing is indefensible, and the people who are falling for their propaganda are nothing more than enablers.

    Israel of course, does the opposite, and actually warns civilians beforehand, telling them to flee before the area is bombed. Which side do you think has the moral high ground here?
    Neither. And we don't need a "forceful-defense" for either side.
    "The Patriarch"

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by DevilsAdvocate View Post
    Israel of course, does the opposite, and actually warns civilians beforehand, telling them to flee before the area is bombed. Which side do you think has the moral high ground here?
    You may have a point there; Israel does do so, just as terrorist group Irgun used to make phone calls before bombing targets like King David hotel.


    Encyclopedia of Terrorism - Volume 1 - Page 394
    books.google.com/books?isbn=0313308950
    Peter Chalk - 2012 - ‎Political Science
    Donna Bassett KING DAVID HOTEL BOMBING On July 22, 1946, a 350-kilogram (771-pound) bomb ... The Irgun made three phone calls prior to the bombing.




  18. #16
    Rand Paul asked to "promise to always stand with Israel" in 2010:

    Last edited by anaconda; 07-20-2014 at 08:11 PM.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by DevilsAdvocate View Post
    Hamas is using human shields in this conflict and forbidding it's civilians to flee. Clustering as many women and children as they can around bombing targets in order to raise their body count and curry sympathy from the west. What these people are doing is indefensible, and the people who are falling for their propaganda are nothing more than enablers.

    Israel of course, does the opposite, and actually warns civilians beforehand, telling them to flee before the area is bombed. Which side do you think has the moral high ground here?
    Riiiiiiiight.....

    Goliath is Winning in Gaza
    By Eric Margolis
    July 19, 2014

    Israel is clearly winning the David v. Goliath struggle with Palestinians in Gaza.

    Israel’s Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, seized on the murder in June of three Jewish teenagers from a West Bank settlement to launch Israel’s third war against Gaza in six years.

    So far, some 230 Palestinians have been killed, 70% women and children, and one Israeli has died. Israeli bombing and shelling has made the rubble in Gaza bounce.

    As in the two previous Israeli assaults on Gaza, it’s unclear who began the reciprocal rounds of shelling. Palestinians claim Israel broke what had been a successful, 18-month cease-fire; Israel claims Hamas fired first.

    In fact, the latest conflict was likely begun by rockets launched against Israel by the militant Islamic Jihad movement to avenge an air attack by Israel on its members. Israel knows just how to provoke the Palestinians to violence.

    Hamas, the Palestinian Islamic movement, replied to Israeli air attacks by launching salvos of home-made and smuggled rockets at Israel. These unguided weapons have proven militarily useless, little better than rocks. But they gave Israel an ideal pretext to attack Gaza and try to crush the elected Hamas government, which Israel considers its bitterest foe after Lebanon’s Hezbollah.

    The Palestinians made a grave mistake resorting to rockets and mortars. Firing back at Israel certainly makes Palestinians feel good, but doing so has allowed Israel’s powerful worldwide supporters to portray the Gaza siege as a battle between equals, rather than what it really is – Israel shooting fish in a barrel.

    “Israel has the right to defend itself,” goes the pro-Israel mantra – one even repeated by US President Barack Obama.

    It matters not that Israel is violating US law – the Arms Control Export Act – by using US weapons against Gaza’s civilians. Nor that the assault on Gaza violates international law and the Geneva Convention. Or that much of the world sees the assault on Gaza as a crime against humanity. US elections are on the horizon and the US/Canadian government and media have taken Israel’s side.

    Hamas rejected the fraudulent US/Israeli engineered truce presented by Egypt, Israel’s new best friend. On Thursday night, Israel launched a major ground offensive into Gaza, strongly backed by Washington. Palestinians have been starved and denied basic materials for years by the Israel-Egyptian siege of Gaza. The 1.7 million Gaza inhabitants live in a giant open air concentration camp on the verge of malnutrition.

    The current Israeli attacks have shut down Gaza’s sewage, water and power grid, a tactic the US used in Iraq in 1991 that caused the deaths, according to the UN, of 500,000 Iraqi children. These attacks are designed to break the will of Gaza’s people, and cause them to overthrow Hamas.

    It’s worth recalling that Israel helped give birth to Hamas. Israel security forces turned a blind eye to Hamas activities, and may have secretly funded it, in hopes the Islamic movement would split the Palestinians (it did) and rival the PLO. This was, of course, before PLO chief Yasser Arafat was murdered and the current PLO leadership brought under US and Israeli control.

    Today, Israelis can’t even say the word ‘Hamas” without scowling and making a spitting sound…hhhhhhhhhhhamas.

    Hamas has played right into Israel’s hands by launching its rocket barrages, which have proven worse than useless. Israel will now receive a half billion dollars more from the US to acquire more of its excellent Iron Dome anti-missile systems.

    Meanwhile, PM Netanyahu has managed to portray Palestinians as rabid terrorists with whom no negotiations are possible. Any Palestinian state next to Israel, warns Netanyahu, would become another Gaza, shooting rockets into peaceful Israel.

    Netanyahu used the Gaza crisis to repeat he would never accept even a Palestinian mini state on the West Bank. Israel must forever control the eastern border of Palestine – the Jordan River Valley. Palestinians will be left with self-governing tribal reservations. To many Israelis, Palestinians are simply wild animals who must be caged up.

    By again attacking Gaza, Netanyahu has made any Israeli-Arab peace deal all the more impossible. He has also shown that his patron, the United States, has little say in the matter. Ever-timid President Obama offered to mediate between Israel and the PLO (not Hamas) while the world was waiting for him to order Israel to cease fire.
    There is no spoon.

  21. #18
    So who is handling Christie these days? Is it still Condoleezza Rice?
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  22. #19

  23. #20




    of subject... but on a home defense level, super low penetration... maximum destruction; custom coat hanger flachettes:


    'We endorse the idea of voluntarism; self-responsibility: Family, friends, and churches to solve problems, rather than saying that some monolithic government is going to make you take care of yourself and be a better person. It's a preposterous notion: It never worked, it never will. The government can't make you a better person; it can't make you follow good habits.' - Ron Paul 1988

    Awareness is the Root of Liberation Revolution is Action upon Revelation

    'Resistance and Disobedience in Economic Activity is the Most Moral Human Action Possible' - SEK3

    Flectere si nequeo superos, Acheronta movebo.

    ...the familiar ritual of institutional self-absolution...
    ...for protecting them, by mock trial, from punishment...


  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by enhanced_deficit View Post
    Doubt it, Christie be too dumb to associate with her.

    Partial list of Christie advisors:

    New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie:

    Condoleezza Rice, former Secretary of State
    Henry Kissinger, former Secretary of State
    Richard N. Haass, president, Council on Foreign Relations
    Robert E. Grady, venture capitalist and former White House associate budget director

    https://news.yahoo.com/brain-trusts-...185300373.html
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  25. #22
    I get so tired of the anti Israel stuff here. It really has absolutely nothing to do with non interventionism at all. True non interventionists should be critical of Obama for interfering in Israel's internal affairs and trying to tell them that they don't have the right to defend themselves. Telling Israel to show "restraint" when Hamas is launching rockets into their country is simply absurd, and non interventionists should strongly condemn President Obama for violating Israel's sovereignty and trying to dictate to them what they can and can't do.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Traditional Conservative View Post
    I get so tired of the anti Israel stuff here. It really has absolutely nothing to do with non interventionism at all. True non interventionists should be critical of Obama for interfering in Israel's internal affairs and trying to tell them that they don't have the right to defend themselves. Telling Israel to show "restraint" when Hamas is launching rockets into their country is simply absurd, and non interventionists should strongly condemn President Obama for violating Israel's sovereignty and trying to dictate to them what they can and can't do.
    So calling for "restraint" is now a bad thing? Can't see how that violates anyone's sovereignty. Just sounds like advise, unless Obama has made some threat to attempt to enforce that advise.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Traditional Conservative View Post
    I get so tired of the anti Israel stuff here. It really has absolutely nothing to do with non interventionism at all. True non interventionists should be critical of Obama for interfering in Israel's internal affairs and trying to tell them that they don't have the right to defend themselves. Telling Israel to show "restraint" when Hamas is launching rockets into their country is simply absurd, and non interventionists should strongly condemn President Obama for violating Israel's sovereignty and trying to dictate to them what they can and can't do.
    lol, cut off aid to Israel and watch the squawking.
    Pfizer Macht Frei!

    Openly Straight Man, Danke, Awarded Top Rated Influencer. Community Standards Enforcer.


    Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!

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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Danke View Post
    lol, cut off aid to Israel and watch the squawking.
    I say cut it off to everyone .

  30. #26
    I respect the Palestinians for trying to defend themselves and their land, but it's futile. At some point they need to give up, because they aren't going to win. I say that knowing full well the aggressions that Israel has done upon them, but this fighting isn't getting them anywhere. How many generations of Palestinians must die?

    That's just me though. It's their land, their families, so if they want to fight, that's their choice. I'm just hoping they aren't fighting simply out of pride, at this point.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
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    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  31. #27
    Well I guess if the Palestinians can hold out long enough for the US to collapse, they may get international support to get their land back.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Traditional Conservative View Post
    I get so tired of the anti Israel stuff here. It really has absolutely nothing to do with non interventionism at all. True non interventionists should be critical of Obama for interfering in Israel's internal affairs and trying to tell them that they don't have the right to defend themselves. Telling Israel to show "restraint" when Hamas is launching rockets into their country is simply absurd, and non interventionists should strongly condemn President Obama for violating Israel's sovereignty and trying to dictate to them what they can and can't do.
    Im sick of people actually thinking that its our duty to defend another country, Im sick of political lobbying for another country which I see as the very definition of treason. Israel has its own problems, but they are by and large one of the good guys as far as I am concerned. But just because I want them to prosper doesn't mean I want them lobbying my congressmen, and calling people jew haters because they don't provide support to a country.

    When someone like Obama who is a borderine neo-con on foreign policy is being called a jew hater because of his deemed lackluster support for a country I think we have a serious $#@!ing problem.

    Now if Israel was actually on the verge of being destroyed I would probably want to support them militarily, but this entagling support we have for a country is just a bad foreign policy move.
    A society that places equality before freedom with get neither; A society that places freedom before equality will yield high degrees of both

    Make a move and plead the 5th because you can't plead the 1st

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by dillo View Post
    Now if Israel was actually on the verge of being destroyed I would probably want to support them militarily
    Ya, in which case they could probably use some more of these, for, you know, protecting Israel:

    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by bxm042 View Post
    I respect the Palestinians for trying to defend themselves and their land, but it's futile. At some point they need to give up, because they aren't going to win. I say that knowing full well the aggressions that Israel has done upon them, but this fighting isn't getting them anywhere. How many generations of Palestinians must die?

    That's just me though. It's their land, their families, so if they want to fight, that's their choice. I'm just hoping they aren't fighting simply out of pride, at this point.
    You seem very certain, what is the basis of this certitude?

    Election of son of an African arab muslim man as POTUS few years after 9/11 attacks on WTC1/2 and following wars was a radical shift in US , as was British policy change after Irgun terror attacks on King David Hotel in Palestine decades ago.
    US had not always been sugar daddy sponsoring Israeli occupation of Palestinians, for self-interest why US Americans could not revert back to stances like these inthe post 9/11 world?

    U.S. had emergency plan for attacking Israel in 1967

    Plan was aimed at preventing Israel from expanding westward, into Sinai, or eastward, into the West Bank.
    By Amir Oren | Apr. 23, 2007
    For some time, the United States had had an emergency plan to attack Israel, a plan updated just prior to the 1967 war, aimed at preventing Israel from expanding westward, into Sinai, or eastward, into the West Bank. In May 1967, one of the U.S. commands was charged with the task of removing the plan from the safe, refreshing it and preparing for an order to go into action.

    This unknown aspect of the war was revealed in what was originally a top-secret study conducted by the Institute for Defense Analyses in Washington.
    http://www.haaretz.com/news/u-s-had-...-1967-1.218857

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