Malaysia Airlines passenger jet reportedly shot down in Ukraine

[AngryCanadian]

Reagan: "It was an understandable accident."

Yup and where was the western journalism and news media.


Reagen was a Hero.

[AngryCanadian]

Vice has some very disturbing footage of the wreckage. Don't watch if you are queasy - I had to turn it off when they started showing mangled bodies.

It is a very sad thing. I doubt the higher-ups had the intention of shooting a passenger jet. Especially Putin because he obviously knew he would immediately be blamed. It was most likely a couple of low-level rebel $#@!s who thought they were so badass with their fancy weaponry.

The fact that the plane was being followed by Ukrainian fighters i doubt that it were the rebels.

[UWDude]

most of the evidence points to Russian separatists shooting down the MH17 on accident, they even took credit for it on twitter/social media until they discovered it was civilian, then they deleted everything ... unless this information is forged or an elaborate conspiracy, Putin has blood on his hands.

Ukrainian rebels captured SAM missiles that could shoot down an airliner. Putin has done little to help the rebels, or they would not have been driven out of Slavyansk (if Russia wanted they could eliminate the Ukrainina military with a sneeze).

Even if this was a mistake by Ukrainian rebels, Putin does not have blood on his hands.

[UWDude]

Both of those do not fly over Donetsk. Both of those paths are south of it.

[wizardwatson]

Here's some more propaganda for this lovely Saturday.

And again, this was the top story on Google News. I will admit that my searching may be skewed to what I've been clicking on all week, but that doesn't necessarily mean the propaganda isn't aimed at everyone.

With Jet’s Fall, War in Ukraine Becomes Global

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/20/wo...obal.html?_r=0

...

But in that instant, the monthslong proxy war between East and West took a devastating turn, one that would shift the ground geopolitically amid the charred wreckage and broken bodies in a Ukrainian wheat field.

The downing of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 rippled across multiple continents, from Amsterdam where friends and family had just seen off their loved ones to the distant shores of Asia and Australia that had been waiting for 298 passengers and crew who would never show up.

...

Get that? It's a "world war".

Now this is mostly an emotional piece for the sheople. It doesn't actually address the aspects of the political state to say why it's a global issue apart from the fact that people from many countries died at once.

It's more of a "Get it in your head it's a global war now" piece.

So obey and start thinking like that. Got it?

[Brian4Liberty]

Here's some more propaganda for this lovely Saturday.

Yep, it's all anti-Russian, reckless interventionism propaganda.

And still, no one asks why the US supported regime in Kiev is using aircraft to bomb and attack it's own citizens. If this was Syria and Assad, John McInsane would be calling for arming the "rebels" and dropping bombs on Kiev.

[Dark_Horse_Rider]

yahoo news is touting the Sara Firth resignation from RT story because of downed plane, quoting her saying they were lying

[Dark_Horse_Rider]

funny how very public that resignation was

[Zippyjuan]

Wasn't RT the ones who said that shooting down the plane (which I still think was an accident- they thought it was a Ukrainian plane, not a civilian one) was a failed attempt to kill Putin?

[Petar]

Does anyone else find it rather coincidental that "the big bad Rooskies shoot down a civilian airliner" the very moment that Israel starts to really come under severe international scrutiny regarding its actions in Palestine?

[pcosmar]

Wasn't RT the ones who said that shooting down the plane (which I still think was an accident- they thought it was a Ukrainian plane, not a civilian one) was a failed attempt to kill Putin?

There have been a few rumors of that.. and Putin's plane did fly a similar route.

An observer (whoever targeted it) would see from the markings that it was not a military transport..

However, the Markings on the Malaysia plane are similar to Putin's Plane. It could have been mistaken by one of those sports hooligans or Far right Russian hating radical that make up the Ukrainian/Kiev faction.

[pcosmar]

Does anyone else find it rather coincidental that "the big bad Rooskies shoot down a civilian airliner" the very moment that Israel starts to really come under severe international scrutiny regarding its actions in Palestine?

So far that is only a conspiracy theory,, despite it also being a fact.

I don't think the two are unrelated.

[GunnyFreedom]

No, Putin has basically nothing to do with this. A group of rebels who happen to like Russia accidentally shoot down a passenger jet that had strayed into hotly contested air space, the shooters having expected some kind of military supply/weapons run from the de facto Ukraine gov. At best they can blame Putin for not telling the separatists to go home sit down and shut up.

The fact that the plane was being followed by Ukrainian fighters i doubt that it were the rebels.

Even if the Ukraine had jets on this contact (the myth of Reagan strikes again? lol), you would not know if it was being predated or escorted, neither would either scenario speak to the identity of a missile launched from the ground. Given a(n entirely speculative) scenario where the Ukraine had fighters on the contact, they could have just been investigating the aircraft, when a missile site on the ground see a large contact with two small escorts, and voila, this has to be our target. (RADAR is no longer 'just a blip')

[juleswin]

Wasn't RT the ones who said that shooting down the plane (which I still think was an accident- they thought it was a Ukrainian plane, not a civilian one) was a failed attempt to kill Putin?

Do you have a link to support that statement? Cos I bet the context will reveal the actual meaning and that's assuming they even made such a statement in the first place

[PRB]

There have been a few rumors of that.. and Putin's plane did fly a similar route.

An observer (whoever targeted it) would see from the markings that it was not a military transport..

However, the Markings on the Malaysia plane are similar to Putin's Plane. It could have been mistaken by one of those sports hooligans or Far right Russian hating radical that make up the Ukrainian/Kiev faction.

that wasn't the question, the question was, was RT the ones who said it?

[juleswin]

I think the biggest lesson I learned from this whole crisis is to never ever ever ever fly with Malaysian Airline. I know, I know, this is just 2 out of thousands of flights but I will do everything in my power to avoid getting on that airline.

[Zippyjuan]

that wasn't the question, the question was, was RT the ones who said it?

What I had seen was posted on "BeforeItsNews" (somebody else posted it here http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative...o-2994596.html ) which does make it questionable. It did quote RT which said that Putin's plane might have been in the area that same day about an hour before though RT did not say it might have been an attempt on the Russian President's life.

http://rt.com/news/173672-malaysia-plane-crash-putin/

Malaysian Airlines MH17 plane was travelling almost the same route as Russia’s President Vladimir Putin’s jet shortly before the crash that killed 298, Interfax news agency reports citing sources.

“I can say that Putin’s plane and the Malaysian Boeing intersected at the same point and the same echelon. That was close to Warsaw on 330-m echelon at the height of 10,100 meters. The presidential jet was there at 16:21 Moscow time and the Malaysian aircraft - 15:44 Moscow time,” a source told the news agency on condition of anonymity.

"The contours of the aircrafts are similar, linear dimensions are also very similar, as for the coloring, at a quite remote distance they are almost identical", the source added.

In fact, RT said that the Russian President's plane did not fly over the area. I didn't have time to double check earlier hence the questioning nature of my post.

At the same time, there have been reports contradicting Intefax’s report that was the first and the only media source to publish the news, saying that Presidential plane was not flying over Ukraine at the same time.

As a source told Gazeta.ru online news portal, Putin’s plane does take off from Vnukovo-3 [the terminal that accepts business jets], but the president does not fly over the conflict-gripped neighboring country.

“Putin has only one jet – Board One, he does not fly other planes. This plane always takes off from Vnukovo-3, but the presidential plane have not been flying over Ukraine for a while,” the source at Vnukovo-3 terminal said.

President Putin was on his way from Brazil, where he attended the BRICS summit, to Moscow.

It does blame the Ukranian government- saying no aircraft would have been shot down if they had not tried to repel forces which took over the region in Eastern Ukraine.

“This tragedy would not have happened if there was peace on this land, if military action in the southeast of Ukraine had not been resumed,” Putin said, adding that he has asked the appropriate Russian authorities to do everything to investigate the matter.

Ukraine should bear responsibility for Malaysian airliner tragedy, said the head of the Russian state at a meeting on economic issues, which he proposed to start with a minute of silence in memory of the victims of the disaster.

“Obviously, the state over whose territory it happened bears responsibility for this terrible tragedy,” he said late on Thursday.

Wouldn't that mean rebel occupied territory?

[Madison320]

According to Fox News it's Obama's fault for not being "tough enough".

Fox News is the logical reverse of MSNBC where everything is still Bush's fault.

Everytime I hear some idiotic right wing hack say the US needs to get tough I want to ask "with what money?"

[GunnyFreedom]

I think the biggest lesson I learned from this whole crisis is to never ever ever ever fly with Malaysian Airline. I know, I know, this is just 2 out of thousands of flights but I will do everything in my power to avoid getting on that airline.

LOL that was my first thought when this happened.

[luctor-et-emergo]

LOL that was my first thought when this happened.

I like flying when I sit next to the pilot. Apart from that it's a lottery thing to me, luckily I never win lotteries.

[Brian4Liberty]

Does anyone else find it rather coincidental that "the big bad Rooskies shoot down a civilian airliner" the very moment that Israel starts to really come under severe international scrutiny regarding its actions in Palestine?

Yep. Very coincidental. Connected or cause and effect? I doubt it.

[Brian4Liberty]

No, Putin has basically nothing to do with this. A group of rebels who happen to like Russia accidentally shoot down a passenger jet that had strayed into hotly contested air space, the shooters having expected some kind of military supply/weapons run from the de facto Ukraine gov. At best they can blame Putin for not telling the separatists to go home sit down and shut up.

Even if the Ukraine had jets on this contact (the myth of Reagan strikes again? lol), you would not know if it was being predated or escorted, neither would either scenario speak to the identity of a missile launched from the ground. Given a(n entirely speculative) scenario where the Ukraine had fighters on the contact, they could have just been investigating the aircraft, when a missile site on the ground see a large contact with two small escorts, and voila, this has to be our target. (RADAR is no longer 'just a blip')

Agree. That's the highest probably scenario.

[juleswin]

I like flying when I sit next to the pilot. Apart from that it's a lottery thing to me, luckily I never win lotteries.

How the hell do you sit anywhere near the pilot on an international flight? Even on small domestic flights, the closest strapped to the seat passenger is sitting at least 3 feet away from the cockpit. I cannot think of how that can be of any comfort to someone scared of dying from a plane crash

[luctor-et-emergo]

How the hell do you sit anywhere near the pilot on an international flight? Even on small domestic flights, the closest strapped to the seat passenger is sitting at least 3 feet away from the cockpit. I cannot think of how that can be of any comfort to someone scared of dying from a plane crash

I used to sit in the third seat (there's no flight engineer on MD11's) behind the captain (my father) and co-pilot. Best seat ever. These were usually cargo flights, so lots of freedom. I have only flown a couple times while seated in regular seats. My experience of flying was so good when I was younger that I don't really appreciate commercial flying anymore.

[Brian4Liberty]

Even if the Ukraine had jets on this contact (the myth of Reagan strikes again? lol), you would not know if it was being predated or escorted, neither would either scenario speak to the identity of a missile launched from the ground. Given a(n entirely speculative) scenario where the Ukraine had fighters on the contact, they could have just been investigating the aircraft, when a missile site on the ground see a large contact with two small escorts, and voila, this has to be our target. (RADAR is no longer 'just a blip')

Yeah, I have not seen any confirmation of Ukrainian fighter escorts. Does anyone have any links confirming them?

[GunnyFreedom]

Yeah, I have not seen any confirmation of Ukrainian fighter escorts. Does anyone have any links confirming them?

I don't even think they were rumored...I think the gentleman I was responding too got confused with the Reagan stuff.

[Danke]

No, Putin has basically nothing to do with this. A group of rebels who happen to like Russia accidentally shoot down a passenger jet that had strayed into hotly contested air space, the shooters having expected some kind of military supply/weapons run from the de facto Ukraine gov. At best they can blame Putin for not telling the separatists to go home sit down and shut up.

And just how the blank do you know?

[GunnyFreedom]

And just how the blank do you know?

The judicial application of Occam's Razor and the application of deductive reasoning. Of note, the utter lack of a significant and clear beneficiary.

[Brian4Liberty]

The judicial application of Occam's Razor and the application of deductive reasoning. Of note, the utter lack of a significant and clear beneficiary.

I would add that we also have some (not completely verified) evidence that the separatists very briefly celebrated shooting down a Ukrainian transport of some kind...

[PRB]

The judicial application of Occam's Razor and the application of deductive reasoning. Of note, the utter lack of a significant and clear beneficiary.

I already gave you a clear beneficiary.

ISRAEL IS BOMBING THE $#@! OUT OF GAZA AND NOBODY GIVES A $#@!.