View Poll Results: Do you see ending the of PetroDollar as a good thing or bad thing overall for US citizens.

Voters
24. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, absolutely; Bring on its demise.

    10 41.67%
  • No, it will destroy the US.

    2 8.33%
  • Unknown, I don't know what the PetroDollar is or why it is important.

    1 4.17%
  • Mixed. Some good, Some bad.

    11 45.83%
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Thread: Do you see ending the of PetroDollar as a good thing or bad thing overall for US citizens.

  1. #1

    Do you see ending the of PetroDollar as a good thing or bad thing overall for US citizens.

    Do you see ending the global hegemony of the PetroDollar as a good thing or bad thing overall for US citizens and the US govt?

    For further reading:
    http://archive.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul303.html
    Or listening:
    Last edited by specsaregood; 03-11-2014 at 10:00 AM.



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  3. #2
    Short term it will hurt badly. Long term we will be better off.

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    Short term it will hurt badly. Long term we will be better off.
    So, would you support legislation that would hasten its demise?

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    So, would you support legislation that would hasten its demise?
    NO
    ================
    Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.

    Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America

    The Property Basis of Rights

  6. #5

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    NO
    If you don't mind me asking, why?
    edit: I would suggest that Ron's competing currency legislation would have hastened its demise.

    Do you think its remotely possible that it ends in a calm, peaceful manner or a slow unwinding?

  8. #7
    OK. I've listened to half of the video in the OP. So far RP has not made a single mention of petrodollars. Does it actually come up in the video?

    I have trouble believing that there's anything economically significant about petrodollars. Oil and currency are both fungible. It doesn't really matter what unit you use to measure the value of oil exported and imported into countries.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by erowe1 View Post
    OK. I've listened to half of the video in the OP. So far RP has not made a single mention of petrodollars. Does it actually come up in the video?

    I have trouble believing that there's anything economically significant about petrodollars. Oil and currency are both fungible. It doesn't really matter what unit you use to measure the value of oil exported and imported into countries.
    Yes, it comes up. if you click on the link I provided its the text from that same speech. It is very economically significant. Well worth reading.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    So, would you support legislation that would hasten its demise?
    sure

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by erowe1 View Post
    I have trouble believing that there's anything economically significant about petrodollars. Oil and currency are both fungible. It doesn't really matter what unit you use to measure the value of oil exported and imported into countries.
    Its not measuring the value, its transacting. In order to buy oil via OPEC, you HAVE to have USD to buy the oil. this has created an artificial demand for USD for decades now. this is why the world has gladly accepted our debt.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    Short term it will hurt badly. Long term we will be better off.
    //
    There are only two things we should fight for. One is the defense of our homes and the other is the Bill of Rights. War for any other reason is simply a racket.
    -Major General Smedley Butler, USMC,
    Two-Time Congressional Medal of Honor Winner
    Author of, War is a Racket!

    It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours.
    - Diogenes of Sinope

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    sure
    I ask because if one wants to bring about an end to the petro dollar and if one assumes that Russia is serious about responding to sanctions by actively fighting the petrodollar and working with china to boot.... then one should support said sanctions.

  15. #13
    not a poll option.

    The end of the petrodollar will be the end of the Federal Reserve and the beginning of a ONE World Currency.

    It is only in place as long as it is useful.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    So, would you support legislation that would hasten its demise?
    They have done enough all ready.

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by erowe1 View Post
    OK. I've listened to half of the video in the OP. So far RP has not made a single mention of petrodollars. Does it actually come up in the video?

    I have trouble believing that there's anything economically significant about petrodollars. Oil and currency are both fungible. It doesn't really matter what unit you use to measure the value of oil exported and imported into countries.
    The dominance of petrodollars drive the adoption of the US Dollar as the World Reserve Currency. Without the US Dollar as the WRC, the Fed will not be able to offshore monetary inflation pressure, and the unloading of those reserves will create huge inflation problem. About the only way to avoid that outcome is to destroy all of these overseas dollars when they are on-shored; but I imagine the people repatriating these dollars are not going to like that idea very much.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    I ask because if one wants to bring about an end to the petro dollar and if one assumes that Russia is serious about responding to sanctions by actively fighting the petrodollar and working with china to boot.... then one should support said sanctions.
    There won't be any meaningful sanctions on Russia. Just a lot of talk and some show. The UK is already against them. Russia has the EU by the balls so they won't either. If Russia gets sanctioned, they cut off the flow of gas to the EU. So real sanctions aren't happening.



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  20. #17
    What is more important is what it is replaced with. If it is a world wide fiat currency, we have a major problem. If it is replaced by a currency that is backed by value, not fiat, and restrictions are imposed on Banks, then it can be a good thing. The destruction of the Petro Dollar is going to happen no mater what. It is a mathematical certainty. What we do decides where we are going, and we need to head to someplace better, not worse.
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.

  21. #18
    There are many possibilities. It could usher in a one-world currency and, with it, a one-world government. That would be a nightmare.

    It could also help us return to a gold-backed currency and, though we are hurt on the short-term, on the long-term, we will be better off.

    Then, of course, there is the possibility of Marxists being elected in the short term blowback as they promise to take care of everyone and blame Republicans/Libertarians for all the country's woes.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    Short term it will hurt badly. Long term we will be better off.
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    So, would you support legislation that would hasten its demise?
    We will see the dollars demise precisely when THEY want it.

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by GunnyFreedom View Post
    The dominance of petrodollars drive the adoption of the US Dollar as the World Reserve Currency. Without the US Dollar as the WRC, the Fed will not be able to offshore monetary inflation pressure, and the unloading of those reserves will create huge inflation problem. About the only way to avoid that outcome is to destroy all of these overseas dollars when they are on-shored; but I imagine the people repatriating these dollars are not going to like that idea very much.
    I thought about that yesterday after listening to Rand's proposal to lower the repatriation tax to 5%. That's a lot of FRN's that would come home...
    "When a portion of wealth is transferred from the person who owns it—without his consent and without compensation, and whether by force or by fraud—to anyone who does not own it, then I say that property is violated; that an act of plunder is committed." - Bastiat : The Law

    "nothing evil grows in alcohol" ~ @presence

    "I mean can you imagine what it would be like if firemen acted like police officers? They would only go into a burning house only if there's a 100% chance they won't get any burns. I mean, you've got to fully protect thy self first." ~ juleswin

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Paulbot99 View Post
    Then, of course, there is the possibility of Marxists being elected in the short term blowback as they promise to take care of everyone and blame Republicans/Libertarians for all the country's woes.
    My greatest fear.

    I also have great belief this will happen if any liberty candidate is elected to the Presidency. The country will still $#@! up due to Congress, the Supreme Court, and State and Local Governments, and it will be blamed solely on the President and his philosophy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sister Miriam Godwinson View Post
    We Must Dissent.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Spikender View Post
    My greatest fear.

    I also have great belief this will happen if any liberty candidate is elected to the Presidency. The country will still $#@! up due to Congress, the Supreme Court, and State and Local Governments, and it will be blamed solely on the President and his philosophy.
    One things for sure, they will blame the people that are dependant and addicted to their debt while no one will point a single finger at the source of the debt, Banks.
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.

  26. #23
    Yes and no. For long term health and stability; and to reduce our exposure to risk and economic attack, we have to get away from the petrodollar eventually. If we do not then we will be vulnerable to all kinds of horrific economic calamity. However, the collapse of the petrodollar will in the short run be disastrous for our economy.

    So, for the sake of the long term prosperity of the American economy, the petrodollar WILL have to end in order to reduce the exposure of some critical vulnerabilities to a world that by and large hates us today; however, unless that transition can be done carefully it will come as a calamity and do absurd harm to the economy.

    A catastrophic collapse of the petrodollar would do enough damage to America and our economy that we are better off at the status quo than a catastrophic collapse, HOWEVER, continuing the status quo while failing to address the issue at all will inevitably lead to that very catastrophic collapse, and worse for having put it off. SO, if we are adamantly and stubbornly refusing to address the issue and will have a catastrophic collapse sooner or later no matter what, then it is better sooner than later for recovery's sake. BUT if there is any real hope of putting people in power who will unhook from the petrodollar in a controlled fashion it is better to unhook in a controlled fashion a year from now than a catastrophic collapse today.

    So I guess my position is, if we simply aren't going to do anything to mitigate the petrodollar crisis, then just go on and collapse it right now -- but if there is any chance of a controlled unhooking in the future, we'd be light-years better off to hang on until then.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    not a poll option.

    The end of the petrodollar will be the end of the Federal Reserve and the beginning of a ONE World Currency.

    It is only in place as long as it is useful.
    Perpetuating this system of immorality and fraud will only make the correction that much more painful. That pain will be what causes the average American to accept a single global currency.

    Can you expound a bit on what exactly you are referring to?
    “The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.” --George Orwell

    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    In terms of a full spectrum candidate, Rand is leaps and bounds above Trump. I'm not disputing that.
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  29. #25
    Not sure if you noticed, but there is no longer a United States of America .. That thing in the White House has given entire control of the former United States to the United Nations ... So complain or question the Russians and Chinese, who now own the former USA

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by kcchiefs6465 View Post
    Perpetuating this system of immorality and fraud will only make the correction that much more painful. That pain will be what causes the average American to accept a single global currency.

    Can you expound a bit on what exactly you are referring to?
    Those that control the money, have a long term goal.
    Total control of all. They gained control of the US 100 years ago and have used the US Dollar,,as well as manipulating other currencies.
    Their Goal is a One World currency.

    The bible warned of (or foretold) this.
    It has been resisted for years,, but eventually they will impose it.

    There was not a related Poll option. The (eventual) end of the Petrodollar will be bad for everyone..
    The creation of the petrodollar was bad for everyone.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  31. #27
    I support , " real " dollars .

  32. #28
    It is nearly impossible to tell whether this would be "good" for the US, the world, or anyone because we do not know the degree to which control extends in such matters, what the ultimate goals are of those in power, and so on. There are manifold factors involved and even knowing them all it would still be difficult to make linear predictions about a system whose complexities may conceivably drive beyond linearity under circumstances.

    I am tempted to say that the collapse of this so-called system would be a good thing for the race of men in the longer term, but this is clearly uncertain. Given the disastrous consequences of such an event, one has to ask which of those among us shall stand tall and volunteer to be the first to step into the disintegration chambers? Given this small truth, I would have to say that collapse will only be "good" for those who survive, and even then the ascription may not be truthful, depending on what the survivors' world looks like.

    The bottom line is that we are painted into a very bad corner and all we can do is wait and see what (d)evolves from this point onward. I do not dare hope that the race of men shall bear with them the lessons in all this.
    Through lives and lives shalt thou pay, O' king.

    Freedom will be stolen from you in a heartbeat if you do not behave as a wild and ravening beast pursuant to its protection.

    "Government" is naught but a mental construct, a script to which people meekly accept and play out their assigned roles by those with no authority to dictate such.

    Pray for reset.


  33. #29
    Bring on the demise and yes, short term it will be painful. The younger I am when it happens the better I can cope with it.
    Quote Originally Posted by BuddyRey View Post
    Do you think it's a coincidence that the most cherished standard of the Ron Paul campaign was a sign highlighting the word "love" inside the word "revolution"? A revolution not based on love is a revolution doomed to failure. So, at the risk of sounding corny, I just wanted to let you know that, wherever you stand on any of these hot-button issues, and even if we might have exchanged bitter words or harsh sentiments in the past, I love each and every one of you - no exceptions!

    "When goods do not cross borders, soldiers will." Frederic Bastiat

    Peace.

  34. #30
    One way to break free from the status quo would be to get the crony out of capitalism. The oil lobbyists and defense contractors benefit immensely. Once free from their clutches, a movement to renewable energy could help in weaning us off of fossil fuel consumption and limit our need to dominate the middle east. While making a gradual shift away from business as usual, we could be building up gold reserves to strengthen the US dollar so that it remains the global currency of choice in trade.
    Last edited by Constitutional Paulicy; 06-21-2014 at 02:47 AM.
    “The easiest way to gain control of a population is to carry out acts of terror. [The public] will clamor for such laws if their personal security is threatened”.
    - Josef Stalin

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