Maybe its because single payer health care is better than the insurance cartel we have currently?
[mod delete]
Pfizer Macht Frei!
Openly Straight Man, Danke, Awarded Top Rated Influencer. Community Standards Enforcer.
Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!
Short Income Tax Video
The Income Tax Is An Excise, And Excise Taxes Are Privilege Taxes
The Federalist Papers, No. 15:
Except as to the rule of appointment, the United States have an indefinite discretion to make requisitions for men and money; but they have no authority to raise either by regulations extending to the individual citizens of America.
How about actually writing a coherent response instead of accusing people of being trolls.
Because a FNG would observe and learn before commenting. You could at least do a search as topics you are bringing up tonight in rapid succession have been debated here ad nauseum. (hmm...) So just bump some of those threads with your input, after reading them of course.Originally Posted by 56ktarget
No, you won't do that, 'cause you are just a $#@!ing troll.
Pfizer Macht Frei!
Openly Straight Man, Danke, Awarded Top Rated Influencer. Community Standards Enforcer.
Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!
Short Income Tax Video
The Income Tax Is An Excise, And Excise Taxes Are Privilege Taxes
The Federalist Papers, No. 15:
Except as to the rule of appointment, the United States have an indefinite discretion to make requisitions for men and money; but they have no authority to raise either by regulations extending to the individual citizens of America.
What makes you think that other countries with "socialized medicine" have better health care? How are you arriving at this claim or conclusion?
Thats funny, I actually did and all I see are threads warning about death panels and how a massive government conspiracy are making all those numbers up. If you can't issue a rational response, just ignore the thread and move on.
Last edited by 56ktarget; 01-21-2014 at 01:31 AM.
It is well documented that America has the 37th best health care system in the world.
http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp0910064
http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html
Oh - I see what you're doing, now; you're equating redistribution of wealth with health care quality.
This.
Statistics that put other countries ahead tend to positively index the mere fact that socialized healthcare exists.
Also US system is highly socialized already. Elderly, children and poor qualify for free healthcare. Only young working professionals get screwed.
Dude. Seriously.
You're brand new. You just register. You don't bother to introduce yourself. Then you immediately toss out the following threads:
Why did the economy boom during the 1950's when the top tax rate was 91%?
America has the highest gun violence in the world
Do Libertarians support the Citizens United decision?
Why do other countries with "socialized medicine" have better health care?
Obama is not a liberal
Libertarian policies were already tried... It was called the Articles of Confederation
It's clear you understand that RPF is a libertarian/anarchist/voluntaryist minded forum. It's equally clear you have an immense dislike for all things libertarian.
If you are here to have a civil exchange, share a few ideas and promote your own statist viewpoint, and if you want to do it in earnest and really be a part of this community, you're off to a very bad start.
Given the actions I listed above, why should we NOT consider you to be a troll?
It took me a few years to go through all of the discussion here before I ever even registered as a member. I've never really been a big fan of existing members (of any public platform) attacking new members (especially with the auto troll label) who register just because I think that the forum serves a unique means for others to synergize, even if disagreement exists. But, as others have mentioned, there is a wealth of discussion here. Nobody really wants to start from scratch. Especally when you come in cock strong...bull of the woods kind of thing. Whatever though. Consider my advice.
I don't have a problem with trolls, but at least be interesting. Do I go over to DU and talk about how liberalism has created more pansy men? No, I don't do that. Do I talk about how the liberal wuss would let his wife get raped in his own home because the big, black gun is so scary? No again. You're welcome.
You started a thread about healthcare?! Guns and homicide?!! Give me a break. Go back to the drawing board and try again. At least put the words "white man" and "racist" in the same paragraph. Your post doesn't even have to be remotely true. Maybe something along the lines of how liberal women have bigger breasts. Who knows? Maybe that is true. Go do some research and find out. Anyway, post $#@! like that. Be sure to post some good pictures.
Now get your government-support-me ass in gear, and come back when you're more interesting.
That is very possible that you are right. It is very possible that a quasi free market system where the government fund over 60% of the healthcare system and regulates to death the other 40% is going to less efficient that a system where the govt via tax payers funds 99.9% of it. But still, it would be trading one tyrant for another.
Maybe its because single payer health care is better than the insurance cartel we have currently?
Just imagine a system where the govt seizes the children of the country and sends them to a govt approved boarding school. Do you think that system would not produce on average better behaved and educated children than we have right now in this quasi free market system? if you agree with me, then does it follow that we should let the govt en mass seize of the children and fix the nations problem with under educated and bad behaved children?
Freedom to fail and succeed counts for something. This forum is not called liberty tree for nothing, people here will never accept the idea of an immoral mean justifying the ends.
Note: I am totally in favor of allowing people who want this govt system the right to pool together and pay some extra taxes to govt so it can provide this socialized medicine for them.
Why do so many folks from socialized medicine countries come to the USA for their health care?
An answer: no rationing and the lines and waiting time to be seen is shorter. (This unfortunately, will probably change and be lost under Obamacare.)
Last edited by Ronin Truth; 01-21-2014 at 07:39 AM.
Honestly, I can imagine some socialized clinics can treat a lot of small things. Because it's free, people go in there and the clinic catches things like Hypertension. You can prevent small health issues from becoming serious through neglect. Or have less people that stay home diagnosing themselves on WebMD or something.
However, if you are hit by a car or get cancer, I can imagine that American medicine can put you back together better. I think catastrophic medical conditions are where private medicine does the job better even though it's extremely expensive. Or may be the difference between whether or not a limb is saved or amputated.
But that number doesn't compare to the number of Americans going to India, East Asia and south American for treatment. Socialized medicine has greater access on Average and the US system also has access but prices is a bigger hindrance to obtaining that access
The truth is both systems are flawed, govt is into every aspect of the US healthcare system and you cannot expect anything good to come out of it. Depending on your situation socialized medicine can offer a better option that the quasi free market system we have in the US.
US health care costs started going ballistic with the passage of Medicare in the 60s.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_(United_States)
So you honestly believe that Turkey has better healthcare than Switzerland? Because the way you are apparently interpreting that graph.........
Hey, who believes that Mexico has better healthcare than Sweden? And if Mexican healthcare is so good, why are so many Mexicans trying to come to America?
The Slovak Republic has better healthcare than the UK, Spain and Denmark?
Or is % of GDP spent on healthcare and absolutely stupid way to rate how good healthcare is?
Maybe its because single payer health care is better than the insurance cartel we have currently?
9/11 Thermate experiments
Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I
"I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"
"We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul
"It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
How many Americans are going to Mexico for healthcare? According to the OP graph, healthcare in Mexico must be much better. And India isn't even on the OP graph. Are they better or worse? Can't say from the graph.
9/11 Thermate experiments
Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I
"I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"
"We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul
"It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
The graph is for Healthcare spending as % of GDP. It saying nothing about the quality or access of healthcare in X country. So a country at the top of the list can still have a better healthcare system than one on top of that list.
Ummm...yeah. That's my point! So why even pretend this troll actually said anything of use? And for the record, I have heard Obamacare supporters use the stupid "America spends more on healthcare than anyone else" argument as if it actually means something. It doesn't.
9/11 Thermate experiments
Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I
"I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"
"We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul
"It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
I thought most Americans where going to the border for cheaper drugs.
Nope...cause you'd be banned in 30 seconds.
The wisdom of Swordy:
On bringing the troops home
On fighting corruption:
Fascism Defined
I can only offer an anecdote, but one of my customers was an Indian. He got deathly sick while visiting India, and his wife spent upwards of 6 figures to hire an air ambulance to get him back here.
They both grew up and went to school in India. Still had family there, he owned a couple of farms and did massive amounts of charity work there. They were not strangers in a strange land.
Last edited by angelatc; 01-22-2014 at 04:24 PM.
That figures. The DU members probably run away, flailing their arms in panic. "Help, somebody is attacking my argument! Please call 911!!!"
I'd expect an air ambulance from Inda to the US to cost more than $100.
Depends on who you are. If you have resources and good insurance, you get access to the best coverage in the world. If you lack resources or insurance, you can get poor care.
DADADADADAAnytime I see this rear its head I remember looking at charts. The high cost of healthcare looks directly attributed to government involvement. (And I agree that gluttonous bureaucracy is the first thing that needs some stapling... )
Most people connect the HMO act of 1973 with the skyrocketing of costs. We see that in this 100 year chart:
But the visual story goes back further, with precipitous rises from earlier government interventions
Roosevelt's irksome Revenue Act of 1942 opened Pandora's Box and incubated the quasi public monstrosity we see today. It gave tax incentives to businesses for Healthcare "benefits", it did not include any such incentives to individuals... So lets look at a smaller section of that chart from that era - 1910 to 1960
The next foray by the socialists was the Medicare Act of 1965, so lets look at that time frame:
What is kinda disturbing is how moderate the pre Medicare rise looks compared to the former chart, which ends where the latter begins...
Which brings us to the HMO Act of 1973, which actually doesn't show such a drastic rise (and my layman's mind attributes to the onerous nature of these cumulative interventions with the corresponding avalanche of paperwork bureaucracy pushes to justify its existence)
which brings us back to the first chart, only lets bring it as far back as we can go - 1792 to 2010
Looks to me like government meddling is the problem
It should also be noted that during the entire history of the US, we have been close to the top among countries for life expectancy. Further, it was mainly the Nordic countries that we trailed as the avg has risen worldwide and it has basically been since the time frames mentioned in the above charts that the rest of the world has been catching up and overtaking. A tool to see that is here:
www.bit.ly/coSUs8
Charity is good - Mandates are bad.
Yup, they will ban you and then come around to dance on your grave after you cannot defend yourself. They will also congratulate themselves for getting rid of a voice of decent. You cannot question or even correct their outright lies without getting the boot.
Yup, also the system we have in the US is very good for people with diseases and illness that is very rare and is very expensive and unprofitable to research and treat. The govt seizing and funding healthcare with massive amounts of tax payers money has created a high quality not seen anywhere in the world.
Would the free market choose to invest their limited resources this way if given the chance? nobody can tell. So depending on your condition, socialized medicine like they have in Europe can be a much better system than what we have in the states.
Posting Permissions
Connect With Us