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Thread: Has anybody ever demanded a jury trial to fight a traffic ticket?

  1. #1

    Default Has anybody ever demanded a jury trial to fight a traffic ticket?

    Very curious as I was stopped at a DUI checkpoint and given tickets for such things as using my cell phone (because I was recording the officer)

    Wanted to know anybodys' personal experience or input on the matter.

    Thanks



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  3. #2

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    No idea, but made me think of this:

    There are only two things we should fight for. One is the defense of our homes and the other is the Bill of Rights. War for any other reason is simply a racket.
    -Major General Smedley Butler, USMC,
    Two-Time Congressional Medal of Honor Winner
    Author of, War is a Racket!

    It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours.
    - Diogenes of Sinope

  4. #3

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    Please keep us updated....tell us how it went.
    Today I decided to get banned and spam activism on this forum...

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    Quote Originally Posted by orenbus View Post
    If I had to answer this question truthfully I'd probably piss a lot of people off lol, Barrex would be a better person to ask he doesn't seem to care lol.


  5. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Mitrosky View Post
    Very curious as I was stopped at a DUI checkpoint and given tickets for such things as using my cell phone (because I was recording the officer)

    Wanted to know anybodys' personal experience or input on the matter.

    Thanks
    Get links to what you are charged with and lets have a crack at it.

  6. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Mitrosky View Post
    Very curious as I was stopped at a DUI checkpoint and given tickets for such things as using my cell phone (because I was recording the officer)

    Wanted to know anybodys' personal experience or input on the matter.

    Thanks
    No, I haven't. I always had a job and taking days off to fight a ticket I was fairly certain I would lose, as certain human's testimony is worth more than another's, so I just plead no contest and got it over with. I strongly discourage doing that. I'm paying dues to a union that doesn't even represent me to this day. It's rather insane when you think about it.

    Fight it til the end. Especially for something so flagrantly corrupt as that. There is precedent after precedent outlining the right to film public servants. It isn't even up for debate. Unfortunately there is a corrupt system that does not care about its own decrees. If you do get a trial by jury, which I didn't even think most traffic tickets qualified for, (you end up getting a trial by judge, if I'm not mistaken) you should easily win. Contact the local paper and see if they are interested in justice. Write an editorial outlining the absurdity. Good luck.
    “The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.” --George Orwell

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  7. #6

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    While I've never had to deal with NJ in this respect, I've ALWAYS attempted to get a jury trial on traffic matters. When sending in the ticket to plead not guilty, I always include a written statement saying "I wish to exercise my right to a trial by jury, and hereby request a jury trial". The response I've always gotten is that a jury trial is only given in criminal court, not traffic court, and this alleged right does not exist with regards to traffic courts. The bastards know damn well that they would never win traffic cases if it was up to a jury.
    I have an autographed copy of Revolution: A Manifesto for sale. Mint condition, inquire within. (I don't sign in often, so please allow plenty of time for a response)

  8. #7

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    I'd get a DUI lawyer and plea out if you think you are guilty in this case. Maybe you will only own 3 grand and 100 hours of community service before it's over. And I wouldn't take about this online using your real name. And if you already did, I'd delete it. If there is a jury trial, that will come up in the trial.
    Lifetime member of more than 1 national gun organization and the New Hampshire Liberty Alliance. Part of Young Americans for Liberty and Campaign for Liberty. Free State Project participant and multi-year Free Talk Live AMPlifier.

  9. #8

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    i didnt get in trouble for drunk driving.. i got in trouble because i asked the cop where i could opt out and he said i couldnt opt out so i told him it was unconstitutional.

    so i got tickets for things like not having a license plate on the front of my car, not having a current inspection, and for using a cell phone.. because i was recording him.

    traffic violations are considered criminal, so the constitution guarantees my right to a trial by jury in all criminal cases.. 6th amendment.. as well as the NJ constitution.



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  11. #9

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    I just saw this today. Might come in handy for you:

    http://www.copblock.org/40583/on-fre...-act-requests/
    "Sorry, fellows, the rebellion is off. We couldn't get a rebellion permit."

  12. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tod View Post
    I just saw this today. Might come in handy for you:

    http://www.copblock.org/40583/on-fre...-act-requests/
    i dont think i need anything like that but i appreciate the thought

  13. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by kcchiefs6465 View Post
    No, I haven't. I always had a job and taking days off to fight a ticket I was fairly certain I would lose, as certain human's testimony is worth more than another's, so I just plead no contest and got it over with. I strongly discourage doing that. I'm paying dues to a union that doesn't even represent me to this day. It's rather insane when you think about it.

    Fight it til the end. Especially for something so flagrantly corrupt as that. There is precedent after precedent outlining the right to film public servants. It isn't even up for debate. Unfortunately there is a corrupt system that does not care about its own decrees. If you do get a trial by jury, which I didn't even think most traffic tickets qualified for, (you end up getting a trial by judge, if I'm not mistaken) you should easily win. Contact the local paper and see if they are interested in justice. Write an editorial outlining the absurdity. Good luck.
    I have been on salary about my whole life . The only advantage it has ever afforded me is I will take a day off and show up in court in a hearbeat for a ticket. The locals know this , so they only give me warning tickets .

  14. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Mitrosky View Post
    Very curious as I was stopped at a DUI checkpoint and given tickets for such things as using my cell phone (because I was recording the officer)

    Wanted to know anybodys' personal experience or input on the matter.

    Thanks
    Well , I dunno , but I would imagine using the phone while stopped would not be a legitimate ticket .

  15. #13

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    You cant win a jury trial in New Jersey unless you are very clearly innocent. This is one of the most pro-government states, Democrat or Republican, in the entire country, and it has been since the War for Independence. New Jersey was a notorious Tory state, and even had the estranged Tory son of Ben Franklin as governor.

    However, you can fight traffic tickets fairly easily with the right know how. At a minimum, you can get this reduced easily. If you are lucky, and can probe the right angles, you can get it all tossed. There is a fellow, I think Marc Stevens, who writes and speaks a lot about how to fight in traffic court. Its all a racket and has no legal basis. I think he said 75% of the time, they get you the heck out of court asap as soon as they realize what you are up to. There is some line of questioning you can go thru that reveals a contradiction, and that forces the case to be dismissed. I am not entirely sure how it works, and I havent looked at the site in awhile, but its really fascinating and informative. There are even court videos. I have never done it, but considering how successful ticket fights are even without this stuff, its no stretch. There is also the possibility that the cop who is the witness wont show up, and usually after a postponement or two, the judge tells the prosecutor to stuff it. Cops hate showing up at court over stupid stuff. Judges also hate stupid stuff. Just be prepared.

    Regarding DUI checkpoints, they appear to be easy to get out of if you appear sober and make it clear that you are not easy pickings. Like all predators, they want the peons and its easier to just let you go then to waste resources and time fighting this.



    Now, you have to wonder what would happen if multiple people at a checkpoint refused to comply simultaneously.

    This is also an example of why dashcams are useful and why every libertarian, or really everyone should have one in their car. One facing out and one facing the window. Literally, for the price of a traffic ticket, you can set this up and probably get out of any ticket.
    Quote Originally Posted by DamianTV View Post
    When Freedom is Outlawed, only Outlaws will have Freedom.

  16. #14

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    Why do you believe their *codes* apply to you?


    http://www.marcstevens.net
    “One may come to the aid of another being unlawfully arrested, just as he may where one is being assaulted, molested, raped or kidnapped. Thus it is not an offense to liberate one from the unlawful custody of an officer, even though he may have submitted to such custody, without resistance.” (Adams v. State, 121 Ga. 16, 48 S.E. 910).

  17. #15

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    It is amazing how many people downvote you tube videos of checkpoint refusal.
    "Sorry, fellows, the rebellion is off. We couldn't get a rebellion permit."

  18. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tod View Post
    It is amazing how many people downvote you tube videos of checkpoint refusal.
    Really it isn't. Think about it. The video is from 2011 and it has 540 downvotes. There's far more than 540 govt parasites that either participate in these checkpoints or something similar. Add to that the MADD nuts and it's understandable that theres an agenda and followers.



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  20. #17

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    Do you have the video? Post it on Youtube and contact PINAC (Photographyisnotacrime.com) Their audience is quite effective at lighting up the telephone lines.

    Do a write up of what happened and submit to Copblock.org. They'll post it on their site.

    The more attention the better. I doubt the judge will uphold the bogus charge, but in the event that he does, making a stink about it is a victory in itself.

  21. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Mitrosky View Post
    Very curious as I was stopped at a DUI checkpoint and given tickets for such things as using my cell phone (because I was recording the officer)

    Wanted to know anybodys' personal experience or input on the matter.

    Thanks
    I'd start looking for ways to weasel out long before it gets to a jury trial.

    One of the most productive things you can do is get to court as soon as it opens. Then hope your case gets called late enough you've got your defense figured out solid enough to speak it out plain and simple in terms to court recognizes and can rubber stamp something nice for you and send you on your way. Usually several cases will be almost like yours.

    Also listen to those before you trying things the court frowns on. That can also end things very quickly for you if you didn't pay attention.

    Not having any priors alone can get you a freebee in some courts.


    A jury trial used to be a way that got some prosecuting attorneys backed into a corner because of the expense. I wouldn't bank on that much anymore. They are in with the people that can fire up the fake money presses and print up what ever it takes to get their way. You don't want them mad and having their way with you.

  22. #19

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    Having refamiliarized myself with Marc Stevens, I cannot recommend checking out his site marcstevens.net enough. Listen to the old radio shows, check out the forums, and poke around the site. The main thing he advocates doing is asking if the prosecution has any evidence that their constitution and laws apply (ie, have jurisdiction). The courts have several stock responses to this, but it seems 75% of cases get tossed/dismissed in nonviolent offenses. The answer to the question is no, they have no evidence. Any purported evidence is fallacious circular logic (the law applies because it says it does).

    All of you should check it out. Be prepared in advance of future extortion notices and kidnappings.
    Quote Originally Posted by DamianTV View Post
    When Freedom is Outlawed, only Outlaws will have Freedom.

  23. #20

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    "Sorry, fellows, the rebellion is off. We couldn't get a rebellion permit."

  24. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Mitrosky View Post
    i didnt get in trouble for drunk driving.. i got in trouble because i asked the cop where i could opt out and he said i couldnt opt out so i told him it was unconstitutional.

    so i got tickets for things like not having a license plate on the front of my car, not having a current inspection, and for using a cell phone.. because i was recording him.

    traffic violations are considered criminal, so the constitution guarantees my right to a trial by jury in all criminal cases.. 6th amendment.. as well as the NJ constitution.

    I wouldnt know...because I happen to be one of those majority of citizens who have the proper registration, safety inspection and license plates. Sounds to me as youre the one clearly at fault here. Man up and accept the tickets.

  25. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronnyman View Post
    I wouldnt know...because I happen to be one of those majority of citizens who have the proper registration, safety inspection and license plates. Sounds to me as youre the one clearly at fault here. Man up and accept the tickets.
    HA HA HA. Welcome to the forums. You clearly are not libertarian.

    He didnt initiate aggression against anyone. he didnt steal, hurt or kill anyone. he didnt endanger anyone either. He is not "at fault at all", if you consider libertarian principles of nonaggression. He is at fault if you think that we are slaves and should obey our masters just because they say so (NO RECORDING OF KINGS SOLDIERS etc.).
    Today I decided to get banned and spam activism on this forum...

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    Quote Originally Posted by orenbus View Post
    If I had to answer this question truthfully I'd probably piss a lot of people off lol, Barrex would be a better person to ask he doesn't seem to care lol.


  26. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronnyman View Post
    I wouldnt know...because I happen to be one of those majority of citizens who have the proper registration, safety inspection and license plates. Sounds to me as youre the one clearly at fault here. Man up and accept the tickets.
    Thank you for following the law. Myself, the state of New Jersey, whatever state you live in, and this great country of the United States of America, thank you.

    It's threads like this that remind me how great it is to be a law abiding citizen. It just makes life... easy.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  27. #24

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronnyman View Post
    I wouldnt know...because I happen to be one of those majority of citizens who

    'We endorse the idea of voluntarism; self-responsibility: Family, friends, and churches to solve problems, rather than saying that some monolithic government is going to make you take care of yourself and be a better person. It's a preposterous notion: It never worked, it never will. The government can't make you a better person; it can't make you follow good habits.' - Ron Paul 1988

    Awareness is the Root of Liberation Revolution is Action upon Revelation

    'Resistance and Disobedience in Economic Activity is the Most Moral Human Action Possible' - SEK3

    Flectere si nequeo superos, Acheronta movebo.

    ...the familiar ritual of institutional self-absolution...
    ...for protecting them, by mock trial, from punishment...




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  29. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Barrex View Post
    HA HA HA. Welcome to the forums. You clearly are not libertarian.

    He didnt initiate aggression against anyone. he didnt steal, hurt or kill anyone. he didnt endanger anyone either. He is not "at fault at all", if you consider libertarian principles of nonaggression. He is at fault if you think that we are slaves and should obey our masters just because they say so (NO RECORDING OF KINGS SOLDIERS etc.).

    The fact is his car was out of date.....inspection/registration and no front plate. Plain and simple. A cop can pull you over for just not having a plate or a bulb out. Pretty common sense here folks. Im no boot suck....I just abide by the law. Knowing mitrosky....he probably gave the cops a load of crap too because he hates all Feds and cops. And the cell phone...well here in NY its the law and a hefty fine.....people just need to deal with it...theres a reason the laws are in place.....for our safety. more people are dying now while texting than most all other accidents.....but you guys dont seem to understand that part.

  30. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronnyman View Post
    The fact is his car was out of date.....inspection/registration and no front plate. Plain and simple. A cop can pull you over for just not having a plate or a bulb out. Pretty common sense here folks. Im no boot suck....I just abide by the law. Knowing mitrosky....he probably gave the cops a load of crap too because he hates all Feds and cops. And the cell phone...well here in NY its the law and a hefty fine.....people just need to deal with it...theres a reason the laws are in place.....for our safety. more people are dying now while texting than most all other accidents.....but you guys dont seem to understand that part.

    Oh, look, it's another troll I get to neg rep. If you check "Ronnyman's" posts, then it looks like he is just seeking posts where he can troll. Like these:

    We dont need a wimp like Ron Paul leading this nation.
    LOL....conspiracy? Is this the place to hang with the conspiracy freaks?
    Enjoy your pink bars soon!
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Influenza View Post
    which one of yall fuckers wrote the "ron paul" racist news letters
    Quote Originally Posted by Dforkus View Post
    Zippy's posts are a great contribution.




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  31. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronnyman View Post
    The fact is his car was out of date.....inspection/registration and no front plate. Plain and simple. A cop can pull you over for just not having a plate or a bulb out. Pretty common sense here folks. Im no boot suck....I just abide by the law. Knowing mitrosky....he probably gave the cops a load of crap too because he hates all Feds and cops. And the cell phone...well here in NY its the law and a hefty fine.....people just need to deal with it...


    theres a reason the laws are in place.....for our safety.



    more people are dying now while texting than most all other accidents.....but you guys dont seem to understand that part.

    You're new here. Meet one of our collective heros:




    'We endorse the idea of voluntarism; self-responsibility: Family, friends, and churches to solve problems, rather than saying that some monolithic government is going to make you take care of yourself and be a better person. It's a preposterous notion: It never worked, it never will. The government can't make you a better person; it can't make you follow good habits.' - Ron Paul 1988

    Awareness is the Root of Liberation Revolution is Action upon Revelation

    'Resistance and Disobedience in Economic Activity is the Most Moral Human Action Possible' - SEK3

    Flectere si nequeo superos, Acheronta movebo.

    ...the familiar ritual of institutional self-absolution...
    ...for protecting them, by mock trial, from punishment...


  32. #28

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronnyman View Post
    ..theres a reason the laws are in place.....for our safety.
    Indeed. Without a front license plate or registration sticker, someone could get seriously hurt. And without safety inspections.... god.... I don't even want to imagine the harm & chaos that would ensue.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  33. #29

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronnyman View Post
    The fact is his car was out of date.....inspection/registration and no front plate. Plain and simple.
    Even if true: SO WHAT? Who did he hurt?
    A cop can pull you over for just not having a plate or a bulb out.Pretty common sense here folks...
    In Nazi Germany cop could send you to prison (concentration camp).
    In communist Yugoslavia cop could send you to prison (concentration camp) if you sang certain song.
    Im no boot suck....I just abide by the law.
    Could you tell me the difference? You know, just in case our definitions differ.


    Knowing mitrosky....he probably gave the cops a load of crap too because he hates all Feds and cops. And the cell phone...well here in NY its the law and a hefty fine.....people just need to deal with it....... more people are dying now while texting than most all other accidents.....but you guys dont seem to understand that part.
    "Load of crap" is covered in your thingy called first amendment.
    He obviously started using his phone to video-record cop AFTER he was pulled over and not while driving. NO TEXTING. No one was in danger
    Regarding hefty fine read again my part about concentration camps.
    theres a reason the laws are in place.....for our safety.
    To counter your argument I just punched myself in my left leg. Not too much just to feel some pain in protest to all of those pricks outside who do things "for my safety". Take that.
    Today I decided to get banned and spam activism on this forum...

    SUPPORT RANDPAULDIGITAL GRASSROOTS PROJECTS TODAY!

    http://i.imgur.com/SORJlQ5.png

    For more info. or to help spread the word, go to the promotion thread here.



    Quote Originally Posted by orenbus View Post
    If I had to answer this question truthfully I'd probably piss a lot of people off lol, Barrex would be a better person to ask he doesn't seem to care lol.


  34. #30

    Default

    Looks like Ronnyman also has sock puppet accounts. He has those accounts giving him + reps.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Influenza View Post
    which one of yall fuckers wrote the "ron paul" racist news letters
    Quote Originally Posted by Dforkus View Post
    Zippy's posts are a great contribution.




    Disrupt, Deny, Deflate. Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3): http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...eptive-members

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