Well, I'm no cultural authority on these matters. Most of our parishes seem to really be connected that way, giving the kiss of peace whenever possible. Or in my case, getting my face squished and lips kissed by a 93 year old Eastern European woman. hahaOriginally Posted by heavenlyboy34
Perhaps.My parish is Antiochian (Byzantine rite is the correct term, IIRC).
Tonight was intro to orthodoxy class again. First we discussed Icons. (that thing that so many non-orthodox so despise for various irrational reasons :P ) In particular the distinction between "veneration" and "worship" of them. Also the meanings of some of the imagery. Then we discussed Theotokos at pretty good length. Then martyrs and saints. Neat stuff, IMO.
Chris promises he will teach me about liturgical music ASAP.
Hey HB, check out this link. It has 24 hour music as well many podcasts you might enjoy!
Www.ancientfaithradio.com
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
Hey HB, check out this link. It has 24 hour music as well many podcasts you might enjoy!
Www.ancientfaithradio.comYou must spread some Reputation around before giving it to TER againLove it!
Good stuff! There's tons of meaning in iconography. Nothing in Orthodoxy is done without meaning. I don't remember who it was but they called icons theology for the illiterate. Pictures are universal and transcend language barriers. One could understand the entire Gospel in iconography alone. The Resurrection icon is my favorite.Tonight was intro to orthodoxy class again. First we discussed Icons. (that thing that so many non-orthodox so despise for various irrational reasons :P ) In particular the distinction between "veneration" and "worship" of them. Also the meanings of some of the imagery. Then we discussed Theotokos at pretty good length. Then martyrs and saints. Neat stuff, IMO.
Liturgical music is also fascinating stuff. I enjoy both the Byzantine and Russian styles!
A true treasure trove of knowledge. Thankfully the Maddox family has vision, I hope it grows into a television network some day!Hey HB, check out this link. It has 24 hour music as well many podcasts you might enjoy!
Www.ancientfaithradio.com
Did you find that missing 1 or more intro to orthodoxy classes affected your progress? Just curious in case I'm too busy, can't get a ride, etc. and have to miss some class time.Good stuff! There's tons of meaning in iconography. Nothing in Orthodoxy is done without meaning. I don't remember who it was but they called icons theology for the illiterate. Pictures are universal and transcend language barriers. One could understand the entire Gospel in iconography alone. The Resurrection icon is my favorite.
Liturgical music is also fascinating stuff. I enjoy both the Byzantine and Russian styles!
Not terribly. But then again, my wife and I were personally taught by our priest in individual sessions. So we chose the time that worked for us.
However, there's such a wealth of podcast and books (as approved by your priest) that it's easy to catch up.
This book is a stellar introduction and easy to read (plus plenty of Scripture references)
A book loaned to me by the local Orthodox Priest is: http://www.amazon.com/Introducing-Or...ony+m+coniaris
It goes pretty deep yet still reads easily. I'm still in prayer about my direction, but if I remain a Catholic, the book will still help me to appreciate my own faith better.
Before the New Testament, Was the Divine Liturgy
By Elder Sophrony of Essex
We Orthodox live Christ within the Divine Liturgy, or rather Christ lives within us during the Divine Liturgy. The Divine Liturgy is a work of God. We say: "Time is a creation of the Lord". Among other things it means now is the time for God to act. Christ liturgizes, we live with Christ.
The Divine Liturgy is the way we know God and the way God becomes known to us.
Christ celebrated the Divine Liturgy once and this passed into eternity. His divinized human nature came to the Divine Liturgy. We know Christ specifically in the Divine Liturgy. The Divine Liturgy we celebrate is the same Divine Liturgy which was done by Christ on Great Thursday in the Mystical Supper.
The 14th through the 16th chapters of the Gospel according to John is one Divine Liturgy. So in the Divine Liturgy we understand Holy Scripture.
The early Church lived without a New Testament, but not without the Divine Liturgy. The first records, the written hymns, exist in the Divine Liturgy.
In the Divine Liturgy we live Christ and understand His word.
As Christ cleansed His Disciples with his word and said to them: "You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you” (John 15:3) and He washed the feet of His Disciples with water, during the Sacred Washing, so also in the first section of the Divine Liturgy He cleanses us that we might attend later His Table of love. The purpose of the Divine Liturgy is to convey Christ to us.
The Divine Liturgy teaches us an ethos, the ethos of humility. As Christ sacrificed Himself, so also should we sacrifice ourselves. The type of the Divine Liturgy is the type of impoverishment for us. In the Divine Liturgy we try to be humbled, because we have the sense that there is the humble God.
Every Divine Liturgy is a Theophany. The Body of Christ appears. Every member of the Church is an icon of the Kingdom of God.
After the Divine Liturgy we must continue to iconify the Kingdom of God, keeping His commandments. The glory of Christ is to bear fruit in every member His fruit. This explains His word: "Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit" (John 15:8).
Source: I Knew A Man In Christ: The Life and Times of Elder Sophrony, the Hesychast and Theologian (Οίδα άνθρωπον εν Χριστώ: Βίος και πολιτεία του Γέροντος Σωφρονίου του ησυχαστού και θεολόγου) by Metropolitan Hierotheos of Nafpaktos and Agiou Vlasiou
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
The Divine Liturgy is the Greatest Mission of the Church
By Elder Sophrony of Essex
Our greatest missionary work in life takes place in the Divine Liturgy. The Fathers of the Church would always build an Altar of Sacrifice in whatever country or city they traveled to. And this is so, because when the heart is sweetened by the Divine Liturgy, it then seeks God. It then desires to live an Orthodox ecclesiastical life, the heart of which is the Holy Eucharist.
I told the brotherhood that it should always be a priority for it to perform the Divine Liturgy in the Monastery. The prayers of the Divine Liturgy should not be intoned for personal gratification because at that moment the priests are expressing the prayers of all those praying in Church. And for this reason the priests should not be praying with self-centered feelings. We do not celebrate as individuals.
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
what an uplifting thread. thanks.
The bigger government gets, the smaller I wish it was.My new motto: More Love, Less Laws
Great 9 part podcast series on the Divine Liturgy by two converts to the Orthodox Church.
http://ourlifeinchrist.com/?page_id=325
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
Oh, new happening-I have recently contacted my priest's secretary to get a meeting with him so he can teach me how to read/perform liturgical music per his offer. I've long been fascinated by it, and unfortunately instruction in the theory and practice of it seems to be only available to clergy. 'Twill be an interesting learning experience.
I'm jealous! (in a good way)Oh, new happening-I have recently contacted my priest's secretary to get a meeting with him so he can teach me how to read/perform liturgical music per his offer. I've long been fascinated by it, and unfortunately instruction in the theory and practice of it seems to be only available to clergy. 'Twill be an interesting learning experience.
This is a mini lesson about the Eight Tones important in liturgical music. This would be a good prep before Father Chris gives you more indepth instruction.Oh, new happening-I have recently contacted my priest's secretary to get a meeting with him so he can teach me how to read/perform liturgical music per his offer. I've long been fascinated by it, and unfortunately instruction in the theory and practice of it seems to be only available to clergy. 'Twill be an interesting learning experience.
http://ourlifeinchrist.com/?page_id=315
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
We are all members of the church, all members and parts of the body of Christ, each important and with different abilities and gifts. And though you jest that you are jealous (for I know you have only joy to see HB's blessed seeking and growing in the faith), there is a sad fact that jealously exists in this world. The demon of envy stems directly from our pride, and this is what one must overcome to grow in the life of Christ. Only in humility are we members of Christ Who was humble. Only in love do we share in His love. Humbling our minds is the only way and opening our hearts to others is the work of the ekklesia, the church, the assembly of believers. This is the mission of the faithful, the members of Him, who in obedience with the Word and communing of Him, have held fast to the teachings and traditions of the saints, empowered and illumined by Him by His Holy Spirit. When we celebrate the Holy Eucharist, we do so with 2000 years of saints. Glory to You, our merciful and loving God! Glory to You, our Savior and Giver of Life!I'm jealous! (in a good way)
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
We too should humble our minds to the Church, for when we do so, we submit to the Head of the Body, namely Jesus Christ. The faith is not what we think, it is what has been carried down from the beginning and through the ages.
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
I understood the church to be the bridegroom of Christ, not his body. Can you explain what you mean there? (btw, I like how you describe the faith. This phrase is found over and over in orthodox prayer and liturgical chant. It's very beautiful and poetic.
The Church is a lot of things!I understood the church to be the bridegroom of Christ, not his body. Can you explain what you mean there? (btw, I like how you describe the faith. This phrase is found over and over in orthodox prayer and liturgical chant. It's very beautiful and poetic.
By definition, ekklesia (the greek word for church and the word written in the original New Testament) means 'assembly of believers'. You see, the church is not the temple we pray in or the building we partake in the Divine Liturgy, the church is the believers, the faithful men, women, and children who meet in these sacred places in order to pray for the world. The church is wherever the faithful congregate.
The church is also described as the body of Christ, that is, the presence of Christ in the world among the assembly of believers. For where two or three are together in His name, He is in the midst of them and sups with them. Thus, the church is the living presence of Christ in this material world, the very Body of Christ in the world.
The church is also described the bride of Christ in the New Testament. In Revelation, we read about the multitudes saying in chorus : "
“Hallelujah!
For the Lord our God
the Almighty reigns.
Let us rejoice and exult
and give him the glory,
for the marriage of the Lamb has come,
and his Bride has made herself ready;
it was granted her to clothe herself
with fine linen, bright and pure”—
for the fine linen is the righteous deeds of the saints.
And the angel said to me, “Write this: Blessed are those who are invited to the marriage supper of the Lamb.” And he said to me, “These are the true words of God.”" (Revelation 19:6-9)
Above, we learn that in the Last Day, their will be a marriage feast of the Lamb, and in this heavenly eucharistic celebration, the bride, that is the church, will offer herself to Christ and be united with God (in a type of holy matrimony). In this faith, the assembly of believers are indeed in one faith, one mind, one spirit, one Lamb, and one bride.
And not only as a passive participant, but in an offering. For 'the Bride has made herself ready; it was granted her to clothe herself with fine linen, bright and pure'
And how did she make herself ready? By faith alone is how we clothe ourselves with fine linen, bright and pure? No, 'for the fine linen is the righteous deeds of the saints'.
That is why the church, the assembly of believers, look to the saints for instruction and emulation.
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
Well, what I mean to say, is I've been trying out for the choir but it's a "come-as-you-are" type setup and there's no formal practice sessions. I'd like to have some more formal training but there doesn't seem to be at my parish. Thankfully I have a wife who is professionally trained so she helps me not look totally lost.
beware that your church choir may use one of the archaic systems of notation which your wife may not understand. Those systems tend to have a pretty steep learning curve for those of us trained in Western music.Well, what I mean to say, is I've been trying out for the choir but it's a "come-as-you-are" type setup and there's no formal practice sessions. I'd like to have some more formal training but there doesn't seem to be at my parish. Thankfully I have a wife who is professionally trained so she helps me not look totally lost.
Oh yes, we've already dealt with this! No tempo or key indicated.beware that your church choir may use one of the archaic systems of notation which your wife may not understand. Those systems tend to have a pretty steep learning curve for those of us trained in Western music.
nice site with the audio hymns of the Major Feasts of the Church in Greek and English whereby to practice for those who are musically inclined!
http://chant.hchc.edu/#
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
The entire notation system is different!
There are versions which have the music written in western notation, in fact, that is how most of the choirs here in the west probably read them.The entire notation system is different!
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
I prefer the Tridentine over the Byzantine. It is truly the closest thing to heaven on earth...a matter of taste I suppose.
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