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Thread: Austrian Economics - PhD student

  1. #1

    Austrian Economics - PhD student

    Hello, I'm a grad student at a top20 in economics... When I was 17 or so, I used to watch Ron Paul videos, etc.. I was one of you guys

    But, after being exposed to real economics, I must say. Austrian economics is marginalized, and even made fun of, not because there is a conspiracy going on, but because its un-scientifical, and downright funny.

    So. Stop trolling "keynesian" videos. Stop harassing good researchers. Study "mainstream" before attacking it blindly. Thank you



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  3. #2
    LOL. Good troll. "Un-scientifical" Is that even a word? But thank you. You provided good fodder for another thread.
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  4. #3
    Perhaps you should try to fit a formal logic class into your schedule. And maybe redo english 101?

  5. #4
    Appeal to authority, ad hominem, no true scotsman, begging the question, and a red herring all fit inside 4 complete sentences and 3 fragments. Pretty impressive OP.

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by kozel View Post
    Hello, I'm a grad student at a top20 in economics... When I was 17 or so, I used to watch Ron Paul videos, etc.. I was one of you guys

    But, after being exposed to real economics, I must say. Austrian economics is marginalized, and even made fun of, not because there is a conspiracy going on, but because its un-scientifical, and downright funny.

    So. Stop trolling "keynesian" videos. Stop harassing good researchers. Study "mainstream" before attacking it blindly. Thank you
    The mainstream ain't as great as you make it out to be. Mainstream economics isn't like mainstream science, because mainstream science deals with facts, not theories backed up with insufficient evidence.

    For example, most economists would have you believe that trade started out as bartering, whereas evidence suggests, as mentioned in David Graebar's "5000 Years", that primitive societies used systems of credit and debit as money.

    Also, most economists believe the loanable funds theory, that is fractional reserve banking, that deposits create loans, but evidence is mounting up that suggests the opposite, that is that loans actually create deposits and new money is literally created by private banks when they make loans. This is why Steve Keen calls money 'endogenous', yet people in the mainstream still claim that the loanable funds theory is correct.

    Mainstream economics doesn't deal with the operational realities of our economic system, and is mainly prescriptive, but heterodox economic schools of thought are emerging, helped largely by the failure of the mainstream to predict the financial crash of '08.

    It's all well and good standing on your 'mainstream horse' and pissing on the Austrians, but don't forget that their emergence is largely down to your group's failures.
    Schiff the Fraud?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sevin


    It's crazy that the really high inflation STILL hasn't happened. Don't get me wrong. I agree with Peter Schiff that it is going to happen and that the longer they kick the can down the road the worse it's going to be, but every year since 2009 I think, "Okay, this year gold is going to fucking skyrocket" and the last couple years it hasn't gone up much at all!


  7. #6
    Study "mainstream" before attacking it blindly.
    By study, do you mean read Keynes and Marx? Or do you mean to study the hole Keynesian economics has gotten us in? I agree with the latter-- although I don't know how much studying you need to do to realize how badly the Keynesians have $#@!ed up the economy--, but to the prior, I'd say, there are too many (endless) worthwhile books to read to waste time reading books clamoring for government involvement in the economy. The whole world, or almost at least, has tried this big government spend-spend-spend, manipulate-manipulate-manipulate philosophy, and now we find ourselves on the brink of a total meltdown. If this is success to you-- if this has proved to you that government involvement in the economy works--, you sir are $#@!ed in the head.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by bbjaylive View Post
    The mainstream ain't as great as you make it out to be. Mainstream economics isn't like mainstream science, because mainstream science deals with facts, not theories backed up with insufficient evidence.

    For example, most economists would have you believe that trade started out as bartering, whereas evidence suggests, as mentioned in David Graebar's "5000 Years", that primitive societies used systems of credit and debit as money.

    Also, most economists believe the loanable funds theory, that is fractional reserve banking, that deposits create loans, but evidence is mounting up that suggests the opposite, that is that loans actually create deposits and new money is literally created by private banks when they make loans. This is why Steve Keen calls money 'endogenous', yet people in the mainstream still claim that the loanable funds theory is correct.

    Mainstream economics doesn't deal with the operational realities of our economic system, and is mainly prescriptive, but heterodox economic schools of thought are emerging, helped largely by the failure of the mainstream to predict the financial crash of '08.

    It's all well and good standing on your 'mainstream horse' and pissing on the Austrians, but don't forget that their emergence is largely down to your group's failures.
    hahaha thanks for the laugh, endogenous money isn't a novelty at all.. Steve Keen is hilarious, as funny as the Austrian bunch

  9. #8
    Obvious paid troll is obvious.
    //////////////////



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by P3ter_Griffin View Post
    By study, do you mean read Keynes and Marx? Or do you mean to study the hole Keynesian economics has gotten us in? I agree with the latter-- although I don't know how much studying you need to do to realize how badly the Keynesians have $#@!ed up the economy--, but to the prior, I'd say, there are too many (endless) worthwhile books to read to waste time reading books clamoring for government involvement in the economy. The whole world, or almost at least, has tried this big government spend-spend-spend, manipulate-manipulate-manipulate philosophy, and now we find ourselves on the brink of a total meltdown. If this is success to you-- if this has proved to you that government involvement in the economy works--, you sir are $#@!ed in the head.
    Marx mainstream? Keynes was important, but guys like Lucas and Sargent were more..

    This is not like Austrian economics, researchers aren't appealing to the General Theory like its the Bible. Different from you guys "Mises says X.. ERGO X is true!! QED"

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by kozel View Post
    hahaha thanks for the laugh, endogenous money isn't a novelty at all.. Steve Keen is hilarious, as funny as the Austrian bunch
    LOL, now you're just being a troll.
    Schiff the Fraud?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sevin


    It's crazy that the really high inflation STILL hasn't happened. Don't get me wrong. I agree with Peter Schiff that it is going to happen and that the longer they kick the can down the road the worse it's going to be, but every year since 2009 I think, "Okay, this year gold is going to fucking skyrocket" and the last couple years it hasn't gone up much at all!


  13. #11
    if you're a PhD mind telling us your thesis topic?
    “…let us teach them that all who draw breath are of equal worth, and that those who seek to press heel upon the throat of liberty, will fall to the cry of FREEDOM!!!” – Spartacus, War of the Damned

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  14. #12
    How about offering some constructive criticism? How exactly am I supposed to react to your drivel? "No, you are wrong!" ?

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by bbjaylive View Post
    LOL, now you're just being a troll.
    Steve Keen is indeed utterly overestimated by some people and I disagree with almost all your arguments in your initial response. That being said, kozel is a joke.

  16. #14
    Bolded really, really ups your credibility.

    Well done, well done.



    Quote Originally Posted by kozel View Post
    Hello, I'm a grad student at a top20 in economics... When I was 17 or so, I used to watch Ron Paul videos, etc.. I was one of you guys

    But, after being exposed to real economics, I must say. Austrian economics is marginalized, and even made fun of, not because there is a conspiracy going on, but because its un-scientifical, and downright funny.

    So. Stop trolling "keynesian" videos. Stop harassing good researchers. Study "mainstream" before attacking it blindly. Thank you
    "Like an army falling, one by one by one" - Linkin Park

  17. #15

  18. #16
    aww he made some gramatical mistakes.. nevermind that english isn't my first language and this is the internet

    BTW where is the hyperinflation you guys were claiming ??? Where is it??



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  20. #17
    Funny

    "Mainstream economics" is very much like witchcraft. A bunch of nonsense based on superstition.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by kozel View Post
    aww he made some gramatical mistakes.. nevermind that english isn't my first language and this is the internet

    BTW where is the hyperinflation you guys were claiming ??? Where is it??
    I've never claimed hyperinflation was comming. Try again.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by kozel View Post
    aww he made some gramatical mistakes.. nevermind that english isn't my first language and this is the internet

    BTW where is the hyperinflation you guys were claiming ??? Where is it??
    http://mises.org/daily/6340/Where-Is-the-Inflation

  23. #20
    Wrong.. You can't change the rules of the game. You guys claimed hyperinflation with the current inflation measuring, if you can't win, don't change the rules.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by kozel View Post
    Wrong.. You can't change the rules of the game. You guys claimed hyperinflation with the current inflation measuring, if you can't win, don't change the rules.
    Links please.

  25. #22
    Great, you seem to have figured things out at your top school. Do you mind actually posting your arguments against Austrian economics?

  26. #23
    Your own "dude" already has provided arguments against it

    http://econfaculty.gmu.edu/bcaplan/whyaust.htm

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by kozel View Post
    Your own "dude" already has provided arguments against it

    http://econfaculty.gmu.edu/bcaplan/whyaust.htm
    Not sure how he is my "dude." Are you willing to articulate your own views, or must I assume you agree with everything in that article?



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  29. #25
    Suggestion: post actual critiques people could focus on and hopefully start an intelligent conversation.

    Or

    Continue with strawmen and and name calling and watch down on us peasents from up there on your high horse, and expect a reply in kind.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by kozel View Post
    Wrong.. You can't change the rules of the game. You guys claimed hyperinflation with the current inflation measuring, if you can't win, don't change the rules.
    You have GOT to be the most obvious troll I have ever witnessed on these forums. Why don't you actually bring logical debate to the argument instead of just saying things are wrong; we love and value debate here, but you obviously don't have the pride to stick by your guns. Only but a few have prematurely claimed hyperinflation and it's because we are very close to the brink of it and now is the time for people to be aware. I don't blame those who have claimed it, but I also don't look to them as the all-knowing either. If that is your argument against Austrian economics, it's a very useless and highly flawed one.

  31. #27
    my view is that ABCT assumes that enterpreneurs are making systematic errors (i.e. when CB lowers interest rates, they blindly invest in new longer-term projects, which subsequently become unprofitable when rate goes up) and thus completely ignores the role of expectations. Also, since austrians hate both math and econometrics, they never write a formal model and estimate it - so even if ABCT was true, we have no idea how much of business cycle it really explains.

    There are other problematic things with austrian economics (especially with more hardcore part of it, e.g. Mises Institute), like a crazy methodology which refuses empirical testing of theories, general ignorance of any new mainstream economics since circa 1950, and annoying libertarian ramblings. I hope you get the idea.




  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by kozel View Post
    Hello, I'm a grad student at a top20 in economics... When I was 17 or so, I used to watch Ron Paul videos, etc.. I was one of you guys

    But, after being exposed to real economics, I must say. Austrian economics is marginalized, and even made fun of, not because there is a conspiracy going on, but because its un-scientifical, and downright funny.

    So. Stop trolling "keynesian" videos. Stop harassing good researchers. Study "mainstream" before attacking it blindly. Thank you
    I believe you're taught how to write persuasive essay's in middle school. Perhaps now that you finished your PhD you can overview your middle school teachings and (try to)write a proper criticism of austrian economics. At the very least elaborate for a few measly paragraphs. You provide zero evidence for your claims.

  33. #29
    You cannot build a "formal model" of human action. Humans are not physical particles that abide the laws of physics. They have reason and behave differently in each case. That's why you can't "empirically test theories" in economics like they do in physics or chemistry.

  34. #30
    That's funny though, isn't it? Austrian models human behaviour, in a very 40's kind of way (ignore rational expectations, assume humans are half-retarded). If it was true that you guys never modeled behavior, what about the "low interest rates causing bad investments" cycle? A very $#@!ty theory, but it does model behavior. You check-mated yourself there

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