Irish Town Legalizes Drinking and Driving

[green73]

The Irish town of Kilgarvan passed a law this winter that allows members of its community to drink and drive.

Proposed by local pub owner and politician Danny Healy-Rae, the motion allows people who live in country areas to have a few beers before they drive home. Healy-Rae told The New York Times he thinks the measure will help preserve pub culture, lower the risk of suicide and attack isolation in the small town.

Amid governmental and local backlash, Healy-Rae says the law isn’t supposed to apply to everyone.

“I am talking about mainly elderly people who live in very remote places who come to town to get a bit of shopping, enjoy a couple of pints and a chat with friends and then drive home at less than 30 miles an hour,” Healy-Rae told The Times. “These are not the ones causing accidents. What is the alternative for them where no public or other transport is available? Staying at home lonely, staring at the four walls?”

Some local politicians are still shocked that the motion was passed. Although Kerry County council member Toireasa Ferris said that isolation by the elderly in rural areas is a problem, she doesn’t see allowing them to drink and drive the only fix to the problem.

“Never in my wildest imaginations did I think it would ever be passed,” Ferris, who was absent when the measure passed because her child was sick, told The Times.

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/weird...199867031.html


Legalize Drunk Driving
by Lew Rockwell
http://www.lewrockwell.com/rockwell/drunkdriving.html

More
https://encrypted.google.com/search?...+drunk+driving

[MelissaWV]

I am sure the entire area is now littered with countless wrecked cars, and every child has been slain by vehicles driven by people who normally would not drive drunk, heard about this law, and immediately did so.

[Keith and stuff]

It doesn't allow drinking and driving. It allows drinking and then driving. You cannot do both at the same time (which isn't dangerous if you aren't drunk) but you can get drunk and the drive according to the article. Well, not you or me or anyone reading this. It only allows a few select people to drive drunk. That's how I understand the article, anyway.

[KrokHead]

Stupid, as Billy Joel said in "Anthony's Song", I'MMMMMM... MOVIN' OUT!

At least that stupid town was honest with what people are doing, throwing away the usual doublethink. Everyone who's considered a "man" drinks and drives yet is expected to elude law enforcement on the inevitable trip back home. I think the police cars should just wait outside the bars and change the drinking and driving culture, economy be damned.

[Keith and stuff]

Stupid, as Billy Joel said in "Anthony's Song", I'MMMMMM... MOVIN' OUT!

At least that stupid town was honest with what people are doing, throwing away the usual doublethink. Everyone who's considered a "man" drinks and drives yet is expected to elude law enforcement on the inevitable trip back home. I think the police cars should just wait outside the bars and change the drinking and driving culture, economy be damned.

They not only do that, they walk into bars and look around. I've seen that in TN anyway. My guess is similar behavior happens in other places.

[kcchiefs6465]

Stupid, as Billy Joel said in "Anthony's Song", I'MMMMMM... MOVIN' OUT!

At least that stupid town was honest with what people are doing, throwing away the usual doublethink. Everyone who's considered a "man" drinks and drives yet is expected to elude law enforcement on the inevitable trip back home. I think the police cars should just wait outside the bars and change the drinking and driving culture, economy be damned.

They should quit generating revenue by harrassing the local folk, 'economy be damned.' Rather, police state be damned.

[torchbearer]

I think the police cars should just wait outside the bars and change the drinking and driving culture, economy be damned.

the cops do this in Louisiana as a form of extortion against the bar owner. the bar owner can pay the off-duty officers a good sum to sit outside his place, or he can have their car stopping people as they leave- racking up tickets.
and even then, the extortion only last so long before they are getting both the extra pay and the dui tickets by camping outside the bar. that is why most drinking places are now closed in this area.

[MRK]

the cops do this in Louisiana as a form of extortion against the bar owner. the bar owner can pay the off-duty officers a good sum to sit outside his place, or he can have their car stopping people as they leave- racking up tickets.
and even then, the extortion only last so long before they are getting both the extra pay and the dui tickets by camping outside the bar. that is why most drinking places are now closed in this area.

Yep, I hear lots of rumors in Miami when one business puts the hit on another business by paying the undercovers to wait outside a competitor and then bust mass amounts of people at once so word gets out that the competitor is unsafe. I've heard this happen to a couple of places that started getting popular and then died suddenly after getting hit every weekend.

[Brian4Liberty]

Creation of the terminology "drinking and driving" has been a very successful propaganda campaign. It used to be driving while intoxicated.

Laws about driving while intoxicated, when evidenced by the probable cause of erratic driving, makes sense.

The rest should be decriminalized. No checkpoints, no pulling people over simply because they left a pub, no blood alcohol tests for people who are driving perfectly fine.

[thoughtomator]

I agree with the measure. Drunk driving in and of itself is a fictional, victimless crime.

Now, reckless driving is another, distinct matter. Recklessness isn't be measured by the content of a man's bloodstream, but his actual actions-in-fact. I know of quite a few drivers who are a danger to the public totally sober, and many more who are no danger whatsoever well above the legal limit.

[Brian4Liberty]

I am sure the entire area is now littered with countless wrecked cars, and every child has been slain by vehicles driven by people who normally would not drive drunk, heard about this law, and immediately did so.

Pure mayhem and chaos.

[Christian Liberty]

Creation of the terminology "drinking and driving" has been a very successful propaganda campaign. It used to be driving while intoxicated.

Laws about driving while intoxicated, when evidenced by the probable cause of erratic driving, makes sense.

The rest should be decriminalized. No checkpoints, no pulling people over simply because they left a pub, no blood alcohol tests for people who are driving perfectly fine.

Yeah, I agree with this. If someone is driving safely, you have no probable cause to search them. That doesn't mean it should be legal to drive while intoxicated ("Intoxicated" is the importnat thing here) but that without probable cause, they have no right to search.)

Ultimately, honestly, I do think private road owners would probably enforce some kind of DUI checks. There's just too much danger. I can imagine speeding restrictions being removed, seat belt restrictions would probably be removed, but no DUI and no texting while driving actually make sense. Of course, I support privatized roads, and the free market making its own rules, but while the government is illicitly controlling the roads, next to giving up control, the next best thing is to run them as close to how a private business would as possible. I can't imagine private road owners just disregarding real dangers like this. The government shouldn't either.

[fr33]

They probably all ride bicycles anyways...

[Brian4Liberty]

They probably all ride bicycles anyways...

Isn't drinking and riding a bike also illegal (in the US)?

Riding a bike in the dark is plenty dangerous though. Hitting something at high speed on a bicycle because you can't see it can be fatal. I've witnessed it. Someone rode into bike racks because they were nearly invisible in the dark, with no bikes parked there.

[torchbearer]

Yep, I hear lots of rumors in Miami when one business puts the hit on another business by paying the undercovers to wait outside a competitor and then bust mass amounts of people at once so word gets out that the competitor is unsafe. I've heard this happen to a couple of places that started getting popular and then died suddenly after getting hit every weekend.

it happened to my brother-in-law's club. exactly as you stated. he won his lawsuit against the sheriff's department.

[Christian Liberty]

Isn't drinking and riding a bike also illegal (in the US)?

I don't think I'd support that law. Riding a bike isn't nearly as likely to cause harm to other people. Admittedly, stupidly riding into the middle of the road could cause some harm, but then, if you're intoxicated, you could do that while WALKING. Driving is somewhat unique since you could fairly easily kill someone while having a ton of machinery under your direct control.

[kcchiefs6465]

Isn't drinking and riding a bike also illegal (in the US)?

Riding a bike in the dark is plenty dangerous though. Hitting something at high speed on a bicycle because you can't see it can be fatal. I've witnessed it. Someone rode into bike racks because they were nearly invisible in the dark, with no bikes parked there.

Yes, riding a bicycle while drinking or being drunk is a DUI. Lawnmowers and horses are no exception either.

[torchbearer]

I don't think I'd support that law. Riding a bike isn't nearly as likely to cause harm to other people. Admittedly, stupidly riding into the middle of the road could cause some harm, but then, if you're intoxicated, you could do that while WALKING. Driving is somewhat unique since you could fairly easily kill someone while having a ton of machinery under your direct control.

wouldn't the actual damage or destruction while intoxicated be the crime. and any arrest before that is simply arresting someone for what they 'might' do? like arresting people for pre-crimes.

[Dr.3D]

Yes, riding a bicycle while drinking or being drunk is a DUI. Lawnmowers and horses are no exception either.

Seems like the horse would have to be drunk to be a problem.

[Christian Liberty]

wouldn't the actual damage or destruction while intoxicated be the crime. and any arrest before that is simply arresting someone for what they 'might' do? like arresting people for pre-crimes.

Well, as I mentioned before, my ideal is privatized roads. While I highly doubt private road owners would be as draconian as our statist overlords (They, after all, risk losing business if they do) I also think they would have a vested interest in ensuring their roads are safe. While government owns the roads, I think it is a necessary evil to allow them to regulate them to some extent.

Admittedly, I don't think someone who is driving safely while drunk should ever be checked, but it still shouldn't be "Legal". If they kill someone, they really ought to be charged with murder, but they will get let off with far less. If they are driving recklessly and endangering other people, they should be pulled over and not allowed to continue driving.

Although of course they do not actually accept this duty, I actually do think the cops have some duty to keep us safe. That's their job. Of course, they don't actually do it, but that is one of the reasons cops are supposed to exist. Not wearing a seat belt is no danger to anyone. Speeding can be, but usually isn't unless its extreme (The numbers posted, of course, are arbitrary.) But DUI usually is. I'm not proposing random checks, but if we know someone is driving while seriously drunk, and therefore likely to endanger other drivers, yes, government shouldn't let them do that on a publicly owned road.

[kcchiefs6465]

Seems like the horse would have to be drunk to be a problem.

That's what I thought too. It's not like the horse is going to willingly run into traffic.

[Keith and stuff]

Beer For My Horses http://youtube.com/watch?v=o1JOFhfoAD4

[Tod]

How about if the local people band together and each night one of them volunteers to be the designated driver?

The local elks club has a big van they call the drunkmobile or something and they drive members home who have been drinking.

[Tod]

Well, as I mentioned before, my ideal is privatized roads. While I highly doubt private road owners would be as draconian as our statist overlords (They, after all, risk losing business if they do)

How does THAT work? Drive around the block? What happens when one company has all the roads in a town? People have to start to fly drunk instead?

[Anti Federalist]

They probably all ride bicycles anyways...

Which will still get you a DUI here in Amerika.

[Anti Federalist]

I am sure the entire area is now littered with countless wrecked cars, and every child has been slain by vehicles driven by people who normally would not drive drunk, heard about this law, and immediately did so.

/thread

/debate

+rep

[anaconda]

According to this you can still drink and drive in Mississippi, as long as you're under the legal limit. And open containers are allowed in seven states (for passengers to drink).

http://www.opencontainerlaws.com/ope...nvehicles.html

[heavenlyboy34]

Creation of the terminology "drinking and driving" has been a very successful propaganda campaign. It used to be driving while intoxicated.

Laws about driving while intoxicated, when evidenced by the probable cause of erratic driving, makes sense.

The rest should be decriminalized. No checkpoints, no pulling people over simply because they left a pub, no blood alcohol tests for people who are driving perfectly fine.

OMG, you anarchist! How dare you not want to prohibit pre-crime!

[tod evans]

Be nice to see more common sense people in office...

Kudos to the pub owner/politician!

[parocks]

I agree with the measure. Drunk driving in and of itself is a fictional, victimless crime.

Now, reckless driving is another, distinct matter. Recklessness isn't be measured by the content of a man's bloodstream, but his actual actions-in-fact. I know of quite a few drivers who are a danger to the public totally sober, and many more who are no danger whatsoever well above the legal limit.

Yeah. Like this.

Less "don't do things that might make you dangerous"
Replace with "don't be dangerous".

Or, wait until harm.

We do have laws about stop signs, though. And there's no harm in blowing through stop signs unless you hit someone.