3-year-old Russian boy killed by American adoptive mother in Texas

[RockEnds]

First off pointing out that certain foreign outlets media tend to do stories that more often critical of the US does not equal Exceptionalism.

Second, what exactly do you mean by "demand that foreign countries continue to surrender their children to us" that's not how I understand adoption to be at all. If the Russian government or any government bans children from being adopted by Americans. Then most people who want to adapt will just find another way.

And the vast majority of those who would still want to adopt children from these nations, would be doing so because they are already financially or personally invested in the process.

Just making sure I understand what you're saying. Adoption is frequently held to different standards than any other modern institution. I'm really not completely clear on your post, but there was a reference to the 'it's for the children' mentality. The institution of American adoption has escaped scrutiny since its inception around a century ago due to the 'it's for the children' mentality. Child placement should be for the children. Adoption is a form of child placement. However, adoption as it's currently practiced in the US is really for the adults who wish to adopt. It's shrouded in secrecy. Few people who are not directly involved in adoption have a working knowledge of the institution, and many of those who are directly involved only see the parts of the puzzle that directly impact them. The institution was designed to function in just that manner. Any institution founded upon secrecy should have a really, really bright light shined in each and every crack and crevice. When that begins to happen, the institution screams, "Turn off the light!! Turn off the light!! It's for the children!!" Their plea is having less effect now than in the past.

Here's an American link to the deportee issue:

http://landofgazillionadoptees.com/2...been-deported/

As for the Russian child(ren), it is being reported in the American press. The article about his mother in Russia was not from RT. It was from the United Kingdom.

[BlackTerrel]

Off the top of my head, 60,000. I'm sure google has a better recall than I do. The abuse cases are listed at the link if you are interested in them.

The number 19 dead seems to come to mind. I don't have a cite for you.

Ok so best guess is 19 out of 60,000 Russian babies in US have died. My guess is that is likely as good treatment as they are getting in Russia. Maybe better.

The bottom line is that Russia does not owe us children. They don't have to give a reason to end US adoptions. They can do it just on accounta because.

Of course they can. I don't give a shit. I don't ever want to adopt a Russian baby. People are using this to try to justify why the Russians stopped adoptions. If that's the case then let's look it is a valid reason.

Attempting to minimize the death of a child could be a factor in their reasoning. I don't know. I'm not Russian. But it seems to me that if the Russians were attempting to reduce the life of an American child to a statistic, that may offend a few folks in this country.

All you have is statistics. Otherwise you are just relying on anecdotes and heart-wrenching stories.

There are abusive Russian parents and abusive American parents. Without statistics how can you make an evidence based decision.

[thequietkid10]

Just making sure I understand what you're saying. Adoption is frequently held to different standards than any other modern institution. I'm really not completely clear on your post, but there was a reference to the 'it's for the children' mentality. The institution of American adoption has escaped scrutiny since its inception around a century ago due to the 'it's for the children' mentality. Child placement should be for the children. Adoption is a form of child placement. However, adoption as it's currently practiced in the US is really for the adults who wish to adopt. It's shrouded in secrecy. Few people who are not directly involved in adoption have a working knowledge of the institution, and many of those who are directly involved only see the parts of the puzzle that directly impact them. The institution was designed to function in just that manner. Any institution founded upon secrecy should have a really, really bright light shined in each and every crack and crevice. When that begins to happen, the institution screams, "Turn off the light!! Turn off the light!! It's for the children!!" Their plea is having less effect now than in the past.

Here's an American link to the deportee issue:

http://landofgazillionadoptees.com/2...been-deported/

As for the Russian child(ren), it is being reported in the American press. The article about his mother in Russia was not from RT. It was from the United Kingdom.

My reference to children was quoting something written by you. I asked you what you meant by that, and you haven't answered.

To the extent that there is a "for the children" element to my post its this. The anecdotal stories posted here about horrible experiences that some children have had after being adopted by American parents is a plea to emotion, just like the "for the children" mentality. It doesn't tell the percentage of adoptees abused by their adopted parents and it doesn't tell us much about the state of adoption system in this country. And it certainly doesn't justify a broad decree from a pseudo dictator (Putin), ending all American adoptions from his country.

I do believe that US adoption system designed to severe all connection between the biological parent and the biological child is a smart decision. If Russia, or anyone has a problem with the system before hand, they should ask for more openness and make their decision on a case by case bases.

[RockEnds]

My reference to children was quoting something written by you. I asked you what you meant by that, and you haven't answered.

To the extent that there is a "for the children" element to my post its this. The anecdotal stories posted here about horrible experiences that some children have had after being adopted by American parents is a plea to emotion, just like the "for the children" mentality. It doesn't tell the percentage of adoptees abused by their adopted parents and it doesn't tell us much about the state of adoption system in this country. And it certainly doesn't justify a broad decree from a pseudo dictator (Putin), ending all American adoptions from his country.

I do believe that US adoption system designed to severe all connection between the biological parent and the biological child is a smart decision. If Russia, or anyone has a problem with the system before hand, they should ask for more openness and make their decision on a case by case bases.

Well then we must agree to disagree. I don't believe the state has the power to destroy the family. You don't like anecdotal stories. I don't like lives reduced to statistics.

I'll have to cut this a little short for the evening. FTDNA finally got new matches posted after almost two months, and I think I've broken down two brick walls. One on my Hays line, and the other on my Adams line. It's pretty amazing. The state didn't have the power to control my DNA. The government may fancy itself in such a position of power that they possess the authority to sever all connection between the biological parent and child, but they are beyond arrogant in thinking so. And for the record, Russia has asked for more openness.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...010490110.html

[texasbelle]

The death was ruled accidental. These kids from Russia are subjected to horrors in the orphanages. I have seen recently a family that adopted a 15 year old from Eastern Europe that only weighed 26 pounds. Utter sheer HORROR! To the person who posted about why people just do not adopt from the US. Its not that easy to adopt from US. Have you tried? The kids in foster care are usually affected by FAS or born to mothers on drugs. So many of them are not even available to adopt because the birth family rights have not been terminated. These kids are in limbo. A domestic newborn adoption with a placing agency costs around 50K and there are TONS of people lined up for them. Many of these kids will still have FAS or exposure to drugs too. We adopted from China because its a stable program. The adoption is final once you have custody of your child. Total adoption cost were about 24K and only 5K was spent in China. The rest was spent on US side of things. Overall I think adoption should be a last resort though. I think if families can stay together its best for everyone. Its not a perfect world though...

[libertyjam]

Apparently the adoption industry is loaded with rent seekers