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Thread: Israel Anderson: Ron Paul has NOT gone to the UN to strong-arm RonPaul.com

  1. #1

    Default Israel Anderson: Ron Paul has NOT gone to the UN to strong-arm RonPaul.com

    People who would put up their real name while defending or smearing another, putting their own reputation on the line, speaks many folds more than those who would not.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAwgSWzQFwQ

    Last edited by jtstellar; 02-11-2013 at 11:25 PM.



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  3. #2

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    the people at RonPaul.com are untrustworthy
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  4. #3
    Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!

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  5. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    the people at RonPaul.com are untrustworthy
    and why is that?

    Is milking Ron Paul supporters for a multi level marketing scam where milk shake powder and vitamin packs sell for 3x the price of a health food store "trustworthy"?

    Why did Ron Paul's internet geniuses let the domain lapse in the first place? They need to pay a price for that.

    Free Market is only Free and Trustworthy when Doug Wead or Israel Anderson try it, but when the RonPaul.com people do it it's not free and trustworthy. Got it.

    There's a reason Wead laughs so much.
    "If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." -- George Orwell

  6. #5

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    Israel is wrong...he is saying that the Campaign For Liberty staff let RonPaul.com lapse....Ron Paul has never owned RonPaul.com so the Campaign For Liberty staff never let it lapse...The incompetent Campaign For Liberty staff DID let RonPaul.ORG expire, not RonPaul.COM.

  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peace Piper View Post
    and why is that?

    Is milking Ron Paul supporters for a multi level marketing scam where milk shake powder and vitamin packs sell for 3x the price of a health food store "trustworthy"?

    Why did Ron Paul's internet geniuses let the domain lapse in the first place? They need to pay a price for that.

    Free Market is only Free and Trustworthy when Doug Wead or Israel Anderson try it, but when the RonPaul.com people do it it's not free and trustworthy. Got it.

    There's a reason Wead laughs so much.
    Nothing about domains is free market from what I can tell.
    "Integrity means having to say things that people don't want to hear & especially to say things that the regime doesn't want to hear. -Ron Paul

    "Bathtub falls and police officers kill more Americans than terrorism, yet we've been asked to sacrifice our most sacred rights for fear of falling victim to it." -Edward Snowden

  8. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    the people at RonPaul.com are untrustworthy
    What evidence do you have that they are untrustworthy. Your word on this matter is not enough, hard evidence that can be verified is what I am looking for.

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by qh4dotcom View Post
    Israel is wrong...he is saying that the Campaign For Liberty staff let RonPaul.com lapse....Ron Paul has never owned RonPaul.com so the Campaign For Liberty staff never let it lapse...The incompetent Campaign For Liberty staff DID let RonPaul.ORG expire, not RonPaul.COM.
    I figure it would be something like that. The moment he stated his name I decided there was no sense in watching it because I don't trust him at all.

  10. #9

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    Good god people. The site is worth what its worth. If Ron Paul wants the dang thing buy it and buy it at market price. You can't piss and moan about freemarkets all day long and then think for one minute that the guy who owns it shouldn't get the market price.

    Don't like it buy another #$@!$$%@#$%!#$$@!#$%$^%$^%$!@#$!#$!#@$^%@#^&^*^&*^ %^% website.

  11. #10
    Member Cleaner44's Avatar
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    Default

    Israel is wrong that Ron Paul is doing the only thing he can legally do.

    Ron could agree to purchase the domain from Tim. Ron could then send Tim a check or even gold.

    Settling the matter privately is certainly an option. Ron is not required to ask for ICANN to intervene.
    U.S. Air Force Veteran
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    I am a libertarian. I am advocating everyone enjoy maximum freedom on both personal and economic issues as long as they do not bring violence unto others.

  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by sailingaway View Post
    Nothing about domains is free market from what I can tell.
    What about domains is *not* free market?

    It's first come first served, unless we're talking about trademarks.

    If these aren't examples of a "free market" please explain your understanding of the term and why domains are excluded.

    Sedo - The world's leading domain marketplace
    Afternic boasts over 3 million domain names available for purchase on their aftermarket platform.
    Bido is a 1 a day, domain name auction service
    DomainMonkey is a domain auction and parking website
    NameJet allows its customers to backorder a domain name and set a price up to which they are willing to go
    "If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." -- George Orwell

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peace Piper View Post
    and why is that?

    Is milking Ron Paul supporters for a multi level marketing scam where milk shake powder and vitamin packs sell for 3x the price of a health food store "trustworthy"?

    Why did Ron Paul's internet geniuses let the domain lapse in the first place? They need to pay a price for that.

    Free Market is only Free and Trustworthy when Doug Wead or Israel Anderson try it, but when the RonPaul.com people do it it's not free and trustworthy. Got it.

    There's a reason Wead laughs so much.
    Okay. I missed the milk shake powder vitamin pack thingy. But I do plan to get into some kind of network marketing myself. The biggest deficiency of this movement is that it's all been about "Send moneybomb donations to the campaign even if you're barely getting by financially". As a group we need to look at ways to help each other become financially independent. Seriously, I've seen somebody post a request for emergency food aid! I ain't mad at the person, but if all we're about is gathering money for some campaign staff to waste spend, what good is that?

    Alright, enough soapboxing. As to your point about the free market, I agree. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. I don't know the full story behind RonPaul.com per se, but people surrounding Ron Paul making 6 figure salaries have been woefully negligent in securing domain names.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Eze 22:25 There's a conspiracy of prophets within her....

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

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  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cleaner44 View Post
    Israel is wrong that Ron Paul is doing the only thing he can legally do.

    Ron could agree to purchase the domain from Tim. Ron could then send Tim a check or even gold.

    Settling the matter privately is certainly an option. Ron is not required to ask for ICANN to intervene.
    He can also use another domain...I offered to give him RonPaul.name

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by qh4dotcom View Post
    He can also use another domain...I offered to give him RonPaul.name
    You might as well use it yourself or give it to someone that can do something with it because I highly doubt Ron cares about it. He seems to think like many that are Internet noobs that ".com" is the Internet.

  16. #15

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    Okay. Watched 1/2 the video. Mr. Anderson's argument seems to be this.

    1) By purchasing a domain name through ICANN, the RonPaul.com owner voluntarily submitted himself to the ICANN dispute resolution process.
    2) The ICANN dispute resolution process may be part of the U.N. but that's besides the point.
    3) Ron Paul is just following that process.

    Okay. So any time a international government agency takes on monopoly powers and a businessman "voluntarily submits" to those powers, it's still within libertarian principles to go to that international government agency to "exercise my rights" under those powers and I'll pretend I'm not actually doing that because the person "volunteered" to the process? WTF?
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Eze 22:25 There's a conspiracy of prophets within her....

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cleaner44 View Post
    Israel is wrong that Ron Paul is doing the only thing he can legally do.

    Ron could agree to purchase the domain from Tim. Ron could then send Tim a check or even gold.

    Settling the matter privately is certainly an option. Ron is not required to ask for ICANN to intervene.
    Right, Ron could buy it for $250,000 or he could take the better deal of the free ronpaul.org offer and put his site on it and all this could be avoided. Ron most certainly is not doing the only thing he could do, he is doing something that in my opinion seems totally out of character for him.

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peace Piper View Post
    What about domains is *not* free market?

    It's first come first served, unless we're talking about trademarks.

    If these aren't examples of a "free market" please explain your understanding of the term and why domains are excluded.

    Sedo - The world's leading domain marketplace
    Afternic boasts over 3 million domain names available for purchase on their aftermarket platform.
    Bido is a 1 a day, domain name auction service
    DomainMonkey is a domain auction and parking website
    NameJet allows its customers to backorder a domain name and set a price up to which they are willing to go
    My understanding is this one body has a monopoly and you take a domain subject to its precise rules of how you can use it, which rules Ron is claiming under. However, he tried to buy it first at what he thought was market value. Now it is for sale on whosis and if someone else buys it do you really think the value they pay above what Ron would would be based on the site as used to date? Or would it be based on Ron's fame and potential, the precise type of thing not allowed by the domain rules the site owner took it subject to?

    However, while domains seem to be nauseatingly UN free market, that doesn't prevent the two sides from voluntarily negotiating a result to settle it and I really hope they do.
    "Integrity means having to say things that people don't want to hear & especially to say things that the regime doesn't want to hear. -Ron Paul

    "Bathtub falls and police officers kill more Americans than terrorism, yet we've been asked to sacrifice our most sacred rights for fear of falling victim to it." -Edward Snowden

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by RickyJ View Post
    Right, Ron could buy it for $250,000 or he could take the better deal of the free ronpaul.org offer and put his site on it and all this could be avoided. Ron most certainly is not doing the only thing he could do, he is doing something that in my opinion seems totally out of character for him.
    It does seem out of character but I don't know all of what happened in negotiations either. But I hope they sides can work out a settlement.
    "Integrity means having to say things that people don't want to hear & especially to say things that the regime doesn't want to hear. -Ron Paul

    "Bathtub falls and police officers kill more Americans than terrorism, yet we've been asked to sacrifice our most sacred rights for fear of falling victim to it." -Edward Snowden

  20. #19

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    If the sake of America's future depends upon ownership of a domain name, it is time to start looking outside of the United States regarding the whereabouts of the next advancement of the social contract.

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Emanuel Watkins View Post
    If the sake of America's future depends upon ownership of a domain name, it is time to start looking outside of the United States regarding the whereabouts of the next advancement of the social contract.
    You know that is not true. This is an important topic here because we are all Ron Paul supporters, at least most of us are, this is ronpaulforums.com after all. No one is saying the future of the USA depends on the resolution of this matter.

  22. #21

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    so what's the new argument? that ron paul shouldn't even have the right to dispute like all other citizens? this keeps getting more hilarious by the day

    so half a dozen anonymous disagreements. anymore? that the best you have?

  23. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by jtstellar View Post
    so what's the new argument? that ron paul shouldn't even have the right to dispute like all other citizens? this keeps getting more hilarious by the day

    so half a dozen anonymous disagreements. anymore? that the best you have?
    This is a fundamental question about whether Ron truly supports private property rights.

  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by schiffheadbaby View Post
    This is a fundamental question about whether Ron truly supports private property rights.
    domains are subject to contractual provisions to begin with, however.
    "Integrity means having to say things that people don't want to hear & especially to say things that the regime doesn't want to hear. -Ron Paul

    "Bathtub falls and police officers kill more Americans than terrorism, yet we've been asked to sacrifice our most sacred rights for fear of falling victim to it." -Edward Snowden

  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by RickyJ View Post
    You know that is not true. This is an important topic here because we are all Ron Paul supporters, at least most of us are, this is ronpaulforums.com after all. No one is saying the future of the USA depends on the resolution of this matter.
    The only way to crush the bones of the enemy that is endangering the United States today is by laying down a foundation of philosophy. This would be the American Movement! Get your minds off the stupid two party system! The two party system wasn't the advancement over the U.S. Constitution! It was the American Movement led by the American transcendentalists later on who saved the Union by returning the people to revering our Founders, to cherishing the new order they declared within The Declaration of Independence, and to honor the laws instituted within the U.S. Constitution they established to further advance that new order!

  26. #25
    Member Cleaner44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RickyJ View Post
    Right, Ron could buy it for $250,000 or he could take the better deal of the free ronpaul.org offer and put his site on it and all this could be avoided. Ron most certainly is not doing the only thing he could do, he is doing something that in my opinion seems totally out of character for him.
    I suspect that it is people that work for Ron that are behind this. Maybe this is being used as leverage to negotiate a better price. Who knows? If Ron wants the domain that badly I don't see why he doesn't just pay its current market value, even though he can force an ICANN arbitration.
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  27. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by sailingaway View Post
    domains are subject to contractual provisions to begin with, however.

    I would like to see the agreement that Ron Paul signed when the .org was in his control. I wonder if it contains the same clause that the current agreements do, which state that failure to pay for the site shall be construed as consent to transfer the site to new ownership.
    .[QUOTE]"Every great new thought was opposed. Every great new invention was denounced. The first motor was considered foolish. The airplane was considered impossible. The power loom was considered vicious. Anesthesia was considered sinful. But the men of unborrowed vision went ahead. They fought, they suffered and they paid. But they won." - Ayn Rand, The Fountainhead[/QUOTE]
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  28. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peace Piper View Post
    Is milking Ron Paul supporters for a multi level marketing scam where milk shake powder and vitamin packs sell for 3x the price of a health food store "trustworthy"?
    I don't think anyone is milking anyone. In fact Doug has been quote upfront and honest about what he is doing with Isagenix.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peace Piper View Post
    Why did Ron Paul's internet geniuses let the domain lapse in the first place? They need to pay a price for that.
    Dunno if anyone in any of Ron's organizations actually owned RonPaul.com
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  29. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    I don't think anyone is milking anyone. In fact Doug has been quote upfront and honest about what he is doing with Isagenix.

    Dunno if anyone in any of Ron's organizations actually owned RonPaul.com
    I dont think so.. it would sold on ebay to the current owners.

    It certainly is out of character for Ron.. I will say that..

  30. #29

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    Domain names aren't property to be owned, people. They're rented out and the landlord has certain rules. Who here thinks it's a violation of private property rights for an apartment manager to prohibit smoking? Well, the landlord renting out ronpaul.com says you can't take someone else's name and profit from it.

  31. #30

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    Some of the people here are a bit thick.

    ICANN is a private entity which regulates these matters. When you register a domain, you are submitting yourself to their process and in the event of a dispute one must follow UDRP policy. This policy dictates that when there is a domain dispute, it can only be heard by a number of arbitration providers. That the owners of the domain are Australian means Paul is obliged to go to WIPO. There is no other choice. People saying he could instead pay the guys money miss the point: if someone came to your home and took your car, would you then pay money for it back? Paul believes he owns his trademark, so of course he is going to try to get it back. That he initially even asked how much they wanted shows he was willing to give something, but the RonPaul.com guys asked first for ~$850,000 and then lowered it to $250,000.

    The fact that WIPO was a UN created agency is incidental here. The whole issue is a private/arbitration matter. When people sign contracts often there'll be arbitration clauses that illustrate what should happen if there is a dispute. These proceedings are quicker and cheaper than courts. They're legal and it is a part of the free market that one can submit themselves to arbitration. Now, this doesn't impinge on the sovereignty of the courts (which would have been a legitimate gripe) because the matter can be appealed to the courts.

    WIPO is used because it predates ICANN and was an international IP forum that was in existence and already trusted. That ICANN uses it is incidental - it could use another private arbitration provider if it really wanted to. The UN has no power and thus the things Paul would ideologically oppose aren't in issue here.

    Furthermore, for those that think the RonPaul.com guys are just exercising their free market rights: wrong. Paul is arguing that he has a common law trademark of which the owners of the domain have used to unjustly enrich themselves. This is akin to theft, if proven. The free market does not protect theft or fraud. Paul does not want their site - they can keep it, their email list, and register another domain and be up in business in a few hours. And that is the telling part: the RonPaul.com guys KNOWINGLY used a name that is inarguably connected to the real Ron Paul. The only reason that site can generate anything is because of Ron Paul and all the efforts he has gone to throughout the years to spread his message - by books, interviews, etc.

    The fact that they've profited at all from that site for this many years is enough - as Paul can actually ask for not only the domain but compensation for their using his trademark through all this time. They post news that will garner hits and get money from adsense and they also sell Ron Paul merchandise. Has Paul asked for a cut, even, there? No; he just wants the domain.
    Last edited by annoy; 02-13-2013 at 03:54 PM.

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