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Thread: Should the US Government Buy Only US Made Products?

  1. #61
    une plume de Libertée GunnyFreedom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bxm042 View Post
    Works for me
    Aye, anything whatever to increase the difficulty in government for 'getting things done' is a plus IMHO.



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  3. #62

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    Quote Originally Posted by GunnyFreedom View Post
    Aye, anything whatever to increase the difficulty in government for 'getting things done' is a plus IMHO.
    I won't lie, I think you and I disagree, but I respect that you're willing to admit you want to hold government to a different standard, or make their lives/jobs harder.

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  5. #64
    Member Pauls' Revere's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GunnyFreedom View Post
    Apparently it is.

    But why should I answer you -- you've accused me of wanting to murder children against their will in a war. You have accused me of being a Keynesian. So anything I say, no matter how benign, I am convinced you are just going to twist it into the next monstrosity that pops into your head.

    From where I sit, why should I help you imagine weird crimes against me that I have never committed?

    What's next, I quote a line from the Constitution and you accuse me of being a pedophile?

    How about take a step back and reassess what's happening here and try starting fresh?
    From your past posting I presumed you agree with the idea that the US should buy USA made only. However, I disagree. It's my belief that it only leads to nepotism and fraud within and between governement and coporations (see $500 toilet seat link I posted). It would ultimately lead to a self serving ever expanding perpetual cycle of bigger and bigger government. This im sure would be accomplished through the printing press by The FED borrowed on the backs of future generations with inflated currency.

    You stated you didn't care as long as government gets smaller or eliminated, I couldn't agree more. I think we are trying to accomplish the same ideal. I think you would support the idea because in the end it would hasten the government demise. It would collapse under it's weight. Whereas I would not want to support that notion beliving that it's not feasible.

    If, we choose your path and hasten the demise through government sponserships of coporations and business then, we may as well pull out all the stops and go for broke. The end thus justifies means. Meaning, we support everything that supports government including the military industrial complex and all that entails. Yes, even a draft, and yes sending people off to die. because in the end it hepls the government go broke and becomes eliminated. After all, made in the USA includes all those ships, planes and bombs were so good at making.

    This in my mind becomes Keyesian as government spends and decides what, where, when and how all this money gets spent. A lefty idea wouldn't you agree?

    I hope this is some sort of clarification but please elaborate more on your thoughts.
    Last edited by Pauls' Revere; 02-03-2013 at 11:35 PM.
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  6. #65
    une plume de Libertée GunnyFreedom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    From your past posting I presumed you agree with the idea that the US should buy USA made only. However, I disagree. It's my belief that it only leads to nepotism and fraud within and between governement and coporations (see $500 toilet seat link I posted). It would ultimately lead to a self serving ever expanding perpetual cycle of bigger and bigger government. This im sure would be accomplished through the printing press by The FED borrowed on the backs of future generations with inflated currency.

    You stated you didn't care as long as government gets smaller or eliminated, I couldn't agree more. I think we are trying to accomplish the same ideal. I think you would support the idea because in the end it would hasten the government demise. It would collapse under it's weight. Whereas I would not want to support that notion beliving that it's not feasible.

    If, we choose your path and hasten the demise through government sponserships of coporations and business then, we may as well pull out all the stops and go for broke. The end thus justifies means. Meaning, we support everything that supports government including the military industrial complex and all that entails. Yes, even a draft, and yes sending people off to die. because in the end it hepls the government go broke and becomes eliminated. After all, made in the USA includes all those ships, planes and bombs were so good at making.

    This in my mind becomes Keyesian as government spends and decides what, where, when and how all this money gets spent. A lefty idea wouldn't you agree?

    I hope this is some sort of clarification but please elaborate more on your thoughts.
    the $300 toilet seat isn't a vendor issue, it's how they fund off-the-books operations. offshoring that vendor isn't going to change the way they populate slush funds for off the books operations.

    I said that I am OK with civilians having the authority to arbitrarily restricting government.

    you are STILL trying to push that this necessarily means I want to enslave children and send them off to die in a war. you are STILL trying to push that I'm a liberal big-government whack-job inflating fiat currency.

    Deciding where and how to spend money isn't Keynesianism. Keynesianism is a very specific (and wrong) economic philosophy involving fiat currency, deficit spending, and the 'broken window' fallacy. You can be a Keynesian and agree with restricting government, or you can be an Austrian and agree with restricting government. You can't just call anyone you disagree with economically a Keynesian anymore that you can just call anyone you disagree with militarily a Neocon.

    You still appear to have taken some emotional disagreement and are desperately reaching out for any 'sin' you can possibly apply and flinging them at me in rapid succession hoping that one sticks.

    That's not even treatment I would give monsters like Obama and Romney. So why are you doing it to me?

  7. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    They would simply raise the budget, print more money, then tax everyone more....where have I heard that before?
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    'The budget is a mythical beanbag. Congress votes mythical beans into it, and then tries to reach in and pull real beans out.'--Will Rogers
    ..

    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    From your past posting I presumed you agree with the idea that the US should buy USA made only. However, I disagree. It's my belief that it only leads to nepotism and fraud within and between governement and coporations (see $500 toilet seat link I posted). It would ultimately lead to a self serving ever expanding perpetual cycle of bigger and bigger government. This im sure would be accomplished through the printing press by The FED borrowed on the backs of future generations with inflated currency.
    Nepotism and fraud? One, you can have competitive bidding among U.S. corporations. There are few areas in which there is only one U.S. company. Two, what on Earth makes you think politicians are incapable of 'nepotism and fraud'--i.e. taking kickbacks for favors, I presume--with/from corporations that aren't based in the U.S? A German, Phillipino, Argentinian, or whatever company is capable of owning or renting almost any American politician, if they have enough money.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    You stated you didn't care as long as government gets smaller or eliminated, I couldn't agree more. I think we are trying to accomplish the same ideal. I think you would support the idea because in the end it would hasten the government demise. It would collapse under it's weight. Whereas I would not want to support that notion beliving that it's not feasible.
    He did mention that he was thinking of this as part of a larger campaign to make everything government does more difficult.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    If, we choose your path and hasten the demise through government sponserships of coporations and business then, we may as well pull out all the stops and go for broke. The end thus justifies means. Meaning, we support everything that supports government including the military industrial complex and all that entails. Yes, even a draft, and yes sending people off to die. because in the end it hepls the government go broke and becomes eliminated. After all, made in the USA includes all those ships, planes and bombs were so good at making.
    Horse hockey. Tell you what, I'll use some of your logic for you. Since government (not the federal government, but some kind of government) would have to investigate the crime, let's also help overload government by murdering your mother.

    No, Gunny didn't say that crap. And don't blame me, I'm just using your 'logic'--so-called logic Gunny didn't use and didn't pretend to use. Your 'logic', so, obviously we have to use your mother.

    Hint: He said, make what spending they do more difficult for them. He did not say have them spend more, so they can have yet more difficulty. You said that--which would have been fine, if only you had said it, instead of trying to put those words in Gunny's mouth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    This in my mind becomes Keyesian as government spends and decides what, where, when and how all this money gets spent. A lefty idea wouldn't you agree?

    I hope this is some sort of clarification but please elaborate more on your thoughts.
    You don't clarify things by twisting them into unrecognizable shapes. What the man said is, make it difficult for government to spend and decide where and how for government, at least partially. It doesn't take much reading comprehension to understand that. Anything else is spin for the purposes of trying to shame someone into this forum's version of political correctness. Or, to put it another way, you're the one acting like a prog if anyone here is.

    Elaborate on that.
    Last edited by acptulsa; 02-04-2013 at 05:06 AM.
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  8. #67
    Site Staff - Moderator Brian4Liberty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GunnyFreedom View Post
    the $300 toilet seat isn't a vendor issue, it's how they fund off-the-books operations. offshoring that vendor isn't going to change the way they populate slush funds for off the books operations.
    Not that your point about off the books operations isn't valid, but in the specific case of the infamous toilet seat (really not the seat, but the cover) there was a reason for the cost. The military/government goes the deluxe route on everything. They were given the option of custom carbon fiber toilet covers (to reduce weight, lol). A limited production of custom carbon fiber anything tends to be expensive. It was certainly wasteful.
    Last edited by Brian4Liberty; 02-04-2013 at 12:22 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Not that your point about off the books operations isn't valid, but in the specific case of the infamous toilet seat (really not the seat, but the cover) there was a reason for the cost. The military/government goes the deluxe route on everything. They were given the option of custom carbon fiber toilet covers (to reduce weight, lol). A limited production of custom carbon fiber anything tends to be expensive. It was certainly wasteful.
    On a related note:

    A small South Carolina parts supplier collected about $20.5 million over six years from the Pentagon for fraudulent shipping costs, including $998,798 for sending two 19-cent washers to an Army base in Texas, U.S. officials said.

    The company also billed and was paid $455,009 to ship three machine screws costing $1.31 each to Marines in Habbaniyah, Iraq, and $293,451 to ship an 89-cent split washer to Patrick Air Force Base in Cape Canaveral, Florida, Pentagon records show.

    The owners of C&D Distributors in Lexington, South Carolina -- twin sisters -- exploited a flaw in an automated Defense Department purchasing system: bills for shipping to combat areas or U.S. bases that were labeled ``priority'' were usually paid automatically, said Cynthia Stroot, a Pentagon investigator.
    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...d=aY5OQ5xv9HR8

    And from a US supplier, no less.

  10. #69

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    I think the government should buy the most expensive product available when they buy things they don't need with stolen money.

  11. #70

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    Quote Originally Posted by enoch150 View Post
    On a related note:



    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...d=aY5OQ5xv9HR8

    And from a US supplier, no less.

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