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Thread: Liberty For All and Teaparty groups seek to defeat McConnell in 2014

  1. #31

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    Waste of money and likely not going to achieve anything. Lindsey Graham should be the target.




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  3. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheTyke View Post
    Moffett was an unknown and with 1/10th of the funds, came within 10% of beating the Republican State Senate President in the primary for governor. He was not a good speaker, and did this with no help from the national movement because of certain folks relentlessly making discouraging posts. The power of the Tea Parties in Kentucky even took Rand by surprise... everyone expected it to be a blowout, not a 10% difference. So again, realism is fine, but discouragement is not helpful.
    Close only counts in horseshoes. McConnell won't be touched. You should take the long-term view of this, since the outlook is very hopeful. This could very well be McConnell's last term before he retires. He's old and his time is coming to a close. By the time McConnell is done, Massie will have the household name recognition to ease into his Senate seat without much of a fight at all. He's just keeping it warm for Thomas.
    Last edited by Bastiat's The Law; 01-23-2013 at 04:53 PM.

  4. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deborah K View Post
    This is a sickening reality. Our elections aren't won - they're bought. So let's just accept that a creeper like McConnell will stay in office screwing us, irreparably, because nothing can be done about the fact that our elections are bought and paid for - and the money goes to.......the main stream media - the brainwashers.....yep....we're screwed until there's REAL campaign finance change.

    Carry on...
    You could easily say that all of our candidates won thanks to money. Nothing new...


  5. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy View Post
    You could easily say that all of our candidates won thanks to money. Nothing new...
    Yes, you could say that. But I, for one, would much prefer an electoral process that provided a level playing field. Trying to get the right people in office is never going to happen at a fast enough pace to make any difference as long as money controls the process. The money power will always win out. Not trying to be a Debbie Downer, but I'm just not 'feelin it' these days.
    Diversity finds unity in the message of freedom.

    Dilige et quod vis fac. ~ Saint Augustine

    Quote Originally Posted by HOLLYWOOD View Post
    If anything, this situation has proved the government is nothing but a dictatorship backed by deadly force... no different than the dictatorships in the banana republics, just more polished and cleverly propagandized.

  6. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deborah K View Post
    Wow, this is dispicable on so many levels. Sailingaway isn't damaging the liberty movement, what a ridiculous assumption. You not only insult her, but everyone else because you assume we need YOU to keep us on the straight and narrow since we can't think for ourselves. We're not the borg. Wow. How about you "reign in" your self-righteous attitude.
    Do you think the word "Republican" behind Dr. Paul here was an accident? What about the phrase "We Are The Future"? This was in direct response to supporters wanting to give up and leave the party. Keeping the liberty movement focused on what actually works has always been the agenda from Ron Paul on down. I'm sorry you just got the memo.


  7. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy View Post
    You could easily say that all of our candidates won thanks to money. Nothing new...
    It takes money to reach the non-political junkies.

    Then it takes more money to educate them on matters the government schools either overlooked or brainwashed them into believing.

  8. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bastiat's The Law View Post
    Do you think the word "Republican" behind Dr. Paul here was an accident? What about the phrase "We Are The Future"? This was in direct response to supporters wanting to give up and leave the party. Keeping the liberty movement focused on what actually works has always been the agenda from Ron Paul on down. I'm sorry you just got the memo.

    Memo to you! It's your approach, Genius! Get it? And besides, you're never going to get liberty-minded people all on the same page of political action, nor should you want to. Restoring freedom in this country requires a multi-pronged approach (including but not limited to infiltrating BOTH parties), and either you're going to have to trust the people to move in the right direction - or NOT! But you don't get to insult other members while sitting on your high horse trying to corral everyone into thinking and acting the way you deem we should. Just knock it off.
    Diversity finds unity in the message of freedom.

    Dilige et quod vis fac. ~ Saint Augustine

    Quote Originally Posted by HOLLYWOOD View Post
    If anything, this situation has proved the government is nothing but a dictatorship backed by deadly force... no different than the dictatorships in the banana republics, just more polished and cleverly propagandized.

  9. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bastiat's The Law View Post
    When you have finite resources, yes it is an either or decision. I'm not entirely convinced we have the resources to mount credible challenges to multiple Senate seats simultaneously. To defeat someone as entrenched as McConnell you need to secure the three M's: Man, Money, Message

    At this juncture we have none of those requirements fulfilled.
    but the point is you spend your resources others spend theirs. You don't want people cutting down efforts you find worthy of spending your money on, and might want to be considerate of other people's efforts as well,

    It isn't like there is a pot of money and a democratic control of where it goes. Each spend their own money.
    "Integrity means having to say things that people don't want to hear & especially to say things that the regime doesn't want to hear. -Ron Paul

    "Bathtub falls and police officers kill more Americans than terrorism, yet we've been asked to sacrifice our most sacred rights for fear of falling victim to it." -Edward Snowden

  10. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deborah K View Post
    Memo to you! It's your approach, Genius! Get it? And besides, you're never going to get liberty-minded people all on the same page of political action, nor should you want to. Restoring freedom in this country requires a multi-pronged approach (including but not limited to infiltrating BOTH parties), and either you're going to have to trust the people to move in the right direction - or NOT! But you don't get to insult other members while sitting on your high horse trying to corral everyone into thinking and acting the way you deem we should. Just knock it off.
    Infiltrating the democratic party? Seriously?


  11. #40

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    Yes, seriously. Remember the Blue Republicans? If Robin K ran as a D I'd back him. I hope he'd run Gop because we have more organization there, but there are states where R makes no sense. Ron has said our ideas have to be in all parties, just as the bad ideas are, and I agree with him.
    "Integrity means having to say things that people don't want to hear & especially to say things that the regime doesn't want to hear. -Ron Paul

    "Bathtub falls and police officers kill more Americans than terrorism, yet we've been asked to sacrifice our most sacred rights for fear of falling victim to it." -Edward Snowden

  12. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bastiat's The Law View Post
    Infiltrating the democratic party? Seriously?
    Ron is friends with Dennis Kucinich as I'm certain you know. That video is a small sampling of democratic voters. Any Democrat could go around a Republican event and scrounge up just as many boneheads. If we're ever going to get anywhere, we have to move beyond the right-left paradigm - it's how they are able to distract us - by dividing us. We get liberty-minded individuals into office as Dems, as well as Republicans, then we may actually change the hearts and minds of a nation.
    Diversity finds unity in the message of freedom.

    Dilige et quod vis fac. ~ Saint Augustine

    Quote Originally Posted by HOLLYWOOD View Post
    If anything, this situation has proved the government is nothing but a dictatorship backed by deadly force... no different than the dictatorships in the banana republics, just more polished and cleverly propagandized.

  13. #42

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    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

  14. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deborah K View Post
    This is a sickening reality. Our elections aren't won - they're bought. So let's just accept that a creeper like McConnell will stay in office screwing us, irreparably, because nothing can be done about the fact that our elections are bought and paid for - and the money goes to.......the main stream media - the brainwashers.....yep....we're screwed until there's REAL campaign finance change.

    Carry on...
    That's going a little too far. In most cases both party's main candidates have enough money to compete for the Senate, so it isn't 'bought' when it comes down to the general. The primary can be bought though, and most people don't have the kind of money needed to run.

  15. #44

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    but usually both funded candidates are funded because they will get goodies at taxpayer expense for different special interests, so it is still bought, just on both sides.
    "Integrity means having to say things that people don't want to hear & especially to say things that the regime doesn't want to hear. -Ron Paul

    "Bathtub falls and police officers kill more Americans than terrorism, yet we've been asked to sacrifice our most sacred rights for fear of falling victim to it." -Edward Snowden

  16. #45

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    The point is, there are races that are winnable and races that aren't. Every cycle, good money is thrown at candidate's who couldn't win their race under any circumstances. John Dennis, Peter Schiff, Art Robinson, and Kurt Bills come to mind. This Kentucky Senate Race looks like a loser. McConnell has the entire establishment behind him. He will have over $10 million if he wants it, probably more. He can call for help at any moment. He is also known as one of the greatest politicos in the history of the state. There are winnable races out there where money would matter more.

    Everyone can do what they want with their own money, but I caution that this may not be the best use of that money.

  17. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by sailingaway View Post
    McConnell has screwed the country for decades. Who is worse?
    Every single Democratic US Senator.
    Lifetime member of more than 1 national gun organization and the New Hampshire Liberty Alliance. Part of Young Americans for Liberty and Campaign for Liberty. Free State Project participant and multi-year Free Talk Live AMPlifier.

  18. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deborah K View Post
    Ron is friends with Dennis Kucinich as I'm certain you know. That video is a small sampling of democratic voters. Any Democrat could go around a Republican event and scrounge up just as many boneheads. If we're ever going to get anywhere, we have to move beyond the right-left paradigm - it's how they are able to distract us - by dividing us. We get liberty-minded individuals into office as Dems, as well as Republicans, then we may actually change the hearts and minds of a nation.
    I've love to see people start doing that somewhere besides New Hampshire. Are people outside of NH just lazy? Do they not know how to organize? What's the problem?
    Lifetime member of more than 1 national gun organization and the New Hampshire Liberty Alliance. Part of Young Americans for Liberty and Campaign for Liberty. Free State Project participant and multi-year Free Talk Live AMPlifier.

  19. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith and stuff View Post
    I've love to see people start doing that somewhere besides New Hampshire. Are people outside of NH just lazy? Do they not know how to organize? What's the problem?
    The Democrat Party is a waste of time.

    Anyone who is slightly to the right is now beaten down hard by progressives and spendaholics.

    The Blue Dogs are practically extinct.

    It is an Obama, uber liberal party now.

    The good news is that because they're overrun with progressives they won't get the House for a long time.

  20. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by itshappening View Post
    The Democrat Party is a waste of time.

    Anyone who is slightly to the right is now beaten down hard by progressives and spendaholics.

    The Blue Dogs are practically extinct.

    It is an Obama, uber liberal party now.

    The good news is that because they're overrun with progressives they won't get the House for a long time.
    Then why is the strategy of running liberty Democrats starting to work in NH? Why are Democrats getting elected in town after town in local elections and also as state reps? In fact, 6 of the stat rep. races won by FSPers in NH were FSPers running as Democrats. Perhaps where you live Democrats are different. Where I live, even the Democrats work hard to prevent a state income or state sales tax.

    I think you are WAY too over generalizing and collectivizing. I'm not sure why you are doing it but it's distasteful at best.
    Lifetime member of more than 1 national gun organization and the New Hampshire Liberty Alliance. Part of Young Americans for Liberty and Campaign for Liberty. Free State Project participant and multi-year Free Talk Live AMPlifier.

  21. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by itshappening View Post
    The Democrat Party is a waste of time.

    Anyone who is slightly to the right is now beaten down hard by progressives and spendaholics.

    The Blue Dogs are practically extinct.

    It is an Obama, uber liberal party now.

    The good news is that because they're overrun with progressives they won't get the House for a long time.
    Left-right paradigm. This is divisive and distracting and nothing will ever change as long as parties are pitted against each other. Infiltration of both parties could change the entire game. Infiltration.
    Diversity finds unity in the message of freedom.

    Dilige et quod vis fac. ~ Saint Augustine

    Quote Originally Posted by HOLLYWOOD View Post
    If anything, this situation has proved the government is nothing but a dictatorship backed by deadly force... no different than the dictatorships in the banana republics, just more polished and cleverly propagandized.

  22. #51
    Member Keith and stuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deborah K View Post
    Left-right paradigm. This is divisive and distracting and nothing will ever change as long as parties are pitted against each other. Infiltration of both parties could change the entire game. Infiltration.
    I like a lot of what you said but using that word is also divisive and distracting. I mean don't get me wrong, what you said is certainly an improvement over what itshappening said but it is still counterproductive (IMO) to use that type of political language in public. Maybe use that type of language in a back room filled with cigar smoke. It certainly isn't going to run you any friends when you or your friends are running for office and it is used against you on the radio, online and in debates.
    Last edited by Keith and stuff; 01-23-2013 at 10:57 PM.
    Lifetime member of more than 1 national gun organization and the New Hampshire Liberty Alliance. Part of Young Americans for Liberty and Campaign for Liberty. Free State Project participant and multi-year Free Talk Live AMPlifier.

  23. #52
    Mr. Republitarian FSP-Rebel's Avatar
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    The main thing that people can do in their state to make it easier to knock off these rinos is to push to scrap your primary system in favor for party delegates picking nominees at state conventions and local nominees at county conventions. Each C4L state group should be pushing for this in an unofficial capacity if needed. This should be the main question asked of candidates running for state chair and those for exec comm spots. Forget blowing absurd amounts of money in primaries as it's damaging to the party itself as well as to the taxpayers that foot the election tab. There's where the additional power of precinct delegates come into play and many more changes can happen relatively sooner on a broad scale.

  24. #53
    Member Keith and stuff's Avatar
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    I don't support replacing voting by the people with major decisions like these being made in cigar smoking rooms.
    Lifetime member of more than 1 national gun organization and the New Hampshire Liberty Alliance. Part of Young Americans for Liberty and Campaign for Liberty. Free State Project participant and multi-year Free Talk Live AMPlifier.

  25. #54

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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith and stuff View Post
    I like a lot of what you said but using that word is also divisive and distracting. I mean don't get me wrong, what you said is certainly an improvement over what itshappening said but it is still counterproductive (IMO) to use that type of political language in public. Maybe use that type of language in a back room filled with cigar smoke. It certainly isn't going to run you any friends when you or your friends are running for office and it is used against you on the radio, online and in debates.
    How is discussing the strategy of infiltration counterproductive? It's an excellent strategy, just ask the KGB during the Cold War. It's done all the time, and it's time for this movement to seriously consider it, afterall, it wouldn't be for subversive purposes. It would be to restore freedom, the Constitution, and the Republic.

    I don't intend to run for office, I'm not a pundit, and I highly doubt anything I say on these forums gets reported back to the shadow gov't. LOL. However, I am aware that ideas discussed here can permeate the subconscious and stir in the soul, and can potentially become successful strategies.

    Let's say, for the purpose of argument, that this was used against our movement on the radio, online, and in debates. So what? Explain to me how an adversary can, with intellectual honesty, accuse us of wanting to be destructive to the country by implanting liberty-minded individuals in the Democratic party, or any other party?
    Diversity finds unity in the message of freedom.

    Dilige et quod vis fac. ~ Saint Augustine

    Quote Originally Posted by HOLLYWOOD View Post
    If anything, this situation has proved the government is nothing but a dictatorship backed by deadly force... no different than the dictatorships in the banana republics, just more polished and cleverly propagandized.

  26. #55
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    It is the use of the word infiltration. It many people it is a negative word. It is a word that a decent opponent would use against you in a campaign, and they should. After all, it is a present you gave them to use against you. They should play that you (or whomever uses it) isn't a real Democrat and so on. Why give the opposition so much to use against you? It doesn't seem like smart politics to me. Someone runs as a Democrat because they like this and that about the Party, not because they want to infiltrate the Party. I recommend doing it for the right reasons.
    Lifetime member of more than 1 national gun organization and the New Hampshire Liberty Alliance. Part of Young Americans for Liberty and Campaign for Liberty. Free State Project participant and multi-year Free Talk Live AMPlifier.

  27. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith and stuff View Post
    It is the use of the word infiltration. It many people it is a negative word. It is a word that a decent opponent would use against you in a campaign, and they should. After all, it is a present you gave them to use against you. They should play that you (or whomever uses it) isn't a real Democrat and so on. Why give the opposition so much to use against you? It doesn't seem like smart politics to me. Someone runs as a Democrat because they like this and that about the Party, not because they want to infiltrate the Party. I recommend doing it for the right reasons.
    Keith, I get what you're saying. It would be ridiculous for someone to use the word in a highly visible venue while campaigning. LOL. I'm not suggesting that, I promise. hehe. I'm attempting to bring awareness to the strategy of running in a party that desperately needs reforming from within. What do you think we've been doing with the Republican party? How many Libertarians run as Republicans now? You may not like the use of the word, but as Shakespeare so eloquently put it: "A rose by any other name would smell as sweet." In this case, infiltration is a sweet smelling rose in that it produces a positive effect for the mindset of a nation, and thus its government. How many democrats left the party when they learned about Ron? I personally know of many. They could legitimately run as Democrats.

    My belief is that we are running out of time in this country. We must activate all courses of action, in the most timely of fashions. The two-party system is entrenched and isn't going away any time soon. Our political philosophy (Ron's political philosophy) must permeate both parties as we don't have time to build an effective new party. My use of the word "infiltration" may be offensive and concerning to others, but even if the opposition knows of our intentions, they will most likely never be able to pin it on any one candidate. I'm not paranoid enough to think anyone from the opposition cares about what I've written in this post, or will ever read it. And if it plants seeds in the minds of doers, then I've accomplished my objective.
    Last edited by Deborah K; 01-24-2013 at 03:36 PM. Reason: typo
    Diversity finds unity in the message of freedom.

    Dilige et quod vis fac. ~ Saint Augustine

    Quote Originally Posted by HOLLYWOOD View Post
    If anything, this situation has proved the government is nothing but a dictatorship backed by deadly force... no different than the dictatorships in the banana republics, just more polished and cleverly propagandized.

  28. #57
    Mr. Republitarian FSP-Rebel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith and stuff View Post
    I don't support replacing voting by the people with major decisions like these being made in cigar smoking rooms.
    The insiders can buy the votes of the "people" during primaries while the conservative base tends to come up short, not to mention non-pro-party platform people vote in these primaries for what should be a private party's officers picking their nominees. Party officers are like the electors that pick the prez, it's called a republican form of government. Plus, we surely don't want a democracy w/i the GOP, esp the way the media gets around. Yall don't have to do that in NH if you don't want but I'd want nothing to do with Ayotte or the other broad and my advice is to make it easier on yourselves and go for state convention nominee-picking route. Of course, many of you are content to send the worst of the worst to DC not caring much for the rest of the country, I've long since sensed that and got that impression when I lived there.

  29. #58

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    We don't have the numbers to infiltrate both major parties. Besides, the democrats are irreversibly hopeless.

  30. #59

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bastiat's The Law View Post
    We don't have the numbers to infiltrate both major parties. Besides, the democrats are irreversibly hopeless.
    If all of them are hopeless, then why have so many of them become Paul supporters?
    Diversity finds unity in the message of freedom.

    Dilige et quod vis fac. ~ Saint Augustine

    Quote Originally Posted by HOLLYWOOD View Post
    If anything, this situation has proved the government is nothing but a dictatorship backed by deadly force... no different than the dictatorships in the banana republics, just more polished and cleverly propagandized.

  31. #60
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    We don't have the numbers to bother to care about and work with both major parties. Besides, the Democrats are irreversibly hopeless.
    Then why are liberty Democrats getting elected and doing great things? Why are decent Democrats beating hopeless Democrats in major Democratic primaries?
    Lifetime member of more than 1 national gun organization and the New Hampshire Liberty Alliance. Part of Young Americans for Liberty and Campaign for Liberty. Free State Project participant and multi-year Free Talk Live AMPlifier.

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