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Thread: Secret Service demands ebay remove all Norfed Liberty dollars as counterfeits

  1. #1

    Default Secret Service demands ebay remove all Norfed Liberty dollars as counterfeits

    http://www.goldismoney2.com/showthre...s-counterfeits

    This is getting ridiculous.

    So now it is illegal to sell something that the government considers counterfeit?

    Seems anything related to NORFED is being taken off of Ebay.

    If you have any of these items, you had better hide them carefully.
    Dear mike XXX,

    You recently listed the following listing:

    221158190865 - $5 Liberty Dollar Silver Certificate Warehouse Receipt (Norfed) 1/2 Oz UNC
    221158191090 - Liberty Dollar $10 Silver Certificate Warehouse Receipt (Norfed) 1oz UNC

    Unfortunately, we had to remove your listing because of the following:

    The United States Secret Service has requested the removal of all Norfed Liberty dollars on the eBay site as counterfeits. If you have any questions you can contact them at the US Secret Service Public Affairs Office: 202-406-5708.

    Please do not relist this item(s).

    We appreciate that you chose to list this coin on our site and understand there was no ill intent on your part. Your listing fees have been credited to your account.
    http://www.libertydollarnews.org/pom...ings[]=248
    Seems even the warehouse receipts are considered counterfeit. Of course they look nothing like U.S. currency and the only reason they are worthless is because the government confiscated the gold and silver backing them.
    Last edited by Dr.3D; 12-09-2012 at 10:45 AM.



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  3. #2

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    Wow... considering there's no real value to Federal Reserve Notes, that's pretty cheeky indeed. Maybe Tim Geitner ought to be arrested for passing off worthless, counterfeit stuff as well.

  4. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by KCIndy View Post
    Wow... considering there's no real value to Federal Reserve Notes, that's pretty cheeky indeed. Maybe Tim Geitner ought to be arrested for passing off worthless, counterfeit stuff as well.
    Could be they are upset those $1 warehouse receipts were getting around $36 bucks on Ebay now.

  5. #4

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    Simple, melt them down.
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    The government hates competition!
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  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Simple, melt them down.
    I doubt people who have those rare Ron Paul 2008 silver Liberty Dollars that have been selling on Ebay for around $300, want to melt them down.

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  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by SpreadOfLiberty View Post
    Secret Service?
    Yeah, that struck me as especially odd too.
    I have many friends in the libertarian movement who look down on those of us who get involved in political activity,
    he acknowledged, but "eventually, if you want to bring about changes what you have to do is participate in political
    action.
    -- Ron Paul


    "We do have some differences and our approaches will be different, but that makes him his own person. I mean why should he [Rand] be a clone and do everything and think just exactly as I have. I think it's an opportunity to be independent minded. We are about 99% the same on issues." "People Try To Drive Wedges Between Rand And Me." --Ron Paul

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=pB5JgzBVHN0

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  10. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by SpreadOfLiberty View Post
    Secret Service?

    The Secret Service was originally created with the sole purpose of tracking down currency counterfeiters:

    http://www.secretservice.gov/faq.shtml#faq1

    The United States Secret Service, one of the nation's oldest federal investigative law enforcement agencies, was founded in 1865 as a branch of the U.S. Treasury Department. It was originally created to combat the counterfeiting of U.S. currency - a serious problem at the time. In fact, following the Civil War, it was estimated that one-third to one-half of the currency in circulation was counterfeit.
    While I disagree wholeheartedly with the government's take on the Liberty Dollar, the "counterfeiting" charge is what the Feds used to go in and stomp NorFed.

  11. #10

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    Yeah, the SS is tasked foremost with guarding the Treasury. Protective duties came second.
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    Secret Service , what a bunch of douches, only fake money I see are FRN's.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KCIndy View Post
    The Secret Service was originally created with the sole purpose of tracking down currency counterfeiters:

    http://www.secretservice.gov/faq.shtml#faq1



    While I disagree wholeheartedly with the government's take on the Liberty Dollar, the "counterfeiting" charge is what the Feds used to go in and stomp NorFed.
    Yes , that was when money was real , or backed by something.No more , they are just douche detail now.

  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by oyarde View Post
    Secret Service , what a bunch of douches, only fake money I see are FRN's.
    Exactly why Geitner needs to be arrested by the Secret Service.... as if that will happen. Yeah.

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    I can't see from that how any of those could be confused for the United States currency they claim is being counterfeited. The warehouse receipts are so far from looking like anything used as money, it's just crazy to say they are counterfeit anything. The only reason those receipts are now bogus is that the government stole their backing from the mint.

  17. #16

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    [QUOTE=Dr.3D;4767761
    This is getting ridiculous.

    So now it is illegal to sell something that the government considers counterfeit?

    Seems anything related to NORFED is being taken off of Ebay.

    If you have any of these items, you had better hide them carefully.
    [/QUOTE]


    Hmm... this is getting more interesting. I did some digging, and as near as I can tell, there's no Federal law against possessing - or even selling - a counterfeit as long as the counterfeit is NOT being represented as the real thing.

    Granted, I'm not a lawyer. Not even close. But the key seems to be the phrase "intent to deceive."

    Here's a link to the section of the U.S. code that pertains to counterfeiting:

    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/te...t-I/chapter-25

    Funny thing is, it looks like it is easier for the Feds to bust someone who is minting coins rather than printing paper notes. Here's the section I'm guessing they used against Bernard von NotHaus:

    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/486
    Whoever, except as authorized by law, makes or utters or passes, or attempts to utter or pass, any coins of gold or silver or other metal, or alloys of metals, intended for use as current money, whether in the resemblance of coins of the United States or of foreign countries, or of original design, shall be fined under this title [1] or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.

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    If ideas like these caught on, the counterfeiters would lose all of their power so they gotta be clamped down upon. No surprise here. Has Von NotHaus been sentenced to federal prison yet?
    Defend liberty, Michiganders! Join the Tenth Amendment Center & work to nullify the Feds in your community today:

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  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgt150 View Post
    If ideas like these caught on, the counterfeiters would lose all of their power so they gotta be clamped down upon. No surprise here. Has Von NotHaus been sentenced to federal prison yet?
    October 2012

    So, here we stand, waiting for Judge Voorhees to take action and hope for the best. As of October 18, it has been nineteen months since my conviction. WOW, in a few more months, I could be back in court on the second anniversary of my conviction. Whenever, I hope some of you might join me.

    http://www.libertydollarnews.org/pom...ings[]=245
    Looks like he is still waiting for sentencing.


    Here is a link to all of the email that was sent out to his supporters.
    http://www.libertydollarnews.org/pom...r/mailings.php
    Last edited by Dr.3D; 12-09-2012 at 08:36 PM.

  20. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgt150 View Post
    Has Von NotHaus been sentenced to federal prison yet?
    I don't think so. Here's an interesting article from the New York Times giving a rundown of the case. I still can't see how the jury could have convicted him.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/25/us...pagewanted=all

  21. #20

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    Hmm. As near as I can tell, the sentencing date hasn't been set yet. Which is a bit odd since his conviction was back in March '11. Maybe is defense is holding up the process with appeals?

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    One thing that might help , is if you avoid the word "Liberty", that appears to ensure these worthless tax tick mongoloids show up.

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    Call them Socialist , Marxist , Alinsky , LBJ, Wilson, UN, Commie, Fascist dollars and nobody would bother you ....

  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by oyarde View Post
    Call them Socialist , Marxist , Alinsky , LBJ, Wilson, UN, Commie, Fascist dollars and nobody would bother you ....
    There's something to that, I think. Sometimes I think we should take a page out of the Fed's Jekyll Island strategy book more often. There's a Choir Vocabulary for every ideology that serves as red flags for everyone of an opposing ideology, and causes them to shut down and turn off whenever they hear it. It pays to be self-aware, and to know how and when to avoid those words, making substitutions as needed.

    If you called the Federal Reserve Bank System the Counterfeiter of First Resort System, it wouldn't fly. But the monsters at Jekyll Island weren't concerned about the name at all, except as it might help get the Federal Reserve Act accepted by the public and passed. They didn't care what it was called; only that it have the power to do what it was designed to do, regardless of its deliberately misleading name.

    I would have no problem with the same NORFED coins being called Marxist Socialist Commie Money, even stamped right on it. A rose by any other name... I love Rocky Road ice cream, and if you passed an obnoxious law that stated that it had to be called Crap Ice Cream instead, then I guess I would love Crap Ice Cream instead.

  25. #24

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    17 norfed listings at the moment:

    http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trks...at=0&_from=R40
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    Member Gideon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by presence View Post
    Of those 17 listings, only 5 were designed by BvNH, and only 3 are actually Liberty Dollars.

    Thus far, neither ebay nor SS has been the least bit cooperative, in that neither will provide the names of the individuals responsible for these bans.

    Stay tuned!
    Peacefully Engaged in Domestic Economic Terrorism Since 2004.

    Audit Fort Knox so we will know how much Tungsten backs the FRN!

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    Quote Originally Posted by KCIndy View Post
    Hmm. As near as I can tell, the sentencing date hasn't been set yet. Which is a bit odd since his conviction was back in March '11. Maybe is defense is holding up the process with appeals?
    http://lewrockwell.com/wenzel/wenzel126.html

    There is no time period during which United States District Court Judge Richard Voorhees has to rule on the motion to dismiss. Von NotHaus tells me that in one North Carolina case the Judge took 10 years to rule.
    He's asking that people write to the judge.

    Your letter could save Bernard von NotHaus from prison
    http://www.downsizedc.org/blog/your-...us-from-prison

    A Helping Hand for Liberty Dollar Founder?
    http://www.nolanchart.com/article999...r-founder.html
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    --Albert Jay Nock

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    Default Give me Liberty!

    Quote Originally Posted by oyarde View Post
    One thing that might help , is if you avoid the word "Liberty", that appears to ensure these worthless tax tick mongoloids show up.
    Neither the fed nor the U.S. Mint hold title to the words "liberty" or "dollar."

    However, if I were to do it all again, I would use the term "unit" instead of "dollar," just because the Mint does not.

    Excerpted from The Coinage Act of 1792:

    DOLLARS OR UNITS--each to be of the value of

    a Spanish milled dollar as the same is now

    current, and to contain three hundred and

    seventy-one grains and four sixteenth parts

    of a grain of pure, or four hundred and

    sixteen grains of standard silver.

    ...

    Section 10. And be it further enacted, That,

    upon the said coins respectively, there shall

    be the following devices and legends, namely:

    Upon one side of each of the said coins there

    shall be an impression emblematic of liberty,

    with an inscription of the word Liberty, and

    the year of the coinage;
    ...
    Peacefully Engaged in Domestic Economic Terrorism Since 2004.

    Audit Fort Knox so we will know how much Tungsten backs the FRN!

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    Anyone know any other site to check prices of NORFED's? I have a $10 Silver (not Ron Paul) and just curious what its is worth now.

  30. #29

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    So it must be really tough for them. We have no money so they will be counterfeiting the money supply in order to take the real assets out of circulation.



    Merry Christmas.

  31. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Simple, melt them down.
    worst case scenario you can melt them down, but they sell for so much as collectibles.

    I was still able to find NORFED listings on eBay

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