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I agree with Rand (Didn't watch the video, but I'm guessing I know what he said.) It bugs me when people make this particular criticism of Obama because its a means of trying to separate Obama from the GOP establishment, rather than acknowledging that they believe a lot of the same things.
Its funny how John McCain (Who actually did run for President) and Ted Cruz (Who may be about to run for President, and has been floated around as a candidate) actually weren't born here, and yet nobody mentions it.
That said, I've read somewhere that the original intent of "Natural born" May mean being born in the US to parents who are US citizens. That would discount both Obama and Senator Rubio.
This post represents only the opinions of Christian Liberty and not the rest of the forum. Use discretion when reading
Rand was actually talking about Cruz. But he said he's not a birther for Democrats or Republicans. He just doesn't want to bother with that fringe issue.Originally Posted by FreedomFanatic
With regards to McCain, he was born in the US. The Panama Canal Zone was a US territory, not foreign soil.
I understand. But... wasn't Cruz actually born in Canada? Like, isn't that what his birth certificate says? IIRC the argument for him being natural born are about his parents' citizenship not his birthplace
I can understand that, but nonetheless, I find it bizarre that nobody ever brought it up for McCain yet everyone did it to Obama (And understand, I'm no fan of his, there's plenty I don't like about Obama.)With regards to McCain, he was born in the US. The Panama Canal Zone was a US territory, not foreign soil.
This post represents only the opinions of Christian Liberty and not the rest of the forum. Use discretion when reading
Good, that whole crazed out wing of the GOP is nothing but trouble. 'He's a secret Muslim terrorist.' Even when Romney made the supposed joke that no one's asking to see his birth certificate, it's like 'Really?' That sort of crap is what led Donald Trump to be considered a potential Republican presidential candidate.
Cruz was born in Canada to an American mother. He was eligible for US citizenship from birth, therefore a natural born citizen despite not being a native born citizen.
It was brought up, which is why the Senate passed a motion saying he is a natural born citizen. They didn't have to do that though since McCain was born in a US territory to two US citizen parents and Congress had passed a law in the 30s granting everyone born in the Panama Canal Zone territory natural born status if they were born to at least one US citizen parent.
OK: I'm not normally one to appeal to SCOTUS but this is the kind of thing they should probably define (Unless they already have) because I don't think this is a question with an obvious answer.Cruz was born in Canada to an American mother. He was eligible for US citizenship from birth, therefore a natural born citizen despite not being a native born citizen.
This post represents only the opinions of Christian Liberty and not the rest of the forum. Use discretion when reading
It is obvious. The question is:
Has he been a citizen since birth? Yes.
I recall once Rand saying he wasn't sure. (Don't have the link at the moment). Anyway, anyone not willing to file impeachment proceedings over NSA spying, funding of Al Qaeda linked terrorists in Libya and Syria, whatever happened at Bengazi, IRSGate and a whole host of other issues has no right to bring up something as comparably trivial as where Obama was born. Oh....but if you went after Obama for real stuff like that you'd have to go after republicans too.
9/11 Thermate experiments
Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I
"I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"
"We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul
"It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
You know I'm not unwilling to criticize Rand when appropriate, but isn't Rand UNABLE to file impeachment proceedings, being in the senate?
This post represents only the opinions of Christian Liberty and not the rest of the forum. Use discretion when reading
I wasn't talking about Rand. Sorry for being unclear. I'm talking about all of the people who freak out about the birther issue but ignore more important stuff that cut across more than one administration. Yes impeachment happens in the house and if successful then removal proceeds in the senate.
9/11 Thermate experiments
Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I
"I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"
"We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul
"It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
OK, I completely agree, and yeah, this is exactly the point, it lets them attack Obama without attacking their own.
I'd love to see Amash or Massie try to impeach Obama, but I can understand why they wouldn't. That said, the people who blame Rand for the fact that they don't are absolute idiots, and this coming from someone who prefers Amash and Massie over Rand in virtually every respect.
This post represents only the opinions of Christian Liberty and not the rest of the forum. Use discretion when reading
Erin has quite the baby bump!
Obama was obviously born in Kenya and was not a natural born citizen and thus was never qualified for the Senate nor the presidency. Obama didn't spend millions fighting the release of his birth certificate in court because he had nothing to hide. The fraud he has committed here alone could get him a lengthy jail term, never mind impeached and removed from office.
I just look at her and I see bad breath.
You obviously did not watch the interview, because he wasn't talking about Obama.
It was never a fringe issue, any more than end the Fed is a fringe issue, just a constitutional one the statist media wants to paint as fringe. About half the public (certainly half the GOP) polled as doubting Obarry's citizenship as of 2011, which is why he was forced to release the photoshopped BC to kill the momentum of this sentiment. He has never submitted the original document to any court to be vetted as genuine, the way it would be done for anybody else---because he doesn't have one.
One of the key issues is a statutory definition of US citizen (or a legislative decree by Congress, in the case of Cruz) is NOT the same thing as being a natural born citizen as per the Constitution. Would we accept a vote of Congress authorizing all the current foreign interventions as legal wars, as being as good as a Constitutional declaration of war? Some want to have an a la carte approach to defending the Constitution while putting down others, but some like me are more consistent. The statutory replacement definitions are NOT sufficient. Neither Obarry or McCain, or Rubio, nor Cruz meet the Constitutional qualifications for running for President.
Last edited by Peace&Freedom; 08-14-2013 at 08:17 PM.
-----Peace & Freedom, John Clifton-----
Blog: https://electclifton.wordpress.com/2...back-backlash/
What definition does the constitution give for natural born citizen?
And how does McCain no qualify as natural born citizen. Even under the most stringent defintion he would be one. He was born on US soil to two US citizens.
It has been discussed in innumerable prior threads, Freedom Fanatic expressed the core essence in his post. Natural born citizen means (among other things, under original intent), being born in one of the original states of the Union. A federal territory (a base in Panama) only meets a statutory definition, not the Constitutional standard, thus disqualifying McCain.
-----Peace & Freedom, John Clifton-----
Blog: https://electclifton.wordpress.com/2...back-backlash/
So you must be born in one of the original 13 states to be a natural born citizen? That is absurd.
Again, where in the constitution does it give a definition of natural born citizen?
All that is needed is one parent must be an American citizen at the time your birth, regardless of place of birth, you are qualified to be President.
We're beating a dead horse here
If you tell the truth, you don't have to remember anything.
You just need to be a citizen at and by birth. For those born in the US that is enough, for those born outside the US one parent must be a citizen and meet the residency requirements.
Great answer.
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