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Thread: something I don't understand when buying silver....

  1. #31

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    I was kind of thinking that people have been listening to the concept that inflation is sucking the life out of the economy and are allowing some deflation to get it moving again.

    I started seeing all of the commodities start on a downward trend about a week back. At least that is what it looked like to me. It could be wishful thinking.
    yeah it took awhile for me to realize that gold is not an investment, its a store of value and because its constant makes excellent currency. When you listen to all the inflationists what they don't realize is that even Murray Rothbard talked about credit deflation due to credit contraction, because the credit acts like money and there is not much of this around then the currency itself appreciates in value. The FED comes along and prints to cancel this out, but this doesn't have a uniform effect intially and you have to guess where the new money is going first which makes things even harder to guage as stock prices can go up, but food prices stay constant, now you have to ask yourself is the stock really going up or is that where the new money goes first.

    So to try find out REAL UP AND DOWNS by extracting the fluctuating currency values you have too look at the fundemental commodities like oil, copper, weat, cotton also gold and silver.



    To be honest with you this is where I get left in the dust, because I realise that oil, cotton etc can fluctuate through lack of demand in a bad economy, but for me gold is a good anchor point to sort the weat from the chaf.

    Serioulsy the government poeple are so clever with their sneaky taxes that indirectly links the gold to the dollar, we should basically go black market with this stuff, it is afterall not illegal according to the constitution.
    Last edited by freedomordeath; 06-01-2012 at 02:25 AM.



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  3. #32

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    Silver is in a downtrend at the moment.I like the idea of just buying a little when you can.
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  4. #33

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    So where's the best place to buy?
    It's just an opinion... man...

  5. #34

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    Looks like Gold is trying an upside breakout today lol so Silver should follow.If it follows through on monday,I'd buy.
    The LAND Of Israel Forever

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    'Long Live Insert Name Here!'

    www.endofhistory.info

  6. #35

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    Following the jobs report, nearly everything is down except gold and silver, and both are way up at the moment.

    Anyway, I went ahead and tried out Northwest Territory Mint. They carry hefty premiums, though.
    Just for anybody who's interested in buying.
    Welcome to the R3VOLUTION!

  7. #36

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    Yes, just like 08, this market crash will see gold/silver bottom MONTHS (about half a year) before the real crash in everything else bottoms. FOr the most part, the bottom is in. Gold/silver could go a bit lower, but I don't think so.

    **Edit** Disclaimer: I hope silver drops to around 20$ before it starts it's next cyclical uptrend.

    Quote Originally Posted by Okie RP fan View Post
    Following the jobs report, nearly everything is down except gold and silver, and both are way up at the moment.

    Anyway, I went ahead and tried out Northwest Territory Mint. They carry hefty premiums, though.
    Just for anybody who's interested in buying.
    Last edited by Seraphim; 06-01-2012 at 09:14 AM.

  8. #37

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    Good day to be a gold bug, so far.. With the volatility, who knows where it will end up..

    All the other non PM commodities, like oil, gasoline, and natural gas are getting cock punched...

    I still think Nat Gas might represent the best medium to long term speculative play at this moment. Germany and Japan are shutting off all their nuke plants, something has got to keep spinning those turbines and making those electrons. Natural Gas seems like the winner in that race as it's cheap, clean (at least compared to coal), and reliable...

  9. #38
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    Nat gas is interesting....

  10. #39
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    Someone is sending me to pick up $1100 in silver Wed morning .What is your guess to next Tue close ??

  11. #40

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    Buy silver the cheapest you can find it. Don't pay premium for maples or silver eagles. Get the most recognized generic round... the indian/buffalo.

    If you are buying less than 500 oz get from here and pay with check: (0.89c over spot best deal)

    http://www.goldmart.com/bullion-1/si...-999-fine.html

    If you are buying more than 500oz get it from tulving at .59c over spot:

    http://www.tulving.com/bullion/1_oz_...lver_round.htm

    http://www.tulving.com/goldbull.html

  12. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Xar View Post
    When I have purchased Silver in the past, it would be some standard brand. Nothing fancy or unique date, ala:
    http://www.apmex.com/Category/1202/1...er_Rounds.aspx

    but then I see these, which are more expensive - isn't silver is silver is silver is silver? What does it matter the pattern or manufacterer?
    http://www.apmex.com/Category/1596/E...er_Rounds.aspx
    or

    http://www.apmex.com/Category/2/Cana...12__Prior.aspx


    What is the difference? When / If one was to cash in sometime in the distant future, why would one 1oz of one be more than another 1oz?
    The difference is in the Trust factor. When you buy coins gov't stamped the buyer knows what they are getting. Especially since the more metals are worth, the more people will try and find a way to scam...http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworst...with-tungsten/

    Also, if you are worried the gov't will make it illegal to own gold/silver, you should buy older coins. I am not going to do the research but anything over a certain age is considered collectible and the gov't allowed that when they made it illegal. (Then Mexico, i believe it was Mexico, started making gold and silver coins and just stamping them with a date older than that so Americans could buy them - lol).

    Furthermore, if you are buying in case of a societal collapse, having the coins that are reputable could make things much easier for you. In this case, silver dimes are probably the way to go since they are of a value more easily traded (in other words, it will be hard to trade a gold coin for a loaf of bread, but a silver dime...)

    Hope this helps.
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  13. #42
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    Well , I see none of my friends here called anything for me this past Wed , but I did make a purchase....

  14. #43
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    Alright , help a Brother out , what will be silver price tomorrow at noon ???

  15. #44
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    Thinking of another purchase ....

  16. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Xar View Post
    I see.

    Do you have any thoughts, personally, on that? Will/does it matter? APMEX seems reputable, why would they not have a premium attached as a valid/trusted producer of silver...

    Just trying to wrap my head around this. I see so many options.
    I buy all of my silver and copper from the AOCS(American Open Currency Standard) they have very good rates and are guaranteed .999 fine for copper and silver and .9999 fine for gold. They guarantee the weight of their bullion and if it turns out to not be the purity or weight indicated on the piece, they will replace it for free. They produce barter currencies and their currency is accepted by many merchants already. You can even make your own custom currency if you want. I have a bunch of different proof silver pieces for my retirement savings. I also have a larger variety of copper pieces which include Ron Paul Campaign for Liberty, Ludwig Von Mises Institute, Lawful Money, 2nd Amendment, Republic of Texas and so on. These guys are awesome.
    I'm starting to think that the Mayans were right about 2012. Ron Paul will change the world.

  17. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Professor8000 View Post
    I buy all of my silver and copper from the AOCS(American Open Currency Standard) they have very good rates and are guaranteed .999 fine for copper and silver and .9999 fine for gold. They guarantee the weight of their bullion and if it turns out to not be the purity or weight indicated on the piece, they will replace it for free. They produce barter currencies and their currency is accepted by many merchants already. You can even make your own custom currency if you want. I have a bunch of different proof silver pieces for my retirement savings. I also have a larger variety of copper pieces which include Ron Paul Campaign for Liberty, Ludwig Von Mises Institute, Lawful Money, 2nd Amendment, Republic of Texas and so on. These guys are awesome.
    AOCS has good rates? Really?

    Tell me, how much are silver rounds? Or copper rounds? No, I am not asking you how pretty their coins look, I give you that.

  18. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by NoOneButPaul View Post
    So where's the best place to buy?
    Depends on your budget and preference of form (rounds, bars, government minted...etc)

  19. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by liberdom View Post
    AOCS has good rates? Really?

    Tell me, how much are silver rounds? Or copper rounds? No, I am not asking you how pretty their coins look, I give you that.
    I can get silver for $30.77/oz and copper $34.00/20oz at the time I'm writing this post.
    I got 40oz of copper for $40 yesterday and the guy who sold it to me bought me lunch, these guys are awesome.

    Here's where you can see some of their stuff.
    Last edited by Professor8000; 06-22-2012 at 03:36 AM.
    I'm starting to think that the Mayans were right about 2012. Ron Paul will change the world.

  20. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by Professor8000 View Post
    I can get silver for $30.77/oz and copper $34.00/20oz at the time I'm writing this post.
    I got 40oz of copper for $40 yesterday and the guy who sold it to me bought me lunch, these guys are awesome.

    Here's where you can see some of their stuff.
    Is $31 for silver shipping included? How many do you have to buy to get that price?

    Copper coins are more like a collectible, because copper in metal costs only $3 per lb, fun to have though

  21. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by liberdom View Post
    Is $31 for silver shipping included? How many do you have to buy to get that price?

    Copper coins are more like a collectible, because copper in metal costs only $3 per lb, fun to have though
    The shipping price for my silver depends on how often I want them to ship my orders. If I want them shipped every month it's $7.90/month. Every 3 months is $2.65/month. Every 6 months is $1.35/month. Every 12 months is $0.65/month. I do local pickup so I don't have to pay for shipping. I order a set amount every month as part of a silver savings club which gives me discounts on their products too.

    If you are just buying one time, the shipping is $7.90. I would suggest getting a lot of silver if you were to go that route.

    The thing about their copper is that it is part of their barter currency, you can barter for $2.00 worth of stuff with each copper ounce of theirs.
    Last edited by Professor8000; 06-22-2012 at 01:58 PM.
    I'm starting to think that the Mayans were right about 2012. Ron Paul will change the world.

  22. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by Professor8000 View Post
    The shipping price for my silver depends on how often I want them to ship my orders. If I want them shipped every month it's $7.90/month. Every 3 months is $2.65/month. Every 6 months is $1.35/month. Every 12 months is $0.65/month. I do local pickup so I don't have to pay for shipping. I order a set amount every month as part of a silver savings club which gives me discounts on their products too.

    If you are just buying one time, the shipping is $7.90. I would suggest getting a lot of silver if you were to go that route.

    The thing about their copper is that it is part of their barter currency, you can barter for $2.00 worth of stuff with each copper ounce of theirs.
    It's good that you do local pick up.

    How much do you buy a month? 20 ounces? 50 ounces? 100 ounces?

    What if I wanted it shipped right away, rather than monthly or every 3 months?

    You mean I can buy 30 copper rounds and give to them to get 2 silver rounds in exchange?
    Last edited by liberdom; 06-22-2012 at 02:06 PM.

  23. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by liberdom View Post
    It's good that you do local pick up.

    How much do you buy a month? 20 ounces? 50 ounces? 100 ounces?

    You mean I can buy 30 copper rounds and give to them to get 2 silver rounds in exchange?
    I'm a poor man, so I can only afford to invest in my retirement so I only buy 2 silver proofs a month.

    No, they don't do that. They provide the currency, it's the merchants and other people who will barter with it. Besides, the 1oz silver pieces have a face value of 50.
    I'm starting to think that the Mayans were right about 2012. Ron Paul will change the world.

  24. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by Professor8000 View Post
    I'm a poor man, so I can only afford to invest in my retirement so I only buy 2 silver proofs a month.

    No, they don't do that. They provide the currency, it's the merchants and other people who will barter with it. Besides, the 1oz silver pieces have a face value of 50.
    There you have it. You might be better off saving your money until you can buy 10-20. You can negotiate better discounts too. I don't think you're driving to pick up 2 ounces each time, because that's a waste of time. Or, since you only have $65 a month, you're probably better off reselling copper rounds.

    Face value is meaningless, it can say $100 for all I care. Nobody would accept it as face value if they can buy it for $33. Let me know when you find merchants that accept these barter currency, and specifically , what you bought with it (I know how Liberty Dollar worked, so I've heard it all).

  25. #54

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    Quote Originally Posted by liberdom View Post
    There you have it. You might be better off saving your money until you can buy 10-20. You can negotiate better discounts too. I don't think you're driving to pick up 2 ounces each time, because that's a waste of time. Or, since you only have $65 a month, you're probably better off reselling copper rounds.

    Face value is meaningless, it can say $100 for all I care. Nobody would accept it as face value if they can buy it for $33. Let me know when you find merchants that accept these barter currency, and specifically , what you bought with it (I know how Liberty Dollar worked, so I've heard it all).
    Actually, there's quite a few merchants here in DFW that accept AOCS currency at face value. The AOCS has been building a network of merchants since 2008. We bought 5 large pizzas from a local pizzeria with one AOCS 1oz piece. You can even barter for weapons at the gun shows here with AOCS friendly gun sellers. All at face value.
    I'm starting to think that the Mayans were right about 2012. Ron Paul will change the world.

  26. #55

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    Quote Originally Posted by Professor8000 View Post
    Actually, there's quite a few merchants here in DFW that accept AOCS currency at face value. The AOCS has been building a network of merchants since 2008. We bought 5 large pizzas from a local pizzeria with one AOCS 1oz piece. You can even barter for weapons at the gun shows here with AOCS friendly gun sellers. All at face value.
    I'll ask you again. Why would they accept silver rounds at $50 face value when they can buy it at $33?
    Or are you only speaking of copper rounds?

  27. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by liberdom View Post
    I'll ask you again. Why would they accept silver rounds at $50 face value when they can buy it at $33?
    Or are you only speaking of copper rounds?
    I'm talking about the entire barter currency. They accept silver rounds at $50 face value because they still realize a profit and they expand their customer base into an area few other merchants get into. The ones willing to barter with this currency before SHTF will be in a much better position later. It's not currently about getting the most silver for the least work for merchants right now, it's about building a consistent base with which to continue business when inflation catches up with the markets. Also, merchants have to establish fair value for their goods in relation to this barter currency so that they are not affected as much when inflation creates hyper volatility in the markets. Besides, the face values on the medallions are suggestions from the AOCS to make it easier to compare with FRNs and it is always up to the merchant and buyers to decide what makes a fair trade. I just happen to know a pizzeria that will trade 5 large pizzas for 1oz AOCS silver, which compared to their FRN pricing saves you 40% with the current spot price of silver.
    I'm starting to think that the Mayans were right about 2012. Ron Paul will change the world.

  28. #57

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    Quote Originally Posted by Professor8000 View Post
    I'm talking about the entire barter currency. They accept silver rounds at $50 face value because they still realize a profit and they expand their customer base into an area few other merchants get into.
    I don't know many people who are willing to take a 35% loss just like that, but ok.


    The ones willing to barter with this currency before SHTF will be in a much better position later.
    If you mean they'll be better because they have silver in hand, then they can do better by buying silver at cost.

    It's not currently about getting the most silver for the least work for merchants right now, it's about building a consistent base with which to continue business when inflation catches up with the markets.
    If they share the concern about inflation, they should buy silver or whatever they believe will appreciate ASAP. why take silver at a loss profit?

    Also, merchants have to establish fair value for their goods in relation to this barter currency so that they are not affected as much when inflation creates hyper volatility in the markets.
    isn't that why face value is pointless?

    Besides, the face values on the medallions are suggestions from the AOCS
    that's what I said. Mere suggestions, people who accept it at face value are simply stupid.

    to make it easier to compare with FRNs and it is always up to the merchant and buyers to decide what makes a fair trade. I just happen to know a pizzeria that will trade 5 large pizzas for 1oz AOCS silver, which compared to their FRN pricing saves you 40% with the current spot price of silver.
    Unless buying 5 large pizzas is regular practice for you, that's probably just his way of giving you a discount for buying 5 at a time. Ask him next time if you wanted just one pizza, would he give you 40 worthless FRN for change, or 40 copper rounds. Also, nobody buys silver at spot price, not unless you buy 500oz or more, that's my experience. Today typically buying rounds will cost you 10% premimum/spread. This is not to mention, you didn't buy the 1oz AOCS at spot price, did you?

  29. #58

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Xar View Post
    When I have purchased Silver in the past, it would be some standard brand. Nothing fancy or unique date, ala:
    http://www.apmex.com/Category/1202/1...er_Rounds.aspx

    but then I see these, which are more expensive - isn't silver is silver is silver is silver? What does it matter the pattern or manufacterer?
    http://www.apmex.com/Category/1596/E...er_Rounds.aspx
    or

    http://www.apmex.com/Category/2/Cana...12__Prior.aspx


    What is the difference? When / If one was to cash in sometime in the distant future, why would one 1oz of one be more than another 1oz?
    Numistmatics. The rarity of the specimen coupled to it's popularity.

    HTH
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  30. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolution9 View Post
    Numistmatics. The rarity of the specimen coupled to it's popularity.

    HTH
    Rev9
    Ahh , numistics , I do love it , some of my best buys ever , a 1914 D cent , a 1909 S cent , handful of 1909 VDB cents , 1922 & 1924 cents , 1860's and 1970's cents ,war nickels , Carson City dollars , CC quarter , CC dimes etc etc
    Last edited by oyarde; 06-22-2012 at 10:33 PM.

  31. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by oyarde View Post
    Ahh , numistics , I do love it , some of my best buys ever , a 1914 D cent , a 1909 S cent , handful of 1909 VDB cents , 1922 & 1924 cents , 1860's and 1970's cents ,war nickels , Carson City dollars , CC quarter , CC dimes etc etc
    When I was a kid of five and six I would steal a couple of quarters an go up and down th stores changing for rolls of pennies and pulling out the ones I didn't have or were in better grade condition, rerolling them and exchanging at the next store on the block.. I was a philatelist as well. A few months back I viewed a stamp collection worth over 50 million bucks with rows of rare US stamps. They fellow was quite surprised this long haired rock and roller could identify by name most of the rare stamps and give some history behind them.

    Rev9
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