Guys, what do you call a 8.5 inch handguard piece?

[Athan]

Sup fellow k/manndos.
I have an M4 and just realized that my foregrip is not kocher. I thought it was a midlength 9' and found out when I tried to get a drop-in M.O.E. handgrip this rig is 8.5!

WTF do you call this thing? It's not a carbine length or midlength!

[brushfire]

Any details on the make/model? If its a clone/home built, what is the upper and barrel make/model?

You do have handguard cap/delta ring installed, right? Standard FSB?


I'll look out for your response, but its possible you purchased the wrong lenghth guards, or they sent you the wrong length.

M4 would likely mean a carbine length, which should be 6.5". If they sent you one that's 8.5, that's the mid length (m16 / 16"). If you have a home built/custom that could be any combination of the types...

Get out a ruler and measure the delta ring to the FSB/cap. If that dimension is near 7", then you have yourself a carbine length - which, based on your description, is not compatible with the handguards you have.


ETA: this may help - http://cheaperthandirt.com/blog/?p=330

[oyarde]

Athan , Brushfire gave you something useful ,Cheaper than Dirt should be able to fix you up.

[Pericles]

Rifle length is 11" whether 20" rifle barrel or 16" dissapator



Carbine length is 6" (M4 style has 7 holes, XM177 style has 6 holes) whether 16" barrel or shorter



Mid length should be just over 8.5

Not sure what else would be out there ..... for an AR weapon

[Athan]

Ok, thanks for waiting guys. I didn't want to post yesterday without getting accurate information you asked for. (Plus I ended up at a Paul meeting till about 12a.)

1. It is infact an Rock River Arms upper reciever (RRA markings on the non-detachable rear iron sight.)
2. It was purchased fully assembled by a class 3 gun store. I believe this is the model:
"Forged UTE2 Upper Reciever UTE2 - Universal Tactical Entry"
http://www.rockriverarms.com/index.c...ategory_id=279
(Yeah, I know that isn't much information about the rest of the parts, but I caught this issue a year after its purchase)
3. It is a standard Delta ring/Handguard cap and FSB

4. Here's the low down on the measurements:
- Measures 8" from FSB to to Delta Ring.
- Adding in two 1/4' drop in notches, its 8.5" from one end of the hand guard to the other.

5. It is not a carbine length 7" handguard.
6. It is not exactly normal 9" midlength either.
7. This is that "something else out there" for an AR weapon Pericles. Now these may be free float but my handguard size would likely be the third down while a normal midlength is the fourth down..

[Athan]

I'll look out for your response, but its possible you purchased the wrong lenghth guards, or they sent you the wrong length.

Also a note: I didn't purchase the M.O.E. handguard. I was comparing the store's M.O.E. with my handguard and noticed the difference in sizes. This upper reciever assembly was likely a custom creation by the gun store.

[brushfire]

Interesting

So what you got to replace the original was a Magpul MOE handguard, right?
This guy:


He shrouds over the side of the FSB, so I can understand > 8.5" measurement there. Based on your information, I believe you are right - you have a midlength.

I would not use a free float tube or rail system as comparable. Since they are not supported by the cap, they can often be shorter or longer. Some folks like to extend beyond the gas block, while others like the railed block, some support piston systems, etc..there's just too many options.

If your MOE setup has an 8.5" measurement from tab to tab, then you should be GTG. Is it that you're having a b1tch of a time trying to compress the delta ring?

I just grabbed one of my middies - it has the 7 hole handguard and I measure 8 5/8" from tab to tab.

FSB to receiver is 9 1/8

FSB to barrel nut face is 8 3/8

The delta ring will compress all the way back to the forward lug on the receiver.

Forgive me if I'm covering the obvious - when you compare the original with the MOE, what are the lengths, tab to tab? Are they not the same?

[brushfire]

Also a note: I didn't purchase the M.O.E. handguard. I was comparing the store's M.O.E. with my handguard and noticed the difference in sizes. This upper reciever assembly was likely a custom creation by the gun store.

Oh, so you've not purchased anything yet? When you compared, did you so so with the handgards off of the rifle? Side by side?

You're probably right - the store probably assembled their own with whatever parts they had, but I'm still not familiar with an odd sized handguard.

[Athan]

Yes. Right now I still have my original standard handguard they put on all non-quadrail and M.O.E. assemblies. I took off the handguard and did measure it off the barrel.
It is an odd-sized handguard. Hence I'm trying to figure out what they call this.

[brushfire]

You know, I'd call them up and ask them if they use mil spec handguards on their m4 clones.

Then report back, because you got me curious as he11.

To use a non-standard handguard, means a non-standard barrel, gas tube, etc...
Doesnt seem to make much business sense to me - especially on the AR platform who's biggest strength is the versatility that comes as a result of the standardization (mil spec). That said, I've seen slight variations in spec between colt, bushy, RRA, etc... They are very subtle with the exception of some of colt's (fcg pins, and sights)

[Athan]

+rep for you man! I didn't even think about military specifications differences.
And I agree. I have to go talk to this gunstore again. It's just they are an hour away drive so I have to do it on a weekend or something.

[pcosmar]

*

Guys, what do you call a 8.5 inch handguard piece?

A pipe dream,, a fantasy,, a wish.

Naw, really, I like the Disapator,, in Left handed.



*
there were already plenty of quality answers

[Pericles]

+rep for you man! I didn't even think about military specifications differences.
And I agree. I have to go talk to this gunstore again. It's just they are an hour away drive so I have to do it on a weekend or something.

I do everything weapons related mil spec for a reason. I'm not smart enough to do a better design job for all possible circumstances than did the designers.

[Athan]

I do everything weapons related mil spec for a reason. I'm not smart enough to do a better design job for all possible circumstances than did the designers.

Well, if your's was mil spec on the midlength (just over 8.5), then mine is 8.5 and under and it isn't midlength. Hence my problem.

[Pericles]

Well, if your's was mil spec on the midlength (just over 8.5), then mine is 8.5 and under and it isn't midlength. Hence my problem.

Midlength hasn't been mil spec since about 1970 .... mil spec weapons use either rifle length guards or carbine length.

Many vendors abuse the term mil spec. If it isn't from Colt, FN, or BCM, it has a low probability of being a mil spec weapon. Some other vendors supply some mil spec parts for the MWS, but they fit mil spec weapons. Even Colt has civilian production which is really CINO (Colt in name only).

[Athan]

Ah. Very informative.

[Pericles]

A correction to a previous post of mine. The military abandonded the nid length in prototype stage about 1967 as I was informed by somone more learned in the development of the M16 than am I.

[twisted]

cheaper than dirt is badly overpriced on nearly everything. Google aroound a bit and you can do better.

[twisted]

I'd get the store to put it back milspec, or lose my biz along with that of everyone I could influence against them.