New Hampshire man arrested for firing gun into ground while catching suspected burglar

[donnay]

New Hampshire man arrested for firing gun into ground while catching suspected burglar

By Joshua Rhett Miller

Published February 21, 2012

| FoxNews.com


"I didn't think I could handle this guy physically, so I fired into the ground," Fleming told FoxNews.com.


A New Hampshire man who fired his handgun into the ground to scare an alleged burglar he caught crawling out of a neighbor's window is now facing a felony charge -- and the same potential prison sentence as the man he stopped.

Dennis Fleming, 61, of Farmington, was arrested for reckless conduct after the Saturday incident at his 19th century farmhouse. The single grandfather had returned home to find that his home had been burglarized and spotted Joseph Hebert, 27, climbing out of a window at a neighbor's home. Fleming said he yelled "Freeze!" before firing his gun into the ground, then held Hebert at gunpoint until police arrived.

"I didn't think I could handle this guy physically, so I fired into the ground," Fleming told FoxNews.com. "He stopped. He knew I was serious. I was angry … and I was worried that this guy was going to come after me."

No one was injured in the incident, but when the police arrived, they made two arrests. Hebert was charged with two counts of burglary and drug possession. He faces up to seven years in prison if convicted. Fleming, meanwhile, is scheduled to be arraigned March 20 on a charge of reckless conduct, which could potentially land him a sentence similar to the one Hebert faces.

"I didn't know it was illegal [to fire into the ground], but I had to make that guy realize I was serious," Fleming said. "I've got a clean record. I really don't want to be convicted."

County Attorney Tom Velardi told Foster's Daily Democrat he will review the case and determine if the charge against Fleming is appropriate under the state statutes regarding self-defense and defense of property.

Fleming, meanwhile, is hoping to catch a break.

"I have 14 grandchildren, I don't want to be a felon and go to jail," he said. "I'm kind of wound up about it."

Fleming's collection of seven rifles and a .38-caliber handgun were seized by police. But Fleming said he's not entirely defenseless: "I've got a Louisville Slugger here, but I would call the police," he said.

Calls seeking comment from Farmington Police Department Chief Scott Roberge were not immediately returned.

Penny Dean, a spokeswoman for the Gun Owners of New Hampshire, said her organization is "absolutely outraged" by Fleming's arrest.

"This homeowner fired at the ground, from all accounts, in a safe direction and held a burglar for police and did things correctly," Dean told FoxNews.com. "The fact that this man would be charged is an outrage. Burglars in New Hampshire must know it's open season, since homeowners cannot defend themselves, as evidenced by this case. This is charging the victim."

Rick Pelkey, Fleming's longtime neighbor, said he's now worried how the "straight-forward, working-class guy" will pay legal fees associated with the arrest.

"I think it's outrageous," Pelkey told FoxNews.com. "He did the community a service here. We ought to thank him for it."

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/02/21...#ixzz1n2d8xb3n

[phill4paul]

And yet a police officer can shoot someone through a car window killing the occupant and get 'paid leave.' The situation is getting untenable.

[Kylie]

And yet a police officer can shoot someone through a car window killing the occupant and get 'paid leave.' The situation is getting untenable.

Qft. Cant say it any better than that.

[heavenlyboy34]

And yet a police officer can shoot someone through a car window killing the occupant and get 'paid leave.' The situation is getting untenable.

This^^ Having a WTF?? moment here.

[phill4paul]

Fleming's collection of seven rifles and a .38-caliber handgun were seized by police. But Fleming said he's not entirely defenseless: "I've got a Louisville Slugger here, but I would call the police," he said.

And IF the burglar makes bail and decides on some 'revenge' I hope his baseball bat serves him well. Because the police sure weren't there to keep his and his neighbors homes from being burgled.

[slamhead]

Note to self. See burglar, grab Louisville Slugger, grab handgun. Shoot burglar and drop Louisville Slugger at burglars feet.

This man shows more restraint and common sense in his responsibility as a gun owner than most police yet he is the criminal? The fact is the police do not want to see common citizens handling situations in a much more reasonable manner than themselves. This citizen gives cops a bad name and makes them obsolete.

[Tudo]

Live free or die eh? We will all be dead if we take that literally in new hampshire or anywhere else.

The man should have been given a medal.

[fisharmor]

I'd like to say that this is why I am not involved in the FSP. I don't see how NH is better off than VA.

Though I do see the legal problem. I'm willing to bet that if he was defending his own home, there would be no problem.
I'm having trouble finding out about NH, but I looked up statute in VA and the exception here for public discharge involves defending your OWN life or property.
'Cause, you know, you don't want to do the cops' job for them of protecting others (which SCOTUS repeatedly rules they're not responsible for )

So it's probably that simple: the law allows for him to do time in the rape cage, so that's what they're going to do.

My money says the burglar walks.

[GraniteHills]

NH has actually been tending toward being a police state in recent years: highway cameras everywhere, increased aerial surveillance by the cops, more state troopers than you can shake a stick at on I-93 and I-89, nanny state digital road signs, crackdowns like this one/Ward Bird, etc.

It's a pretty peaceful and crime-free place but don't tell that to the war zoners.

[phill4paul]

And of course there is that which is unstated. Had he been an off-duty police officer returning home to find a burglary in progress there would have simply been a quick internal investigation and dismissal over the discharge of the weapon, perhaps a few paid days leave and nothing more.

[Keith and stuff]

I wonder if this bill, which Ron Paul supporters and a free staters helped sponsor and pass last year, will come into this case.

http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/bill...illnumber=sb88

AMENDED ANALYSIS

This bill:

I. Allows a person who is anywhere he or she has a right to be to use deadly force to protect oneself or a third person.
II. Inserts a civil immunity provision for the use of force against a perpetrator in certain circumstances.
III. Deletes the minimum mandatory sentencing requirement for felony convictions which include the possession, use, or attempted use of a firearm.
IV. Amends the definition of “non-deadly force” to include the act of producing or displaying a weapon.

[Czolgosz]

No victim or damages? No crime.


Y'all can turn this around anytime you like. With numbers we can fight, individually...not so effective.

[Keith and stuff]

NH has actually been tending toward being a police state in recent years: highway cameras everywhere, increased aerial surveillance by the cops, more state troopers than you can shake a stick at on I-93 and I-89, nanny state digital road signs, crackdowns like this one/Ward Bird, etc.
It's a pretty peaceful and crime-free place but don't tell that to the war zoners.

In all fairness, the high cameras are meant to help with the digital road signs. As for the Ward Bird case, it was horrible but we did get 1 law changed because of it (to reform the gun laws) and are in the process of passing another law because of it (to reform the jury laws.)

[slamhead]

I'd like to say that this is why I am not involved in the FSP. I don't see how NH is better off than VA.

Though I do see the legal problem. I'm willing to bet that if he was defending his own home, there would be no problem.
I'm having trouble finding out about NH, but I looked up statute in VA and the exception here for public discharge involves defending your OWN life or property.
'Cause, you know, you don't want to do the cops' job for them of protecting others (which SCOTUS repeatedly rules they're not responsible for )

So it's probably that simple: the law allows for him to do time in the rape cage, so that's what they're going to do.

My money says the burglar walks.

I would think a good attorney could get him off arguing the case that he was protecting his property as he had reasonable belief that this burglar was in possession of his stolen property, which is the case as the burglar was charged with two counts of burglary.

[GraniteHills]

In all fairness, the high cameras are meant to help with the digital road signs. As for the Ward Bird case, it was horrible but we did get 1 law changed because of it (to reform the gun laws) and are in the process of passing another law because of it (to reform the jury laws.)

I'm actually referring to the awful, condescending nanny state signs on the side of 93, which I'm sure you're familiar with (i.e. "SPEED KILLS" or "TAKE CHANCES / GET TICKET"), bla bla.

John Lynch was possibly the worst person to ever happen to this state; this is NOT the late 1970s/1980s NH I grew up in and adored. Factor in the corporate wind farms blighting the north woods and you have a real weird situation wherein the state is physically beautiful but riddled with techno-surveillo-industrial filth all over the place.

[Brian4Liberty]

County Attorney Tom Velardi told Foster's Daily Democrat he will review the case and determine if the charge against Fleming is appropriate under the state statutes regarding self-defense and defense of property.

Often this is a case of Police CYA. They always want to cover their asses and put it into someone else's hands (in this case the County Attorney). Arrest (or shoot) them all, let the Attorney sort it out...

Arresting him and confiscating his weapons was not necessary, and disciplinary action should be taken against the officers who made that call. They could have referred it to the Attorney without doing that. And if the Attorney decides to file charges, it's definitely time to fire him.

[donnay]

NH has actually been tending toward being a police state in recent years: highway cameras everywhere, increased aerial surveillance by the cops, more state troopers than you can shake a stick at on I-93 and I-89, nanny state digital road signs, crackdowns like this one/Ward Bird, etc.

It's a pretty peaceful and crime-free place but don't tell that to the war zoners.

I agree. A lot of it has to do with those people south of us moving to New Hampshire--the ones that had no problem with Massachusetts laws striping citizens of their guns.

Carl Drega comes to mind too!

[azxd]

Understanding your local laws can go a long way toward preventing such things.

Discharging a firearm within city limits is illegal in most places, and firing a warning shot (that's what this was) is also a bad thing with repercussions.

If the man was feeling threatened, he should have fired to stop the threat ... Period !!
No more, no less.

That's why I suggest that anyone who owns a firearm, attend a concealed carry class and learn what the laws actually are.

Agree or not, this guy was an idiot.

Concerning "No victim or damages? No crime.",
As long as the law is on the books, there will be a crime (in this situation).
It's no different than our seat-belt laws.

[mrsat_98]

Understanding your local laws can go a long way toward preventing such things.

Discharging a firearm within city limits is illegal in most places, and firing a warning shot (that's what this was) is also a bad thing with repercussions.

If the man was feeling threatened, he should have fired to stop the threat ... Period !!
No more, no less.

So was a warning shot more or less than enough to stop the threat. Looks like it was just right.

That's why I suggest that anyone who owns a firearm, attend a concealed carry class and learn what the laws actually are.

Agree or not, this guy was an idiot.

Concerning "No victim or damages? No crime.",
As long as the law is on the books, there will be a crime (in this situation).
It's no different than our seat-belt laws.

Reckless conduct is a rash or careless act that is a gross deviation from the standard of care a reasonable person would exhibit under similar circumstances. Someone who has behaved recklessly will have knowingly taken a risk that will have put others in danger. The recklessness standard is treated much more seriously than the negligence standard, because of the person’s disregard that harm could come to other people by their behavior. However, to be found guilty of reckless conduct, courts will use an objective standard, meaning that it does not actually matter what the reckless person was thinking at the time. If the person’s actions deviate far enough from how a reasonable person would act, they will be found guilty and/or liable for reckless conduct.
Legal Implications of Reckless Conduct

People who are charged with reckless conduct may face criminal prosecution. Depending on the nature of the crime, reckless conduct can be classified as a misdemeanor or a felony. Reckless conduct is often seen in the context of driving, and depending on the seriousness of the accident, can lead to a variety of punishments. If a driver gets into his car with a blood alcohol level over the legal limit, and hits another car, injuring the passenger, the fact that he made the choice to drive after drinking will raise his culpability from negligence to recklessness, no matter the other circumstances. A person can be guilty of reckless driving when they are sober as well.

Many states consider any intentional violation of the rules of the road to be reckless conduct. License suspension or losing one’s license is a major consequence of reckless driving. Moreover, depending on how badly the victim was injured or how reckless the guilty party was, they might also face fines and/or jail time. If the reckless conduct is charged as a misdemeanor, the guilty party will not have to spend more than a year in jail. However, in more serious cases, when there is extreme gross disregard for human life, the reckless conduct can be charged as a felony, and the guilty party can spend years in jail and pay thousands in fines.
Reckless Conduct and Civil Suits

Reckless conduct may result in having to pay money damages as well. For example, if you injure someone while driving recklessly, you are not only faced with a criminal lawsuit, you may also be faced with a civil suit. In civil suits, reckless conduct can mean being liable for compensatory damages, which may include lost wages, medical bills, rehabilitation, as well as payment for any permanent injury or pain and suffering. A plaintiff injured by reckless behavior may also be awarded punitive damages by the court, or damages awarded to punish the party who behaved recklessly, and deter him and the rest of society from doing it again.

If you have been charged either criminally or civilly for reckless conduct, you should contact a criminal defense attorney or a personal injury attorney, or both. Because the legal implications of reckless conduct can be grave, it is wise to have an experienced attorney on your side that knows the law and will protect your rights as best they can.

[osan]

The normative me cheers for this man. The positive side says, "ignorant dumbass".

NEVER talk to police. NOT A WORD beyond "I need my lawyer". You don't explain yourself, you don't admit or deny ANYTHING including whether the sky is blue.

ANYTHING that CAN be used against you WILL be.

Shut your trap and get a lawyer on hand ASAP. Any deviation from this of even the smallest value could effectively end your life as you know it.

STFU means learning to put your ego back in your pants and zipping your fly watertight. STFU means getting your ignorant ass into some research to understand the realities of having to deal with police for even the most seemingly innocuous reasons, much less the discharge of a firearm. STFU means UNLEARNING the lifelong conditioning that drives you to submit to anyone projecting a sense of authority. NOBODY has inherent authority over you. Not a single soul, especially prior to any conviction. All they have is bull$#@!, outright lies, and brute force. If you give them an inch they will take a mile and hang you with it.

Shut

The

$#@!

Up

Learn these words. Live these words. Violate the mandate at your peril.

Have a nice day.

[azxd]

So was a warning shot more or less than enough to stop the threat. Looks like it was just right.

Someone stealing from your neighbor is not a threat to you, unless you try to play hero, and are unprepared.

As it is,
It doesn't change anything.

A New Hampshire man who fired his handgun into the ground to scare an alleged burglar he caught crawling out of a neighbor's window is now facing a felony charge -- and the same potential prison sentence as the man he stopped.

"I didn't know it was illegal [to fire into the ground], but I had to make that guy realize I was serious," Fleming said. "I've got a clean record. I really don't want to be convicted."

County Attorney Tom Velardi told Foster's Daily Democrat he will review the case and determine if the charge against Fleming is appropriate under the state statutes regarding self-defense and defense of property.

If he knew the laws, he would have known what his responsibility is as it relates to local laws ... He did not, and was not protecting self or property.

Man Cleared for Killing Neighbor's Burglars - ABC News

If he knew the laws he might have acted as this Texas man did, but he is admittedly ignorant of his local laws, and will now suffer the consequences of trying to be a good citizen, but using poor judgement.

[Brian4Liberty]

Much better to confront people with no weapon. Call the Police, they will protect you.

Police said Daniel Dewitt attacked the victim at about 8:45 p.m., after he and his wife returned home to find Dewitt near their garage. The victim told Dewitt to leave, went inside, then came out again and was attacked, said Berkeley police Sgt. Mary Kusmiss.

The victim had called police on a nonemergency line after first seeing Dewitt, according to sources familiar with the case. But police were busy monitoring an Occupy Oakland march to UC Berkeley, and officers were dispatched only to high-priority calls.

An officer who noticed the call about Dewitt on his computer told a dispatcher he would respond, but was told not to go, sources said.

Minutes later, the victim's wife heard her husband yelling for help and called 911 after seeing the suspect dragging him into bushes and hitting him with a potted plant, sources said.

Officers responded and gave the victim first aid until paramedics arrived. He was taken to a hospital, where he was pronounced dead.

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...#ixzz1n8yRvCUN

[Brian4Liberty]

Much better to confront people with no weapon. Call the Police, they will protect you.

"Minutes later, the victim's wife heard her husband yelling for help and called 911 after seeing the suspect dragging him into bushes and hitting him with a potted plant, sources said."

The irony of this tragedy is that based on the general description of the victim (white, up-scale, living in Berkeley), he was probably anti-gun and against any crack-down on drunk-drugged crazies that roam the streets.

He would probably call for a harsh penalty against the person in the other, OP story who defended themselves.

Once again, pure conjecture, based on a generalization, and backed up by the fact that he didn't have a gun when he confronted the trespasser.

[Roxi]

What? Does NH not have a Castle Doctrine?

[AFPVet]

And yet a police officer can shoot someone through a car window killing the occupant and get 'paid leave.' The situation is getting untenable.

And of course there is that which is unstated. Had he been an off-duty police officer returning home to find a burglary in progress there would have simply been a quick internal investigation and dismissal over the discharge of the weapon, perhaps a few paid days leave and nothing more.

Very well said. Some states have pretty $#@!ty laws. In my opinion, a LEO should have no more power than a private citizen. While I do not condone warning shots, I would not have given the man grief for shooting into the ground.

[Voluntary Man]

I thought NH was the "free state"?

[RM918]

Unfortunately, most people believe that police training confers unto cops a godly benevolence that would never be abused, while private gun owners obviously just want to shoot people 'cuz it's fun and that's the only reason why someone would ever want a gun.

EDIT: A comment from that story about the guy who was beat to death with a goddamned potted plant while the cops did nothing:

Do we really want a man that doesn't have enough sense to leave a burglar alone, waving a gun around? It's almost as likely that he'd shoot his wife. Guns aren't for everybody.

Maybe he's a troll, but I doubt it. People really believe this $#@!. You can't give people guns! They'll get drunk and murder everybody.

[chudrockz]

Unfortunately, most people believe that police training confers unto cops a godly benevolence that would never be abused, while private gun owners obviously just want to shoot people 'cuz it's fun and that's the only reason why someone would ever want a gun.

I have a coworker who thinks EXACTLY like this, and it periodically drives me mad. I told her the other day that after four years I FINALLY got my wife to try shooting my AK Saiga, and now she's hooked and signed up for gun safety classes starting next Monday night, and her response was "Why on Earth would she want to DO that?!"

Sigh.

[Voluntary Man]

...her response was "Why on Earth would she want to DO that?!"

"What slaves say," for 1,000 points, Alex!

[donnay]

What? Does NH not have a Castle Doctrine?

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...berty-gun-bill