Bill Still criticizing Ron Pauls idea about sound money

[nedomedo]

Ok, I am sure all of you here have seen the famous Money Masters documentary. I knew that they were suggesting something different than Ron Paul's proposition to go back on the gold standard, but I didn't think they condemn the gold standard this much. He basically said at one point, unsure if its this interview or another that when all else fails we will eventually follow Ron Paul's system only to watch it become a bigger monster that will fall. Only then will we realize that the debt free money system is the only solution. He is however stating that Ron Paul has correctly identified the problem, however they are saying that a gold standard will be even worse than what we have today. Still argues, there is nothing to stop the banks from doing fractional reserve banking with Gold. Additionally he argues that currently the banks have all the gold and that if we went back on the gold standard they will become even more powerful than they already are.

Anyway, he starts to talk about Ron Paul in the last third of the video, and he mentions him throughout



What do you guys think?

[emazur]

First off, "debt free" money is bullshit. Yes the government does pay interest on the money borrowed from the Fed but the Fed pays back that money to the government to the government. Sounds stupid but that's how it is. As for fractional reserve gold standard, there are 2 ways to deal with it:
1) Outlaw it and don't send regulators to oversee the banks but promise to imprison or execute bankers whose banks go bust and seize and sell off their assets and distribute as much as possible back to the depositors (if a bank goes bust, perhaps give them 30 days to get their shit in order and make good on the claims)
2) Allow it and have have depositors (or the banks themselves) privately insure deposits against a run on the bank. An uninsured bank will not be trusted and not last long, a bank w/ a high insurance premium makes it too expensive to do business, and if consumers have to pay high insurance premiums for a bank, not only will they look elsewhere but it's an obvious red flag that the bank is built on a house of cards

Will banks that "have all the gold" hoard it and become more powerful? Banks don't bury their gold in the back yard or stick it under the mattress. They exist to loan it out and make money off it and/or exist as a service to warehouse depositors' gold.

Bill Still wants to take away the money power from the evil Fed and put it into the hands of the Treasury - you know, trustworthy fellows like Tim Geithner, Hank Paulson, and Larry Summers. Yeah, that'll work.

[onlyrp]

Bill Still is a greenbacker who hates the gold standard. It's incredibly explicit in his Money Masters film

[Travlyr]

What do you guys think?

Yeah, I don't get that thinking.

"History records that the money changers have used every form of abuse, intrigue, deceit, and violent means possible to maintain their control over governments by controlling money and its issuance." - James Madison

Whoever controls the money supply controls you. So the question becomes... who do you want to control your money?

• The Federal Reserve?
• The Treasury Department?
• You?

When you are in control of your own money, then it is a much freer and prosperous system for productive individuals.
"The Purse & The Sword" by Dr. Edwin Vieira Jr.

[nedomedo]

First off, "debt free" money is bullshit. Yes the government does pay interest on the money borrowed from the Fed but the Fed pays back that money to the government to the government. Sounds stupid but that's how it is. As for fractional reserve gold standard, there are 2 ways to deal with it:
1) Outlaw it and don't send regulators to oversee the banks but promise to imprison or execute bankers whose banks go bust and seize and sell off their assets and distribute as much as possible back to the depositors (if a bank goes bust, perhaps give them 30 days to get their shit in order and make good on the claims)
2) Allow it and have have depositors (or the banks themselves) to privately insure deposits against a run on the bank. An ininsured bank will not be trusted and not last long, a bank w/ a high insurance premium makes it too expensive to do business, and if consumers have to pay high insurance premiums for a bank, not only will they look elsewhere but it's an obvious red flag that the bank is built on a house of cards

Will banks that "have all the gold" hoard it and become more powerful? Banks don't stick bury their gold in the back yard or stick it under the mattress. They exist to loan it out and make money off it and/or exist as a service to warehouse depositors' gold.

Bill Still wants to take away the money power from the evil Fed and put it into the hands of the Treasury - you know, trustworthy fellows like Tim Geithner, Hank Paulson, and Larry Summers. Yeah, that'll work.

Good points, sorry to ask but aside from peoples belief that Gold is money, what kind of difference is there to Gold vs Paper aside from scarcity? I have just started getting into this over the last few days (debt free money) and I can't simply dismiss every argument they make against gold. I am a strong Austrian Economics supporter, but I never engaged in a factual discussion about it.

When I was at the late night caucus here in Nevada for Ron Paul I got into an argument with someone over Federal Reserve and the Gold standard. At one point the person asked me: What is gold backed by? I didn't have an answer for him and felt kind of stupid because if you think about it Gold isn't backed by anything. The only argument I could think of on the spot is that Gold has been used for thousands of years as money and everyone trusts it.

Bill Still says that Gold standard is fiat money too.

One more question, current argument is that our money isn't backed by anything, but couldn't you say that the dollar is backed by US economy and assets? If all oil is traded in dollars then couldn't you say that the dollar is backed by oil? This is so confusing and frustrating, I hope you can understand what I am asking.

[onlyrp]

on top of that, he's trying to be 2012 President too.

http://still2012.com/

[danda]

allow competition in currency. good money will drive out bad. let the market decide the currency. repeal legal tender laws.

[The Gold Standard]

Good points, sorry to ask but aside from peoples belief that Gold is money, what kind of difference is there to Gold vs Paper aside from scarcity? I have just started getting into this over the last few days (debt free money) and I can't simply dismiss every argument they make against gold. I am a strong Austrian Economics supporter, but I never engaged in a factual discussion about it.

When I was at the late night caucus here in Nevada for Ron Paul I got into an argument with someone over Federal Reserve and the Gold standard. At one point the person asked me: What is gold backed by? I didn't have an answer for him and felt kind of stupid because if you think about it Gold isn't backed by anything. The only argument I could think of on the spot is that Gold has been used for thousands of years as money and everyone trusts it.

Bill Still says that Gold standard is fiat money too.

One more question, current argument is that our money isn't backed by anything, but couldn't you say that the dollar is backed by US economy and assets? If all oil is traded in dollars then couldn't you say that the dollar is backed by oil? This is so confusing and frustrating, I hope you can understand what I am asking.

The point of gold money or silver money or platinum money or whatever money is that it isn't printed by a central bank or a government. If people use whatever money they want then they have control over it. We the Treasury prints money the government controls your money. When the Fed creates new credit, the central bankers control your money.

When free people choose money they choose something that has value in itself, like gold, silver, etc. This way you know someone will want it. If it is also portable and divisible and all of those traits that made a good medium of exchange, then it becomes widely accepted. It doesn't need a government fiat to force people to accept it.

[onlyrp]

allow competition in currency. good money will drive out bad. let the market decide the currency. repeal legal tender laws.

there is nothing illegal about 2 people deciding how to trade. So to say "let the market decide" is an inaccurate accusation that it's somehow now currently allowed.

[The Gold Standard]

there is nothing illegal about 2 people deciding how to trade. So to say "let the market decide" is an inaccurate accusation that it's somehow now currently allowed.

Right now you can not freely transact in any currency you wish. Legal tender laws deny you recourse if someone were to pay you in Federal Reserve notes instead of your desired currency. There are sales taxes and capital gains taxes on gold ans silver bullion.