HSLDA Does NOT Support Ron Paul (Homeschooling)

[Krugerrand]

Blogger OneMom endorsed Ron Paul ... in part because of his homeschooling positions:

http://onemom.com/2011/11/onemom-endorses-ron-paul/
Homeschooling:

Ron Paul believes no nation can remain free when the state has greater influence over the knowledge and values transmitted to children than the family does. And the truth is, no big government spending program can or will solve our nation’s education problems.

One-size-fits-all central planning simply does not work.

As a congressman, Ron Paul has been a consistent supporter of homeschooling and educational freedom.

Being a homeschooling parent takes a unique dedication to family and education.

Thread on endoresment:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...orses-Ron-Paul

[XNavyNuke]

This is a big deal as many, if not most homeschoolers use HSLDA as their legal defense.

Not a big deal to us, and we homeschool. Michael Farris is a wonderful lawyer when it comes to homeschooling issues. He can cite decisions chapter and verse like you would want any good lawyer to do. On the downside, he doesn't look to the history behind the decisions and is willing to spin stories based on what he thinks he knows.

The Oregon ballot initiative that he refers to was an attempt by the Freemasons and KKK to scrub Catholicism from the state by outlawing their schools. The initiative specifically did not ban individual education and private tutelage, only parochial schools, and therefore wouldn't necessarily prevent homeschooling. Of course, given the blatant anti-Catholic nature it should have been overturned on 1st amendment grounds.

Google News Archive is your friend.

XNN

[pinkmandy]

Not a fan of HSLDA myself. Several years back in VA (under governor Warner the democrat) HSLDA, against the wishes/advice of our state homeschool association which is and has been well equipped and funded to speak on our behalf, challenged our state homeschool laws. The blowback to this was opening the laws up for revision. When the legislation they proposed hit the governor's desk he tried to rewrite our laws so that all homeschooling parents would have to take the teacher certification test before being allowed to homeschool their kids. His "nationwide" group was messing with state laws which were already decent and fair and if not for our conservative legislature (who definitely heard from the homeschooling population) who rebuffed Warner's proposals we'd have a much more difficult time homeschooling in VA today.

I have an issue w/any group that would step into state affairs and meddle with laws against the wishes of a large number of the people that would be affected by your meddling. Yes, they have done great things, too for parents in more restrictive states but our homeschooling rights in VA are and have been fairly well protected if you know the laws (which are pretty simple to understand) and we have our state association which is very active and helpful. The overstepping against our wishes was pretty blatant, though and they were well aware of our state group's opinion/position on their lobbying yet they did it anyway.

[Dissent]

What other homeschool legal group can be used to protect home schoolers from CPS and the police etc. I have had run ins with both of the above and am planning on homeschooling my oldest child come fall and was told its best to join the HSLDA for legal help if needed and in my case I bet I will. I seem to attract the assholes from CPS and would love to have a lawyer from HSLDA tell them off when they come to harass me for homeschooling.Also is the robertson curriculum good to use? I like what I have read.

[Voluntary Man]

[1]Ron Paul is an enemy of the legal principles that the homeschooling
movement has used successfully to defend our freedom to teach our own
children. He recently said that he does not believe that the 14th
Amendment trumps the 10th Amendment. He said this is an abortion
context (which proves that he is not politically pro-life) but, let's examine
what this means in a homechooling context.
In the 1920s, the State of Oregon banned all private education. This
Oregon law was challenged as a violation of the 14th Amendment. The
Supreme Court ruled that the 14th Amendment's Due Process Clause
prohibited states from banning private education because this overrode
parental rights in an unconstitutional fashion.
If Ron Paul's philosophy were applied to this case, then Oregon's law
would have prevailed under the 10th Amendment.
The case I won before the Supreme Court of Michigan for homeschooling
freedom was based on the 14th Amendment. The federal constitutional
principles of religious freedom and parental rights overrode the power of
Michigan to require homeschoolers to all be certified teachers.
The homeschool victory that I argued before the Court of Appeal of
California when that court had previously ruled that homeschooling was
illegal in that state--was based on the 14th Amendment.
I could go on.
Home schooling would be legal in about 3 states in this country today if
Ron Paul's view of the Constitution was actually practiced by the Supreme
Court.
[2]So I have a quesxtion for all of the members of Homeschoolers for Ron
Paul: Do you agree with Ron Paul that the states have the exclusive
authority over the legality of homeschooling and the 14th Amendment
provides no constitutional right to homeschool?
How can you support a candidate who denies the very constitutional
principle that our movement used to win our freedom?
[3]Supporting Ron Paul in the name of homeschooling is like supporting
Barack Obama in the name of reducing the national debt.

there is no doubt that Mike Farris is a very prominent attorney. i belong to HSLDA (although i must now begin to wonder "for how much longer?"), and my wife worked on his US Senate campaign (although i now must consider that an even bigger mistake than i have already come to, over the years). let's examine his arguments:

1. Mike criticizes Ron for opposing the legal activism of the federal courts, the fulcrum of which has, historically, been the 14A. The basis of Mike's criticism is that Farris has been successful in using the federal courts' activism against the states, in a manner that has helped to promote home education, a fact for which i am personally grateful. however, what Mr. Farris fails to acknowledge is that, as a skillful attorney, the moment it is the federal government using the 14A to restrict homeschooling, nationally, it will be his duty to take Dr. Paul's position, and to defend it as vigorously as he has done the opposite. This, however, may present a challenge for Mike, a Romans13 authoritarian, who considers SCOTUS the final arbiter. i don't believe my fellow HSLDA members will be impressed by Mike rolling over for federal restrictions on parental rights, based on Farris' own prior defenses of the 14A.

2. Did a man who named his school after Patrick Henry really just suggest that rights come from government?

3. There are many reasons to support Ron Paul, among which is his principled defense of parental rights. Unlike Mr Farris, Dr Paul does not believe that the state has the authority to define or restrict parental rights. Unlike Mr Obama's views on fiscal responsibility, Dr Paul is a true personal champion of parental rights, and Mr Farris knows it, which is specifically why he accuses Dr Paul of being "not politically pro-life," implying that his political positions stand in the way of his personal principles.

Farris' arguments are so cherry-picked that it's clear his arguments with Dr Paul go far beyond homeschooling. in fact, Dr Paul would abolish the federal machinery that empowers the individual states' opposition to homeschooling, begging the question of whether HSLDA is as dependent upon the status quo as H&R Block.

[XNavyNuke]

What other homeschool legal group can be used to protect home schoolers from CPS and the police etc. I have had run ins with both of the above and am planning on homeschooling my oldest child come fall and was told its best to join the HSLDA for legal help if needed and in my case I bet I will. I seem to attract the assholes from CPS and would love to have a lawyer from HSLDA tell them off when they come to harass me for homeschooling.Also is the robertson curriculum good to use? I like what I have read.

You don't need a legal group. Find yourself a local attorney that is also a homeschooler (or private schools and supports homeschooling), and who has local political connections. (either party's fine) Meet with that person and explain your situation. A small retainer is better protection than dues to any organisation who may only decide to support your cause if they see a fundraising opportunity. Keep that person's card on hand and don't talk to any official period. That's how we do it.

We also don't use any canned curriculum exclusively.

Good luck!
XNN

[osan]

Something needs to be done about the search function. It sucks pretty badly.

Very true. If they'd let me loose on it, I would repair the queries in a day or so, but that ain't gonna happen any time ever. Not sure I could even get a copy of the DB schema in order to be able to make suggestions.

[LibertyEagle]

Very true. If they'd let me loose on it, I would repair the queries in a day or so, but that ain't gonna happen any time ever. Not sure I could even get a copy of the DB schema in order to be able to make suggestions.

Have you even talked to Josh about it?

[osan]

Ron Paul is an enemy of the legal principles that the homeschooling movement has used successfully to defend our freedom to teach our own children.

This guy is a lawyer? An ignorant one, apparently.

The case I won before the Supreme Court of Michigan for homeschooling freedom was based on the 14th Amendment.

Just because he won, it does not follow that either he or the courts functioned properly. His claim is analogous to patting oneself on the back after winning a baseball game, your team having used a spud gun to launch balls out of the park while the other used the usual wooden bats.

The federal constitutional principles of religious freedom and parental rights overrode the power of Michigan to require homeschoolers to all be certified teachers.

And these relate to the 14th how, exactly?

Home schooling would be legal in about 3 states in this country today if Ron Paul's view of the Constitution was actually practiced by the Supreme Court.

Which almost certainly has NOTHING to do with RP's view, but rather the view of our utterly failed courts. HELLO.

So I have a quesxtion for all of the members of Homeschoolers for Ron Paul: Do you agree with Ron Paul that the states have the exclusive authority over the legality of homeschooling and the 14th Amendment provides no constitutional right to homeschool?

I am not sure that is his position, but if it is, I would disagree as the only authority is that of the parent and the student.

How can you support a candidate who denies the very constitutional principle that our movement used to win our freedom?

Because the principle is wrong. Because the courts are hopelessly broken and corrupted.

What a fool - seriously folks, either this guy is an ignorant fop-lawyer or he is working a thinly veiled agenda running counter to the best interests of personal freedom.

[osan]

Have you even talked to Josh about it?

Actually, yes. He told me they had no access to the innards of this thing... which seems odd, but if that's the case, then that's the case.