Platinum

[xFiFtyOnE]

The silver run has started!

[ILUVRP]

pick this up from 321gold today.

http://www.hardassetsinvestor.com/we...re-upside.html

[Seraphim]

Yeah silver is going to bust the 1980 high on this leg of the bull market. BUST it.

The silver run has started!

[Guzabuza]

Sent a email two days ago to CME Chicago and wrote, silver has been in heavy backwardation for the past two weeks without prices going up, stop the silliness and let it raise. Thank you.

Hold and behold they listened and prices have risen 6 % already

[RabbitMan]

Yes! Right before I was going to cash out too! Awesome! Maybe I'll get rid of some Vangard instead.

[Guzabuza]

Poll: How long until we hit 40 $ ?

My guess before end of march this year!

[enoch150]

Again, platinum will surely rise, but as stated before, you are betting on 1 industrial sector that maybe will grow 60 % in 18 years?
http://www.usmint.gov/mint_programs/...ales&year=2002

For silver the investment demand is growing at 16 % rate a year and industrial demand some 4 % a year. Also, platinum is only 14 % from its all time nominal high, silver is priced at the same level as in 1980. In other words there have been no gains in silver for the past 30 years at the same time platinum has taken out its peak from 1980 and has gained almost 1300 $ since then. In the last pm bull run platinum went from 100 to 700 $, silver went from 4 to 50$.
I mean it looks like a no brainer to me.

If history repeats it self and platinum runs as much as it did in the last bull run, then the top for platinum would be around 3200 $. But lets say it makes doubles the gain this time and it goes to 6400 $. If we are conservative and take a 1:1 ratio for P / G gold would also then be around 6400. If gold is 6400 and take a conservative ratio of 1:30 G / S then silver would be around 200 $.

Commonly used talking points, but not ones I put much worth in. I especially like how you can simultaneously claim that silver is undervalued because it has had no gains in 30 years, but also has a gain of 1,250% in 10 years.

Demand, of course, is only half of the equation. Silver demand could increase 300% and platinum only 60%, but if supply of silver increases 500% and supply of platinum drops 20%, then the price of platinum goes up while silver declines.

Also, the BP report said car ownership would increase 60% - that does not include repeat sales to existing customers.

There is absolutely no reason for gold/silver/platinum to have any kind of target ratio. Maybe if nearly all of the metals went towards the same thing (coins or whatever) and there was an ideal mix of coins, that would be the case. But given the widely varying uses for each, any suggested target ratio is meaningless.

FWIW: I own way more silver than platinum. My only platinum exposure comes from PPLT, and only 10 shares. I had been planning on adding 10 more shares of PPLT every time it dropped 5-10%, but I bought them at $133.86, and it only got down to $133 before taking off. It's up 27% in less than 2 months.

[Seraphim]

^^ Good post.

[Guzabuza]

Commonly used talking points, but not ones I put much worth in. I especially like how you can simultaneously claim that silver is undervalued because it has had no gains in 30 years, but also has a gain of 1,250% in 10 years.

Demand, of course, is only half of the equation. Silver demand could increase 300% and platinum only 60%, but if supply of silver increases 500% and supply of platinum drops 20%, then the price of platinum goes up while silver declines.

Also, the BP report said car ownership would increase 60% - that does not include repeat sales to existing customers.

There is absolutely no reason for gold/silver/platinum to have any kind of target ratio. Maybe if nearly all of the metals went towards the same thing (coins or whatever) and there was an ideal mix of coins, that would be the case. But given the widely varying uses for each, any suggested target ratio is meaningless.

FWIW: I own way more silver than platinum. My only platinum exposure comes from PPLT, and only 10 shares. I had been planning on adding 10 more shares of PPLT every time it dropped 5-10%, but I bought them at $133.86, and it only got down to $133 before taking off. It's up 27% in less than 2 months.

I never claimed silver was undervalued, my point was, do you want to buy something that has not moved anywhere for the past 40 years or something that has already made a new nominal high? Ratios do matter. I trade gold / silver with help of ratios, put on fibonacci number on the ratio and you have an road map, this last bottom in pm when silver hit 26 and gold 1522 the ratio came in at around 57,5-58,5, long term resistance going back a decade if you look at a chart, you can see the ratio on http://www.bloomberg.com/quote/XAUXAG:CUR/chart. You could have easily bought silver at 26 $ and have a stop when the ratio broke over 60. Same thing when silver hit 50 bucks last year, was very prudent to scale down the position since g/s ratio hit 31,5 long term support area. Ratios are not bulletproof but they do give an advantage. How will you know when to sell, at least a portion of your silver? The only way to compare silver value agaisnt something else is to use ratios, how much gold or platinum can i buy with my silver, how much of the Dow Jones can i buy with my silver, heck how much oil can i buy with my silver. Ratios are an better indicator of value then price. If platinum goes to 10 000$ in the future, have you made any money if gold is at 100 000 $ ?
Price doesn't tell you anything about the value, ratios do.

"Also, the BP report said car ownership would increase 60% - that does not include repeat sales to existing customers. " Repeated car sales won't add to new demand, that is still the same demand. You need new people buying cars not same people replacing old ones. For each replaced car the platinum is recycled. You could sell 10 million cars each year for the next 100 years but the demand for platinum won't increase because most of those catalytic converters are recycled.

"Demand, of course, is only half of the equation. Silver demand could increase 300% and platinum only 60%, but if supply of silver increases 500% and supply of platinum drops 20%, then the price of platinum goes up while silver declines." That is your own talking point. Not based on any evidence, ratios are at least used and have been an indicator of undervaluation or overvaluation.

[enoch150]

I never claimed silver was undervalued, my point was, do you want to buy something that has not moved anywhere for the past 40 years or something that has already made a new nominal high? Ratios do matter.

I don't care where it's been; I care where it's going.

I trade gold / silver with help of ratios, put on fibonacci number on the ratio and you have an road map, this last bottom in pm when silver hit 26 and gold 1522 the ratio came in at around 57,5-58,5, long term resistance going back a decade if you look at a chart, you can see the ratio on http://www.bloomberg.com/quote/XAUXAG:CUR/chart. You could have easily bought silver at 26 $ and have a stop when the ratio broke over 60. Same thing when silver hit 50 bucks last year, was very prudent to scale down the position since g/s ratio hit 31,5 long term support area. Ratios are not bulletproof but they do give an advantage. How will you know when to sell, at least a portion of your silver? The only way to compare silver value agaisnt something else is to use ratios, how much gold or platinum can i buy with my silver, how much of the Dow Jones can i buy with my silver, heck how much oil can i buy with my silver. Ratios are an better indicator of value then price. If platinum goes to 10 000$ in the future, have you made any money if gold is at 100 000 $ ?
Price doesn't tell you anything about the value, ratios do.

Ratios and other technical analysis can be used in the short term only because so many other people are looking at the same thing and basing their trades off of the same patterns that it becomes a self fulfilling prophesy. If you can make money doing it, good for you. For the most part, I ignore this as noise. In the longer term fundamentals rule. In the case of commodities, supply vs. demand. I never look at something in comparison to something else, only the internal fundamentals. I'll admit to being more comfortable with stocks than commodities.

[Guzabuza]

i wish you all the best in platinum hoarding, may 500 million new cars be build in the next two decades so that you make phat moonies! =)

[Bern]

It appears that platinum has been reacting to news about a strike at the Impala mine.

[xFiFtyOnE]

The silver run has started!

And it continues! Silver is pushing $37!

Edit: And $37 is broken!

[ronpaulfollower999]

I had a convo with my grandpa on Saturday about PM's. Said he'd rather invest in platinum and was shocked when I told him its cheaper than gold ATM.

And it continues! Silver is pushing $37!

Edit: And $37 is broken!

To da moons bitchez!!!

[SkarnkaiLW]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Platinum_coin

On the history of Platinum as a money, for the person that asked about. I recalled that Russia had tried it without much success, against Alfred Nobel's advice.