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Thread: Vegan parents charged in death of baby raised on mother's milk; facing 30 years in prison

  1. #1

    Vegan parents charged in death of baby raised on mother's milk; facing 30 years in prison




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  3. #2
    Good, I hope they rot in prison.

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Teaser Rate View Post
    Good, I hope they rot in prison.
    You've got to be $#@!ting me, I can't believe you are buying this crap. I guarantee this is a manufactured hit against vegetarianism/veganism by the establishment. It's also a hit against parents who desire to raise their kids how they choose. It is a hit against home schooling. It is a hit against freedom itself.

    We already had a lengthy discussion on this topic in another thread, I don't think anybody attacked them like you just did.

    You don't even know the details or the true cause of death. I can 100% guarentee it had nothing to do with simply being vegan, because that is a very healthy lifestyle.

    People's baby's die from things all the time.
    Last edited by dannno; 04-06-2011 at 07:25 PM.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  5. #4
    My mom had older siblings who died very young, it is common. I guess my grandparents should have rotted in prison as well and my mom should have died after physically attacking her foster parents for abusing her instead of having me. What a bunch of crap..
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    You've got to be $#@!ting me, I can't believe you are buying this crap. I guarantee this is a manufactured hit against vegetarianism/veganism by the establishment. It's also a hit against parents who desire to raise their kids how they choose. It is a hit against home schooling. It is a hit against freedom itself.

    We already had a lengthy discussion on this topic in another thread, I don't think anybody attacked them like you just did.

    You don't even know the details or the true cause of death. I can 100% guarentee it had nothing to do with simply being vegan, because that is a very healthy lifestyle.

    People's baby's die from things all the time.
    No, this is getting justice from two insane parents who deliberately let their 11 month old die a brutal death. Here's a more recent article on the story.

    A French couple who refused to take their sick and undernourished daughter to hospital and treated her with cabbage and clay compressions have been convicted of causing her death.

    Joel and Sergine Le Moaligou, who fed the 11-month-old child on nothing but breast milk were accused of "neglect or food deprivation" after ignoring their doctor and seeking advice in a 35-year-old book on alternative medicine.

    ...

    Dr Stéphane Bernard told the court at Amiens in northern France how the couple had refused to take Louise immediately to hospital after seeing him in January 2008, two months before she died.

    "I suspected she was suffering from pneumonia and told them to go straight to casualty for an x-ray and blood test. I told them quite clearly it was pneumonia, which is more serious than bronchitis because the lungs were infected," he said.

    "I didn't prescribe any drugs because in my mind it was obvious they'd go to casualty. I didn't even weigh the child as I was convinced they'd do it at hospital."

    Afterwards, however, the Moaligou returned home and consulted their books on natural medicine. They continued to treat Louise with mustard, garlic and clay, the jury was told.
    Full article.


    They are the worst scum of the earth in my book.

  7. #6
    You have canine teeth. You are meant to eat meat.
    Sorry if you don't like this fact, please feel free to starve yourself and kill your children.
    You have been deemed to stupid to live, thanks and have a nice day.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Teaser Rate View Post
    No, this is getting justice from two insane parents who deliberately let their 11 month old die a brutal death. Here's a more recent article on the story.



    Full article.


    They are the worst scum of the earth in my book.
    They treated the child in a way they thought would make him better. You could look at this like a religious matter, this could be considered possibly a native american way of healing which might have worked before with native americans. But they weren't negligent to their child. Why do you have to treat your wounds as the government sees fit? These people took a gamble and lost, they really believed in this stuff or they wouldn't have not done it for their child.

    So it would of been ok if the baby had died in a hospital which they do on occasions but when parents use alternative methods they should be prosecuted and thrown in prison? Just because someone has a different belief in what works and what doesn't, doesn't make you right or them right. Those pesky individuals, everyone should conform and be exactly the same so we don't have these types of scum running around thinking for themselves....so disgusting.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Nastynate View Post
    They treated the child in a way they thought would make him better. You could look at this like a religious matter, this could be considered possibly a native american way of healing which might have worked before with native americans. But they weren't negligent to their child. Why do you have to treat your wounds as the government sees fit? These people took a gamble and lost, they really believed in this stuff or they wouldn't have not done it for their child.

    So it would of been ok if the baby had died in a hospital which they do on occasions but when parents use alternative methods they should be prosecuted and thrown in prison? Just because someone has a different belief in what works and what doesn't, doesn't make you right or them right. Those pesky individuals, everyone should conform and be exactly the same so we don't have these types of scum running around thinking for themselves....so disgusting.
    you spoke my mind!



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  11. #9
    Why is it even mentioned that they are vegan? That has nothing to do with the child's death. The child died of pneumonia which the parents failed to treat correctly. Also, what's wrong with breast feeding past 11 months?

    The fact that they mentioned they were vegan even though it was irrelevant makes it seem like this is just an attack on people who chose to not eat meat. Because the human body does not require it, and there are a few people enjoy mocking and insulting people who chose to abstain from flesh; the fact that they do abstain from flesh and are healthy is proof meat is not required, so I am not sure why it bothers some people. Does it bother them somehow that humans are living and healthy without meat and have done so for millions of years, which proves it is not required? Or do they just like to insult? Not everyone reacts that way, and I am glad for it.

    I have a message in response to the following factually incorrect post (canines are great for crushing crisp vegetables):

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyRevolution View Post
    You have canine teeth. You are meant to eat meat.
    Sorry if you don't like this fact, please feel free to starve yourself and kill your children.
    You have been deemed to stupid to live, thanks and have a nice day.
    My response:

    Quote Originally Posted by Yieu View Post
    The human body does not require meat nutritionally, regardless of blood type, or anything. Before that statement angers anyone, you have the right to eat whatever you want and I don't care one way or the other, and I am not judging anyone. I am only stating a medical fact. If you want to eat flesh, then do so. But understand that there is nothing in flesh that is nutritionally required by the human body that cannot be found easily in vegetarian sources. Whether to eat flesh or not is a personal choice, based only on taste preference and not on nutrition requirements.
    This applies to humans of all types and ages, from birth to death.

    I don't advocate being vegan. Milk and honey are good for you.

    I'm not telling anyone not to eat meat; do as you please. I'm not vegetarian for health reasons, it is for religious reasons.

    I'm not going to tell you that you're less healthy for eating meat. But don't tell me that I need to or that it is unhealthy to abstain from it -- it is not required.

    Health Freedom, right? You're free to eat as you wish. Let me be free to eat as I wish.
    Last edited by Yieu; 04-07-2011 at 08:09 AM.

  12. #10
    I don't get it. Doctors Kill Patients every day. They don't go to jail.

  13. #11
    Everyone here doesn't have the full details, including Mike Adams, yet ready to make a judgement.
    Last edited by EndDaFed; 04-07-2011 at 09:07 AM.
    A king metal slime draws near!

  14. #12
    I look at vegans the same way I look at anorexics.
    You have an eating disorder, that's nice you call it a lifestyle.

  15. #13

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyRevolution View Post
    I look at vegans the same way I look at anorexics.
    You have an eating disorder, that's nice you call it a lifestyle.
    It is impossible to talk about this subject without being subject to insults from people who do not base their opinions on science but instead on emotion.

    I'm not a vegan, but look at me incorrectly all you want. You have the right to. It's rude and incorrect, but you have the right to lie to yourself, and you have the right to insult me as much as you please, even if you're wrong. I get the feeling that you've already lost the argument if all you can do is insult. I'm having a hard time justifying being here these days. It's just not worth it.
    Last edited by Yieu; 04-07-2011 at 12:05 PM.

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Yieu View Post
    I'm having a hard time justifying being here these days. It's just not worth it.
    Just put the $#@!s on ignore. Then it ain't no thing.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyRevolution View Post
    You have canine teeth. You are meant to eat meat.
    Sorry if you don't like this fact, please feel free to starve yourself and kill your children.
    You have been deemed to stupid to live, thanks and have a nice day.
    These threads get more stupid as time goes by. Newsflash, your "canines" aren't the same as carnivore canines.

    http://www.daviddarling.info/encyclopedia/T/teeth.html
    The tooth arrangement depends to a large extent upon the feeding method and the nature of the food. Humans are omnivorous (eating all types of food) and consequently our teeth are not highly specialized when compared with the grinding teeth of herbivores and the cutting teeth of carnivores. Incisors are retained in most mammalian groups as chisel-shaped biting or cutting teeth. The canine is highly developed in hunting carnivores as a stabbing and tearing tooth. In humans it is rather reduced and functions almost as another incisor. Many herbivorous animals have lost the canine tooth altogether. The premolars and molars of humans are the grinding and chewing teeth. The surface of these teeth is covered with triangular or conical ridges (cusps) which fit into hollows of the opposing teeth when the jaws are brought together. Chewing movements then cause the teeth to act as millstones and grind up the food.

    Now before you get all slap happy about us being omnivores and you jump from the true premise that we can eat all kinds of food to the ridiculous premise that we must eat all kinds of food, consider this. The gorilla has canines that are much closer to that of a carnivore, yet basically the only "meat" in their diets are insects. Are you ready to trade your t-bone steak in for grasshopper?
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  20. #17
    if the vegans had killed their baby before it was born then it would have been all good.

    but now? lock em down i say.

    pretty sure they got vegan grub now in most penitentiaries.
    Last edited by teacherone; 04-07-2011 at 12:40 PM.
    Those Who Do Not Move, Do Not Notice Their Chains.

  21. #18
    This sort of thing has happened here. The French are just imitating us. But there's a difference. Here it was, iirc, Church of Christ, Scientist members who were refusing to take children to the doctor on religious grounds. That and the seperation of church and state made the issue quite different, legally speaking. Of course, the French obviously aren't taking Yieu's stance into it.

    Tricky business for libertarians. It isn't a victimless crime. Of course, just as soon as you try to make it into a crime at all, though, you open a door better left closed...
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyRevolution View Post
    I look at vegans the same way I look at anorexics.
    You have an eating disorder, that's nice you call it a lifestyle.
    Wow, you have an extremely uneducated view of this topic and shouldn't be so insulting of a lifestyle that many people here take part in either from time to time or on a regular basis.

    Please read this:

    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...*s-you-f*****s!!


    Also, silverback gorillas are gigantic and very muscular. They only eat vegetation, and their large canines, which you mentioned earlier, are for ripping apart vegetation. The do get some bugs from the vegetation, but otherwise do not eat meat at all.
    Last edited by dannno; 04-07-2011 at 12:44 PM.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Yieu View Post
    Why is it even mentioned that they are vegan? That has nothing to do with the child's death. The child died of pneumonia which the parents failed to treat correctly.
    Because this is a hit piece against vegetarians and the few statists and anti-vegetarians on this forum are lapping it up.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by shemdogg View Post
    lmao
    You really don't recognize this for what it is, a hit piece?
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  25. #22
    It's interesting that the main "charge" is not taking the baby in for treatment. At the same time in the US, we have people who can't afford the treatment being told "pay up or go die".
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
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    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  26. #23
    The thread title is misleading. The word 'vegan' is irrelevant and only serves to provoke people to wish to insult vegetarians.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Teaser Rate View Post
    Good, I hope they rot in prison.
    i agree, they should have followed a government approved feeding program for their kid :\

    /sarcasm



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Yieu View Post
    The thread title is misleading. The word 'vegan' is irrelevant and only serves to provoke people to wish to insult vegetarians.
    Agreed. It is about a child who died because it was not given proper treatment.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Nastynate View Post
    They treated the child in a way they thought would make him better. You could look at this like a religious matter, this could be considered possibly a native american way of healing which might have worked before with native americans. But they weren't negligent to their child. Why do you have to treat your wounds as the government sees fit? These people took a gamble and lost, they really believed in this stuff or they wouldn't have not done it for their child.

    So it would of been ok if the baby had died in a hospital which they do on occasions but when parents use alternative methods they should be prosecuted and thrown in prison? Just because someone has a different belief in what works and what doesn't, doesn't make you right or them right. Those pesky individuals, everyone should conform and be exactly the same so we don't have these types of scum running around thinking for themselves....so disgusting.
    Yes they $#@!ing were. We have a large body of evidence which proves that modern medicine works. Cabbage doesn’t.

    Anyone who can’t make the distinction between using antibiotics and cabbage to treat pneumonia is crossing into absurdity.

    What the parents did was the equivalent of putting a gun to their child’s head and pulling the trigger because they believed bullets in her brain would make her smarter, they absolutely deserve to be thrown in prison.


    Quote Originally Posted by Kelly. View Post
    i agree, they should have followed a government approved feeding program for their kid :\

    /sarcasm
    It's almost like the last century of medicinal advances didn't occur in your world.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Because this is a hit piece against vegetarians and the few statists and anti-vegetarians on this forum are lapping it up.
    This tragic story is as much a hit piece against vegetarianism as the Columbine massacre was a hit piece against gun rights.
    Last edited by Teaser Rate; 04-07-2011 at 05:02 PM.

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Teaser Rate View Post
    Yes they $#@!ing were. We have a large body of evidence which proves that modern medicine works. Cabbage doesn’t.
    Those large bodies of evidence are funded by big pharma who can go $#@! themselves. They don't rule me, neither do you. Don't tell other people how to take care of their children unless you want to be told explicitly how to take care of yours.



    Quote Originally Posted by Teaser Rate View Post
    Anyone who can’t make the distinction between using antibiotics and cabbage to treat pneumonia is crossing into absurdity.
    What about yogurt? I'm aware yogurt isn't vegan, but they do have soy yogurt with all the same benefits. Last time I got an infection I ate a bunch of yogurt. The infection went away in 2-3 days and I kept my gut flora, didn't have to suffer the negative side effects of anti-biotics.

    I think taking anti-biotics is completely absurd for most bacterial infections.


    Quote Originally Posted by Teaser Rate View Post
    What the parents did was the equivalent of putting a gun to their child’s head and pulling the trigger because they believed bullets in her brain would make her smarter, they absolutely deserve to be thrown in prison.
    What a bunch of bologna.


    Quote Originally Posted by Teaser Rate View Post
    It's almost like the last century of medicinal advances didn't occur in your world.
    Many of the 'advances' are giving us all different types of diseases and conditions that didn't exist before. I'm all for medical advancement, but I REFUSE to let people decide what that means for me.
    Last edited by dannno; 04-07-2011 at 05:07 PM.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Teaser Rate View Post
    This tragic story is as much a hit piece against vegetarianism as the Columbine massacre was a hit piece against gun rights.
    Good, we're agreed.

    Both events were tragic, yet the media chose to latch on and shove their own agenda down our throats that had nothing to do with the real problem.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Those large bodies of evidence are funded by big pharma who can go $#@! themselves. They don't rule me, neither do you. Don't tell other people how to take care of their children unless you want to be told explicitly how to take care of yours.





    What about yogurt? I'm aware yogurt isn't vegan, but they do have soy yogurt with all the same benefits. Last time I got an infection I ate a bunch of yogurt. The infection went away in 2-3 days and I kept my gut flora, didn't have to suffer the negative side effects of anti-biotics.

    I think taking anti-biotics is completely absurd for most bacterial infections.




    What a bunch of bologna.




    Many of the 'advances' are giving us all different types of diseases and conditions that didn't exist before. I'm all for medical advancement, but I REFUSE to let people decide what that means for me.
    I honestly have no idea how to argue with someone who believes that the entire medical profession is just a front for some grand profit-seeking conspiracy orchestrated by big pharma.

    I guess I can only hope that you'll take your doctor's advice if you ever get very ill one day, and if you ever have children, you won't try to cure their pneumonia with clay and cabbage.

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