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Thread: Is Lew Rockwell Harming The Liberty Movement With His Constant Use of Hyperbole?

  1. #61
    Needs a bigger boat Anti Federalist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by low preference guy View Post
    Lew denied he did it. What's your proof?
    None.



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  3. #62

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    None.
    I'm skeptical about the accusation, considering that they came from the Kock camp, a long-time enemy of Lew.

    Also, the writing style is different from what I am used to read from Lew, although I suppose a good writer can fake a style.
    Last edited by low preference guy; 03-29-2011 at 11:13 PM.

  4. #63

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    Reason asserted that "a half-dozen longtime libertarian activists—including some still close to Paul" had identified Rockwell as the "chief ghostwriter" of the Ron Paul newsletters published from "roughly 1989 to 1994." According to Reason, Rockwell has denied responsibility for the disputed material and has called the accusations "hysterical smears aimed at political enemies."

    I don't know anything about libertarian internal politics, and maybe Rockwell didn't write them; but who did? Wasn't Rockwell responsible for overseeing all the letters going out?

  5. #64

  6. #65
    Needs a bigger boat Anti Federalist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by low preference guy View Post
    I'm skeptical about the accusation, considering that they came from the Kock camp, a long-time enemy of Lew.

    Also, the writing style is different from what I am used to read from Lew, although I suppose a good writer can fake a style.
    Like I said, I have nothing concrete.

    A bunch of people said one thing, Lew said another and that's all I know.

    And I'm a fan of Lew as well, I enjoy his sites and his writing.

    But if we're going to start talking about people to throw overboard...

  7. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    But if we're going to start talking about people to throw overboard...
    lol fine, if we are, I still stand by what I said that Alex should be one of the first, certainly before Lew.



    etc , etc ,

    I mean he is making a pretty rock solid case right there that he should be the first.
    Last edited by Andrew-Austin; 03-29-2011 at 11:32 PM.

  8. #67

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    Quote Originally Posted by low preference guy View Post
    Lew denied he did it. What's your proof?
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    None.
    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Snowden;
    So its, I would say; illustrative that the president would choose to say, "someone should face the music" when he knows the music is a show trial.

  9. #68

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zatch View Post
    Stuff like this: "The Evil Paul Krugman Attacks Ron Paul"

    http://www.lewrockwell.com/wenzel/wenzel58.1.html

    This one is actually by Wenzel but Lew uses the same kind of language.
    Quote Originally Posted by low preference guy View Post
    that's perfectly fine, what a wuss.
    Exatcly, I dont see whats wrong with that article.

  10. #69

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    Rome is burning and your worried about Lew being polite to the arsonists. Shakes head in wonder.

  11. #70

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    Lew is abrasive. Its a style that we diehards love but regular people don't respond to.

  12. #71

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    Quote Originally Posted by AquaBuddha2010 View Post
    Lew is abrasive. Its a style that we diehards love but regular people don't respond to.
    Is Rockwell even a libertarian? Or an ancap?

    Read what you will. But be a little thoughtful about what you turn n00bs on to first. Work them up to the advanced courses before you send them in.
    Quote Originally Posted by Calvin Coolidge View Post
    'The country cannot be run on the promise of what it will do for the people. The only motive to which they will continue ready to respond is the opportunity to do something for themselves, to achieve their own greatness, to work out their own destiny.'
    Quote Originally Posted by Calvin Coolidge View Post
    'We do not need more government, we need more culture. We do not need more law, we need more religion. We do not need more of the things that are seen, we need more of the things that are unseen.'

  13. #72

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    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Work them up to the advanced courses before you send them in.
    I second this! It is sad but true.

  14. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by malkusm View Post
    Another recent example - when Tom Woods posted a rebuttal to Mark Levin on LRC, Levin jumped at the opportunity to link his followers to LRC articles calling American soldiers murderers, calling for the abolition of drunk driving laws, and calling Reagan a tyrant. I cringed when Woods posted it on LRC because I knew it was coming. It had nothing to do with the perfectly reasonable argument that the Constitution delegated war powers to Congress rather than the executive. Yet, that's the takeaway.

    Lew is in a position where he could assert influence over many who are sympathetic to our small-government ideas, but by and large, he takes the opportunity to turn his page into an echo chamber that condemns the very people who might be influenced.
    That ^ I don't spend much time there anymore as
    (A) I already know what everybody is going to say because there is nothing new
    (B) Well reasoned analysis of why libertarianism provides the best solution to most of the problems of "public policy" is lacking. It is easier to rant than put forth the effort into dissecting the liberal and conservative positions that lead to increased tyranny of the government over the individual.
    Out of every one hundred men they send us, ten should not even be here. Eighty will do nothing but serve as targets for the enemy. Nine are real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, upon them depends our success in battle. But one, ah the one, he is a real warrior, and he will bring the others back from battle alive.

    Duty is the most sublime word in the English language. Do your duty in all things. You can not do more than your duty. You should never wish to do less than your duty.

  15. #74

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    I'd say we already dissected the liberal/conservative positions that lead to tyranny. We already did that years ago.

    So either we can repeat it constantly, sounding like a broken record. Or we can just have some fun and stroke our egos.
    "Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed. I do not ask that you place hands upon the tyrant to topple him over, but simply that you support him no longer; then you will behold him, like a great Colossus whose pedestal has been pulled away, fall of his own weight and break in pieces."-Étienne de La Boétie

  16. #75

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    Lew is an anarchist. I like him. Libertarians who think that anything can be done through the political process are usually turned off by him. Im all in for the Ron Paul 2012 thing, but in my heart of hearts I know it wont change anything and government is essence will continue to grow, I dont care what you put in a constitution.

  17. #76

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheBlackPeterSchiff View Post
    Lew is an anarchist. I like him. Libertarians who think that anything can be done through the political process are usually turned off by him. Im all in for the Ron Paul 2012 thing, but in my heart of hearts I know it wont change anything and government is essence will continue to grow, I dont care what you put in a constitution.
    “But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist.” -Lysander Spooner

    Many people have questioned why I support Ron Paul and other liberty candidates by going to CPAC and posting here and such. I don't view it as trying to get a political victory, but I view it as trying to get an educational victory.
    "Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed. I do not ask that you place hands upon the tyrant to topple him over, but simply that you support him no longer; then you will behold him, like a great Colossus whose pedestal has been pulled away, fall of his own weight and break in pieces."-Étienne de La Boétie

  18. #77

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    LRC might turn some people off...who cares? That wasn't the voice of reason for that particular person. We shouldn't sit here wringing our hands over something or someone we cannot (should not) change. We need to worry about those that continue to applaud the burgeoning size of the US gov't that seeks to oppress us. Lew is one of the good guys. We can talk about "refining liberty" when we actually win, not cut our own throats because we don't like the delivery of someone's message.

    Either people are too thin-skinned to take LRC (or any liberty-type for that matter) or they are more resilient than we are giving them credit for...and will have to seek someone else they can relate to. If they are reading LRC at all - at least that means they are searching for an answer. You don't just flip the switch on liberty because you dislike a person's commentary.
    "In the beginning, the Patriot is a scarce man, brave, hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, however, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a Patriot." ~ Mark Twain


  19. #78

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    Hyperbole won't help our movement at all. Also, these days Lew is looking like a homeless man, not sure what happened but he really let himself go. Image is everything, and his poor image won't help the movement either.

  20. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fredom101 View Post
    Hyperbole won't help our movement at all. Also, these days Lew is looking like a homeless man, not sure what happened but he really let himself go. Image is everything, and his poor image won't help the movement either.
    It really gets on my nerves that so many apparently are so worried about "What will the mainstream think about us *wring handkerchief in worry*"

    All of us are on the morally right side. We shouldn't have to worry about "sanitizing" our message. The only people who will care about this are those who we will never "win over" to begin with, like Mark Levine.

    Even if we get rid of the "offensive" material, they will still find something to attack us on.
    Last edited by Vessol; 03-30-2011 at 09:47 AM.
    "Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed. I do not ask that you place hands upon the tyrant to topple him over, but simply that you support him no longer; then you will behold him, like a great Colossus whose pedestal has been pulled away, fall of his own weight and break in pieces."-Étienne de La Boétie

  21. #80

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vessol View Post
    “But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist.” -Lysander Spooner

    Many people have questioned why I support Ron Paul and other liberty candidates by going to CPAC and posting here and such. I don't view it as trying to get a political victory, but I view it as trying to get an educational victory.
    Q F T! I keep saying this too, getting RP in front of as many people as possible with his message is the goal, not numbers of votes. You never know who he may light a fire under when he's on CNN or Fox and speaking about taxes or the war on drugs or another radical platform of his.

  22. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vessol View Post
    It really gets on my nerves that so many apparently are so worried about "What will the mainstream think about us *wring handkerchief in worry*"

    All of us are on the morally right side. We shouldn't have to worry about "sanitizing" our message. The only people who will care about this are those who we will never "win over" to begin with, like Mark Levine.

    Even if we get rid of the "offensive" material, they will still find something to attack us on.
    I completely agree with you. But, I would prefer if prominent libertarians like Lew stay away from hyperbole (and name calling). It really doesn't help no matter what the underlying message is, and how right it is.

  23. #82

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fredom101 View Post
    Q F T! I keep saying this too, getting RP in front of as many people as possible with his message is the goal, not numbers of votes. You never know who he may light a fire under when he's on CNN or Fox and speaking about taxes or the war on drugs or another radical platform of his.
    Many attack Ron Paul for his style of speech, just like they do to Lew Rockwell or Alex Jones.

    Many neocons hate Ron, yet love Rand. Even though they have the same beliefs.

    Does that mean Ron should tone down what he says and how he says it?
    "Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed. I do not ask that you place hands upon the tyrant to topple him over, but simply that you support him no longer; then you will behold him, like a great Colossus whose pedestal has been pulled away, fall of his own weight and break in pieces."-Étienne de La Boétie

  24. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vessol View Post
    I don't view it as trying to get a political victory, but I view it as trying to get an educational victory.
    This^.

    If Ron Paul becomes president, it is merely a happy consequence of spreading the message of liberty...
    "In the beginning, the Patriot is a scarce man, brave, hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, however, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a Patriot." ~ Mark Twain


  25. #84

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    Everyone runs here to whine about how they hate being associated with everyone else here. Well, liberty isn't pretty. Makes for strange bedfellows.

    In fact, the only thing uglier than liberty is the lack of it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Calvin Coolidge View Post
    'The country cannot be run on the promise of what it will do for the people. The only motive to which they will continue ready to respond is the opportunity to do something for themselves, to achieve their own greatness, to work out their own destiny.'
    Quote Originally Posted by Calvin Coolidge View Post
    'We do not need more government, we need more culture. We do not need more law, we need more religion. We do not need more of the things that are seen, we need more of the things that are unseen.'

  26. #85

  27. #86

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    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Everyone runs here to whine about how they hate being associated with everyone else here. Well, liberty isn't pretty. Makes for strange bedfellows.

    In fact, the only thing uglier than liberty is the lack of it.
    Even people I may have many disagreements with, I still don't mind being associated with them.

    I remember when I was at CPAC I spent about 20 minutes at the John Birch Society stand, talking with them. I believe they were wary of my big 'ole Anarcho-Capitalist button I had, but they seemed to get along with me. I even shook the hand of the President of the JBS, John F. McManus and had a small discussion on the history of the JBS which I knew little about.
    "Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed. I do not ask that you place hands upon the tyrant to topple him over, but simply that you support him no longer; then you will behold him, like a great Colossus whose pedestal has been pulled away, fall of his own weight and break in pieces."-Étienne de La Boétie

  28. #87

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vessol View Post
    I don't view it as trying to get a political victory, but I view it as trying to get an educational victory.
    I feel the same way. The more people become educated about liberty and the more people that demand it...that's the best chance we have.

  29. #88

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    FWIW: I have a podcast playing of the jason lewis show (from monday where he talks about libya) and he plugged lewrockwell.com, postively.
    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Snowden;
    So its, I would say; illustrative that the president would choose to say, "someone should face the music" when he knows the music is a show trial.

  30. #89

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vessol View Post
    “But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist.” -Lysander Spooner

    Many people have questioned why I support Ron Paul and other liberty candidates by going to CPAC and posting here and such. I don't view it as trying to get a political victory, but I view it as trying to get an educational victory.
    As anarchism was the natural state of man, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist.
    Out of every one hundred men they send us, ten should not even be here. Eighty will do nothing but serve as targets for the enemy. Nine are real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, upon them depends our success in battle. But one, ah the one, he is a real warrior, and he will bring the others back from battle alive.

    Duty is the most sublime word in the English language. Do your duty in all things. You can not do more than your duty. You should never wish to do less than your duty.

  31. #90

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    I think we need people of all walks. Rand is speaks in milder tone and Lew is the raw truth. People use different methods I suppose to achieve desired ends.

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