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Thread: Ron Paul: Democracy is not Freedom

  1. #1

    Ron Paul: Democracy is not Freedom


    Ron Paul, CPAC 2011 Straw Poll Winner


    Democracy Is Not Freedom


    Rep. Ron Paul, MD
    February 7, 2005


    “…man is not free unless government is limited. There's a clear cause and effect here that is as neat and predictable as a law of physics: As government expands, liberty contracts.”

    ~ Ronald Reagan


    We've all heard the words democracy and freedom used countless times, especially in the context of our invasion of Iraq. They are used interchangeably in modern political discourse, yet their true meanings are very different.

    George Orwell wrote about “meaningless words” that are endlessly repeated in the political arena.* Words like “freedom,” “democracy,” and “justice,” Orwell explained, have been abused so long that their original meanings have been eviscerated. In Orwell's view, political words were “Often used in a consciously dishonest way.” Without precise meanings behind words, politicians and elites can obscure reality and condition people to reflexively associate certain words with positive or negative perceptions. In other words, unpleasant facts can be hidden behind purposely meaningless language. As a result, Americans have been conditioned to accept the word “democracy” as a synonym for freedom, and thus to believe that democracy is unquestionably good.

    The problem is that democracy is not freedom. Democracy is simply majoritarianism, which is inherently incompatible with real freedom. Our founding fathers clearly understood this, as evidenced not only by our republican constitutional system, but also by their writings in the Federalist Papers and elsewhere. James Madison cautioned that under a democratic government, “There is nothing to check the inducement to sacrifice the weaker party or the obnoxious individual.” John Adams argued that democracies merely grant revocable rights to citizens depending on the whims of the masses, while a republic exists to secure and protect pre-existing rights. Yet how many Americans know that the word “democracy” is found neither in the Constitution nor the Declaration of Independence, our very founding documents?

    A truly democratic election in Iraq, without U.S. interference and U.S. puppet candidates, almost certainly would result in the creation of a Shiite theocracy. Shiite majority rule in Iraq might well mean the complete political, economic, and social subjugation of the minority Kurd and Sunni Arab populations. Such an outcome would be democratic, but would it be free? Would the Kurds and Sunnis consider themselves free? The administration talks about democracy in Iraq, but is it prepared to accept a democratically-elected Iraqi government no matter what its attitude toward the U.S. occupation? Hardly. For all our talk about freedom and democracy, the truth is we have no idea whether Iraqis will be free in the future. They're certainly not free while a foreign army occupies their country. The real test is not whether Iraq adopts a democratic, pro-western government, but rather whether ordinary Iraqis can lead their personal, religious, social, and business lives without interference from government.

    Simply put, freedom is the absence of government coercion. Our Founding Fathers understood this, and created the least coercive government in the history of the world. The Constitution established a very limited, decentralized government to provide national defense and little else. States, not the federal government, were charged with protecting individuals against criminal force and fraud. For the first time, a government was created solely to protect the rights, liberties, and property of its citizens. Any government coercion beyond that necessary to secure those rights was forbidden, both through the Bill of Rights and the doctrine of strictly enumerated powers. This reflected the founders' belief that democratic government could be as tyrannical as any King.

    Few Americans understand that all government action is inherently coercive. If nothing else, government action requires taxes. If taxes were freely paid, they wouldn't be called taxes, they'd be called donations. If we intend to use the word freedom in an honest way, we should have the simple integrity to give it real meaning: Freedom is living without government coercion. So when a politician talks about freedom for this group or that, ask yourself whether he is advocating more government action or less.

    The political left equates freedom with liberation from material wants, always via a large and benevolent government that exists to create equality on earth. To modern liberals, men are free only when the laws of economics and scarcity are suspended, the landlord is rebuffed, the doctor presents no bill, and groceries are given away. But philosopher Ayn Rand (and many others before her) demolished this argument by explaining how such “freedom” for some is possible only when government takes freedoms away from others. In other words, government claims on the lives and property of those who are expected to provide housing, medical care, food, etc. for others are coercive — and thus incompatible with freedom. “Liberalism,” which once stood for civil, political, and economic liberties, has become a synonym for omnipotent coercive government.

    The political right equates freedom with national greatness brought about through military strength. Like the left, modern conservatives favor an all-powerful central state — but for militarism, corporatism, and faith-based welfarism. Unlike the Taft-Goldwater conservatives of yesteryear, today's Republicans are eager to expand government spending, increase the federal police apparatus, and intervene militarily around the world. The last tenuous links between conservatives and support for smaller government have been severed. “Conservatism,” which once meant respect for tradition and distrust of active government, has transformed into big-government utopian grandiosity.

    he fog and attach concrete meanings to the words politicians use to deceive us. We must reassert that America is a republic, not a democracy, and remind ourselves that the Constitution places limits on government that no majority can overrule. We must resist any use of the word “freedom” to describe state action. We must reject the current meaningless designations of “liberals” and “conservatives,” in favor of an accurate term for both: statists.

    Every politician on earth claims to support freedom. The problem is so few of them understand the simple meaning of the word.


    *Politics and the English Language, 1946.
    Last edited by FrankRep; 11-18-2012 at 12:40 PM.
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    Ron Paul Forum's Mission Statement:

    Inspired by US Rep. Ron Paul of Texas, this site is dedicated to facilitating grassroots initiatives that aim to restore a sovereign limited constitutional Republic based on the rule of law, states' rights and individual rights. We seek to enshrine the original intent of our Founders to foster respect for private property, seek justice, provide opportunity, and to secure individual liberty for ourselves and our posterity.



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  3. #2
    Ron Paul: A Republic, Not a Democracy
    http://www.free-press.biz/usa/A-republic.htm

    Dr. Ron Paul: A Republic, If You Can Keep It
    http://www.ronpaulforcongress.com/html/republic.html

    _______



    Walter Williams


    Like the founders of our nation, I find democracy and majority rule a contemptible form of government.


    Democracy Versus Liberty


    Walter Williams | The New American
    23 February 2011

    ____


    The American Form of Government: Constitutional Republic




    The New American: A Republic, if You Can Keep It
    http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews...ou-can-keep-it
    Last edited by FrankRep; 11-18-2012 at 12:42 PM.
    ----

    Ron Paul Forum's Mission Statement:

    Inspired by US Rep. Ron Paul of Texas, this site is dedicated to facilitating grassroots initiatives that aim to restore a sovereign limited constitutional Republic based on the rule of law, states' rights and individual rights. We seek to enshrine the original intent of our Founders to foster respect for private property, seek justice, provide opportunity, and to secure individual liberty for ourselves and our posterity.

  4. #3
    Hate is a strong word. I'm not sure Ron Paul would use it. It also looks bad to those who don't get what democracy really means, and could be used as a smear (using the word hate). I like the title of the article better.
    Last edited by Yieu; 02-26-2011 at 09:10 AM.

  5. #4
    I also fking HATE democracy! Just the thought of living in a democracy makes me feel sick to my stomach and anytime I hear cheers for democracy or people mindlessly demanding democracy it makes my head want to explode!

    I WANT FREEDOM.

    And no! I think hate is actually putting it mildly.

  6. #5
    What I mean is that the word hate is a very negative word and can look bad, so some people try to avoid it. Democracy is not freedom, for sure, it is the tyranny of the majority. But the word hate can be used as a smear.

  7. #6
    Btw look at this bull$#@! explanation of the word republic: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/republic

    No wonder sheeple are clueless if even the dictionaries have it wrong..

  8. #7
    The Founding Fathers on Democracy:


    "The experience of all former ages had shown that of all human governments, democracy was the most unstable, fluctuating and short-lived."
    - John Quincy Adams

    "Democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have, in general, been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths."
    - James Madison

    Democracy is the most vile form of government
    - James Madison

    "Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide."
    - John Adams
    ----

    Ron Paul Forum's Mission Statement:

    Inspired by US Rep. Ron Paul of Texas, this site is dedicated to facilitating grassroots initiatives that aim to restore a sovereign limited constitutional Republic based on the rule of law, states' rights and individual rights. We seek to enshrine the original intent of our Founders to foster respect for private property, seek justice, provide opportunity, and to secure individual liberty for ourselves and our posterity.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by FrankRep View Post
    The Founding Fathers on Democracy:


    "The experience of all former ages had shown that of all human governments, democracy was the most unstable, fluctuating and short-lived."
    - John Quincy Adams

    "Democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have, in general, been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths."
    - James Madison

    Democracy is the most vile form of government
    - James Madison

    "Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide."
    - John Adams
    I don't disagree with them. I suppose my point was one of tact. The thread title reads like it was written at MSNBC. It's not a good way to win hearts and minds.
    Last edited by Yieu; 02-26-2011 at 09:44 AM.



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  11. #9
    Democracy will take its rightful place in the trash bin of history right next to feudalism and monarchy.

  12. #10
    Oh but the liberal media porn just loves democracy. They tell everybody, the United States military is spreading democracy all over the middle east.

  13. #11
    While attending college in the 60′s I was taught that the U.S. was a “Democratic Republic”. My Father would rebuttal by saying, “no, we are a Republic". Thinking my professors, and text books knew more than my father, I dismissed his words.

    But in more recent times, I notice students are being taught that the U.S. is a Democracy…leaving out Republic all together. My curiosity began to get the best of me, and I began digging into old text books and documents. I discovered that in the 60′s (and even earlier) the U.S. educational system began rewriting history, and changing the meaning of words (like democracy and welfare): my father was right!

    As a result I cringed when I heard people use the word Democracy synonymously with Republic, but said little about it. It was not until I saw the price of death Egyptians were paying for "democracy"/ mob rule in which workers now protest government for higher wages that I realized the price for silence.

    Thank you for starting this thread
    Last edited by romacox; 02-26-2011 at 04:17 PM.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by romacox View Post
    But in more recent times, I notice students are being taught that the U.S. is a Democracy…leaving out Republic all together. My curiosity began to get the best of me, and I began digging into old text books and documents. I discovered that in the 60′s (and even earlier) the U.S. educational system began rewriting history, and changing the meaning of words (like democracy and welfare): my father was right!
    It's all a big game to transform America. Your dad is correct.

    Democracy in Schools Leads to Socialism
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...s-to-Socialism

    Dr. Samuel Blumenfeld: The Socialist Revolution Via Public Education
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...uel-Blumenfeld

    Last edited by FrankRep; 02-26-2011 at 04:24 PM.
    ----

    Ron Paul Forum's Mission Statement:

    Inspired by US Rep. Ron Paul of Texas, this site is dedicated to facilitating grassroots initiatives that aim to restore a sovereign limited constitutional Republic based on the rule of law, states' rights and individual rights. We seek to enshrine the original intent of our Founders to foster respect for private property, seek justice, provide opportunity, and to secure individual liberty for ourselves and our posterity.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by FrankRep View Post
    It's all a big game to transform America. Your dad is correct.

    Democracy in Schools Leads to Socialism
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...s-to-Socialism

    Dr. Samuel Blumenfeld: The Socialist Revolution Via Public Education
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...uel-Blumenfeld

    I totally agree. The Egyptians were fed this misinformation so they themselves would open the doors for anarchy leaving a vacuum that world banks (One World Governance ) will be only too happy to fill (one world currency and all).

    Also the same misinformation has been fed to us, and Wisconsin is the tip of the ice burg. In a Republic, teachers would not be working for the government, but for a free enterprise run by the parents of the children they teach .
    Last edited by romacox; 02-26-2011 at 05:44 PM.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by romacox View Post
    I totally agree. The Egyptians were fed this misinformation so they themselves would open the doors for anarchy leaving a vacuum that world banks (One World Governance ) will be only too happy to fill (one world currency and all).

    Also the same misinformation has been fed to us, and Wisconsin is the tip of the ice burg. In a Republic, teachers would not be working for the government, but for a free enterprise run by the parents of the children they teach .
    and Rothchilds famous quote: "Give me control of a nations money supply, and I care not who makes it’s laws." Looks like they are replacing the word "nations" with "world".

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by FrankRep View Post
    The Founding Fathers on Democracy:


    "The experience of all former ages had shown that of all human governments, democracy was the most unstable, fluctuating and short-lived."
    - John Quincy Adams

    "Democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have, in general, been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths."
    - James Madison

    Democracy is the most vile form of government
    - James Madison

    "Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide."
    - John Adams
    and also Ben Franklin's great quote:

    "Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding on what to have for dinner."
    Last edited by Echoes; 02-26-2011 at 06:50 PM.

  18. #16
    In Greece they are setting police on fire...that is anarchy. That is not what I want for my children and grandchildren.

    I do not think the Federal Reserve cares who ends up controlling the world government (Museum brotherhood, Christians, communists, socialists, ext) as long as they (the Fed) control the world currency.

    However I do not think they want a Republic because, in a Republic, they would not exist.
    Last edited by therepublic; 02-27-2011 at 06:10 AM.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by therepublic View Post
    In Greece they are setting police on fire...that is anarchy. That is not what I want for my children and grandchildren.

    I do not think the Federal Reserve cares who ends up controlling the world government (Museum brotherhood, Christians, communists, socialists, ext) as long as they (the Fed) control the world currency.

    However I do not think they want a Republic because, in a Republic, they would not exist.
    Actually, Islam forbids usury, so there's zero chance of a Caliphate. Fed/central banks wouldn't exist if Islam took hold around the world.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Feeding the Abscess View Post
    Actually, Islam forbids usury, so there's zero chance of a Caliphate. Fed/central banks wouldn't exist if Islam took hold around the world.
    You are correct that Islam forbids usury.
    u·su·ry (yzh-r)
    n. pl. u·su·ries
    1. The practice of lending money and charging the borrower interest, especially at an exorbitant or illegally high rate.
    2. An excessive or illegally high rate of interest charged on borrowed money.
    3. Archaic Interest charged or paid on a loan.

    But Islamic countries do currently trade in fiat currency. Rothchilds famous quote: "Give me control of a nations money supply, and I care not who makes it’s laws."

  22. #19
    I'm not fond of democracy either, but I fail to see how republicanism is that much better or even substantially different. They're just two different ways of arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic, IMO.
    "When it gets down to having to use violence, then you are playing the system's game. The establishment will irritate you - pull your beard, flick your face - to make you fight, because once they've got you violent then they know how to handle you. The only thing they don't know how to handle is non-violence and humor. "

    ---John Lennon


    "I EAT NEOCONS FOR BREAKFAST!!!"

    ---Me

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by BuddyRey View Post
    I'm not fond of democracy either, but I fail to see how republicanism is that much better or even substantially different. They're just two different ways of arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic, IMO.
    We lost our Republic on December 23, 1917 when the Federal Reserve was established. http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...e-Constitution (fiat money is unconstitutional)

    P.S. I think the only strong opposition to the Federal Reserve (with the exception of Ron Paul and his supporters) is the Chinese government, and that is only because they would like to control the world currency themselves.
    Last edited by therepublic; 02-27-2011 at 08:59 AM.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
    and also Ben Franklin's great quote:

    "Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding on what to have for dinner."
    One important difference being that those other quotes are genuine.

  25. #22
    Utah Legislature: America is a Republic, not a Democracy!

    Salt Lake City Tribune
    Mar 8, 2011

    A bill that would ensure Utah students learn the U.S. is a compound constitutional republic — not a democracy — has passed both Houses of the Legislature and is now headed to the governor for his signature.
    ----

    Ron Paul Forum's Mission Statement:

    Inspired by US Rep. Ron Paul of Texas, this site is dedicated to facilitating grassroots initiatives that aim to restore a sovereign limited constitutional Republic based on the rule of law, states' rights and individual rights. We seek to enshrine the original intent of our Founders to foster respect for private property, seek justice, provide opportunity, and to secure individual liberty for ourselves and our posterity.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by FrankRep View Post
    Utah Legislature: America is a Republic, not a Democracy!

    Salt Lake City Tribune
    Mar 8, 2011

    A bill that would ensure Utah students learn the U.S. is a compound constitutional republic — not a democracy — has passed both Houses of the Legislature and is now headed to the governor for his signature.
    Normally, I am completely against legislating what children should be taught in school but I would vote for this if I were a state senator/representative.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by therepublic View Post
    We lost our Republic on December 23, 1917 when the Federal Reserve was established. http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...e-Constitution (fiat money is unconstitutional)

    P.S. I think the only strong opposition to the Federal Reserve (with the exception of Ron Paul and his supporters) is the Chinese government, and that is only because they would like to control the world currency themselves.
    Actually I would argue we lost our republic April 8, 1913 because the 17th amendment. We turned from having the states being represented to the senate turning into a more powerful vote than the house. But the Federal Reserve was no friend to the republic either.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by awake View Post
    Democracy will take its rightful place in the trash bin of history right next to feudalism and monarchy.
    I doubt monarchy will ever be in the trash bin (at least, it will outlast republicanism). It's more stable than republicanism or democracy. Eventually, all these sort of vertically oriented, top-down power structures will consume themselves and humanity will have to become civil and order itself voluntarily-if not by desire, by the impossibility of stratified, top-down structures of power which lend themselves well to corruption.
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RP Support me on Patreon here Ephesians 6:12

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Nastynate View Post
    Actually I would argue we lost our republic April 8, 1913 because the 17th amendment. We turned from having the states being represented to the senate turning into a more powerful vote than the house. But the Federal Reserve was no friend to the republic either.
    It could be argued that the 16th amendment was more destructive than the 17th, but these amendments were only written a short time apart, so it's difficult to say for sure.
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RP Support me on Patreon here Ephesians 6:12

  31. #27
    So was the USA ever a real constitutional republic or was it some variation of one?
    No more IRS.
    I am now old enough to vote.

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by awake View Post
    Democracy will take its rightful place in the trash bin of history right next to feudalism and monarchy.
    +1

    Can't come soon enough.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by BuddyRey View Post
    I'm not fond of democracy either, but I fail to see how republicanism is that much better or even substantially different. They're just two different ways of arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic, IMO.
    Very true. Anarcho capitalism is the Future. Hopefully, the near future.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by IDefendThePlatform View Post
    Very true. Anarcho capitalism is the Future. Hopefully, the near future.
    I predict bigger government.
    ----

    Ron Paul Forum's Mission Statement:

    Inspired by US Rep. Ron Paul of Texas, this site is dedicated to facilitating grassroots initiatives that aim to restore a sovereign limited constitutional Republic based on the rule of law, states' rights and individual rights. We seek to enshrine the original intent of our Founders to foster respect for private property, seek justice, provide opportunity, and to secure individual liberty for ourselves and our posterity.

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