Catholic Decentralization quotes

[Tend yer biscuits.]

To find the general policy positions of Catholicism, the best place to look is Part Three of the Catechism of the Catholic Church. This document carries a lot of weight with mass attending Catholics. It is a compact summary of all of their beliefs. Most have probably not read it, but will be impressed if you quote to them from it.

Chapter 2, article 1 is gold for promoting decentralization, particularly paragraphs 1883-1885:

1883
Socialization also presents dangers. Excessive intervention by the state can threaten personal freedom and initiative. The teaching of the Church has elaborated the principle of subsidiarity, according to which "a community of a higher order should not interfere in the internal life of a community of a lower order, depriving the latter of its functions, but rather should support it in case of need and help to co-ordinate its activity with the activities of the rest of society, always with a view to the common good."7

1884
God has not willed to reserve to himself all exercise of power. He entrusts to every creature the functions it is capable of performing, according to the capacities of its own nature. This mode of governance ought to be followed in social life. The way God acts in governing the world, which bears witness to such great regard for human freedom, should inspire the wisdom of those who govern human communities. They should behave as ministers of divine providence.

1885
The principle of subsidiarity is opposed to all forms of collectivism. It sets limits for state intervention. It aims at harmonizing the relationships between individuals and societies. It tends toward the establishment of true international order.

[Tend yer biscuits.]

While the Universal Church is itself an absolute monarchy, the actual practice of government is highly decentralized into local Churches, called dioceses. Basically, it's monarchy all the way down to the family though parishes often have elected representative councils for the pastor to consult.

[Petar]

I'm sorry, but Rome is a beast.

The Holy Roman Empire appointed rulers, and did not allow peasants to read.

Dominican monks headed the Inquisition, and by some accounts murdered up to a million people.

When people started to actually read the Bible, then they figured out that Christianity was about finding God within yourself, and they realized that they did not need the RCC hierarchy to be spiritual.

How did Rome react towards this?

Well, they declared all values of the Protestant Reformation to be "heretical", and they reopened the "Holy Office of the Inquisition", and instigated brutal religious warfare of total extermination.

The RCC created its own CIA (the Jesuit order), and these cloak and dagger terrorists have been booted out of practically every country in the world, multiple times, for all of the trouble that they have caused.

By 1823 the RCC had its "Holy Alliance" pushing to take down the American republic, and that is what led to the Monroe doctrine.

The core values of the RCC have never changed, all "diplomatic" documents are just window dressing.

Its also basically run by an international child sex ring.

[Tend yer biscuits.]

Good grief.

[TER]

While the Universal Church is itself an absolute monarchy, the actual practice of government is highly decentralized into local Churches, called dioceses. Basically, it's monarchy all the way down to the family though parishes often have elected representative councils for the pastor to consult.

The Church is a monarchy, with Christ as it's Head, not the bishop of Rome.

[TER]

The One, Holy, Apostolic Church is what is called during modern times as the 'Eastern Orthodox Church'.

There have only been seven Ecumenical Councils to the Church before the apostasy of the Latin Church under the bishop of Rome in the Great Schism.

Decentralization is found most clearly in the Orthodox Church, as the Orthodox Church has maintained the apostolic teachings regarding the hierarchical structure. This is the structure taught by the resurrected Christ to the Apostles, who in turn taught the bishops and have been handed down from one generation to the next.

This is from the wikipedia article which does a nice job in summarizing it:

"The Orthodox Church considers Jesus Christ to be the head of the Church and the Church to be His body. Thus, despite widely held popular belief outside the Orthodox cultures, there is not one bishop at the head of the Orthodox Church; references to the Patriarch of Constantinople as a leader equivalent or comparable to a pope in the Roman Catholic Church are mistaken. It is believed that authority and the grace of God is directly passed down to Orthodox bishops and clergy through the laying on of hands—a practice started by the apostles, and that this unbroken historical and physical link is an essential element of the true church (Acts 8:17, 1 Tim 4:14, Heb 6:2). However, the church asserts that Apostolic Succession also requires Apostolic Faith, and bishops without Apostolic Faith, who are in heresy, forfeit their claim to Apostolic Succession. Each bishop has a territory (see) over which he governs. His main duty is to make sure the traditions and practices of the Church are preserved. Bishops are equal in authority and cannot interfere in the jurisdiction of another bishop. Administratively, these bishops and their territories are organized into various autocephalous groups or synods of bishops who gather together at least twice a year to discuss the state of affairs within their respective sees. While bishops and their autocephalous synods have the ability to administer guidance in individual cases, their actions do not usually set precedents that affect the entire Church. "

[Tend yer biscuits.]

The Church is a monarchy, with Christ as it's Head, not the bishop of Rome.

Catholics, of course, agree with this. They would see the bishop of Rome as his prime minister, the steward of Gondor until the return of the King.

Look, I wasn't trying to spark an argument about the truth or history of Catholicism. All I wanted to do was offer some resources for people who might be trying to win Catholics over to the cause.

[TER]

Catholics, of course, agree with this. They would see the bishop of Rome as his prime minister, the steward of Gondor until the return of the King.

Look, I wasn't trying to spark an argument about the truth or history of Catholicism. All I wanted to do was offer some resources for people who might be trying to win Catholics over to the cause.

I don't want an argument, but am happy to debate you on the history of the Church. I am passionate about the Orthodox Church because I am convinced it is the true Church and it is my greatest pleasure to share it with others who seek for truth.

But I now better understand what the OP was about and apologize for interjecting.

[Petar]

Yeah, I appreciate that you want to figure out a way to attract Catholics to the small government message, I guess that I just happen to have a hair trigger when it comes to the history of the RCC.

Actually, I'm pretty sure that all big religious organizations are run by similar criminals...

[Tend yer biscuits.]

Understandable. No sweat guys.

[Tend yer biscuits.]

I'm not sure what people around here think of New Jersey governor Christie. I don't know anything about him beyond this article. But if this is any indication of a new flavor of Catholic politicians, I welcome the trend.

At a time when most prominent Catholic politicians -- Nancy Pelosi, Joe Biden, and John Kerry -- have advocated federal government solutions to problems like health care, Gov. Christie is pushing in the opposite direction by releasing a New Jersey Privatization Task Force Report.

In the 57-page report, the Task Force proposes privatizing the state’s motor vehicle inspections, housing construction inspections, turnpike toll booths, state parks, psychiatric hospitals, as well as contracting for highway maintenance work, and outsourcing worker's compensation claims and all pension, payroll, and benefit payments systems.

These recommendations, according to Christie, will save New Jersey taxpayers over $200 million a year.

[Tend yer biscuits.]

Reading B16's first encyclical Deus Caritas Est (2005) for the first time. Came across this:

The State which would provide everything, absorbing everything into itself, would ultimately become a mere bureaucracy incapable of guaranteeing the very thing which the suffering person—every person—needs: namely, loving personal concern. We do not need a State which regulates and controls everything, but a State which, in accordance with the principle of subsidiarity, generously acknowledges and supports initiatives arising from the different social forces and combines spontaneity with closeness to those in need. (P.28)

NB: This segment is from a larger discussion of the Marxist critique of Christian charity:

Since the nineteenth century, an objection has been raised to the Church's charitable activity, subsequently developed with particular insistence by Marxism: the poor, it is claimed, do not need charity but justice. Works of charity—almsgiving—are in effect a way for the rich to shirk their obligation to work for justice and a means of soothing their consciences, while preserving their own status and robbing the poor of their rights. Instead of contributing through individual works of charity to maintaining the status quo, we need to build a just social order in which all receive their share of the world's goods and no longer have to depend on charity. There is admittedly some truth to this argument, but also much that is mistaken. (P.26)