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Thread: Zarlenga Responds to Mises.org Article

  1. #1

    Zarlenga Responds to Mises.org Article

    From gnosticmedia.com

    "This show is being released on Monday, March 01, 2010. My interview with Steve Zarlenga was recorded on February 23, 2010.

    Stephen Zarlenga of the American Monetary Institute has become a regular guest on the Gnostic Media program, and we love having him on. After our series that we completed a few months ago, some people from the Austrian school of economics were upset about the interviews with Stephen, and one of them wrote a long article that was posted to the Ludwig von Mises Institute website (http://mises.org/daily/4102) of the Austrian school attacking Stephen and the interview.

    Stephen returns for our 3rd interview together for his critical rejoinder to the Ludwig von Mises Institute website article by Kaj Grüssner. Whether your an economist or not, this is another interview you that won't want to miss."

    http://gnosticmedia.podomatic.com/en...9_16-08_00.mp3



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  3. #2
    Where in that audio clip is the interview or is the interview the whole clip? I couldn't get past the five minute audio intro or the college radio sounding host (I'm sorry if you're the host).

  4. #3
    I'm a very avid Stephen Zarlenga fan. He's spot on in his monetary science. Key word is science. Economics is not a science and Zarlenga always uses this point in his arguments. His other point is that there is nothing wrong with fiat money as long as it's not created by a private institution i.e. the Federal Reserve aka private banks. His basic premise regarding money is that it should fall under the checks and balances of the US government, yes as infallible as government is right now. Fallibility of government is a separate issue. Paulites need to understand it doesn't matter what backs our currency..........as long as private institutions controll it the people are screwed.

    This clip is a perfect example.
    YouTube - Money's Dirty Little Secret - Stephen Zarlenga pt. 4 of 7

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by LiveFree79 View Post
    I'm a very avid Stephen Zarlenga fan. He's spot on in his monetary science. Key word is science. Economics is not a science and Zarlenga always uses this point in his arguments. His other point is that there is nothing wrong with fiat money as long as it's not created by a private institution i.e. the Federal Reserve aka private banks. His basic premise regarding money is that it should fall under the checks and balances of the US government, yes as infallible as government is right now. Fallibility of government is a separate issue. Paulites need to understand it doesn't matter what backs our currency..........as long as private institutions controll it the people are screwed.

    This clip is a perfect example.
    The system he proposes is actually almost exactly to the system we have now, changing the fractional reserve part.

    Goverment has allways abused the monetary system all over history. It is naive to think that this time will be different.

    Zarlenga does not understand monetary policy a bit. He is a cheap hack, and it is a bit sad that is misleading the people with his half-truths.

    EDIT: And he is lying there, FIAT money is not created by private institutions. FIAT money is only created by the goverment. Even when the Fed is a half-private half-public institution, the fiat monopoly is created by goverment laws. Its beyond me how anyone can take this guy seriously.
    Last edited by hugolp; 03-01-2010 at 06:43 PM.

  6. #5
    Can you list some specific "half truths" he uses and why they are wrong? TIA.



    Quote Originally Posted by hugolp View Post
    The system he proposes is actually almost exactly to the system we have now, changing the fractional reserve part.

    Goverment has allways abused the monetary system all over history. It is naive to think that this time will be different.

    Zarlenga does not understand monetary policy a bit. He is a cheap hack, and it is a bit sad that is misleading the people with his half-truths.


    "Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion."
    - Thomas Jefferson

    WATCH: The Money Masters - How International Bankers Gained Control of America

    READ: Tragedy and Hope: A History of The World in Our Time - Carroll Quigley

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by ChooseLiberty View Post
    Can you list some specific "half truths" he uses and why they are wrong? TIA.
    I just edited to include one. But there are others only in that video:

    - He says money is a goverment thing only. This is false. There are examples in history and in modern times where money appears as the result of voluntary agreements between people. It happened in Argentina when their currency colapsed, it happened in Irak, etc... Its plain false that money is a goverment things. Money gets taken over by goverment, because that way it can be abused.

    And if me and my friends want to use something as money, not what this guy think we should use, why does it matter to him or anyone else what we use as money as long as we are not forcing anyone else? Why does he want to use the force to impose a monopoly on money and stop people from using their prefered money?

    - He says that there is not enough gold and silver, and that it does not keep with population growth. This is plain stupid.

    - He implies that inflation creates economic growth... if you believe that bubbles are economic growth then maybe...

    Ask questions with the doubts you have about monetary policy and I or anyone else can try to answer, but seriously, some things this guy say are very very wrong and its very obvious. I dont udnerstand why anyone take him seriously.
    Last edited by hugolp; 03-01-2010 at 07:00 PM.

  8. #7
    I haven't watched the vid yet, but IMO groups against the private fed should find common ground to work together rather than fight each other and miss the big picture which is what the banking cabal wants.

    Quote Originally Posted by hugolp View Post
    I just edited to include one. But there are others only in that video:

    - He says money is a goverment thing only. This is false. There are examples in history and in modern times where money appears as the result of voluntary agreements between people. It happened in Argentina when their currency colapsed, it happened in Irak, etc... Its plain false that money is a goverment things. Money gets taken over by goverment, because that way it can be abused.

    - He says that there is not enough gold and silver, and that it does not keep with population growth. This is plain stupid.

    - He implies that iflation creates economic growth... if you believe that bubbles are economic growth then maybe...

    Ask questions with the doubts you have about monetary policy and I or anyone else can try to answer, but seriously, some things this guy say are very very wrong and its very obvious. I dont udnerstand why anyone take him seriously.


    "Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion."
    - Thomas Jefferson

    WATCH: The Money Masters - How International Bankers Gained Control of America

    READ: Tragedy and Hope: A History of The World in Our Time - Carroll Quigley

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by ChooseLiberty View Post
    I haven't watched the vid yet, but IMO groups against the private fed should find common ground to work together rather than fight each other and miss the big picture which is what the banking cabal wants.
    Its a good policy, but associating yourself with the wrong people can cause problems as well. And the real problem is that what Zarlenga proposes is really saving the face of the present system and it is delaying a real solution.

    Also, I was very simpathetic to the ideas of this people, they sounded ok, until I started to have a better understanding of monetary policy and also when reading what they have to say about Austrian economics. I read a paper written by Zarlenga were he exposed as austrian theory a bunch of nonsense. Basically he said austrian say this, and it wasnt what austrian say, it was nonsense, and then started to criticize the nonsense as if he was destroying austrian theory. That kind of dishonesty got me very wary of this guy. I dont like people who blatantly lie becuase he knows he is talking about stuff not much people really understands and he will get away with it. That is cheap, and if you are really trying to solve things and not confuse the people, you dont do stuff like that. Probably that is why you have notice I am wary of this guy, but its just I dont like this kind of people.

    EDIT: Also, I loved "The money masters". I watched it three times in a month because it impressed me big time. It was one of the reasons I started studying monetary policiy as a hobby. And then studying monetary policiy, I discovered that The Money Masters has a lot of things incorrect. Again, ask any question you want.
    Last edited by hugolp; 03-01-2010 at 07:25 PM.



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  11. #9
    //
    Last edited by brandon; 03-01-2010 at 07:27 PM.

  12. #10
    Other than the Money Masters basically advocating Zarlenga's approach at the end, what other errors do you find?


    Quote Originally Posted by hugolp View Post
    Its a good policy, but associating yourself with the wrong people can cause problems as well. And the real problem is that what Zarlenga proposes is really saving the face of the present system and it is delaying a real solution.

    Also, I was very simpathetic to the ideas of this people, they sounded ok, until I started to have a better understanding of monetary policy and also when reading what they have to say about Austrian economics. I read a paper written by Zarlenga were he exposed as austrian theory a bunch of nonsense. Basically he said austrian say this, and it wasnt what austrian say, it was nonsense, and then started to criticize the nonsense as if he was destroying austrian theory. That kind of dishonesty got me very wary of this guy. I dont like people who blatantly lie becuase he knows he is talking about stuff not much people really understands and he will get away with it. That is cheap, and if you are really trying to solve things and not confuse the people, you dont do stuff like that. Probably that is why you have notice I am wary of this guy, but its just I dont like this kind of people.

    EDIT: Also, I loved "The money masters". I watched it three times in a month because it impressed me big time. It was one of the reasons I started studying monetary policiy as a hobby. And then studying monetary policiy, I discovered that The Money Masters has a lot of things incorrect. Again, ask any question you want.


    "Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion."
    - Thomas Jefferson

    WATCH: The Money Masters - How International Bankers Gained Control of America

    READ: Tragedy and Hope: A History of The World in Our Time - Carroll Quigley

  13. #11
    Should add that I'm in the Dr. Paul's competing currencies hybrid approach camp, which seems to be the most expedient solution politically and logistically.


    "Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion."
    - Thomas Jefferson

    WATCH: The Money Masters - How International Bankers Gained Control of America

    READ: Tragedy and Hope: A History of The World in Our Time - Carroll Quigley

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by ChooseLiberty View Post
    Other than the Money Masters basically advocating Zarlenga's approach at the end, what other errors do you find?
    They have the thing with the silver in the USA XIX century wrong, basically the whole late part of the XIX century in the USA is wrong.

    For example, he says Greenbacks were great and that Lincoln could finance the war with them. Lets set aside the morality of the reaons of the war, he says Lincoln needed to pass a law giving the banks some regulations becuase he needed money. But why did Linoln need money when it had the greenbacks? The reality is because greenbacks did not work and were depreciating big time, but he does not want to say that. Also he says that Lincoln wanted to repeal the law, but I have not seen any prove of that.

    He says that then the USA economy was emprisoned by the bankers controlling gold, but that is false. It is true that bankers started controlling the USA economy then, but it was not because they controlled gold, it was because of the regulations Lincoln had given them, that centralized credit.

    The movie describes that economy as not really working when in reality the USA industrialization happened then, and it happened by constantly raising the salaries of the people.

    Also keep in mind that Andrew Jackson, the president that killed the second bank of the USA created a totally de-regulated monetary and banking system, where any one could use the currency they wanted. The fact that the individuals have control over wich currency to use is a much better way of control than goverment monopoly like we have now and as Zarlenga is proposing. Competition is a better way of controlling things than monopoly.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by hugolp View Post
    The system he proposes is actually almost exactly to the system we have now, changing the fractional reserve part.

    Goverment has allways abused the monetary system all over history. It is naive to think that this time will be different.

    Zarlenga does not understand monetary policy a bit. He is a cheap hack, and it is a bit sad that is misleading the people with his half-truths.

    EDIT: And he is lying there, FIAT money is not created by private institutions. FIAT money is only created by the goverment. Even when the Fed is a half-private half-public institution, the fiat monopoly is created by goverment laws. Its beyond me how anyone can take this guy seriously.
    You are clueless!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's beyond me how someone like you fails miserably in understanding how money is created in the US.

    There is nothing quasi about the FED. The Federal Reserve is a privately owned and controlled corporation which acts in the interest of its investors and shareholders. Through the strategic political lobbying of the Congress it has obtained the primary right to issue and control our currency in the interest of its share holders and participant banks, not in the interest of the people of the US as a nation. Through the same legislation enabled by the ignorance and duplicity of our bribed politicians it has acquired the branding rights to pretend to be an institution of the US Government. To the extent that the faith in the US Currency is based upon this association it is misinformation.

    You're an anarchist who believes that all government is bad. All government is not bad. Bad government is one in which the people aren't represented. And that is the case with our current government. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by adamant View Post
    From gnosticmedia.com

    "This show is being released on Monday, March 01, 2010. My interview with Steve Zarlenga was recorded on February 23, 2010.

    Stephen Zarlenga of the American Monetary Institute has become a regular guest on the Gnostic Media program, and we love having him on. After our series that we completed a few months ago, some people from the Austrian school of economics were upset about the interviews with Stephen, and one of them wrote a long article that was posted to the Ludwig von Mises Institute website (http://mises.org/daily/4102) of the Austrian school attacking Stephen and the interview.

    Stephen returns for our 3rd interview together for his critical rejoinder to the Ludwig von Mises Institute website article by Kaj Grüssner. Whether your an economist or not, this is another interview you that won't want to miss."
    How dare you post insights from someone who is not an authorized leader of the Ron Paul movement, you're just confusing people. Now we'll have to engage in a fight over our leader versus someone else leaders.

    Don't make us read and digest what this man is saying, for we've already made up our mind and trust what von Mises, RP and Peter Schiff have to say, and we know we are right because these are great institutions and men.

    Gold & Silver are the only paths to a fair monetary system, Ron told me so personally. Hence, people should dismiss Zarlinga out of hand, and are better served by continuing to listen to Schiff.

    * * * Saboteurs and Dupes are on my Ignore List. My non-response means they're included. * * *

    email me anonymously

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by LiveFree79 View Post
    You are clueless!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's beyond me how someone like you fails miserably in understanding how money is created in the US.

    There is nothing quasi about the FED. The Federal Reserve is a privately owned and controlled corporation which acts in the interest of its investors and shareholders. Through the strategic political lobbying of the Congress it has obtained the primary right to issue and control our currency in the interest of its share holders and participant banks, not in the interest of the people of the US as a nation. Through the same legislation enabled by the ignorance and duplicity of our bribed politicians it has acquired the branding rights to pretend to be an institution of the US Government. To the extent that the faith in the US Currency is based upon this association it is misinformation.

    You're an anarchist who believes that all government is bad. All government is not bad. Bad government is one in which the people aren't represented. And that is the case with our current government. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water.
    1) I am not an anarchist.

    2) Calling people you hardly know clueless is not the way to go. Lets keep this debate sane. You have questions about monetary policy. Ask them.

    The monopoly on money is imposed by the goverment. The Fed can not impose it. The Fed oficials are nominated by the president and ratified by congress. It is true that there are also the shareholders. That is why I am telling you the Fed is half-private half-public. I dont see that the Coca-Cola president is nominated by the president... Also, this is really not important, the ECB is (suposedly) public and is as evil as the Fed.

    If you really think that congress is so corrupt (I tend to agree) I dont think it would be different if the Fed is inside the treasury or not. It would be the same. In fact, at the beggining of the previous century, before the creation of the Fed, JPMorgan and Rockefeller were pushing for that solution.

    I have made a series of points about Zarlenga points and you have not commented on any. Lets keep this real, lets discuss about it and lets find out what really is going on. You will find out that Zarlenga's ideas do not hold. I know because I use to think he was ok.

    EDIT: This is the link to the discussion on how Zarlenga blatantly lied about the austrian ideas, only so he could rebate this suposedly austrian ideas: http://mises.org/Community/forums/t/13534.aspx. I dont think anyone with good faith and that really wants people to understand what is going on would do something like that.
    Last edited by hugolp; 03-03-2010 at 04:50 AM.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by InterestedParticipant View Post
    How dare you post insights from someone who is not an authorized leader of the Ron Paul movement, you're just confusing people. Now we'll have to engage in a fight over our leader versus someone else leaders.

    Don't make us read and digest what this man is saying, for we've already made up our mind and trust what von Mises, RP and Peter Schiff have to say, and we know we are right because these are great institutions and men.

    Gold & Silver are the only paths to a fair monetary system, Ron told me so personally. Hence, people should dismiss Zarlinga out of hand, and are better served by continuing to listen to Schiff.
    I'll be the first to admit that I don't know $#@!. I try to learn on a daily basis though. I thought that Zarlenga's ideas sounded pretty reasonable and I have great respect for Jan Irving. My hope was that a few members would give the interview a listen to see there are alternatives to what is presented around here...
    Last edited by adamant; 03-03-2010 at 11:28 AM.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by adamant View Post
    I'll be the first to admit that I don't know $#@!. I try to learn on a daily basis though. I thought that Zarlenga's ideas sounded pretty reasonable and I have great respect for Jan Irving. My hope was that a few members would give the interview a listen to see there are alternatives to what is presented around here...
    It is very good to look at other viewpoints. I actually started with the Zarlenga viewpoint because I saw The Money Masters, but as I have been learning more I saw how flawed it was. But what got me wary about him was how dishonest he was in his critique of the austrian school (the one in the previous posts).

    But I dont want anyone to believe just based on preferences. Lets discuss the issues. Ask questions.



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