Hemp=Pot(What's the deal guys?)

[M House]

Okay after researching a ton of "government" stuff. They are already aware of bunchies of potentially good things and plenty of bad about your pot. God, you can go thru pubmed for hours on cannabinoids. I'm pretty sure there's a single damn reason Hemp is illegal and it's so hard to get it and related chemicals....you. They know if they allow Hemp, you or someone smarter than you will be able to breed marijuana strains.

-I never wanna hear again how it's not Hemp (Cannabis Sativa) is often gen. 1 breeding stock. Many strains come straight from it alone. Since you can chemically change it's sex and smuggle a variety of plants in to breed with it, they know it's a potential problem. Single read through some information from weedworld.co.uk explains in detail how the drug comes out.

note: I've had many stoner tell me this wasn't the case. That's just perpetuating a lie... and no better than anyone else who does this. I'm sure some are innocent other people know plenty about it, considering heavy users have told me this over and over again. I'm sure you can see some irony in these tactics. Even the wiki page is bit inaccurate...and won't directly state this connection.

-Plenty of research is pretty blunt about mechanisms involved. I'm pretty sure one of the reason this arguments comes up so much is you want your pot fix, not anything else. You do not want a single other benefit from it.

-It has never cured cancer but it might suppress growth of certain tumors due to immune suppression. I'm pretty sure that study was even government funded since I ran into it on pubmed.

They know due to the mechanisms involved it can probably be highly addictive. I find it amazing that they tested it to repeatedly stimulate paths in common with Heroin, Amphetamines, and Cocaine, but rarely mention any possible implications of this. Seriously I can find a study that marks Amphetamines as addictive cuz of its meso limbic dopamine release but THC, na...?

Though it does last for ridiculously forever in comparison, little withdraw I suppose. Due to the way it works I bet the only way you could become addicted to it is if you put some effort into trying. Aka, smoking it very regularly. Denial is part of the problem, too, if you are a bit hooked on it I’d bet you’d probably be very aware. Knowing how the FDA and doctors are I'm sure they do not want the legal responsibly of dealing with this. Thus the only thing they were even willing to pass here was a Synth(it should be chem. same, fishy) THC at Schedule III for very limited uses. Why would they emphasize that probably so you don’t go out and try to abuse it…sad. After reading about that doesn't look like they put much effort into giving it too many fair tests on things it'd actually have a significant impact. Looking at your responses some have contributed alot to the problem as well. Response to that drug was poor... with limited sales.


So even other cannabinoid meds probably will not or will take forever to get accepted here. Hemp is will remain illegal as well. And you are either a tool or a user. Reading the pot growers descriptions of their strains you can smell a lot of BS too, I’m sure the majority of them did not go into war torn countries to find a magical shrub that can grown in most any climate.

The USA is not California or your drug kingdom. I’m sick of this, it’s not fair to anyone.

[0zzy]

so..what just happened?
you hate pot?

[steve005]

reading your post was the biggest waste of time, what are you even saying? Go out and expereince things, instead of thinking so much about the crap

[Dr.3D]

You are attacking a plant that has been used for more than 3000 years as a medicine. It has only been in the past 100 years, it has been restricted from use.

[pinkmandy]

Reefer Madness

It's a dangerous world out there.

[hillertexas]

Whoa...what's with the chip on your shoulder?

Okay after researching a ton of "government" stuff. They are already aware of bunchies of potentially good things and plenty of bad about your pot.

WTF is that supposed to mean?



And, addictive?! Puuuullleeeaaazzeee.

Try researching non "government" stuff. Hell, just use the search function on this forum as it has been discussed ad nauseam.

[Dr.3D]

And, addictive?! Puuuullleeeaaazzeee.

Yeah, really, tobacco is more addictive and alcohol to some people is also more addictive.

[Grimnir Wotansvolk]

Alright, let's assume pot is as bad as they claim. Let's say it's the most voraciously community and mind destroying substance on the planet.

You still can't $#@!ing stop me. Eat it.

[amonasro]

Oh this is gonna be good. Where do we start? Sounds like you jumped into some advanced reading without really understanding what marijuana is and how it works.

To understand how THC and other compounds in marijuana you must understand what the endocannabinoid system is and how it regulates your body. A quick google search reveals a basic definition.

The endocannabinoid system refers to a group of neuromodulatory lipids and their receptors that are involved in a variety of physiological processes including appetite, pain-sensation, mood, and memory. It is named for endocannabinoids, the endogenous lipids that bind cannabinoid receptors (the same receptors that mediate the psychoactive effects of cannabis).

Basically, the psychoactive compounds in THC are cannabinoids which "activate" all those millions of endocannabinoid receptors in your body. In your brain, it makes you feel "high" but in your body it can give you a heavier feeling or other sensations unique to whatever strain you're ingesting. So it goes without saying that the outward effects of the drug are well understood, but the inward effects on the endocannabinoid system is just beginning to be understood.

All of the health benefits gained by cannabis are because mammals have an endocannabinoid system. Cannabis was created by nature for our use through this specific system--no other drug can boast that.

http://www.endocannabinoid.net/

[M House]

Um thanks for the info on "the endocannabinoid system"? I learned a bit about it in my school class on neurobiology and stuff, no offense to your well done description but could you elaborate. You're right the reading was bit over my head and I'm trying to piece quite a few things together. You seem like incredibly smart and well informed so who knows maybe you are...

Since "the endocannabinoid system" regulates your appetite and all could you break it down into simple language to me like CB1 and CB2 receptor antagonism and agonism. Last time I checked that was part of that amazing "endocannabinoid system". I might not be up to date do they classify them differently? Do you know are their some other types or sub-types to look into? I'm a bit puzzled how it actually regulates digestive hormones. We know it seems to reduce a bit of gastric motility vagus, CCK perhaps?

[dannno]

Yeah, really, tobacco is more addictive and alcohol to some people is also more addictive.

Completely true.

[brandon]

Okay after researching a ton of "government" stuff. They are already aware of bunchies

THEY ALREADY KNOW ABOUT BUNCHIES???? HOW DID THEY FIND OUT?? WAS HE MOSSAD THIS WHOLE TIME?


ll

[Kotin]

reading your post was the biggest waste of time, what are you even saying? Go out and expereince things, instead of thinking so much about the crap

+1776

[dannno]

Reading the pot growers descriptions of their strains you can smell a lot of BS too, I’m sure the majority of them did not go into war torn countries to find a magical shrub that can grown in most any climate.

Actually the kush varieties come from india and the middle east, namely the Hindu Kush Mountain Range. Those are pure indica strains. There are sativas from South Africa, such as Durban Poison that are local to that area. There are sativa dominant strains from Hawaii, such as "Maui Wowie". The native americans had indicas as well as sativas. The majority of strains are hybrids because the highs from pure sativas are mostly cerebral and generally don't last very long while the highs from indicas last longer but are too exausting for the body. When you mix them, you can come up with some interesting varieties that affect the user in vastly different ways.

I recommend picking up a cannabible and reading up. There is plenty of information out there about the various strains. I know many strains came out of war-torn vietnam, and some strains came from the Coast Guard picking up thai sticks and whatnot back in the 70s. The Coast Guard was able to smuggle strains in from around the world before they cracked down, so for you to be so presumptuous isn't very tactful.

[gls]

TBH pot is so avaliable, cheap, and high-quality right now that I'm not sure if I would even want them to legalize it. Why mess with a good thing?



That's the strand I'm currently enjoying, called Kali Mist. Mmmm....it tastes soooo good.

[Kotin]

TBH pot is so avaliable, cheap, and high-quality right now that I'm not sure if I would even want them to legalize it. Why mess with a good thing?



That's the strand I'm currently enjoying, called Kali Mist. Mmmm....it tastes soooo good.

it would be 300% cheaper if it were decriminalized(see Black Markets and their effects on Price)

[gls]

it would be 300% cheaper if it were decriminalized(see Black Markets and their effects on Price)

Maybe. Or maybe they'd tax it so much that the prices wouldn't come down at all. The money would just go to the criminals who run the government instead of someone providing an actual useful service (like my dealer).

Also in all liklihood they would put limits on the amount of THC the buds could contain, doing away with the "dangerous" strands like the one pictured above.

[dannno]

TBH pot is so avaliable, cheap, and high-quality right now that I'm not sure if I would even want them to legalize it. Why mess with a good thing?

Cause I already know how to make it that good myself.

If I can't grow it myself, then it's not "legal" yet.

That's the strand I'm currently enjoying, called Kali Mist. Mmmm....it tastes soooo good.

Arguably the top sativa strain available today.
With 90% sativa genetices, Kali Mist grows into tall, running, classically sativa plants with very few leaves.
This strain produces dense clusters of full fluffy buds, producing much higher yields than you would expect.
The plant structure and few leaves allow the light to pass all the way to lower branches, allowing bottom buds to develop fully.

When planted outside early in the year this plant can grow very tall.
Expect spiraling flowers with a high resin content and a delightfully spicy scent.
Kali Mist is often the choice of experts for their own stash grows.
Also, particularly women seem to like this strain, next to the sheer pleasure of smoking it, we received several reports that it works great against menstrual cramps.

We are proud to announce that Kali Mist was improved in 2000 to produce bigger yields.

In Spain it proved to be very mold resistent, even outside during bad weather.
This strain has flavor and subtle cerebral effect that gave it a Cannabis Cup first prize in 1995 (Hydro Cup) and again (with this new and improved version) in 2000 (Seed Company Sativa Cup)!
Without a doubt the choice for connoisseur stash.
Gives a very strong, clear and energizing High

http://www.cannabis-seeds.co.uk/prod...kali-mist.html

[acptulsa]

it would be 300% cheaper if it were decriminalized(see Black Markets and their effects on Price)

Impossible. It would be taxx-ed all that and more.

Of course, if you taxx the hell out of it and simultaneously trim the War on Drugs budget, you could well go a long way toward supporting the War on the World currently stuck in Iraq...

...but as the Revenooers and Moonshiners proved after the end of prohibition, the War wouldn't end right away. It would just move into the phase of corralling the tax evaders.

[LibertyEagle]

MHouse, I think you're missing the point. The argument is not how good or bad pot or hemp is. The argument is that it should be none of government's business what I choose to put in my own body, as long as I do not infringe on someone else's liberty.

[M House]

I don't like the fact people aren't representing the issue very fairly on either side. I also think this pro hemp $#@!'s disingenuous. I also don't like the fact, I've been lied to so much especially from the people who use it themselves. It doesn't take a genius there's a bit of pro and con.

Yeah what I read that makes a bit of sense I figured the Indica would be from that area naturally. For Danno I can respect that you do seem to know alot about it actually. Atleast what you say seems match what I've read. I think it's alittle sad all this efforts spent on tooling a plant into drug for a high. I think the majority of the strains are actually hybrids cuz what exactly do you do to feminize the stains? My guess it's something done during development. The plant can polyploid as well so there's probably there's quite a bit of method involved to use this advantage. Corn crops are often done this way for yield. But I don't like this front not having Hemp cuz it cures stuff, and I kinda think not being able to have natural Sativa here is a great loss.

All the plants have the great compounds and but there's sadly little variety of application to humans. Even a single cannabinoid can be broken down who knows how many ways. I also think it's a bit two sided for people to condemn the FDA for allowing certain drugs but not allowing them theirs.

Well for Danno, I'm not sure I care so must about the other opinions. Like I said there's no point in using the same tactic used against you. So whatever you seem to have a bit of info so from what I understand there's another cannabis...
Cannabis Sativa
Cannabis Sativa Indica(if classified as subvariety)
1. What's the other one?
2. Got any info on the chem. mix other than the high from Indica hybrids they seem to vary a bit quite a bit from either parent.

[acptulsa]

Well, why wouldn't someone sick of this goofy neo-prohibition also mention the benefits of hemp we are not enjoying? Seems a valid follow-up argument to me. I mean, no small part of the end of prohibition was predicated not on the idea that people should have a right to drink, but on the true fact that we were shooting ourselves in the foot with it.

[dannno]

I think the majority of the strains are actually hybrids cuz what exactly do you do to feminize the stains? My guess it's something done during development.

Feminizing: http://www.420source.com/post/82

I don't think feminizing has anything to do with the strains, but seed production for sale, generally from seed banks. Historically, growers have simply separated the male plants from the female plants so that the females produce "sensimilla" which are buds that do not contain seeds, so they therefore put more of their energy into producing the oils which contain the THC and CBDs. This is the goal of the cannabis growers, and there are many methods to achieving this. Essentially, any sort of stress, like a cool climate (you will see this referred to in a minute). Depriving the female plants of sex is very stressful, as one could imagine. This type of "tooling" as you call it is beneficial to smokers because it creates a more pure medicine. That means we don't have to smoke as much plant material while getting the same amount of medication. This means less smoke and healthier lungs.

Well for Danno, I'm not sure I care so must about the other opinions. Like I said there's no point in using the same tactic used against you. So whatever you seem to have a bit of info so from what I understand there's another cannabis...
Cannabis Sativa
Cannabis Sativa Indica(if classified as subvariety)
1. What's the other one?
2. Got any info on the chem. mix other than the high from Indica hybrids they seem to vary a bit quite a bit from either parent.

Cannabis Sativa:
These plants are characterized by long thin flowers and spiky leaves. They originate from equatorial regions where the growing season is hotter. They are not generally used for outdoor cultivation in colder climates, although some hybrids can produce good yields in such conditions. Cannabis sativas have more of a high than Cannabis indica buds.

Cannabis Indica:
These plants originated in the Hindu-kush areas of Central Asia, where the weather is changeable and growing conditions can be harsh. Hardy plants, they mature early and are characterized by broad, short leaves and heavy, tight flowers. Cannabis indica varieties are ideal for indoor and outdoor cultivation in cooler climates.

Cannabis Ruderalis: Cannabis ruderalis is a variety of cannabis that grows wild in parts of Eastern Europe and Russia. It is characterized by its early flowering, with some plants starting irrespective of the photo-period. Cannabis ruderalis is ideal for cultivation in cooler climates and areas where conditions are harsh. There are Dutch hybrid varieties available that combine Cannabis ruderalis and Cannabis indica.

http://blog.dopies.com/marijuana-hor...-and-Ruderalis

[M House]

Alotta what you do is simple propaganda picking and choosing anything you can find and editing the result, same as them.

[M House]

Good info Danno, I'll check some more stuff with that.

[dannno]

Alotta what you do is simple propaganda picking and choosing anything you can find and editing the result, same as them.

That's a pretty collectivist view, however, I would also ask you two important questions:

1. Who started it?

2. Who is right?


Answer:

1. They did.

2. According to the principles of liberty and freedom and the constitution, we are right.


Instead of complaining about the half-truths, why not try to get the word out on what you think is the real truth, based on the principles of liberty and freedom??

[M House]

Two wrongs don't make a right. Considering some of the novel effects cannabinoids w/ fairly safe profile it would have been a huge benefit for a variety of people to get to try something synth or non. Whatever I did start looking up this stuff, I think part of the unpopularity of the synth wasn't it's ineffectiveness but it's compounding. It was a close THC with no additional components. Seems you guys like a bit of complexity and particularly that CBD seems to have a more regulated effect on the CB receptors.

[dannno]

1. Who started it?

2. Who is right?


Answer:

1. They did.

2. According to the principles of liberty and freedom and the constitution, we are right.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

This reminds me of a South Park episode. The Feds may be "right" in a few areas for the "wrong" reasons. The legalizers may be "wrong" in a few areas for the right reasons.

In the South Park episode, it was about gays in the Boy Scouts. The Boy Scout advocates argued that a gay Boy Scout leader may end up sexually molesting the scouts, so they should be able to ban it. On the contrary, "straight" men are more likely to molest children than gay men, so the gays sued the Boy Scouts because they thought they should have a right to be Boy Scout leaders. The truth is that the Boy Scouts are a private organization and should be able to choose whoever they want to be in their organization. Ultimately, however, the Boy Scouts were "wrong" for the right reasons, and the gays were "right" for the wrong reasons.


Still, though, I would argue that the Feds use a lot more disinformation than the legalizers.

[amonasro]

Hope ya don't mind if I jump in again

I don't like the fact people aren't representing the issue very fairly on either side. I also think this pro hemp $#@!'s disingenuous. I also don't like the fact, I've been lied to so much especially from the people who use it themselves. It doesn't take a genius there's a bit of pro and con.

What misinformation have you been given from someone who has used it? I would agree there are cons to marijuana use but they are not unreasonable cons--it really is a very harmless drug. In my experience, the users who spread lies about it use it as a scapegoat for their own laziness or screwed-up lives.

Yeah what I read that makes a bit of sense I figured the Indica would be from that area naturally... I think it's alittle sad all this efforts spent on tooling a plant into drug for a high.

Indicas, originating in the middle east, produce a relaxing body high, much like a heavy narcotic. Sativas originate from all over the world but grow best outdoors in equatorial climates. They produce a cerebral high (sometimes psychedelic), although some produce a body high also. The distance from the equator actually plays a role in the type of cannaboids present in each strain, so sativa strains vary greatly--from relaxing and giggly to fearsomely psychedelic.

People who "tool" marijuana for high, taste and other desirable traits are no different than people who make different kinds of beer, or create different kinds of wine or liquor. Medical caregivers in states where it's legal to grow breed plants for medicinal purposes, so I don't think it's sad at all.

I think the majority of the strains are actually hybrids cuz what exactly do you do to feminize the stains? My guess it's something done during development.

The majority of strains today are almost all hybridized to some extent. Pure sativas have flowering times between 8-12 weeks while indicas can mature in as little as 40 days. Indicas also grow better indoors (more hardy, shorter) so it's in breeders' best interests to hybridize to shorten flower times and improve vigor. It's pretty rare to get a 100% pure indica or sativa. That's why breeders prize landrace strains, i.e. strains that come directly from the country they originated from.

Feminization is a breeding techique that involves stressing a female plant, forcing it to hermaphrodite (produce male flowers) so the resulting pollen is feminine. Using it to pollinate another plant will produce seeds that develop into female plants.

Propagation of a specific strain is done through clones, however. A grower will keep mother plants that never get flowered, take cuttings, root the cuttings, grow them out and do it all over again. That way he can produce the exact same plant forever if he wants without planting new seeds.

and I kinda think not being able to have natural Sativa here is a great loss.

I would agree with you Landrace sativas are no joke though and can be too racy for some people. Actually much of the "schwag" coming across the border from Mexico is grown in Columbia and is pure, outdoor, equatorial sativa. Even though the overall quality is poor, the quality of the high is not!

All the plants have the great compounds and but there's sadly little variety of application to humans. Even a single cannabinoid can be broken down who knows how many ways. I also think it's a bit two sided for people to condemn the FDA for allowing certain drugs but not allowing them theirs.

Actually we are still learning about cannabinoids and some haven't been identified yet. And there is a LARGE body of evidence supporting application in humans. Problem with the FDA is that they can't patent a plant, so they won't support marijuana research unless they can produce a synthetic version they can profit from. Which they have, it's called Marinol, and used for treating the side-effects of chemotherapy. It's not about health with them, it's about money.

Cannabis Sativa
Cannabis Sativa Indica(if classified as subvariety)
1. What's the other one?
2. Got any info on the chem. mix other than the high from Indica hybrids they seem to vary a bit quite a bit from either parent.

Cannabis Sativa is the scientific name for the plant, but three psychoactive subvarieties are recognized: sativa, indica and ruderalis.

Ruderalis is not very potent so it's not used except for breeding because of its autoflowering traits.

I'm not sure what you mean about the "chemical mix" in an indica hybrid. A plant can vary from its parents, but probably because it's expressing recessive traits or the combination produces something unique not present in the parents.

[M House]

From what I could tell Marinol is a straight Delta 9 THC same as the plant, though there are other THCs and metabolites from it. Why it's said to be synthetic, I don't know and it's strange. I feel it could be same or some trick with the wording. Like Nicotinic Acid=Niacin=Vitamin B3, but Vitamin B3 can equal Nicotinamide does that mean Niacin can be it as well? Yeah, your guess would be as good as mine. Chemo therapy I doubt would benefit so well from the slowly absorbed version of the stronger immune affecting compounds.