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Thread: Here's the 20 page "GRA" plan (aka 401k Confiscation) briefing paper

  1. #1

    Default Here's the 20 page "GRA" plan (aka 401k Confiscation) briefing paper

    For those who still think this whole "GRA & 401k confiscation thing" was just an "offhand" congressional committee meeting idea that's being overblown...

    Here is a link to a PDF of the 20 page long "briefing paper" about the proposed "Guaranteed Retirement Accounts" written up by the Teresa "Il Duce" Ghilarducci for the "Economic Policy Institute":
    Guaranteed Retirement Accounts
    Toward retirement income security
    by Teresa Ghilarducci

    http://www.sharedprosperity.org/bp204/bp204.pdf
    Among a host of other things, the report includes this nice little "gem":
    If subsidies for 401(k)-style plans and IRAs can be reallocated to Guaranteed Retirement Accounts, why not use this money to shore up and expand Social Security?

    This is certainly an option.
    Then, under the "Questions about Guranteed Retirement Accounts" there is this littel beauty:
    [Q] Will Guaranteed Retirement Accounts provide
    enough retirement income for all workers?

    [A] No. The system is designed to provide a basic retirement
    income for workers with steady, full-time jobs.
    Gee... wasn't "a basic retirement income" what the Social Security system was supposed to take care of?

    So of course, lest people think this is MORE of the same current FAILED system... there has to be some obfuscation of this so that people don't think this is just a round-about way of INCREASING FICA taxes by another 10% (5% from you, 5% from your employer) -- and that instead they are still kinda-sorta like the 401K's and IRA's -- just "pooled" and "government managed":
    The accounts will be managed by a unit of the Thrift Savings
    Plan with its own trustees, who in turn will hire commercial money managers. The trustees will be independently appointed, half by the president (subject to Senate confirmation) and half by Congress. They will have terms structured in a similar fashion to the Federal Reserve Board of Governors.


    And of course -- everyone knows how trustworthy that Federal Reserve Board of Governors" actually is -- no corruption there!

    But at the end -- the very last sentence of the report -- she reveals the TRUTH:
    The GRAs are administered by the Social Security system
    eliminating all individual account management fees.
    And of course, despit all of the BS about it being a "private" account and all -- the money will NOT be yours -- no siree; for example your "heirs" only get a TEENY TINY bit of whatever it is you save (and apparently ONLY if you "die" BEFORE you retire):
    [Q] Why can’t workers bequeath the full amount of their account balances?

    [A]
    The Guaranteed Retirement Account solution is a compromise. Workers can bequeath half their account balances—that is, the worker’s own contributions, plus interest, but not the employer contributions—minus any benefits received.
    [...]
    However, in this case the cash refund feature is paid for by redistributing half of the account balances of workers who die before retiring, rather than by reducing the annuity.
    So... see the addition 5% amount that your employer will "contribute" (another mandatory "voluntary" thingee) -- never mind that your employer is paying you another 5% LESS in wages (because EVERY employer cuts wages based on costs)... nope, THAT little bit the government gets to keep. (Nice little incentive for the government to start "killing off" people before they retire, ain't it? Anyone want to line up for your government supplied "Flu" shots?)

    UPDATE: Just realized they said half of the "account balance" will be "redistributed" -- note that "REdistributed" not "distributed" -- which means the heirs WOULD NOT be able to "cash out" any such inheritance, but instead it would be "transferred" on your behalf (aka "redistributed") into the GRA accounts of the "heirs." Ergo the heirs would see NOTHING until THEY retired (talk about an inheritance tax... WOW!)

    And then... of course... CERTAIN people will be allowed to opt out. Who? well:
    The plan calls for all workers not enrolled in an equivalent
    or better defined-benefit pension
    to enroll in a GRA [...]

    Let's see... who exactly would fit into that category? Government employees for one. And who get's to decide whethen YOUR plan is "equivalent or better"? Hmmm... same answer; government bureaucrats.

    And how will this government-managed "fund" earn its money -- in what "magical" fashion will it do better than people saving and investing on their own? What guarantee is there that it won't disappear like Social Security?
    [Q] How much risk is the government incurring?

    [A] Based on current bond yields and a conservative estimate of future stock returns, a portfolio divided equally between long-term Treasuries, investment-grade corporate bonds, and stocks should earn a real rate of return of around 3.5%, enough to provide a cushion above the guaranteed rate. In the event of a protracted slump, the government retains the option of lowering the guaranteed return and allowing participants to access their funds.
    So... they'll invest it in TREASURIES and CORPORATE BONDS and STOCKS -- in other words the same things that Mutual Funds invest in -- which "should" earn a sufficient intrest rate (HA!). BUT "in the event of a protracted slump" (like THAT would ever happen, I mean seriously!) then the government will ... well, they will just "LOWER the guaranteed return" (which means, of course, that there is NOTHING "guaranteed" about it).


    One last item of note is that the "plan" doesn't even seem to be aware that SOME people are self-employed. Is this an oversight? Nope... because ABOVE ALL this plan is designed to TOTALLY SCREW OVER anyone who owns and operates their own business; essentially driving and "pushing" everyone to work for either the government, OR Big-Corporate America, OR... to essentially join the "gray-market." Since they do not draw a "paycheck" they will not be getting the "government subsidy" in any form -- ONLY PAYING IN EXTRA AMOUNTS FOR THEIR EMPLOYEES -- and ALL of the current subsidies for KEOGH plans are to be eliminated along with the 401K's & IRA's.




    FINALLY, and perhaps most importantly, please note that this thing was written up in November of 2007 (and Ms. Il Duce even wrote a book, called "When I'm Sixty-Four: The Plot against Pensions and the Plan to Save Them" which was published in May of 2008).

    Sidenote: Apparently there CAN be "plots" and "conspiracies" -- but only by those "evil free market capitalists" -- NEVER by government flunkies and apparatchiks.

    So ANY and EVERY statement that you read which says or even implies in any way this idea is a "result" of a need to address the recent stock market "meltdown" is 100% pure bullshit.

    They've been working on and planning this for YEARS.

    And who is "they" you ask? The report acknowledges the following:
    We gratefully acknowledge the generous support of the Rockefeller Foundation.
    Last edited by WRellim; 11-10-2008 at 06:28 PM. Reason: Added Update on "redistribution" to heirs.



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  3. #2

    Default

    bump. PLEASE READ & WARN OTHERS!

  4. #3

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WRellim View Post
    For those who still think this whole "GRA & 401k confiscation thing" was just an "offhand" congressional committee meeting idea that's being overblown...

    Here is a link to a PDF of the 20 page long "briefing paper" about the proposed "Guaranteed Retirement Accounts" written up by the Teresa "Il Duce" Ghilarducci for the "Economic Policy Institute":
    Guaranteed Retirement Accounts
    Toward retirement income security
    by Teresa Ghilarducci

    http://www.sharedprosperity.org/bp204/bp204.pdf
    Among a host of other things, the report includes this nice little "gem":
    If subsidies for 401(k)-style plans and IRAs can be reallocated to Guaranteed Retirement Accounts, why not use this money to shore up and expand Social Security?

    This is certainly an option.
    Then, under the "Questions about Guranteed Retirement Accounts" there is this littel beauty:
    [Q] Will Guaranteed Retirement Accounts provide
    enough retirement income for all workers?

    [A] No. The system is designed to provide a basic retirement
    income for workers with steady, full-time jobs.
    Gee... wasn't "a basic retirement income" what the Social Security system was supposed to take care of?

    So of course, lest people think this is MORE of the same current FAILED system... there has to be some obfuscation of this so that people don't think this is just a round-about way of INCREASING FICA taxes by another 10% (5% from you, 5% from your employer) -- and that instead they are still kinda-sorta like the 401K's and IRA's -- just "pooled" and "government managed":
    The accounts will be managed by a unit of the Thrift Savings
    Plan with its own trustees, who in turn will hire commercial money managers. The trustees will be independently appointed, half by the president (subject to Senate confirmation) and half by Congress. They will have terms structured in a similar fashion to the Federal Reserve Board of Governors.


    And of course -- everyone knows how trustworthy that Federal Reserve Board of Governors" actually is -- no corruption there!

    But at the end -- the very last sentence of the report -- she reveals the TRUTH:
    The GRAs are administered by the Social Security system
    eliminating all individual account management fees.
    And of course, despit all of the BS about it being a "private" account and all -- the money will NOT be yours -- no siree; for example your "heirs" only get a TEENY TINY bit of whatever it is you save (and apparently ONLY if you "die" BEFORE you retire):
    [Q] Why can’t workers bequeath the full amount of their account balances?

    [A]
    The Guaranteed Retirement Account solution is a compromise. Workers can bequeath half their account balances—that is, the worker’s own contributions, plus interest, but not the employer contributions—minus any benefits received.
    [...]
    However, in this case the cash refund feature is paid for by redistributing half of the account balances of workers who die before retiring, rather than by reducing the annuity.
    So... see the addition 5% amount that your employer will "contribute" (another mandatory "voluntary" thingee) -- never mind that your employer is paying you another 5% LESS in wages (because EVERY employer cuts wages based on costs)... nope, THAT little bit the government gets to keep. (Nice little incentive for the government to start "killing off" people before they retire, ain't it? Anyone want to line up for your government supplied "Flu" shots?)

    And then... of course... CERTAIN people will be allowed to opt out. Who? well:
    The plan calls for all workers not enrolled in an equivalent
    or better defined-benefit pension
    to enroll in a GRA [...]

    Let's see... who exactly would fit into that category? Government employees for one. And who get's to decide whethen YOUR plan is "equivalent or better"? Hmmm... same answer; government bureaucrats.

    And how will this government-managed "fund" earn its money -- in what "magical" fashion will it do better than people saving and investing on their own? What guarantee is there that it won't disappear like Social Security?
    [Q] How much risk is the government incurring?

    [A] Based on current bond yields and a conservative estimate of future stock returns, a portfolio divided equally between long-term Treasuries, investment-grade corporate bonds, and stocks should earn a real rate of return of around 3.5%, enough to provide a cushion above the guaranteed rate. In the event of a protracted slump, the government retains the option of lowering the guaranteed return and allowing participants to access their funds.
    So... they'll invest it in TREASURIES and CORPORATE BONDS and STOCKS -- in other words the same things that Mutual Funds invest in -- which "should" earn a sufficient intrest rate (HA!). BUT "in the event of a protracted slump" (like THAT would ever happen, I mean seriously!) then the government will ... well, they will just "LOWER the guaranteed return" (which means, of course, that there is NOTHING "guaranteed" about it).


    One last item of note is that the "plan" doesn't even seem to be aware that SOME people are self-employed. Is this an oversight? Nope... because ABOVE ALL this plan is designed to TOTALLY SCREW OVER anyone who owns and operates their own business; essentially driving and "pushing" everyone to work for either the government, OR Big-Corporate America, OR... to essentially join the "gray-market." Since they do not draw a "paycheck" they will not be getting the "government subsidy" in any form -- ONLY PAYING IN EXTRA AMOUNTS FOR THEIR EMPLOYEES -- and ALL of the current subsidies for KEOGH plans are to be eliminated along with the 401K's & IRA's.




    FINALLY, and perhaps most importantly, please note that this thing was written up in November of 2007 (and Ms. Il Duce even wrote a book, called "When I'm Sixty-Four: The Plot against Pensions and the Plan to Save Them" which was published in May of 2008).

    Sidenote: Apparently there CAN be "plots" and "conspiracies" -- but only by those "evil free market capitalists" -- NEVER by government flunkies and apparatchiks.

    So ANY and EVERY statement that you read which says or even implies in any way this idea is a "result" of a need to address the recent stock market "meltdown" is 100% pure bullshit.

    They've been working on and planning this for YEARS.

    And who is "they" you ask? The report acknowledges the following:
    We gratefully acknowledge the generous support of the Rockefeller Foundation.


    Grey market it is, it seems.

  5. #4

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WRellim
    And who is "they" you ask? The report acknowledges the following:
    We gratefully acknowledge the generous support of the Rockefeller Foundation.
    geez, so we know where this mandate is coming from...

  6. #5

    Default

    Is this just a private think tanks ideas? Has Congress working on any of this?
    War; everything in the world wrong, evil and immoral combined into one and multiplied by millions.

  7. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WRellim View Post
    We gratefully acknowledge the generous support of the Rockefeller Foundation.
    All you need to know, right there.
    "When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny." - Thomas Jefferson

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  8. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by klamath View Post
    Is this just a private think tanks ideas? Has Congress working on any of this?
    This document is a "think tank" piece (paid for by the Rockefeller Foundation, and promoted via CFR, then Congressman George Miller (D) had "hearing" in his committee with this woman (briefing's author) on hand as an "expert" to give "advice" on where Congress "should go").

    But it's like the PNAC, or the groups that worked up the PATRIOT Act years in advance. (Or heck, the Federal Reserve Act back in 1913).

    For the most part, Congress does NOT write legislation (especially not far reaching policy-changing legislation) anymore, everything like this comes "prepackaged" and then slipped in as legislation during an "emergency" or "special session."

    This is kind of like the "tremors" before the REAL earthquake -- but it'll pretty much shape up as this gal outlines it here in this document -- the rest is just a matter of proper timing, then getting Congress via vote-buying via earmarks and "other means" to rubber stamp it.

    I give it less than a year.

  9. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by s35wf View Post
    bump. PLEASE READ & WARN OTHERS!
    I warned a close friend that invests heavily in her 401k. Her reply? "Oh they'll never pass that!"

    My response, "Who's going to stop them now that the Dems have control of both Congress and the Executive? Who did you vote for again?"

    Her: "Obama"

    Me: "Well you did want Change so I guess you're gettin it huh"

    Her: *silence*



    (It takes the ugly truth sometimes to get people to wake up!)
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    Internet shills exposed: (Yes, there are plenty on RPF)
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  10. #9

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    I warned a close friend that invests heavily in her 401k. Her reply? "Oh they'll never pass that!"

    My response, "Who's going to stop them now that the Dems have control of both Congress and the Executive? Who did you vote for again?"

    Her: "Obama"

    Me: "Well you did want Change so I guess you're gettin it huh"

    Her: *silence*



    (It takes the ugly truth sometimes to get people to wake up!)
    She'll probably be all happy about it when it DOES happen: "Oh look, Lord Obama is going to SAVE all of our reitrement money for us... YAAYY!!!"

    Seriously, by the time it hits, the media will have convinced people that it is a GOOD thing (especially if they promise to give people money back that their 401K's lost in the stock market this past year... and what they will STILL lose next year).

    The sheeple will LOVE IT!

  11. #10

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by klamath View Post
    Is this just a private think tanks ideas? Has Congress working on any of this?
    Think Tanks NEVER work for FREE!

    This is either Direct or InDirect funds... Most likely, some government officials like Charlie Rangel, Chris Dodd, Barney Franks, George Miller and the USUAL SUSPECTS... calling on their special OPS slime to pre-plan and pay for this...

    Next phase will be $100's of millions in a propaganda campaign by; US Government, Banks, Financials, Lobbyist, Legal firms, Insurance companies, special interest, profiteers, greed, money parasites, and consulting firms surrounding the Capital buildings.

    And the DUMB ASS Americans will buy into it... because: 90% of ALL statistics, can be made to say ANYTHING!
    Last edited by HOLLYWOOD; 11-10-2008 at 10:08 PM.
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  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by HOLLYWOOD View Post
    Think Tanks NEVER work for FREE!

    This is either Direct or InDirect funds... Most likely, some government officials like Charlie Rangel, Chris Dodd, Barney Franks... calling on their special OPS slime to pay for this...

    Next phase will be $100's of millions in a propaganda campaign by; US Government, Banks, Financials, Lobbyist, Legal firms, Insurance companies, special interest, profiteers, greed, money parasites, and consulting firms surrounding the Capital buildings.

    And the DUMB ASS Americans will buy into it... because: 90% of ALL statistics, can be made to say ANYTHING!
    See, but we KNOW you made that percentage up.

    Because I remember reading in a study (I think done by the Rand group) that 97.65% of all studies end up with statistics with at least 2 decimal points in their findings.

  13. #12

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    The ring of power has corrupted those that hold it in DC.


    I think it is our duty to destroy that ring in the fire that forged it.

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  14. #13

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    How about you peoples read the 13th chapter of Thomas Woods Jr. book "33 Questions your not supposed to ask." That chapter is about the Social Security.
    " Anyone can become angry. That is easy. But to be angry with the right person, to the right degree, at the right time, for the right purpose and in the right way - that is not easy." --Aristotle

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    I warned a close friend that invests heavily in her 401k. Her reply? "Oh they'll never pass that!"

    My response, "Who's going to stop them now that the Dems have control of both Congress and the Executive? Who did you vote for again?"

    Her: "Obama"

    Me: "Well you did want Change so I guess you're gettin it huh"

    Her: *silence*



    (It takes the ugly truth sometimes to get people to wake up!)
    That's freak'n awesome you did that to your friend! Talk about a slap in the face! HAHAHAHAHHAHA!!

  16. #15

    Default

    bump
    "Masterful and arrogant wealth, created largely by Government protection of its profits, not content with its domination and influence within a single party, had sought to corrupt them both, and to that end had insinuated itself into the primaries, in order that no candidates might be nominated whose views were not in accord with theirs." (‘Colonel’ Edward Mandell House in 'Philip Dru: Administrator', circa 1912)

  17. #16

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rp4prez View Post
    That's freak'n awesome you did that to your friend! Talk about a slap in the face! HAHAHAHAHHAHA!!
    Yeah well Ive been trying to convert her for the last year, with very little success. I guess it takes something personal like having your large 401k account threatened with confiscation to wake up. But even then, Im sure she will just repress the thought and keep her money in a sinking system.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

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    No anti-semitism, just logic.

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  18. #17

    Default

    Wow. Great analysis, WRellim. Thanks.
    “I have many friends in the libertarian movement who look down on those of us who get involved in political activity,”
    he acknowledged, but "eventually, if you want to bring about changes … what you have to do is participate in political
    action.
    ” -- Ron Paul


    "We do have some differences and our approaches will be different, but that makes him his own person. I mean why should he [Rand] be a clone and do everything and think just exactly as I have. I think it's an opportunity to be independent minded. We are about 99% the same on issues." "People Try To Drive Wedges Between Rand And Me." --Ron Paul

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  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Yeah well Ive been trying to convert her for the last year, with very little success. I guess it takes something personal like having your large 401k account threatened with confiscation to wake up. But even then, Im sure she will just repress the thought and keep her money in a sinking system.
    I doubt she will wake up. I'm on a very liberal pro Obama forum and posting opinions and articles to back up my argument. I've been ganged up on, called a racist, fear monger, wack-o, and a lot of other not nice things. I stay on the high road and am really nice with my responses. What gets me is how they don't even know me but since I come in with "radical" ideas, which are really just the same ideas that our country was founded on, I get labeled such things.

    Ah well, it makes really good practice for talking with others and creating strategies for convincing others like your friend to our ideas!

  20. #19

    Default

    Very nice analysis.

    Now that the dems are going to cut pentagon spending by 25%, many liberal pentagon employees and defense contractors that voted for Obama will be the first to be let go.

  21. #20

    Default

    hope the things improve this year

  22. #21

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    1/3 of the investment in treasuries! Looks like another cash cow for the government.





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