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Thread: Libertarian National Convention

  1. #631
    Quote Originally Posted by AJ Antimony View Post
    If he were a neocon, wouldn't he currently be an incumbent Republican congressman praising the Bush administration?
    There are neo-conservatives on the Democratic Party's side too, and they aren't doing anything of the sort.

    Bob Barr ISN'T a very good LP candidate. He supports a "national sales tax" in place of the IRS, which is only a gimmick. Taxes are taxes, no matter which way you look at it! He doesn't explicitly state on his website anything about his positions on the War on Drugs either, which is a very important position to me and any libertarian concerned about freedom. Ron Paul is more libertarian than Bob Barr is, especially considering the fact that Bob Barr was one of the bad guys until only a couple of years ago. This makes me very uneasy, because we have people like RP who have had the same positions since they first entered the political game.

    At least Wayne Allen Root ended up losing out - thank goodness. EDIT: Oh shoot - Root ended up getting VP. We truly have the worst ticket that we could have possibly conceived of this year.



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  3. #632
    Quote Originally Posted by G-Wohl View Post
    There are neo-conservatives on the Democratic Party's side too, and they aren't doing anything of the sort.

    Bob Barr ISN'T a very good LP candidate. He supports a "national sales tax" in place of the IRS, which is only a gimmick. Taxes are taxes, no matter which way you look at it! He doesn't explicitly state on his website anything about his positions on the War on Drugs either, which is a very important position to me and any libertarian concerned about freedom. Ron Paul is more libertarian than Bob Barr is, especially considering the fact that Bob Barr was one of the bad guys until only a couple of years ago. This makes me very uneasy, because we have people like RP who have had the same positions since they first entered the political game.

    At least Wayne Allen Root ended up losing out - thank goodness. EDIT: Oh shoot - Root ended up getting VP. We truly have the worst ticket that we could have possibly conceived of this year.
    We'll just have to wait and see who Ron tells us to vote for--I expect that'll come after the RNC. If he says to vote for Barr, then Barr has to be doing something right to get an endorsement from Mr. Liberty himself.
    I ignore the fact that RP's take back the GOP strategy is working. I ignore the fact that RP accomplished more from his 2008 GOP run than he ever has before. I ignore the fact that 3rd party candidates lose and are a joke to voters. I ignore all this b/c I have an arousing fantasy where RP runs 3rd party in 2012, magically polls at 15%, magically is allowed in the debates, and then magically wins the election. Trust me, it'll work this time.
    - The naive attitude of too many RPF members



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  5. #633

    yep

    Quote Originally Posted by G-Wohl View Post
    There are neo-conservatives on the Democratic Party's side too, and they aren't doing anything of the sort.

    Bob Barr ISN'T a very good LP candidate. He supports a "national sales tax" in place of the IRS, which is only a gimmick. Taxes are taxes, no matter which way you look at it! He doesn't explicitly state on his website anything about his positions on the War on Drugs either, which is a very important position to me and any libertarian concerned about freedom. Ron Paul is more libertarian than Bob Barr is, especially considering the fact that Bob Barr was one of the bad guys until only a couple of years ago. This makes me very uneasy, because we have people like RP who have had the same positions since they first entered the political game.

    At least Wayne Allen Root ended up losing out - thank goodness. EDIT: Oh shoot - Root ended up getting VP. We truly have the worst ticket that we could have possibly conceived of this year.
    I truly thought mary was the better choice for the lp party,but ooo well. She did very well. If Ron Paul doesnt win the gop nomination. Then i just might have to be one of her activist in the next 4 yrs. the gop better shape up or we will have to ship them out
    2016 gop est business as usual, rules do not apply.

  6. #634
    in for later
    Screw the big two! Let's all vote Libertarian.

  7. #635

    well same goes for the GOP

    Quote Originally Posted by american.swan View Post
    I am sorry I can't read this whole thread. I am sure it would be entertaining.

    I would just like to say from the little I did read. There is way too much hype on this thread over a "party" that has no chance in hell of winning the White House. If a year ago a person told me that Ron Paul had no chance in hell of winning the White House I would be angry because the GOP and DNC are large powerful vote getting groups and Dr. Paul shouldn't have been labeled a dead weight by the media and such. I personally have no problem saying the Libertarian party candidate has no chance in hell because it's true. They won't be invited to any debates. They won't have the money to compete. It's just flat out impossible.

    Same goes for the Constitution party.
    as far as im concerned the libertarian party is better of then the dying gop

    it takes time,the gop wasnt born overnight. they are growing and with the gop's tactics. the lp should explode this election. If not you can add the gop to the list of useless parties the lp is a better choice for me if the gop nominates useless mccain..
    2016 gop est business as usual, rules do not apply.

  8. #636
    Quote Originally Posted by 0zzy View Post
    what is the problem with barr, you guys are crazy.
    His explanation for his vote for the Iraq War Resolution. He says he regrets it but gives the reason - it was not how the administration "sold it".

    Wrong FREAKIN answer!

    His explanation should be because he transferred his constitutional responsibility to DECLARE WAR to the Executive Branch. Set aside the obvious inconsistency with support for a non-interventionist foreign policy - The constitutionality of the decision should be CLEAR to EVERY Libertarian. And he should make this point and apologize for it.

    That goes for The Patriot Act - which he voted for as well.

    That Said...

    I think he is probably good for the Libertarian Party because his name recognition and respect amongst conservative Republicans will help expand LP membership and ensure ballot access in 2012.

    Many times better than McCain, Obama or Clinton - but still don't think I can get behind him.
    Last edited by JS4Pat; 05-25-2008 at 07:16 PM.

    Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed people can change the world.
    Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has...


    John Stevens

  9. #637
    Quote Originally Posted by Menthol Patch View Post
    True Libertarians support legalizing all drugs immediately.
    I think they voted on that today, you lose.
    My review of the For Liberty documentary:
    digg.com/d315eji
    (please Digg and post comments on the HuffPost site)

    "This political train-wreck Republicans face can largely be traced to Bush’s philosophical metamorphosis from a traditional, non-interventionist conservative to the neoconservatives’ exemplar of a 'War President', and his positioning of the Republicans as the 'War Party'."

    Nicholas Sanchez on Bush's legacy, September 30, 2007.

  10. #638
    Quote Originally Posted by DrSpock View Post
    I have no opinion, I neither like nor dislike Bob Barr. I do believe that his conversion is rather convenient in that he can now expect a portion of the R3volution to support him financially.
    I was asking myself what in hell Bob Barr could gain from running as a Libertarian. Why would anyone run on the LP ticket unless they believed in the ideas?
    "Ron Paul Goes to the Zoo 2012" Ver. 3.0 Now Posted in Forum!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgsMZPdDEZY



  11. #639
    How did the LP Platform changes turn out today?

  12. #640
    Quote Originally Posted by scotto2008 View Post
    I was asking myself what in hell Bob Barr could gain from running as a Libertarian. Why would anyone run on the LP ticket unless they believed in the ideas?
    Exactly. Bob Barr would have been better to run for the Republican nominee, and believe me, he would probably be schooling McCain right now.



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  14. #641
    Quote Originally Posted by american.swan View Post
    I am sorry I can't read this whole thread. I am sure it would be entertaining.

    I would just like to say from the little I did read. There is way too much hype on this thread over a "party" that has no chance in hell of winning the White House. If a year ago a person told me that Ron Paul had no chance in hell of winning the White House I would be angry because the GOP and DNC are large powerful vote getting groups and Dr. Paul shouldn't have been labeled a dead weight by the media and such. I personally have no problem saying the Libertarian party candidate has no chance in hell because it's true. They won't be invited to any debates. They won't have the money to compete. It's just flat out impossible.

    Same goes for the Constitution party.
    This is the core of the '3rd party movement problem'! Just look at who the media/CFR/Bilderbergs are pushing: hillaryobamamccain. Same ole $#@! in a different colored bag. Now, aren't Balwin, Barr or Ron Paul All better choices than that? If you can't agree on that, just go beat your head against the 'lesser of 2 evils wall' and leave me alone. WE MUST ALL UNITE AROUND ONE CANDIDATE! Get it? Even lump Nader in there. Isn't he, with all his flaws, better than the $#@! the media serves us? If we all unite around one 3rd party candidate, there goes the 'wasted vote' phenomenon. Folks, they have been splitting up the 'patriot vote' for years like this. WAKE UP!

  15. #642
    Quote Originally Posted by Menthol Patch View Post
    Bob Barr is nothing but a neo-con. He cannot spread liberty and freedom when he does not believe in it! He believes in throwing people in prison for putting substances into their own body!
    He SHOULD stand strongly against the Federal War on Drugs, but I don't think this should be a deal breaker for a Libertarian Candidate. For one thing the public isn't there yet and for another there are plenty of other more important Libertarian policies that could be advanced first. Drug legalization is not the hill I want to die on.

    Now his vote for the Iraq War and The Patriot Act are a different story...

    Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed people can change the world.
    Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has...


    John Stevens

  16. #643
    To be fair people had a very limited time to vote on the patriot act, a vote for the iraq war is more telling.

    Barr seems like our best option for the general election, he's no Ron Paul, but who is?

    If we become to idealistic... we'll really become a joke
    Alex Merced - A Champion of Freedom
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  17. #644
    Quote Originally Posted by alaric View Post
    This is the core of the '3rd party movement problem'! Just look at who the media/CFR/Bilderbergs are pushing: hillaryobamamccain. Same ole $#@! in a different colored bag. Now, aren't Balwin, Barr or Ron Paul All better choices than that? If you can't agree on that, just go beat your head against the 'lesser of 2 evils wall' and leave me alone. WE MUST ALL UNITE AROUND ONE CANDIDATE! Get it? Even lump Nader in there. Isn't he, with all his flaws, better than the $#@! the media serves us? If we all unite around one 3rd party candidate, there goes the 'wasted vote' phenomenon. Folks, they have been splitting up the 'patriot vote' for years like this. WAKE UP!
    The core of the 3rd party or alternate political movement problem is the establishment treats both as having no chance, which turns into a self-fulfilling prophecy. They deliberately marginalize them, then point to the lack of coverage or mainstream treatment as evidence that the candidate/party has no chance. We all saw how the MSM did the 2 party variation of this to Paul---exclude him from almost all polls, so he stays at 1-2%, then black him out entirely 'because he isn't viable.' This despite his having record fundraising days, solid experience as an elected official, and massive grassroots backing.

    MEANWHILE, McCain had NO money, NO grassroots support, and NO momentum in the polls, UNTIL the media grabbed him and dragged his hide across the finish line. This is the problem, not 3rd party internal issues or divisions. The Paul example shows the elite will do this to 'our candidate' whether inside or outside the two party system.
    -----Peace & Freedom, John Clifton-----
    Blog: https://electclifton.wordpress.com/2...complishments/

  18. #645
    Quote Originally Posted by FindLiberty View Post
    How did the LP Platform changes turn out today?
    The "Restore 04" purists were soundly rejected by the Reform caucus. All of the early "purist" amendments were voted down so decisively that they requested to suspend the rules and withdraw the rest of their amendments to ameliorate their embarrassment.

    There were some minor platform changes that didn't create any significant fights.
    My review of the For Liberty documentary:
    digg.com/d315eji
    (please Digg and post comments on the HuffPost site)

    "This political train-wreck Republicans face can largely be traced to Bush’s philosophical metamorphosis from a traditional, non-interventionist conservative to the neoconservatives’ exemplar of a 'War President', and his positioning of the Republicans as the 'War Party'."

    Nicholas Sanchez on Bush's legacy, September 30, 2007.

  19. #646
    Quote Originally Posted by AlexMerced View Post
    To be fair people had a very limited time to vote on the patriot act, a vote for the iraq war is more telling.

    Barr seems like our best option for the general election, he's no Ron Paul, but who is?

    If we become to idealistic... we'll really become a joke
    True - but these two issues are HUGE!! (Fundamental)

    This separates those who understand and respect the US Constitution from those who don't.

    I believe people can "come around" - but Bob Barr's explanation for his vote on the Iraq War resolutionn tells me he still doesn't quite "get it".

    Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed people can change the world.
    Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has...


    John Stevens

  20. #647
    Quote Originally Posted by AlexMerced View Post
    To be fair people had a very limited time to vote on the patriot act, a vote for the iraq war is more telling.
    Let me paraphrase that line of illogic and see if it makes sense:

    "I got the death penalty, but to be fair, my lawyer said he really didn't have time to read through the whole plea agreement before he signed it on my behalf. Oops."

    Would YOU hire a lawyer that did that?

    Seriously. If you do not have the time to read a contract, you do NOT sign it.

    If a legislator does not have even the opportunity to LOOK at (much less read through and analyse) a piece of legislation... then they should a priori vote AGAINST it. If they vote FOR "hidden" legislation, they are guilty of gross negligence, and dereliction of duty, PERIOD.

    In other words, their character should forever be tainted and questioned. Tarring and Feathering are too good. (What is the point of the "Representation" if it is nothing but a rubber stamp... may as well stuck with the old "mad" King George III).

  21. #648
    Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose...
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.



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