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Thread: Outrage: Pizza Hut punishes employee for defending himself (Call & Email Pizza Hut)

  1. #1

    Outrage: Pizza Hut punishes employee for defending himself (Call & Email Pizza Hut)

    Outrage Of The Week: "Safest for everybody?" Pizza Hut punishes employee for defending himself


    Friday, April 04, 2008


    “The incident wasn’t something quick and simple. ... It was a long ordeal…my life was, without a doubt, in danger.”

    On the night of March 27, 2008, Pizza Hut deliveryman James Spiers of Des Moines, Iowa was delivering pizzas--just as he had many times before over the past 10 years. He walked into an apartment complex thinking he was making another routine delivery, but found himself in a battle for his life: he had been set up by a “customer” who had lured him into the complex by pretending to order the pizza over the phone, but who had an armed accomplice waiting in ambush.

    Spiers soon found himself trapped in a hallway with a gun to his head, his assailant demanding money. “Without a doubt,” he said, “my life was in extreme danger.”

    The thug (who, not surprisingly, has a long list of prior arrests) thought he had the upper hand. Fortunately, Mr. Spiers has a valid concealed carry permit, and was carrying a pistol for personal protection at the time of the attack. He struggled with his attacker and managed to draw his own firearm. He shot the assailant, who fled the scene but was later arrested after he sought medical treatment.

    Unfortunately, that’s not the end of the story. As a result of his actions, Mr. Spiers, a single father trying to make an honest living, was suspended from his job by his employer, Pizza Hut. That’s right. A man who, as a result of doing his job, was forced into a life-threatening situation, defended himself, and whose actions helped take a career criminal off the street, was deprived of his livelihood. Pizza Hut suspended James Spiers for defending his life.

    Vonnie Walbert, vice president of human resources at Pizza Hut, said, “We have a policy against carrying weapons. We prohibit employees from carrying guns because we believe that that is the safest for everybody.”

    “Safest for everybody?” This inane policy certainly makes things safer for criminals, like the one who attacked Spiers. But it does nothing to aid the safety of Pizza Hut’s employees. Every night, hardworking deliverymen and women must do their job in potentially dangerous areas. In fact, their jobs are statistically among the most dangerous in the nation. Yet Pizza Hut would deprive them of self-protection.

    Thankfully, people are taking notice. Spiers has said that he has been “overwhelmed by support from people who cheered what happened,” including Iowa state senator Brad Zaun (R-32), who noted, “If I was in a situation to protect my family, protect myself, to continue being a father, I would’ve done the same thing. What I want everybody to know…is that there [are] people out there supporting this man and his right to defend himself. I’m going to be watching Pizza Hut.”

    To voice your outrage over Pizza Hut’s disciplinary decision, please contact the Corporate Offices by phone at (800) 948-8488, or by e-mail at this webpage:http://www.pizzahut.com/contactus/Co...m.aspx?l1=2024.
    This corporate policy is outrageous.



    SOURCE:
    http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Fe...d.aspx?id=3777
    ----

    Ron Paul Forum's Mission Statement:

    Inspired by US Rep. Ron Paul of Texas, this site is dedicated to facilitating grassroots initiatives that aim to restore a sovereign limited constitutional Republic based on the rule of law, states' rights and individual rights. We seek to enshrine the original intent of our Founders to foster respect for private property, seek justice, provide opportunity, and to secure individual liberty for ourselves and our posterity.



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  3. #2
    What should I say in the complaint?

  4. #3
    Seems obvious, Pizza Hut would rather have people buy from it's competitors.
    A policy against carrying weapons should be ignored by every employee who can legally carry a pistol. It is better to lose your job than it is to lose your life. I've heard that 'safety' speech from other places where I see a sign on the front door saying 'gun free zone'. I ask them about it and they say it is for the safety of their patrons and the workers in the building. Seems if they were really concerned with safety, they wouldn't want just the criminals to be able to bring a weapon into the building but would also want law abiding citizens to do so as well.

    They might as well just post a sign on the front door, saying 'Rob this establishment, nobody will stop you.'

  5. #4
    Yes, this guy is far better off since he broke the rule. Now he has his life. Jobs are far easier to replace.
    Vonnie Walbert, vice president of human resources at Pizza Hut, said, “We have a policy against carrying weapons. We prohibit employees from carrying guns because we believe that that is the safest for everybody.”
    LOL! I agree it is probably safest for overpaid, self-important executives!
    Last edited by angelatc; 04-06-2008 at 12:06 PM.

  6. #5
    now what out weighs what here the constitution or property rights? Can pizza hut legally tell their employees they can not carry legal guns when they are not on pizza hut property but on duty?

  7. #6
    bump
    I just saved a bunch of freedom by switching to PAULCO

  8. #7
    I have a friend that had a similar experience a couple of weeks ago while delivering, but he got out of the situation bc. he had a large knife that he carries with him on deliveries....and btw he delivers for Domino's. My cousin's wife happens to be my friend's store manager and she was all about him being able to protect himself. No blood was drawn in the incident but the presence of the weapon actually diffused the situation.

  9. #8
    damn pepsi company.
    The ultimate minority is the individual. Protect the individual from Democracy and you will protect all groups of individuals
    Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual. - Thomas Jefferson
    I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

    - Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear



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  11. #9

  12. #10
    He had every right to defend himself. WTF pizza hut!

    So Pizza hut hires drivers that put their lives in danger for not that much money and they get penalized for defending themselves?

  13. #11
    I have two thoughts on this

    First, Pizza Hut is a private company and can have whatever gun policy they choose. Therefore it is their right to suspend the guy.

    Second, this is a ridiculous policy and is not, "safest for everybody." Therefore, Pizza Hut needs to hear about this
    We need immigrants in this country. What we don't need is politicians. Get rid of them! - Peter Schiff

  14. #12
    complaint sent! I actually spoke to someone, he says my message will be sent to headquarters. The Revolution continues!

  15. #13
    If the robber had made off with the money, then I'll bet that Pizza Hut would have held the driver liable. They should kiss this guy's ass for protecting their $30.
    "Any fool can make a rule, and any fool will mind it." - Henry David Thoreau

  16. #14
    Another company to add to the banned list right along side faux news

    We wont be funding THEIR empire any longer.
    I contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle.
    -Churchill
    ************************************

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    http://www.noagendashow.com

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr.3D View Post
    They might as well just post a sign on the front door, saying 'Rob this establishment, nobody will stop you.'
    I was watching a conservative TV show one time, and they had a sign that said exactly that.

    This really does suck since I like their stuffed crust pizzas.
    http://www.ronpaul2012.com/
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rt. Hon. Edmund Burke
    Nothing is so fatal to religion as indifference.

  18. #16
    I posted this on MySpace; and Pizza Hut has lost my business. I will not put my money behind these policies.



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  20. #17
    I will not support Pizza Hut after this.
    This is ridiculous, an outrage!

    God Bless that man. I hope he can find another job and be able to support himself and his children.

    What do you want me to do, to do for you to see you through?
    A box of rain will ease the pain, and love will see you through.
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  21. #18
    damn and i really liked pizza hut too its sad when you have to boycott good food

    oh well at least missouri has Imo's the best pizza ever created for sure

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by roxic27 View Post
    damn and i really liked pizza hut too its sad when you have to boycott good food

    oh well at least missouri has Imo's the best pizza ever created for sure

    Support your local mom/pop pizza place. They usually have better pizzas anyway.
    ----

    Ron Paul Forum's Mission Statement:

    Inspired by US Rep. Ron Paul of Texas, this site is dedicated to facilitating grassroots initiatives that aim to restore a sovereign limited constitutional Republic based on the rule of law, states' rights and individual rights. We seek to enshrine the original intent of our Founders to foster respect for private property, seek justice, provide opportunity, and to secure individual liberty for ourselves and our posterity.

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by ItsTime View Post
    now what out weighs what here the constitution or property rights? Can pizza hut legally tell their employees they can not carry legal guns when they are not on pizza hut property but on duty?
    Why not? All it is is a contract that says if you work here, you obey our rules. They can hire or fire whoever they want for any reason whether or not the employee is on Pizza Hut property. But I don't have to eat there.
    "I am a friend of the Free State Project!" -- Rep. Ron Paul

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  24. #21
    I truly enjoy stuff like this... it really gets one to thinking.

    First and foremost I don't think Pizza Hut did the right thing (rules or no rules) by suspending this guy from work. In all likelihood he was treated thus in order to hold up their policy and send a clear message they mean for their employees to follow their policies. I think that by merely suspending the guy, rather than firing him, they are at least trying to compromise between their policy and this guy's right to protect himself. I would place more blame on the "gun grabbers" and insurance companies than I would Pizza Hut.

    However, I've heard arguments before where companies having policies against employees speaking to one another about what they make in compensation. I haven't actually looked up any case law so cannot say so without authority, but the argument goes they do not have a legal right to attempt to enforce a policy that inhibits the individuals right to free speech. Supposedly these arguments don't hold up in court. Which begs the question, at what point does an individuals "unalienable" rights trump those of a private business?

    I would think Pizza Hut could enforce the policy provided it applies only to guns being carried into their restaurant. We all know Pizza Hut does not supply their drivers with company vehicles so I would think if the guy wanted to protect himself he had every right to do so because he was using his property in order to carry out Pizza Hut business.

    Yes, I know, I'm running in circles. As a result of this event, Pizza Hut, as a private entity, has the right to conduct business how they choose. But, another however would be that this policy is more than likely required by their insurance company than it is something Pizza Hut firmly stands behind as a matter of policy. So maybe Pizza Hut was put into a bad position by their insurance company.

    More questions than answers, but I really like thinking out loud about stuff like this and seeing what others come up with!
    We have two major parties [in America], the stupid party and the evil party. Every once in a while they manage to work together and we call it "bipartisanship".
    ~Thomas Woods, Rally for the Republic

  25. #22
    At least armed robbers know which delivery service to use now.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by dougkeenan View Post
    At least armed robbers know which delivery service to use now.
    :snicker:

    Good one!
    We have two major parties [in America], the stupid party and the evil party. Every once in a while they manage to work together and we call it "bipartisanship".
    ~Thomas Woods, Rally for the Republic

  27. #24

    It isn't Pizza Hutt but the legal institution it operates in

    Quote Originally Posted by FrankRep View Post
    Outrage Of The Week: "Safest for everybody?" Pizza Hut punishes employee for defending himself


    Friday, April 04, 2008


    “The incident wasn’t something quick and simple. ... It was a long ordeal…my life was, without a doubt, in danger.”

    On the night of March 27, 2008, Pizza Hut deliveryman James Spiers of Des Moines, Iowa was delivering pizzas--just as he had many times before over the past 10 years. He walked into an apartment complex thinking he was making another routine delivery, but found himself in a battle for his life: he had been set up by a “customer” who had lured him into the complex by pretending to order the pizza over the phone, but who had an armed accomplice waiting in ambush.

    Spiers soon found himself trapped in a hallway with a gun to his head, his assailant demanding money. “Without a doubt,” he said, “my life was in extreme danger.”

    The thug (who, not surprisingly, has a long list of prior arrests) thought he had the upper hand. Fortunately, Mr. Spiers has a valid concealed carry permit, and was carrying a pistol for personal protection at the time of the attack. He struggled with his attacker and managed to draw his own firearm. He shot the assailant, who fled the scene but was later arrested after he sought medical treatment.

    Unfortunately, that’s not the end of the story. As a result of his actions, Mr. Spiers, a single father trying to make an honest living, was suspended from his job by his employer, Pizza Hut. That’s right. A man who, as a result of doing his job, was forced into a life-threatening situation, defended himself, and whose actions helped take a career criminal off the street, was deprived of his livelihood. Pizza Hut suspended James Spiers for defending his life.

    Vonnie Walbert, vice president of human resources at Pizza Hut, said, “We have a policy against carrying weapons. We prohibit employees from carrying guns because we believe that that is the safest for everybody.”

    “Safest for everybody?” This inane policy certainly makes things safer for criminals, like the one who attacked Spiers. But it does nothing to aid the safety of Pizza Hut’s employees. Every night, hardworking deliverymen and women must do their job in potentially dangerous areas. In fact, their jobs are statistically among the most dangerous in the nation. Yet Pizza Hut would deprive them of self-protection.

    Thankfully, people are taking notice. Spiers has said that he has been “overwhelmed by support from people who cheered what happened,” including Iowa state senator Brad Zaun (R-32), who noted, “If I was in a situation to protect my family, protect myself, to continue being a father, I would’ve done the same thing. What I want everybody to know…is that there [are] people out there supporting this man and his right to defend himself. I’m going to be watching Pizza Hut.”

    To voice your outrage over Pizza Hut’s disciplinary decision, please contact the Corporate Offices by phone at (800) 948-8488, or by e-mail at this webpage:http://www.pizzahut.com/contactus/Co...m.aspx?l1=2024.
    This corporate policy is outrageous.



    SOURCE:
    http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Fe...d.aspx?id=3777
    Pizza Hutt is implementing policy on the advise of their lawyers. As Americans, we live in an institutional tyranny of legal precedents.



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  29. #25
    I worked at pizza-hut last year.We all know the policies regarding carrying guns.However 2 out of 5 still carry a gun on their deliveries.If only the criminals knew.Maybe they would not want to take the chance of robbing a pizza delivery guy.If I would have stayed there,I would have definately bought a firearm by now.

  30. #26

    Killed for minimum wage?

    It's not worth it to put your life on the line for a minimum wage job, especially one where you walk around alone in strange neighborhoods with a huge pizza case and money. Talk about temptation to criminals!

    I think pizza delivery will have to change in crime-ridden areas. If they want to have pizza delivered, they will have to register with photo ID and provide a current address to be registered for pizza delivery. Pizza delivery will probably not be available after dark in these cities.

    Remember going door-to-door trick or treating on Halloween? That's becoming a thing of the past in big cities and I think pizza delivery will too. It's just too dangerous and not worth the risk.

  31. #27

    Done. My brother is a pizza del. driver. I told PH that there would be

    likely less robberies if criminals asked themselves is it worth taking a chance on getting shot over 20 bucks.I said it was outragious what they did because the guy only stopped himself from becoming a statistic.

  32. #28
    I think the pizza company should fire the guy. He sounds like exactly the kind of gun-toting nut that no business would want on the payroll, particularily in a job position that involves interracting with customers.

  33. #29
    I called them and let them know I would never spend another penny in there store.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by ItsTime View Post
    now what out weighs what here the constitution or property rights? Can pizza hut legally tell their employees they can not carry legal guns when they are not on pizza hut property but on duty?
    Yes. Pizza Hut can do it and the employee must comply, or the employee can quit. In a free market, no one would want to work as a delivery person for Pizza Hut unless they got hazard pay or were allowed to carry guns.

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