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"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
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"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
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In B4 Zippy.
Pfizer Macht Frei!
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Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!
Short Income Tax Video
The Income Tax Is An Excise, And Excise Taxes Are Privilege Taxes
The Federalist Papers, No. 15:
Except as to the rule of appointment, the United States have an indefinite discretion to make requisitions for men and money; but they have no authority to raise either by regulations extending to the individual citizens of America.
Woooo! We're number one! Exceptional even.
"The United States is the largest debtor nation in the history of the world."
--Jim Rogers
Based on the idea of natural rights, government secures those rights to the individual by strictly negative intervention, making justice costless and easy of access; and beyond that it does not go. The State, on the other hand, both in its genesis and by its primary intention, is purely anti-social. It is not based on the idea of natural rights, but on the idea that the individual has no rights except those that the State may provisionally grant him. It has always made justice costly and difficult of access, and has invariably held itself above justice and common morality whenever it could advantage itself by so doing.
--Albert J. Nock
I think this makes it official. the debt has officially DOUBLED while the current potus has been in office.
nope.
2007 it was 9 T
2008 it was 10 T
I bet this really makes the Bernanke happy.
"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." - Albert Einstein
"for I have sworn upon the altar of god eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man. - Thomas Jefferson.
Notify your congressman/ woman to write a smaller budget. All spending bills must originate in the House of Representatives and then the Senate must concur. The president only signs spending bills (or he can veto them).
Originally Posted by HVACTech
Not quite- as of January 2009, the debt was $10.6 trillion. A double would be $21.2 trillion- not $18 trillion- which can still happen.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...ack-to-double/
Another note- spending under Obama actually started in October, 2009- the start of the new fiscal year. Until that date, we were under budgets passed under the Bush administration. Debt then was $11.9 trillion. http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/r...ebt_histo5.htmWhen Mr. Obama became president in January 2009, the total federal debt stood at $10.6 trillion.
Not arguing in favor of debt but just correcting some info. That is an AWFUL lot of money we are talking about.
Last edited by Zippyjuan; 12-01-2014 at 06:33 PM.
A debt that can never be repaid, and serves only to enslave future generations. And no one has a problem with that. smfh
Diversity finds unity in the message of freedom.
Dilige et quod vis fac. ~ Saint Augustine
"I'll believe in good cops when they start turning bad cops in."
What is wrong with this input?
Moar SWLODs! That'll do the trick!
The Bastiat Collection · FREE PDF · FREE EPUB · PAPER Frédéric Bastiat (1801-1850)
- "When law and morality are in contradiction to each other, the citizen finds himself in the cruel alternative of either losing his moral sense, or of losing his respect for the law."
-- The Law (p. 54)- "Government is that great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
-- Government (p. 99)- "[W]ar is always begun in the interest of the few, and at the expense of the many."
-- Economic Sophisms - Second Series (p. 312)- "There are two principles that can never be reconciled - Liberty and Constraint."
-- Harmonies of Political Economy - Book One (p. 447)· tu ne cede malis sed contra audentior ito ·
LOL, Schifference.
Total US Debt Rises Over $18 Trillion; Up 70% Under Barack Obama
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-1...er-18-trillion
Last week, total US debt was a meager $17,963,753,617,957.26. Two days later, as updated today, on Black Friday, total outstanding US public debt just hit a new historic level which probably would be better associated with a red color: as of the last work day of November, total US public debt just surpassed $18 trillion for the first time, or $18,005,549,328,561.45 to be precise, of which debt held by the public rose to $12,922,681,725,432.94, an increase of $32 billion in one day.
[...]
It also means that total US debt to nominal GDP as of Sept 30, which was $17.555 trillion, is now 103%. Keep in mind this GDP number was artificially increased by about half a trillion dollars a year ago thanks to the "benefit" of R&D and intangibles. Without said definitional change, debt/GDP would now be about 106%.
It also means that total US debt has increased by 70% under Obama, from $10.625 trillion on January 21, 2009 to $18.005 trillion most recently.
And now we wait for the US to become Spain, and add the estimated "contribution" from hookers and blow to GDP, once again pushing the total debt/GDP ratio below the psychological 100% level.
Based on the idea of natural rights, government secures those rights to the individual by strictly negative intervention, making justice costless and easy of access; and beyond that it does not go. The State, on the other hand, both in its genesis and by its primary intention, is purely anti-social. It is not based on the idea of natural rights, but on the idea that the individual has no rights except those that the State may provisionally grant him. It has always made justice costly and difficult of access, and has invariably held itself above justice and common morality whenever it could advantage itself by so doing.
--Albert J. Nock
Speaking of which ...
I have quite the problem with that.
I believe I would regardless if I were not in the generation expected to pay for things they will never see.
“The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.” --George Orwell
Who else in public life has called for a pre-emptive strike on North Korea?--Donald Trump
Money and currency are not the same thing Zip.
the Bernanke worked for a private contractor. who has license to create our currency.
what IS our currency today? 1's and 0's on a computer screen.
sorry to bust your "bubble"
but Bitcoin is not a new idea.
"printing" "money" is SO..
60's?
somebody help me out here, how long has our currency been digital?
"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." - Albert Einstein
"for I have sworn upon the altar of god eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man. - Thomas Jefferson.
We need a miracle, like a break through in technology that will change everything.
Like fracking for instance is doing for us now in the energy sector. How about a replicator technology, like that envisioned by the late Prof Clarke and depicted on Star Trek, where any inanimate object can be synthesized from energy.
We have the capability of creating things that could alter the very existence of humankind making this all mute. In fact we already have become masters at creating wealth from thin air.
SO MUCH DEBT "Must work harder..." (and pay those taxes?) LOL, it can't be undone.
It's really just runaway fiat currency debasement that proceeds the collapse.
Yep
I hope it all crashes in my day so future generations don't have to be slaves.SO MUCH DEBT "Must work harder..." (and pay those taxes?) LOL, it can't be undone.
It's really just runaway fiat currency debasement that proceeds the collapse.I look at the youngsters in my family, at church, etc, and the crimes that have already been committed against them make me want to cry.
I doubt that will happen. We're going to have a currency collapse, then I think we're going to restructure both our currency (gold backing) and our debt.
Finally my chance to post this, ironically:
The bigger government gets, the smaller I wish it was.My new motto: More Love, Less Laws
Currency is cash. Currency is printed by the US Treasury Department. About ten percent of our current money supply exists in the form of currency. Our debt is not currency.Money and currency are not the same thing Zip.
the Bernanke worked for a private contractor. who has license to create our currency.
what IS our currency today? 1's and 0's on a computer screen.
sorry to bust your "bubble"
but Bitcoin is not a new idea.
"printing" "money" is SO..
60's?
somebody help me out here, how long has our currency been digital?
The first computer used by a bank was in the 1950's http://about.bankofamerica.com/en-us...id=7m6eH7Fmw5j but one could argue that paper checks were the first form of "non- currency" US money.
Last edited by Zippyjuan; 12-02-2014 at 12:09 PM.
You are right that it will never be repaid. Except possibly with seriously devalued dollars.
The proper concern of society is the preservation of individual freedom; the proper concern of the individual is the harmony of society.
"Who would be free, themselves must strike the blow." - Byron
"Who overcomes by force, hath overcome but half his foe." - Milton
http://reason.com/blog/2014/12/02/fe...18-trillion-la
Why not?! We're told debt is wealth, after all!Congratulations, America! You, or rather your elected officials, smashed through the $18 trillion ceiling last week, raising the United States government's total outstanding public debt to new heights and leaving shards of devalued greenbacks scattered around the place.
Woo hoo.
[...]
One decade ago, on December 1, 2004, the sum was a wussy $7.5 trillion. It took a lot of hard work to run up another 10-plus trillion in debt in those intervening years. This country won't bankrupt itself, you know. It takes government officials years of subsidizing, overpromising, overspending, and maybe some outright theft to put that many numbers in a row, slather them with red ink, and hand the bill to our grandkids.
The killjoys at the Congressional Budget Office say this pattern of continuing deficits and rising debt threatens to drain money from private investment, compromise national security, and lock the federal government into doing little other than paying the interest on what it already borrowed—a situation they call "unsustainable."
But that's just crazy talk. Who says you can't just borrow your way into the future and never pay it back without nasty consequences? Whaddya say we shoot for $50 trillion?
Based on the idea of natural rights, government secures those rights to the individual by strictly negative intervention, making justice costless and easy of access; and beyond that it does not go. The State, on the other hand, both in its genesis and by its primary intention, is purely anti-social. It is not based on the idea of natural rights, but on the idea that the individual has no rights except those that the State may provisionally grant him. It has always made justice costly and difficult of access, and has invariably held itself above justice and common morality whenever it could advantage itself by so doing.
--Albert J. Nock
It is "manageable" for as long as others are willing to buy the debt (US Treasuries). That could end tomorrow or fifty or 100 years from now.
This is "manageable?":
The killjoys at the Congressional Budget Office say this pattern of continuing deficits and rising debt threatens to drain money from private investment, compromise national security, and lock the federal government into doing little other than paying the interest on what it already borrowed—a situation they call "unsustainable."
Americans could end it today if they'd wake up, realize their power, and instead of writing useless SWLOD, they hit Leviathan where it counts.
http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2014/1...op-empire.html
Many have said that the US doesn’t need tax money as it survives on endless debt. Yes, the empire lives on debt, but the ability to sell debt is based on the bond rating of US treasury bonds. Most recently in June, 2014 S&P gave the US a AA+ rating with “stable outlook.”
If there is any doubt about the US credit rating, the ability to sell debt to continue financing the empire comes into question. The ability to collect taxes is what maintains the US bond rating. Any reduction of the US bond rating, and interest rates have to go up in order to continue attracting more investment. Then the interest on the debt balloons out of control and becomes unrepayable—never mind the principal, which they have no intention of ever paying back. By the way, the Tea Party’s efforts to shut down government by refusing to raise the debt ceiling was helping this effort for a time, although for different reasons. They thought that the welfare system is bankrupting the country. This is a laughable claim, because welfare spending looks negligible when compared to military spending. Still, they did manage to lower the bond rating for a time. Shutting down the federal government is a step in the right direction, and since in recent years only the Tea Party has managed to do it, lets give them some credit.
If the US became unable to reliably collect taxes, then its ability to finance the empire with debt would be diminished, and the US would have to turn to increasing taxes—another politically unpalatable choice, especially in the age of the Tea Party, when the empire’s main constituency is dead-set against more taxes. So it is absolutely clear that the only thing that could stop the empire is a tax revolt. It wouldn’t even have to be that big; the slightest question about the ability of the federal government to collect taxes could reduce the bond rating. Even a minor reduction could raise interest rates enough to make the US debt unrepayable.
Based on the idea of natural rights, government secures those rights to the individual by strictly negative intervention, making justice costless and easy of access; and beyond that it does not go. The State, on the other hand, both in its genesis and by its primary intention, is purely anti-social. It is not based on the idea of natural rights, but on the idea that the individual has no rights except those that the State may provisionally grant him. It has always made justice costly and difficult of access, and has invariably held itself above justice and common morality whenever it could advantage itself by so doing.
--Albert J. Nock
How would you suggest we deal with it?
Unlikely that people will continue to buy the debt when interest exceeds revenue. But you never know . . .
The proper concern of society is the preservation of individual freedom; the proper concern of the individual is the harmony of society.
"Who would be free, themselves must strike the blow." - Byron
"Who overcomes by force, hath overcome but half his foe." - Milton
What about the other 200+ TRILLION $ Fed Government debt?
Anything so contingent upon the caprice of others can hardly be said to be "manageable."
That's like saying that being hit by a bus is "manageable" merely because one has not been hit by a bus yet ...
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